Striped Bass, the condition of the fishery

[Fish_Eye]

Hi Everyone,

This is a subject that I know a little bit about. I worked with National Geographic on two projects related to mycobacteriosis: “Strange Days on Planet Earth/Dirty Secrets” and “Wild Chronicles”.

As for Capt. Jim White’s assessment of the situation as being grim…well it is! Jim DOESN’T make assumptions, he bases his conclusions on FACTS. I’ve followed this situation for years, read most of the studies and concur with Jim White and #^&#^&#^&#^& Russell.

Yes, there is a need for ecosystem wide management of both game fish and forage fish. This was recommended to Congress in 1999; it’s been 10 years and we don’t even have workable models for dealing with this complex issue. Add to this the relatively new threat of midwater and pair trawling off OUR coast and it’s a surefire recipe for disaster. You think we have problems with forage fish now, you can’t even begin to imagine the rape of the resource that is going on RIGHT THIS MINUTE off our coast. The mackerel stocks off RI that could have sustained the local day boats for a couple of weeks were decimated in ONE TOW late last week by one of these huge boats. Check out http://www.comminternet.com/websites...tail.php?id=28
and get an idea of the scope of the problem. Want to know where your river herring are? They got scooped up with the targeted Atlantic herring and with little observe coverage to document the bycatch we have little hope to get the proper time and territory closures we need to protect the bluebacks and alewives. Think the bass are skinny now (and they are malnourished in many of the areas I film in -- which translates to areas you fish in) wait till they arrive this spring and find fewer herring, fewer mackerel, and possibly fewer menhaden.

Yes the fish in the Chesapeake are under extreme duress…in fact, a noted expert on the subject of gut content has established that one of the peak periods for feeding takes place right around now, IN THE WINTER (something biologists believed didn’t happen), in order to help fortify their reproductive systems for upcoming spawning. The problem is that there are far too few menhaden age 0 to provide adequate nourishment for the pre-spawn fish that are too small to eat mature menhaden…see http://www.chesbay.org/articles/latest.asp for more details.
Let's not forget a growing dead zone in the Chesapeake, over nitrification of the bay with run off from the poultry industry (which may be getting a stay of execution from having to deal with their immense contribution to this problem -- got to love big business and their influence).

In the past I couldn’t support game fish status for stripers simply because a well managed stock should provide enough fish for both recreational and commercial interests. However, over the past several years I’ve seen more and more pressure put on the stocks by both user groups. Yes, the recreational take is massive, however the commercial quotas never seem to be high enough for the commercial interests and the black market fishery is completely out of control. How many pirates do you know? How many pseudo-commercial fishermen are out there looking to offset boating and fishing expenses? How many “anglers” sell fish at the back door of a restaurant? How many tons of undersized fish make it to market? How many fishermen exceed their quota and look at a fine as a reasonable cost of doing business? How much meaningful enforcement is there out there?

Consider all of the above and all the anecdotal evidence that the fishery is in decline and it’s time to do something NOW.

I’m not sure that game fish status is a winnable battle, but when I hear commercial striped bass fisherman, who also run charter boats say that they would like to see a halt to the commercial fishing because they would rather have a successful charter business rather than an ever shrinking commercial catch that eventually leads to a collapse and then no business at all.

So what do we do? Talking about it on the site is fine for spreading the word and getting more public awareness, but talk is not going to make one bit of difference. You need to go to the meetings and voice your outrage with the current situation. You need to support organizations that our working to correct these problems. Game fish status for striped bass…I’m still on the fence, but it won’t take much for me to say, enough is enough -- the resource needs to be saved.

Remember, history has a way of repeating itself.

Mike

[hq2]

I don't think there's any doubt that things are not what they were 8 or 10 years ago. I've basically stopped fishing for stripers except maybe Mid June in the canal or Joppa, and even there they're not what they were. The fall migration has become almost a shadow of what it was. If we have to have another moratorium, so be it, but definitely something needs to be done about the herring situation, and closing the runs isn't the whole answer.

