60.85 Lber wieghed for the Cup!

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by BigFish

The only logical way you can keep from contributing to the decline of striped bass is to not fish for them at all! Again though....why do people have to piss all over a thread to voice their own little agendas???

As a disclaimer, I caught a 59 pounder once that I knew was the biggest striper in the Fisherman magazine's annual dream boat contest, and so I kept the fish (and alas, didn't win the 24 foot Triton, even though I was contacting marinas to reserve a slip). I felt, and still feel, awful about it. I did eat all the fillets (which tasted just like a 29" fish), but I did feel guilty about killing what was at least a 25 year-old fish.

That being said, I don't think he "pissed" all over the thread (not if you take the time to read what he actually wrote). And if his agenda is the health of the stock, I wouldn't trivialize it as his "own little agenda", because that's my agenda, and yours, too.

I don't begrudge anyone else keeping a trophy. If I had thousands of dollars to gain in a contest, money that could go in my kids' 529 plans, I'd probably keep another. I wouldn't do it just for a keepsake though, but that's just my $0.02.

And I don't see the relevence of suggesting you can't preach release unless you have caught one that big. Using that logic, I could say no one can support that guy unless you caught one that big, and few of us have.

[sokinwet]

Hey Ken - Tell Frankie congrat's on the "60" from the "northern contingent" of Team RD!! I'll bet the little guy is feeling pretty tall right about now!! I was out at Stellwagen chasing tuna and shaking off bass when I got your text/pic...amazing numbers of big fish out there but Frankies fish is truly a once in a lifetime fish for most guys. PS Every time I look at the board the guys have upped the anti to make the top ten....I'm humbled (almost) by you Jersey guys.

[JohnnyD]

There's so much love and cheer in here that I feel like I'm going to get diabetes.

[Saltheart]

Nice Fish! Congrats on fullfilling a dream.

I read all the posts. Its pretty surprising when the thread started to blow up. I didn't see anything way out of line or at a Peta level.

As much as people are entitled to catch , keep , take a picture and display that picture (all OK to me), receive congrats and words of envy at the luck and /or skill to have caught the fish , people are entitled to post a lament for a truly great fish's end.

I didn't see anything like "He's a murderer or "that fish was in pain when it died" , or other radical Peta type posts. I saw some people sharing the thrill of the catch , some enjoying seeing the pics , some disinterested and some thinking it should have been released. I honestly don't care whether people release any particular fish. They catch it , its their right to decide what to do with it.

Its too bad these threads flare up. IMO the Catch and Keep are way to combative about the opinions of the Catch and Release Types and the Catch and Release types are inconsiderate about posting their opinions in the threads that are started to show a fishermans success.

There is no need to encourage the Catch and Keeps to post pictures. many many large fish pictures are posted by the Angler or the business interest involved in the catch (Charter Boats or Commercial Fisherman). Its natural to want to show your success. I think the Catch and Release buys could learn something from them. I think the Catch and Release guys, who care so much as to always comment on the killing of a fish in a big fish picture, should post more pics of the big fish they catch and the act of releasing the same. To me they would recruit more people to the cause by such positive in nature pics than to only use dead fish pics posts as launch pads to promote catch and release.

Now just for the purpose of full disclosure , everyone I fish with knows I'm a Catch and release fisherman with few exceptions. The few exceptions relate to specific requests for some fish to eat by neighbors and friends. I do not look for people to eat the fish I catch but people know I fish and some on there own ask if I could bring them some fillets to eat. So I do. Some years I catch several hundred fish and keep zero. Some years I'm lucky to get a 100 and might keep 3 or 4. So anyway , just so people know my own practices relative to Catch and Release when they read what's posted above.

lastly , the issue of skill vs luck in catching a big fish also comes up all the time and people also overreact to these things. No matter what the accomplishment , people will be divided on how they respond. Some of your best friends may be busting your nuts saying "Lucky" while some of the most envious may post the classiest formal "Congratulations on your impressive catch". Then everything erupts between people who have no idea whether the initial posts were said in jest or with affection or with "curses of bad luck forever" on the fisherman.

