Lawn Care Advice

[Raven]

i am splurging today

bought $40.00 bucks of heating oil this morning...... wow!

and i get to turn the heat on.... 28 degrees this mornin, chilly

after pancakes i'll build a fire

i enjoy fishing the most when i know that i'm harvesting
sunshine back home....

i couldn't live without a garden
anymore than i could live without ever fishing

[ProfessorM]

I try to eliminate a few feet of lawn every year with more beds for shrubs and plants. I dig up grass and throw it in the compost pile, lay down wood chips and leaves and plant something. I am not a slave to a lawn and would rather have my acre planted with beds and only a small strip of grass to accent the beds. I don't want all the chemicals involved with having a nice lawn. Mine is mostly assorted grass and weeds but it is green and that is all I care about. No time for the lawn thing. Got to pick my battles.

I am with Goose. I enjoy diggin holes and picking weeds and planting things as much as fishing. Sick I know but I love it. Good clean exercise, and a feeling of accomplishment. Good hard physical labor never hurt anybody. In fact it would do most people in this country, especially young folks, a world of good. Get outdoors. P.

[MarshCappa]

This thread inspired me to Lime today. Next is the Scotts and that's about it till it's time to cut. I keep it simple and I get a decent lawn. I have moss in spots but the spectic tank and leeching field do a great job keeping the majority of the back yard green! My Dad calls it Septi Lawn.

[tattoobob]

I just signed up for tru-green chemlawn

I have a really tough time with crab grass the last 3 years and nothing I do is working it just gets worse.

They promised me it would go away or they would do it for free

the cost of them doing there service is less than I can buy the Scotts system 4

[tattoobob]

I have to buy System 4 twice because my yard is so big, that would be 300 bucks, plus all the time I spend spreading it, pulling up weeds, and crabgrass. it is 8 applications at 10 for the first and 35 each after that. comes to 255, next year it will be 280

I told him I will try it for a year if it doesn't improve I will try Lesco products, but I think thats what they use

[rockfisherman]

There's been some discussion on using Milky Spore to control grubs, so here's WIKI:

After researching this on the web, the consensus of the extension programs is that Milky Spore controls Japanese Beetle grubs only. Various vendor websites claim that it controls the other grub species as well, but I have not found cooperative extension research that confirms this.

http://www.ladybug.uconn.edu/WhiteGrubs.htm

In my little corner of South County, RI, 90 % of the grubs are Oriental Beetle. Maybe 4 % are Asiatic Beetle, and 4 % are Japanese Beetle, and 2 % covers the rest.

I'd like to try Milky Spore to control the Oriental Beetles, but I can't find any scientific research to back it up. If someone knows of a scientific study of Milky Spore and Oriental Beetles, I would like to hear about it.

[tattoobob]

Yeah I would never pay that much, I don't even mulch every year, I just turn it over. if it wasn't under 300 I wouldn't even think of it.

[zimmy]

Originally Posted by tattoobob

I just signed up for tru-green chemlawn

I have a really tough time with crab grass the last 3 years and nothing I do is working it just gets worse.

They promised me it would go away or they would do it for free

the cost of them doing there service is less than I can buy the Scotts system 4

Do you have a dog or kids that use your yard or house? My wife is a vet and one thing they look at in veterinary medicine is something about \a significant correlation between the chemicals they use in chem lawn type companies and some sort of carcinoma or other cancer (not sure) in dogs. Also have read studies that the residues from chemlawn can be found in carpets for up to 6 years after use is stopped. They have also found substantial amounts on toys and other kids things inside homes.