[EarnedStripes44]

he's right about the cheasapeake. The health of the largest estuary in the United States is comparable to a morbidly obese woman.

[Canalman]

Not sure if somebody already said this because I got sick of reading all the posts, but the bill proposes the closure of the commercial fishery and imposing a slot limit on the recreational angler (exactly the same as Maine's).

To say that closing the commerical fishery won't help is ludicrous! If you take the privillege of taking 30 fish per day away from the best striper anglers in the world you're going to save a lot of fish.

Anyone who thinks that Stripers Forever is going to then run with this and take away striper fishing or something silly like that is lost in space. Just like people who are afraid the president is going to take away guns or something like that, their ideas have to be voted upon and therefore no one person or oragnizations beliefs can be forced into law. I hear the voices of some people who are going to miss taking a few weeks off from work in the summer to go fishing everyday if this bill passes in this thread.

It has already been proven that fisheries managers and fishermen have no idea how to fish with care and that we have no problem (or qualms about) pushing fish stocks to their breaking point. There are just about no inshore cod left anywhere south of Plymouth (to my knowledge) and the cod stocks in the Maritimes have not recovered after a 10 year moratorium. Our fishermen are very good at what they do and these voices in here sound eerily the same as those that echoed out in the years before the last collapse.

How can you say that closing the commercial fishery won't work? It worked last time! And it's at least a step right direction, if we get people used to the idea of conserving a commercially harvested fish, it might be easier to turn them on the menhaden and sea herring.

Preserving the species should be 100 times more important than making some extra cash this summer. Yes I had my commercial license last year, but it just gave me a sick feeling killing all those fish and I have chosen not to renew it this year.

I say close it up, and bring on the slot limit, we haven't tried that combo yet and we need to save these fish, and we shouldn't wait until it looks really bad.

If you don't like Stripers Forever, (I have no opinion about them btw), then someone needs to form a new organization, because they are the only people actively fighting for anything releated to the striped bass in the mainstream anyway. Maybe RFA should get involved? Or maybe all of us should stop crying online and make a step for own future instead of just sitting by and then sobbing over the results?

Was that too cut throat?

[Canalman]

"The new Massachusetts Striped Bass Conservation Bill prohibits the sale of wild striped bass in the Commonwealth and sets a recreational daily bag limit of one striper measuring between 20 and 26 inches, or alternatively, one fish of 40 inches or greater per angler."

This is a direct quote from their press release

[MakoMike]

One fact that all you guy screaming about the menhaden need to take into account. When stripers are first born and in their larval stages in the chessie and hudson, menhaden are their biggest predators.

[FishermanTim]

As is the american eel.
Isn't funny that when they get larger they turn the tables?

[Cape Cod 19]

Originally Posted by Fish_Eye

In the past I couldn’t support game fish status for stripers simply because a well managed stock should provide enough fish for both recreational and commercial interests. However, over the past several years I’ve seen more and more pressure put on the stocks by both user groups. Yes, the recreational take is massive, however the commercial quotas never seem to be high enough for the commercial interests and the black market fishery is completely out of control. How many pirates do you know? How many pseudo-commercial fishermen are out there looking to offset boating and fishing expenses? How many “anglers” sell fish at the back door of a restaurant? How many tons of undersized fish make it to market? How many fishermen exceed their quota and look at a fine as a reasonable cost of doing business? How much meaningful enforcement is there out there?

Consider all of the above and all the anecdotal evidence that the fishery is in decline and it’s time to do something NOW.

The only sector who has increased their "pressure" is the recreational.

Recs are killing 2/3 as many fish as they are keeping and they are already taking 80% of all the fish. Their discard mortality is equal to all the commercial landings and discards....so who do the fish really need saving from?