Me personally , I am not impressed by the catch of any fish taken by anyone associated with a commercial venture. These fish are caught by or with the help of a professional fisherman. Just as an engineer is supposed to be good at his job , professional fisherman are supposed to be good at their job. I don't hear anyone praising a grocery store cashier for ringing a register a whole week without a single mistake. No stories and praise about a guy who got to the airport on time because a paid limo service drove him there. So that's how I feel about professionally caught fish and in my opinion , anyone on a Charter is part of the activity of catching a "professionally caught fish". Now I have nothing against that activity. I like to take a cod trip now and then. I hope to do a tuna trip sometime.etc. It's almost certain I will never have a boat equiped for going after Giant Bluefin tuna or ever small BFT so if I ever hope to catch one , I know I will pay a guy to make it happen. I will have no illusions that I am a great tuna fisherman if I catch a big one. I will feel lucky to have been on a boat with a captain who knew what he was doing and I'll be glad I spent the money to do it.

Now I know I've said lots of things people will agree with and lots that people will disagree with. Who cares. Its an honest expression of my thinking on fishing. It's is a personal matter as to how and why I do it. I like being able to go ( someday I won't be able to do it anymore), I like going with friends (peoples lives change and people die , enjoy your friends and fishing with them while you can) and I always hope to catch at least one every trip (Despite catching thousands of fish in my life , I still get a thrill when something suddenly pulls back).

If you have the desire to stick your nose into other peoples fishing , you should do so in a positive manner. Respect that its their experience , not yours so you should keep out of someone elses fishing experience unless you will contribute to it in a positve manner. Start your own thread(s) and promote whatever you want. I think you'll recruit many more to your side being positive (whichever side you are on) than by doing in situations where its almost certainly going to turn negative.

[BassDawg]

where's that friggin' popcorn icon???

LOVE THIS THREAD

points well made, points well taken, and

no shots below the belt, relatively speaking.

ain't this what America is ALL about??
thanks Bossman for providing the venue!!!




















WHOOOOOP there it IIIIIIIIS, WHOOOOOOP WHOOOOP!!






THERE IT IIIIIIS

[JohnR]

Originally Posted by Saltheart

Nice Fish! Congrats on fullfilling a dream.

I read all the posts. Its pretty surprising when the thread started to blow up. I didn't see anything way out of line or at a Peta level.

As much as people are entitled to catch , keep , take a picture and display that picture (all OK to me), receive congrats and words of envy at the luck and /or skill to have caught the fish , people are entitled to post a lament for a truly great fish's end.

I didn't see anything like "He's a murderer or "that fish was in pain when it died" , or other radical Peta type posts. I saw some people sharing the thrill of the catch , some enjoying seeing the pics , some disinterested and some thinking it should have been released. I honestly don't care whether people release any particular fish. They catch it , its their right to decide what to do with it.

Its too bad these threads flare up. IMO the Catch and Keep are way to combative about the opinions of the Catch and Release Types and the Catch and Release types are inconsiderate about posting their opinions in the threads that are started to show a fishermans success.

There is no need to encourage the Catch and Keeps to post pictures. many many large fish pictures are posted by the Angler or the business interest involved in the catch (Charter Boats or Commercial Fisherman). Its natural to want to show your success. I think the Catch and Release buys could learn something from them. I think the Catch and Release guys, who care so much as to always comment on the killing of a fish in a big fish picture, should post more pics of the big fish they catch and the act of releasing the same. To me they would recruit more people to the cause by such positive in nature pics than to only use dead fish pics posts as launch pads to promote catch and release.

Now just for the purpose of full disclosure , everyone I fish with knows I'm a Catch and release fisherman with few exceptions. The few exceptions relate to specific requests for some fish to eat by neighbors and friends. I do not look for people to eat the fish I catch but people know I fish and some on there own ask if I could bring them some fillets to eat. So I do. Some years I catch several hundred fish and keep zero. Some years I'm lucky to get a 100 and might keep 3 or 4. So anyway , just so people know my own practices relative to Catch and Release when they read what's posted above.

lastly , the issue of skill vs luck in catching a big fish also comes up all the time and people also overreact to these things. No matter what the accomplishment , people will be divided on how they respond. Some of your best friends may be busting your nuts saying "Lucky" while some of the most envious may post the classiest formal "Congratulations on your impressive catch". Then everything erupts between people who have no idea whether the initial posts were said in jest or with affection or with "curses of bad luck forever" on the fisherman.