...as far as organics don't work that is fundamentally not true. Yeah they don't work if you want your lawn to look like astroturf. You would have to allow for some dandelions and clover and other things that bees and stuff require. Once you do chemicals everything in the soil is dead and you only have non-native single species of grass. The thread started with advice for a "healthy lawn." Chemically induced grass only yard that dies as soon as the yearly chemical applications stop aren't really healthy by any definition in my very humble opinion

[Raven]

you are a very Wize man...

and that was very well spoken...


most chemicals used for fertilizers
are made from petroleum products

and all these chem lawn companies could give
a rats ass about the environment

i read not to many years ago about a guy that went walking barefoot
over his most gorgeous in the neighborhood lawn
and then became a total vegetable having to be spoon fed
in an institution like a baby....essentially...life over...

they are as bad as the tobacco industry if not worse

soil is not comprised of just this brown stuff thats dead
to begin with.... theres thousands of micro organisms
in there all working 24 hours a day...

just like drinking water....it's not pure H2o it's got
all kinds of life forms in it.... it's more alive than inert..

everyone is trying to make their yards into this
award winning homes and gardens magazine cover
and soon they are are addicted to using all this crap
and it smells and is all over the garage...bottles of this
boxes of that....gooey sticky..yucky...
it drives me insane...to see all that waste of money

when i walk thru home depot or lowes to get some hardware
or maybe a piece of plywood... i walk by all that crap...
always have and always will..

i used to buy bird seed for the outdoor birds at walmart
on occasion...then they relocated it all next to the malithion
and all these other NASTY chemicals and i said NO F-ing way
do i want to have to smell those fumes and breath it in.......

-just to go get birdseed

so i complained to management
they didnt give a damn so i no longer shop there except
for an occasional quart of oil or brake fluid maybe

we are all walking bags of chemicals...

especially those manufactured in our brains... which are electro-chemical in nature

each subsequent generation has become ever so much more
intolerant to the levels of pollution or sensative or allergic
to the over abundance of chemicals used for everything now

those all end up either in the atmosphere and then get rained back
down on us or the get into the soil or the water...

and eventually: will affect our lives one way or another

[zimmy]

thanks Raven, that may be the first time someone has referred to me as wise without a 3 letter reference to a back side.

[Raven]

even though i am not a big fan of Seals

the thought of a newly born pure white seal
1 minute old.......
laying on the ice in the artic where every thing seems so clean
and abundant

already has pesticides in its system....

that has changed my thinking in a major way...

the Earth and it's inhabitants have reached the saturation level
for toxins and pollutants... so it's everyones responsibility

to figure just how they can personally make a difference

besides recycling newspaper or soda cans or plastic

it's about doing things the old fashioned way before
companies like Monsanto came about and made us addicts
that have to use their crap...just to grow grass...

when DDT was outlawed in America the company just sold it
to South America and south America sells produce to America

[Raven]

and i understand the fishermans hatred of the animal
and it's perfectly justified

i'd go seal clubbing and splatter seal blood all over the ice any day
and leave them for the polar bears and artic fox to eat...

the point i was trying to make was about individual responsibility
when it comes to the obsession we americans have over the perfect lawn.

I used to watch this one idiot...walk out to his lawn every time a leaf
fell off his tree and pick that solitary leaf up over and over and over.

that's absolutely INSANE

not that i care really, but one of the reasons the Arabs hate us
is because of our insanity over growing grass..
and i can understand why......
i hate the stuff actually except for the fact it cools things down
and makes good compost.,& .mulch .........golf courses Suck!

i'd rather have IVY or clover or vegetables on my lawn instead.

but the fact remains using herbicides, insecticides, and other chemicals
is getting into everything even the nations children the same as anti depressents
are finding their way back into the drinking water in minute quantities
from flushing them down the magic toilet....bye bye pills...yeah right..
.like Arnold Swarzenager they are laughing at us saying "I'll be Back"

Now they are in the fish downstream ... too....

[Goose]

Arab's are jealous.
You make some very good points but its a little unrealistic. Some of the stuff you do is unconventional to say the least....cutting grass only before rain or wood ashes on grass etc. Don't get me wrong, just yesterday I spread ashes based on your advice only because I have it. I believe organic fertilizer cost 3 times more then the regular. There are lots of things people can do and should do to make this place better. IMO. Useing less would be fine, rather then going cold turkey.
I knooow I knooow ....you need every inch of your property to grow food because of the rising food costs.
How do you cut your grass...with a sickle?