[Clammer]

Dave ;;

I agree & disagree ;;

that bill or whatever is only in Mass . so yes it will put the mass commercials OOB / & with a slot / have it more difficult to keep a bas s . But lets be realistic
I don,t know all the numbers especially by state .. RI,s commercial R & R season is a joke / 5 fish a day per week /with the days being Sunday Thru Thursday . & the spring season closing in two weeks or less / while the fall season can start as 3 or 5 fish a day / then they close it short again / even if the fish arn,t coming in / then they open it again & in the last few years its been open longer /because by then they can,t reach the yearly Quota so they have opened it to draggers .
The traps are part of the quota & the size they are allowed to sell is smaller than the R&R .
IMO .. do you really thing stopping just MA , R&R from commercial fishing & a slot is going to turn this around .
For the most part / Ma commercial season was a bust . not many boats did 30 per day / & for those that did there were plenty that couldn,t get 5 /
After all this is said & done / how is this going t change the status of the striper population .
Millions & millions of pounds will still be taken by rec,s up & down the coast & add the commercial dragging that is allowed down south ... It looks ike from here .. that its a sword thru the Ma R&R & a band aid to the mass REC,s
have have no interest in Mass commercial tooooo F #$%^&*( old to play that game anymore ;
bait or no bait . it does have some effect /but the actual reduction of the stripers [again] is a combination of all of the above / plus pollution issue .s & disease ;;;
the C/B had a 25 year plan to clean it up / but as I said before it was a recommendation //& not a law / so the fencing that was suppose to keep the actual [%$%$%$%$} from farm animals washing into the small creeks & streams & eventually into the C/b system . never happened & now 25 years lTER & AROUND 6 BILLION DOLLARS LIGHT / THEY are talking about doing approx the same thing . / by excluding the famers / mostly the chicken farmers ;

If anyone has worked on a dragger of anysize [even] for a week / then they have seen what they catch & what by catch / undersize / off season fish are sholved back over the side ;;;

this is a whole lot larger than Stripers forever going to try & make it a game fish in JUST Mass .

that would do as much good as pouring a 8oz . glass on beer in a 55gal. barrel that has a whole in it ;;;

Just my honest opinion & observation of being on the water 50 years .. not 3 months on weelends .,.,

Carry on MIKE

[MagicWand]

Short and sweet!......Protect the baitfish first.

[fishaholic18]

Originally Posted by Clammer

Dave ;;


IMO .. do you really thing stopping just MA , R&R from commercial fishing & a slot is going to turn this around .
For the most part / Ma commercial season was a bust . not many boats did 30 per day / & for those that did there were plenty that couldn,t get 5 /

Well, the final #'s for 2008 aren't posted yet but I'm sure they came close if not hit the quota.. I know they were over 1/2 way there in a month..which Is down from years past but still a sh!tload of fish.
They have exceeded their quota of over 1,000,000lbs since 2003 (that's only because that's as far back as I could find records for). My info came from the Massachusetts Department of Fish and Game website... So..yes..that WILL have a huge effect on the SB population alone, imagine if they started cutting in in '03.

BTW.. I have had a MA comm. lic. in the past...and sold many fish legally.........and I will not discount getting it again,,,

[quick decision]

IF THE STRIPED BASS POPULATION WAS IN TROUBLE LIKE IS BEING SAID BY SOME, THEN WHY ISN'T THE BLUE FISH HEARD HAVING PROBLEMS? I SAW MORE FISH THIS YEAR THAN EVER BEFORE. PERHAPS THERE IS MORE BAIT IN THE WATER THAN YOU THINK AND THE FISH ARN'T MOVING AROUND AS MUCH. JUST BECAUSE YOU WENT TO YOUR FAVORITE FISHING SPOT AND GOT SKUNKED DOSN'T MEAN THE BASS POPULATION IS HAVING A PROBLEM.