Me personally , I am not impressed by the catch of any fish taken by anyone associated with a commercial venture. These fish are caught by or with the help of a professional fisherman. Just as an engineer is supposed to be good at his job , professional fisherman are supposed to be good at their job. I don't hear anyone praising a grocery store cashier for ringing a register a whole week without a single mistake. No stories and praise about a guy who got to the airport on time because a paid limo service drove him there. So that's how I feel about professionally caught fish and in my opinion , anyone on a Charter is part of the activity of catching a "professionally caught fish". Now I have nothing against that activity. I like to take a cod trip now and then. I hope to do a tuna trip sometime.etc. It's almost certain I will never have a boat equiped for going after Giant Bluefin tuna or ever small BFT so if I ever hope to catch one , I know I will pay a guy to make it happen. I will have no illusions that I am a great tuna fisherman if I catch a big one. I will feel lucky to have been on a boat with a captain who knew what he was doing and I'll be glad I spent the money to do it.

Now I know I've said lots of things people will agree with and lots that people will disagree with. Who cares. Its an honest expression of my thinking on fishing. It's is a personal matter as to how and why I do it. I like being able to go ( someday I won't be able to do it anymore), I like going with friends (peoples lives change and people die , enjoy your friends and fishing with them while you can) and I always hope to catch at least one every trip (Despite catching thousands of fish in my life , I still get a thrill when something suddenly pulls back).

If you have the desire to stick your nose into other peoples fishing , you should do so in a positive manner. Respect that its their experience , not yours so you should keep out of someone elses fishing experience unless you will contribute to it in a positve manner. Start your own thread(s) and promote whatever you want. I think you'll recruit many more to your side being positive (whichever side you are on) than by doing in situations where its almost certainly going to turn negative.

Wish I could state things that well.

One thing I don't believe - sometimes at the expense of this forum - is over censoring what is being said. So please, discuss and post your points but please do so in a manner that is not malicious or simply mean. Arguing your case in a little more respectful manner will pay dividends.

[Sweetwater]

Originally Posted by Nebe

boatfish dont count

Both Tony Stetzko and Charlie Cinto have 73 lb'ers to their credit. Cinto's was from a boat and Stetzko's from the beach. I've never once heard anyone diminish Cinto's fish from Sow and Pigs vs. Stetzko's from Nauset Beach (or there abouts). Beach or boat, and 73 lb'er is a fish of a lifetime.

Boatfish count.

[chathamblue30]

Fish of a lifetime Ken is right the fellow deserves a huge pat on the back for the achievement and should be able to do what he wants with his catch. I think all of us know how many 40 plus pound bass are sold every yr in the commercial fisheries for a few dollars per pound,none of these fish are ever put back to be caught another day,maybe a slot limit there might help a tad more than these few trophy fish caught every yr by hard core recreational anglers. Take a drive sometime to the docks in New Bedford to see the numerous 40 plus pound bass sold every day during the commercial season and all of us will respect this fellows decision about his trophy fish. Ken you are 100% right about the bait as well,look at the additional 73+ inch tuna landed last yr in mass vs yrs past due to the herring restrictions,if we put limits on the pogeys here these fish would also be sitting in vinyard sound and cuttyhunk again like they were in years past.

[CowHunter]

Originally Posted by Sweetwater

Both Tony Stetzko and Charlie Cinto have 73 lb'ers to their credit. Cinto's was from a boat and Stetzko's from the beach. I've never once heard anyone diminish Cinto's fish from Sow and Pigs vs. Stetzko's from Nauset Beach (or there abouts). Beach or boat, and 73 lb'er is a fish of a lifetime.

Boatfish count.

It is what it is at the scale... period.

Shame on those that belittle others catches, they dont ever, ever deserve better...

[RIJIMMY]

Originally Posted by CowHunter

It is what it is at the scale... period.