[Raven]

Originally Posted by Goose

Arab's are jealous.
You make some very good points but its a little unrealistic. Some of the stuff you do is unconventional to say the least....cutting grass only before rain or wood ashes on grass etc. Don't get me wrong, just yesterday I spread ashes based on your advice only because I have it. I believe organic fertilizer cost 3 times more then the regular. There are lots of things people can do and should do to make this place better. IMO. Useing less would be fine, rather then going cold turkey.
I knooow I knooow ....you need every inch of your property to grow food because of the rising food costs.
How do you cut your grass...with a sickle?

i have an acre of grass to mow at present ( the riding lawn mower cost 150 bucks used) and i hope to keep reducing it like what Paul said in an earlier post... actually , when i said use wood ashes i was referring to using them in the garden as opposed to using them on the lawn... Lime can burn if over applied but ashes are a little less corrosive to plants...

I don't need every inch of land to grow food....but i'm hoping to do it as a business after i have satisfied all of our food requirements....i'm still eating frozen veggies from my last garden at my former residence ....remember the comment you made ...i believe it was you... saying you've got enough food to feed an Army...

Perhaps what i do IS unconventional Goose but i am Scottish and thus ultra thrifty by necessity... some people will walk by a dropped penny and i do too. I won't walk by a good washer or a bolt....and it goes in the drawer of spare parts for that rainy day.

[tattoobob]

Originally Posted by zimmy

Do you have a dog or kids that use your yard or house? My wife is a vet and one thing they look at in veterinary medicine is something about \a significant correlation between the chemicals they use in chem lawn type companies and some sort of carcinoma or other cancer (not sure) in dogs. Also have read studies that the residues from chemlawn can be found in carpets for up to 6 years after use is stopped. They have also found substantial amounts on toys and other kids things inside homes.

No kids or Dogs, I have had second thoughts but I am going thru with it for this season anyways

[Raven]

you might think it is... nope

but they charge you an arm and leg for it
when all the materials are essentially free

you take one part ground up leaves
run them over with the lawn mower
(just dont use oak leaves)
one part grass clippings
one part soil to introduce soil bacteria
(you can buy activator in a can too)
and one part manure of choice
Horse manure is always free !!!


you start the pile on top of some sticks to
allow air into the pile

then you make a 6 inch layer of each material
in the same order over and over until you
have a pile thats about 4 feet square by four feet high

you keep it watered so it's damp
like a squeezed out sponge
you can also insert a short length of perforated
drainage pipe in the center to add extra O2
and this makes the pile heat up quick

within 2 to 3 days it should be steaming
after four - six days if you shoved your hand
into the center of the pile you'd get burned
it gets THAT hot ok 160 -180 degrees

in about ten days to 12 days
the pile will reduce in size due to decomposition
by about 1/3 .... and then start to cool off

this is where you pitch fork the pile into
a second pile next to it trying to put the
outside to the middle so it'll heat up a 2nd time


water lightly (squeezed out sponge remember)
then you watch for steam again
and at the end of two- three weeks the pile
should be about half the size now
(it might take a full month )

this is where you can sift out the finer stuff
through a 1/4 inch mesh screen and save the
the coarse materials for the next pile
if done right it should smell kinda sweet

you spread this on the lawn before a rain
or set up the sprinkler.....and then watch out
because your lawn will grow like magic beans

end of lesson

[tattoobob]

We get our compost free from our sewage treatment plant in town

[bloocrab]

Back to Lawn Care -


I have a newly seeded lawn from late last season. I currently have A LOT of Holidays in my lawn...ie: bald spots.

What's the best way to get it to FILL back in?

Re-seed those areas?

Roll out those areas?

I imagine I'll have to drop some more Loom too....

any thoughts ?

[Goose]

What 'I' would do is have someone go there and check it out.
Ooor. If those spots have been washed out hit them with loam, plenty seed and starter fertilizer...don't forget to roll it. You don't need a spreader, throw the seed so it falls through your fingers while throwing, same with starter. Then keep moist. Home depot also sells easier products that are used to fill in spots,, just water. I have seen good results but never used it.