[Crafty Angler]

Originally Posted by Clammer

Dave ;;

I agree & disagree ;;

that bill or whatever is only in Mass . so yes it will put the mass commercials OOB / & with a slot / have it more difficult to keep a bas s . But lets be realistic
I don,t know all the numbers especially by state .. RI,s commercial R & R season is a joke / 5 fish a day per week /with the days being Sunday Thru Thursday . & the spring season closing in two weeks or less / while the fall season can start as 3 or 5 fish a day / then they close it short again / even if the fish arn,t coming in / then they open it again & in the last few years its been open longer /because by then they can,t reach the yearly Quota so they have opened it to draggers .
The traps are part of the quota & the size they are allowed to sell is smaller than the R&R .
IMO .. do you really thing stopping just MA , R&R from commercial fishing & a slot is going to turn this around .
For the most part / Ma commercial season was a bust . not many boats did 30 per day / & for those that did there were plenty that couldn,t get 5 /
After all this is said & done / how is this going t change the status of the striper population .
Millions & millions of pounds will still be taken by rec,s up & down the coast & add the commercial dragging that is allowed down south ... It looks ike from here .. that its a sword thru the Ma R&R & a band aid to the mass REC,s
have have no interest in Mass commercial tooooo F #$%^&*( old to play that game anymore ;
bait or no bait . it does have some effect /but the actual reduction of the stripers [again] is a combination of all of the above / plus pollution issue .s & disease ;;;
the C/B had a 25 year plan to clean it up / but as I said before it was a recommendation //& not a law / so the fencing that was suppose to keep the actual [%$%$%$%$} from farm animals washing into the small creeks & streams & eventually into the C/b system . never happened & now 25 years lTER & AROUND 6 BILLION DOLLARS LIGHT / THEY are talking about doing approx the same thing . / by excluding the famers / mostly the chicken farmers ;

If anyone has worked on a dragger of anysize [even] for a week / then they have seen what they catch & what by catch / undersize / off season fish are sholved back over the side ;;;

this is a whole lot larger than Stripers forever going to try & make it a game fish in JUST Mass .

that would do as much good as pouring a 8oz . glass on beer in a 55gal. barrel that has a whole in it ;;;

Just my honest opinion & observation of being on the water 50 years .. not 3 months on weelends .,.,

Carry on MIKE

Ya know, I may be one of the few guys who is fluent in Clammish, but he makes sense to me, anyway...

Discounting poaching and illegal sales, the numbers just don't work - for all intents and purposes, there aren't any verifiable figures for the take by recreational fisherman targeting striped bass. What is being used now barely even qualifies as a guesstimate, at best.

I don't wanna set fire to my own teepee here, but data collection on that - meaning OUR - side of the fence is way the hell beyond imprecise. It's my understanding that the point of the coming saltwater license is to provide NOAA or NMFS or AFC with more precise numbers on recreational catch to set sustainable size and possession limits to bring striped bass to a sustainable fishery for the future. I hope that's going to be the case but I've got my doubts.

Even if the rec take figures do end up giving the fisheries managers good data, what is it that they intend to do with it? Ya know, it's obvious to just about everyone how important this issue is - and you've got recs and comms in a pitched battle between the two user groups. Striped bass are a common resource for ALL of us.

You want to point a finger at someone? Try pointing it at the fisheries managers - they're not working in the best interests of either us, both recs and comms or the bass. That's the third group in this mess and the one ultimately inflicting the most damage.

An 8 year old kid could tell you why bass are in jeopardy, for chrissakes -

1. You're not letting 'em eat, and
2. You're not letting 'em make baby bass like they used to so there's not enough to catch.
3. Ya gotta leave 'em alone for a little while until they get better. All of ya.

The problem is, there's no political will to do the right thing in terms of habitat and forage - because it's going to be extremely expensive and step on some very big toes in a lot of non-fishing industries. It will also take a paradigm shift in the way in which people have been led to believe they have to live their lives in terms of consumption. And those two issues cover both habitat and forage.

Absolutely no one wants to see a moritorium again - but in a few years there may not be a choice. There's way too much anecdotal evidence from just this board alone that doesn't look good. Everybody will have to take a reduction on an equal basis on a common resource.