Shame on those that belittle others catches, they dont ever, ever deserve better...

nebe was bustin balls guys

[JohnnyD]

Originally Posted by Sweetwater

Both Tony Stetzko and Charlie Cinto have 73 lb'ers to their credit. Cinto's was from a boat and Stetzko's from the beach. I've never once heard anyone diminish Cinto's fish from Sow and Pigs vs. Stetzko's from Nauset Beach (or there abouts). Beach or boat, and 73 lb'er is a fish of a lifetime.

Boatfish count.

Boatfish count. I guess bait from shore counts... but there's no way bait from a boat counts.

[MAKAI]

Wait till you start live lining macs.

[JohnR]

Originally Posted by MAKAI

Wait till you start live lining macs.

That is SO FUN.



Boatfish count, obviously. I do believe (and zero disrespect to boaters) that a 50# from surf beats a 50# from boat, in that it is usually harder to attain.

While we sometimes get lost in the boat -v- surf comparison, to exceed at either takes the application of skill to achieve.

[The Dad Fisherman]

Originally Posted by RIJIMMY

nebe was bustin balls guys

Really....that's so unlike him.....

[BassDawg]

WITHOUT stirring it ALL up~~~~

for reels,,,,,,,,,,,,Boat fish DO NOT count!!

they never have and they never will,,,,,,,,,,,

<<<and here is where you should pay close attention>>>

from the perspective of devoted surfcasters,
SURFcasters i say, isay isay, SURFcasting that is!!

WITHOUT going into the oblivion of the obvious,
it is simply NOT the same game and the only common denominator is
that there is a Striped Bass at the end of the line or on the scale.

and here's another wrinkle to throw at ya'll. a Ditch Feesh beats a surf fish, all day long!!

at the Ditch a 20 feels like a 30, 30 like a 40, a 40 ~you get the idea. factor in current, structure, accessability, bait presence, migrational path, etc,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,we could even get supra technical and separate boulder caught from beach caught, bait caught from AYC caught, breachway caught from canal caught within the surf catching genre. the point being that surfcasting, by its nature, has its own and unique difficulties that make IT surfcasting.

it does not diminish either accomplishment; but, to equate them, imho,
is quite ludicrous and ignores the inherent DIFFERENCES between the two disciplines.
difference is okay, difference is reality.

This world is trying it's damndest to universalize EVERYTHING. The gross homogenization of the planet, so that nothing/no one is superior and all things/everyone is mediocre is a slippery slope that has become a landslide. The celebration of mediocraty is killing GREATNESS, true greatness, in its purest and essential form. We have been lowering our higher standards and elevating the bottom to the point that all we will have left is a mild, milk-toast, middle that ALL can acheive. And in doing so, the acknowledgement of absolutes has become marginalized, or ignored at worst, even though their very existence has not diminished. Whatever happened to Go for it!!? IT being the 'creme da la creme'. See our schools, the job place, health care, and even fishing(25#'ers considered LAHHHHGE). I want to aspire to supreme excellence(IGFA world records) and enjoy the many and varied crests, precipices, valleys, narrow paths, and rolling meadows that that particular journey entails,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Even if I DON'T get there, at the bare minimum, I have aimed for the mountain top and its rarified air.

Sadly WE the people,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,has been usurped by ME the people.

One needs only look to the plight of the Atlantic Coast Menhaden to understand how the "few" are holding hostage the common wealth of the "many". Further, the current state of our oceans and estuaries, while improved, bemoan a more proactive approach to their rescue and conservation NOW ~strictly from a resource management perspective~ not later, and seems remotely imminent at best. Where is the priority? Whose going to speak to the providence of their fortunes, or are they just expendable victims to be wasted by the whims of the almighty dollar? Which generation will cease and desist the status quo to do what is prudent and RIGHT for us all; that is to say planet, species, and peoples?

By accepting all things as good, embracing everything under the rainbow, and by widening the road to Heaven we are exactly where those that would have us to believe that light is dark and dark is light want us to be. When we ~at long last~ have replaced Biblical Correctness with political correctness, then we will have succeeded with the undoing of America. For truly, my dear friends and countrymen, Political Correctness is the scourge of nations and the battle cry of cowards!! This GREAT Land of ours was founded on principles and doctrines that are nothing more than mere shadows of their former selves.