[Raven]

you have to scratch up those areas re seed and the roll it out again

another trick is to borrrow sod from the edges - you cut six inch strips with a very sharp edger and lay them across the bare spots
depending on how big they are of course , until they are filled in

and where you borrowed the grass it will fill itself back in fairly quick
if you keep that edge watered

but you always borrow from the areas where the grass seems to grow the easiest and lay it down where the grass seems difficult to grow.

[bloocrab]

Originally Posted by Raven

......another trick is to borrrow sod from the edges - you cut six inch strips with a very sharp edger and lay them across the bare spots.......

That was my plan for the larger spots, I have areas that I'll be mulching, and from those areas is where I'll pull my carpet from to fill in the big spots....but with the mini-bald spots ALL OVER the place, I guess I'm sprinkling loom and seed.

The steps I ass/ume I'll be taking.

1. spread the loom/fertilizer
2. seed the fertilized loom
3. roll the seeded fertilized loom
4. water the seeded fertilized loom
5. shoot all birds that land on watered seeded fertilized loom


Am I even remotely close???

[Raven]

but depending on the depth of the loam your about to add.....
you could sprinkle some grass seed down first and cover it
lightly with the loam and then roll it and sprinkle a little grass seed on top too....

the main objective is to get the grass seed in firm contact with the soil
and not have the sprouting grass seed dry out

for best germination you want to replant grass seed like 7 days
before the full moon which forces the water into the grass seed
via hydroscopic pressure ( it's highest at the full moon)
to achieve the highest germination rate possible

[bloocrab]

Is it too early in the season to do it now, should I wait for the fullness of the moon or warmer temps, Or just get err' done ASAP?

Also, When should spead the Lye on the Lawn??


Thanks in advance ~

[Raven]

even though the last expected spring frost is approximately
on May 15th grass is very hardy and is turning green underneath wet spring snow showers and loving it....

Notice how its raining now......the moon just passed thru Pisces..

the best time to start anything new and have it last is always when the moon is in the sign of Taurus
which will be this Sunday starting at around 9:00 PM
and it'll go til monday until 9:00 PM .

So do it this sunday right after the rain clears out...then you'll have
6 days before the full moon which is just perfect...
Note: this is to ensure germination of the grass seed and not
expecting it to be an inch tall...

i have already planted peas outside and they'll push up through a inch of snow like nothing happy with the extra watering...

grass is kinda like peas....in that, you generally can't give them to much water....

the rule of thumb when planting seeds of any kind is...

have the soil depth
no more that twice the thickness of the seed when covering it...
which is why many lawn people sprinkle it on top and hope for the best...

but then your germination rate is cut in half "sometimes"
plus the sparrows have a field day

...so you can safely go with 1/8th to 1/4 inch depth
of top soil or loam on top of seed and it'll still sprout fine...

when its rolled with a roller
there's less tendency for it to dry out before the roots get a chance to make a foot hold,

because the firm contact with the soil on top of it is making contact "tightly" and prevents that.

[Raven]

they sell ph meters for like 10 bucks at most nursery outlets

you push it in and it reads the ph

determine the ph first...

[Flaptail]

Let it all die, more time for the new boat! Less care too! Saves water, no chemical applications, thats really being "green" in my book!

[Raven]

do it the BIGFISH way

and.............

[Slingah]

this is a great thread...thanks all.
quick question....how do I seed bald spots I'll get some loam & seed)
AND prevent crabgrass???

[Karl F]

Originally Posted by Slingah

this is a great thread...thanks all.
quick question....how do I seed bald spots I'll get some loam & seed)
AND prevent crabgrass???

Scotts 202932 Step 1 - Starter Fertilizer for Seeding

step one for seeding and halts for crabgrass.
best job related seminar of my winter was with the folks from Scott/Ortho/Miraclegrow..they know green.

[SurfCaster413]

Originally Posted by Slingah

this is a great thread...thanks all.
quick question....how do I seed bald spots I'll get some loam & seed)
AND prevent crabgrass???

Loam and seed it when the grass grows you need to mow it at least 3 times before you put step 1 down. Step 1 is a pre immergent and will stop the growth of grass.