To me it seems like the coup de grace for the striper is ultimately going to be delivered by the fisheries managers, if it is indeed going to happen. They're the guys at the helm, not us.

[Raven]

the animal farmers ,,,pigs & chickens ect. are seeing their animal waste as a source for making bio fuel and more money so eventually less of it will be washing into streams and rivers due to run -off...
but........
the use of pelleted grass fertilizers is a whole other dilemma
especially from golf courses ...and parks

i used to see mounds of cattle manure in texas bigger than a football field that was 30' tall... that's all gonna change....

[DZ]

Some good points mentioned in above posts. While a gamefish status in Mass may not make much difference in the "big picture" it would increase the numbers of surviving bass that call Mass waters home for much of the season. Just imagine how many pin hook boats pound Sow & Pigs and Gay Head during the season. Their take is a LOT of quality bass that, if there is no sale, will continue to populate local waters stabilizing the local population. Every bass that is not kept or sent to market is a bass that everyone has a chance of catching in the future. Of course every quality bass that is released increases the amount that a pin hooker can sell.

DZ

[Slipknot]

Originally Posted by DZ

Of course every quality bass that is released increases the amount that a pin hooker can sell.

DZ

ya DZ, I do think about that when I release a quality fish , say in the canal during comm season, and i kind of bums me out but then again that fish doesn't have any chance at all if I kept it or another rec. caught and kept it. I'll just keep releasing what I can and hope for the best.



Did clammer really write that?

[NIB]

Originally Posted by RIROCKHOUND

Either 1 fish @36"
OR a slot limit like Maine coast wide.
1 @ either 20-26" or over 40" NO more 2 fish...
Fix the forage (which does not mean ban ALL menhaden fishing)
Tighter regulations on pirates/poachers.

If our stocks are in trouble do you think it is wise to take a fish that has not yet had the chance to spawn..And easier to catch..
Perhaps a slot of 1 @ 28-34 inches would be better along with one over 45 inches.A truer trophy size type allotment.

I happen to agree I think the stocks are off.I think there are many reasons why from the big trawlers taking herring and mackerel and the like to seals who are ravenous feeders of the forage fish also to the condition of the waters in the breeding grounds.The Hudson fishery is in no great shakes either.The herring run which coincides with the migratory spawning run of the bass is gone....I think at this point any step towards conservation is a good one. We have to start somewhere and build off of it.You cannot ask the herring boats to stop taking the forage till we do what we can on our end as rec's to protect the fishery.
I think one only has to look at the situation of the cod stoicks to see the management of the waters of the GOM need some serious attention..I have seen too many fisheries disappear to never return..

[RIROCKHOUND]

Tony good points... From the MD fish/game website:
http://www.dnr.state.md.us/fisheries...tripedbass.asp

# Female striped bass can mature as early as age 4; however, it takes several years (age 8 or older) for spawning females to reach full productivity.
# Males can mature as early as age 2.

I'm still a 1 fish 36" advocate; it will reduce the amount of fish taken by a lot;

So maybe a little larger slot is appropriate. I'd be more in favor of a larger upper limit; i.e. One @ 28-24" and 45" (just saw you posted the same slot size) and above...

[MikeToole]

Originally Posted by Slipknot

ya DZ, I do think about that when I release a quality fish , say in the canal during comm season, and i kind of bums me out but then again that fish doesn't have any chance at all if I kept it or another rec. caught and kept it. I'll just keep releasing what I can and hope for the best.
Did clammer really write that?

This follows with my earlier post in that it is hard to convince many recreational fisherman to release fish as long as there is a commercial fishery. If you stop commercial fishing it would be easier to convince people to release fish. Plus even more important it would be easier to put stricter catch limits on the recreational fisherman because you would be saving the fish for them.

I wonder if we learned anything from the past. If the numbers are even close to right we are killing bass at a higher rate then we were in the early 70s. Maine, NJ and NH do not allow commercial fishing, if a big user state like Mass stops it may really start the ball rolling. So don't under estimate what this may do.