Change has been thrust upon our doorstep!! This is OUR time, and WE are the ones being chosen to take formative action to recreate a "more perfect Union". Will our legacy arise, or will we remain sheep fit for the ensuing slaughter? For how much longer will we choose to look the other way, choose to seek the paths of least resistence, or choose to ignore that still small voice within that yearns to be HEARD? Action requires courage, revolution is paved by the blood of the innocent, and the complacency of luxury is wrought from the immeasurable expense of a bludgeoned and apathetic Nation.

SO, i ask you,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,do boat fish reeeely count?
~~Fix the FORAGE~~ ~~1 @ 36"~~ ~~ By the People, FOR the People, PEEPLES!! ~~

[The Dad Fisherman]

Ya Know a "Wow, Nice fish" would have worked too....

[BassDawg]

Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman

Ya Know a "Wow, Nice fish" would have worked too....

already said THAT

and i meant it, definitely a Fish of a Lifetime!!!
excellent work by angler and boat and electronics and GPS and live bait well and fish finder and,,,,,,,,,,,,

[Goose]

PM me the #'ers where fish was caught...and if I catch a bigger one I'll release it.

[MAKAI]

Of course boat fish count.
Would you turn down an invite to fish in a boat by people who could put you onto some quality fish ?
My fav is a howling onshore wind with big big surf and heavy tin. But just get out, any way, how or where.
We never get to fish enough.

[numbskull]

Cinto's fish was taken on a charter with one of the best striped bass boat fishermen ever, Frank Sabatowski. No question Cinto "deserved" his fish. He fished hard and worked hard to hire the guy who put him on it. Yet Sabatowski found that fish and dragged the plug in front of it. Something very similar happened recently with another hard fishing, dedicated fisherman and former poster who took a well deserved 60 while learning to fish chunks with his charter captain friend.

If I charter Cowhunter and he takes me in his boat, picks the spot, time, and tide, sets up the tackle, obtains the bait, tells me what to do and then I catch a world record.....who (after the bunker, of course ) really deserves the credit?

My point is that the accomplishment of any catch is often better measured by something other than the size of the fish.

[MAKAI]

It's nothing more than an intersection of fates.
The more time you put in at favorable locations and conditions the more apt you are to be in the right place at the right time.

[Doublerunner]

Saltheart.....great post. A classic and one that should be made a sticky for all to read.

RIJIMMY too bad so many people mis-interpretted your words. People hear what they want to hear. I give you credit for standing your ground while being bashed by people who were way out of line

Regarding luck. In most cases the people who are the "luckiest" are also the people who work the hardest

Congrats to Mr. Noto on his great catch. I am sure it was a great thrill

As many of you may remember I am against tournaments unless they are 100% catch and release. Killing fish for ego and $$$ is, in my opinion, wrong. At what point do we put aside our selfishness and do what is right? Some never will. Some will later in life. And some always will. We're all different

This thread's deterioration and how people have treated each other is a prime example of how we are all different. For those who have made their points without insulting others or the use of caps and many exclamation points I commend you.

The way I look at it...had this been a C&R tournament then there surely were other people on the boat who could have taken a pic of that fish and measured it and then released the fish alive. Then it's a win/win. The angler still gets credit and the fish lives on with the hopeful possibility of giving birth to thousands more stripers for us and future generations to enjoy

I've learned a lot getting to know some of the people here. There's no doubt the large majority here on this site are all about catching and killing the largest fish possible without any regard to the stock's sustainability because it's all about the ego and the $$$ and right now and screw the future. I will avoid all shows and vendors who support that mentality. If our beloved stripers were more abundant perhaps I would not detest those who kill them for ego or $$$

There is no doubt that Mr Noto and others like him work hard to be able to catch fish like that. I would be more impressed if there was a picture of that fish swimming away rather than hanging from a meat hook

[JohnR]

OK folks, perhaps this thread has (over)run its course.

A lot of us come from different perspectives which often clash. What may be OK with one doesn't jive with another. Happens.

I'm also willing to guess that some people's positions won't budge.

Kudos to the angler that got the fish, helluva fish. Seriously.