[NIB]

Originally Posted by RIROCKHOUND

Tony good points... From the MD fish/game website:
http://www.dnr.state.md.us/fisheries...tripedbass.asp

# Female striped bass can mature as early as age 4; however, it takes several years (age 8 or older) for spawning females to reach full productivity.
# Males can mature as early as age 2.

I'm still a 1 fish 36" advocate; it will reduce the amount of fish taken by a lot;

So maybe a little larger slot is appropriate. I'd be more in favor of a larger upper limit; i.e. One @ 28-24" and 45" (just saw you posted the same slot size) and above...

I am also fine with one at 36"..Makes everything easier..
You cannot believe or maybe you can the education/enforcement nightmare of multiple slot limits..Just go to any busy tackle shop on a saturday afternoon as they try to educate their customers..
We had something like this in NJ a few years ago.

[Back Beach]

Originally Posted by MikeToole

If the numbers are even close to right we are killing bass at a higher rate then we were in the early 70s. Maine, NJ and NH do not allow commercial fishing, if a big user state like Mass stops it may really start the ball rolling. So don't under estimate what this may do.

I don't feel like we are killing more now than back in the 70's. Back then everything was kept regardless of size becuase there were minimal, if any, regulations other than the 16" size limit.

The Mass commercial season is a joke to me not due to the amount thats harvested, but that its a free for all. The biggest issue for me is the ability for an out of stater to purchase a license and harvest the Mass quota. Its simply assinine as there is no reciprocal with other states that allow commercial harvest. I don't support full exclusivity on the license, meaning only "full time" commercials can or should harvest all the fish. The Mass resident taxpayers should reap the benefit of exclusivity versus allowing any other states to participate.

My personal take is there's still a lot of fish, although there may be fewer than 10 years ago following the moratorium. I don't fully buy the Myco epidemic either. I think its seemingly more prevalent because its being talked about more. I'm also basing my views on what I've experienced and I haven't seen many myco laced fish in my travels.

[NIB]

I have seen em where I fish.The infected fish that is.They are nasty they run from a few sores to full on popcorn puss balls.
I have at times cut my line so's not to have to touch em.
Nasty stuff..
Even if you don't believe the stocks are in trouble.Why not err on the side of protecting the fish.??
It's the safe bet..

[Clammer]

B/B

Your right .. anyone can get a Ma. commercial license / that why [I thnk} its in the neighborhood of 5000 of them .

In RI it is a very limited entry .. I believe there are 2 or 3 available for 2009 .
So the last few springs /when we have had alot of market size bass in the bay ......... guys that wanted in .were SOL >>. it least RI is very strick of issuing any kind of commerciL FISHING LICENSE . you can,t get a quohaug license or clam license either // again that fishery too will let a very few into that industry / soley based on the stock & license that didn,t renew for one reason or another .
Back when licenses were readly available / ..everyone had them Inculding out of start anglers // & there are still OOS anglers the fish RI commercially
When they put the freeze on the catching & keeping & selling of stripers . many of these people didn,t renew their licenses ... I can,t count the number of guys that are pissed they let thier licenses go ..
even many diggers / that,s a tough way to make a living & often when a guy has a opportunity to get a real job // they grabbed it ... then things went sour & they also are SOL .

We /the average guy doesn,t even know how many people actually sell fish .
the state does because we have log books that have to be filled out in detail on a daily basis & turned into the state quarterly ;
the reason being / the average commercial fisherman does n,t know .. if that @ one time RI issued a Multi-purpose license / which almost covered all kinds of commercial fisheries . This lincense is no longet available thru the state . The only way one of these can be transferred / if a fisherman has documated proof of so many landing in a certain period of time & he sells his whole business . his complete fishing rig // & even then the paperwork is passed thru the level in the dem & is approved by a high level offical '
getting back to the M/P licenses that are still active .. we don,t know how many are being used for what .. some may be being used for only one fishery / while others may being used in a few / I know alot of guys th a t have the M/P license that only are doing one fishery / but they were wise enough to keep paying the additional fee to keep the M/P ,,, that has always given them a option / Most of us way back used it for mainly digging & fishing / no clue now ;;


Slip >>>yA possed out of the plug forum

[BassDawg]

LOTS of GOOOOD points being stated here;

i firstly and foremostly have to agree with the Fixing of the Forage.

gamefish status seems, imho, to be a moot point if the increased #'s of stripers must work harder to locate their first choice and best nutritional value ~bunker, lb for lb~ bang for the buck that they have been foraging on for centuries. could the increase in the "racers" population be a result of myco bact. AND a decrease in READILY available menhaden???

i imagine this racer stock having to swim farther and farther and already low on nutrition from their nutriously deficient breeding grounds~~~~~~~~~then as they return to their migratory haunts, the same lack of menhaden than say X number of years ago, contributes to a "sickly" stock base that might be more susceptable to myco bacteriosis where they breed and less nourished when they return to the same menhaden depleted OBX. seems like a vicious, multiplying, and repeating cycle that has yet to reach it's MAX potential for disaster,,,,,,,,,,

i say that the Omega Proteins of the world need to diversify and find alternative sources for fish oil and they can plant soy beans for chicken feed!! why not farm the menhaden and leave the wild ones ALONE?? i'm no rocket scientist; but it seems to me that a soy bean field would be onehelluvalot cheaper to service and maintain than a fleet of purse seiners and their spotter planes~~ FOGEDDAH BOUT the indisputable damage that has been done to the Atlantic Coast Stock of Menhaden. human GREED knows no bounds and often will not stop until her obese adzzz is getting her stomach stapled with a fistful of oreos(bunker) in onehand, boatloads of CASH in the other, and her feet firmly planted on the necks of stripers,,,,,,,,,,,,,

on a another tine of this multi-pronged discussion,

while i am quite sure that Mister McKenna's anecdotal observations are very true and accurate,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,from my limited experience and in the "samplings" that i found from '08 i ran into schoolies first in the spring to june from DI to GLCSTR, then i had a better year than in '07 for keepers by size and pb and less racers than '06 and '07 combined. also, the Fall began with a run of schoolies after a great year of big fish up Cape Ann way, and i missed the blitzes due to mucho work. my numbers may be skewed and i fished much less than in '07, but i C&R many fish that covered the entire spectrum of sizes and what seems to be the "right" pattern of progression?? and for the first time in three years i ran into fall morning boos and a deep of the night beached fall inshore cod on the Other Cape in '08. what this ALL means, is for the marinebiologists, but from this layman's perspective seems "normal".

lastly, regarding the liscensing/slots/fisheries mngmnt debate,

i will say this,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,i will concurr with Bryan and others in that we need slots or 1@36"+ with just a coupla provisos. WHEN the feds/states enact this liscensing tariff, i hope and pray that the monies are targeted monies that will and MUST go back into research, enforcement, and parks and recreation.

notsomuch for me and my selfish desires to win back some of the shoreline from the bluebloods and their politicos, but in the interest of proferring the opportunity to pass-on the quintessential NE experience to the generations that will follow,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,our legacy must not only deal with the matters at hand ~~and they ARE multiple~~but we must also consider our children and our children's children.

certainly the Narragansetts from the 1200's - 1700's were responsible enough to ensure that their future peoples had stripers to eat, sell, trade. are we THAT much more shallow and THAT less considerate of one of God's greatest provisions (to include the oceans, the forage, and the species) that we could repeat the atrocities of 80's and the decimation of the American Bison?? both were proud species that flourished and were managed most effectively without phd's, science, mangmt councils, or a gov't that could care less about what's GOOD for its God given resources. these precious commodities were respected by a peoples that knew their intrinsic values for the GOOD of the whole planet and for the enrichment of their immediate, intermediate, and their lives ad infinitum.

i am fully aware that THESE are different times, but WHO
made them this different and at WHAT monumentous COSTS??
for once i would like to see the US of A proact instead of react,
since the latter is always too little too late and wreaks irrepairable
damage more often than NOT!!!

just sum thoughts,,,,,,,,,gents,,,,,,,,,,carry on!

[MagicWand]

Some of the same people who complain about taking 2 bass a day will take 2-3 dozen bunker or other baitfish per day and have no problem with it at all. I grew up catching bass with live pogies. Then they disappeared from our waters. As soon as they came back everyone hit them hard and acted like they discovered that live bait catches big bass. No kidding!! We all have look at life in the oceans differently than we once did. Protect it from the bottom up. You can,t have numbers of Stripers skyrocket while baitfish numbers drop. So protect the baitfish and where they live first. Otherwise it won,t work. IMO

[BasicPatrick]

Originally Posted by Fish_Eye

So what do we do? Talking about it on the site is fine for spreading the word and getting more public awareness, but talk is not going to make one bit of difference. You need to go to the meetings and voice your outrage with the current situation. You need to support organizations that our working to correct these problems. Game fish status for striped bass…I’m still on the fence, but it won’t take much for me to say, enough is enough
Mike

Well said Mike....this bit above is the actual bottom line...less than 6 recreaitonal fishers at the last dozen hearings on bunker and river herring...this is why we loose.

[MagicWand]

Originally Posted by MakoMike

One fact that all you guy screaming about the menhaden need to take into account. When stripers are first born and in their larval stages in the chessie and hudson, menhaden are their biggest predators.

Nature knows what it,s doing. It,s been doing it for millions of years. And now your going to step in with a better plan. laughable..priceless.

[BassDawg]

Originally Posted by BasicPatrick

Well said Mike....this bit above is the actual bottom line...less than 6 recreaitonal fishers at the last dozen hearings on bunker and river herring...this is why we loose.

i would LOVE to be more visual,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

yet, aren't most of these meetings when
us blue collar guys are working ??

if memory serves the last couple of meetings were being held
around 10:30 and in Providence, when i work/live in Boston/NShore.

makes it kinda tough to participate, but i did send an email
the last time you told us to fire something off about the
herring bycatch losses,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,what can i do on w/ends, brah??

[inTHERAPY]

I have sent my request to Sen Menard and my reps asking them not to support this bill. I do not think that MA commercial fisherman, including myself on a part-time basis, should be shut out of the fisheries. I do not buy the SF line. That being said, I posted my thoughts about the desease elsewhere and the need to "think about the fishery" and got my a-hole ripped. If the response I received is any indication of the response being sent to the legislature this bill is gonna have a tough time going through.

[Canalman]

How can anyone call closing the Commercial Season a moot point? If you really think the recreational set is doing more damage, which over the season they might be, you're still saving over a million pounds of commercial bass not to mention the tens-of-thousands of pounds of hardly mentioned cull fish that get tossed over the side when the 31st to 50th bass of the day is bigger than one they kept earlier that morning.

If you're going to keep the season open. Make it 5 fish per day 7 days a week, all season long, that way there is no "free for all" as BackBeach put it and the market doesn;t flood. You can sell your 20 or 30 at $2.00 pp when the market is flooded or you can stabilize the market by guranteeing a fresh, daily supply the restaurants will put it on the menu and the price will go UP.

Next, make it MA residents only. These two changes would keep the guys who save their vacation time to go fishing everyday to make extra money off the water. No one can justify taking time off to sell 5 fish per day.

If you all want your chance to save the bait
Vote on the new Menhaden Bill in MA, they are trying to open our inshore waters to purse seining for Menhaden again.

We need to organize a F()KING bus trip for this one!

I still think we should close the commercial fishery, we're NOT saving ANYTHING by keeping it open and that really IS the BOTTOM LINE.

-Dave