Spot X

[RIJIMMY]

I wasnt comparing the spot I was comparing the article.
So, the rule should be, dont write about spots with limited access, only write about spots with large parking lots.

[SeaWolf]

continuing on from what's been said in this thread and the otw one, is this the beginning of what is to come from magazines such as otw, the fishermen, nor'east, etc.? are they asking for these types of articles to please a certain population of angler and not caring about the other caveats that may now arise? if so, i think it is poor judgement. in this day and age it is also the responsibility of these magazines to look out into all these msg boards (local ones for the region) for what is said, especially when they are the focus. also, anglers need to send their comments in. how many that were upset with the article still have not sent an email to otw editors? if not, dont complain. if you did, good for you and you may be part of the difference if one is decided.

while some say that they have seen more anglers fishing at spot x or z listed in that article, imagine seeing spot j or w or s that was hot the last 2 nights being posted continuously in report areas by one or several anglers. imagine seeing those day-late, dollar-short anglers now coming down asking where to cast and how it was as they heard about it on the internet. how does that taste? and i'm supposed to open my log book to them? you have a rod, there's the water, learn like the rest of us and learn to fish, not catch. you may just earn some respect from those around you as well.

[MakoMike]

Originally Posted by SeaWolf

continuing on from what's been said in this thread and the otw one, is this the beginning of what is to come from magazines such as otw, the fishermen, nor'east, etc.? are they asking for these types of articles to please a certain population of angler and not caring about the other caveats that may now arise? if so, i think it is poor judgement. in this day and age it is also the responsibility of these magazines to look out into all these msg boards (local ones for the region) for what is said, especially when they are the focus. also, anglers need to send their comments in. how many that were upset with the article still have not sent an email to otw editors? if not, dont complain. if you did, good for you and you may be part of the difference if one is decided.
.

I do a lot of writing for Nor'east, and I can tell you that they are not soliciting these types of articles. OTOH if someone throws that kind of manuscript "over the transom" they are unlikely to turn it down. Like it or not, it does provide valuable information to a lot of their readers. You are right on with your comments about making your views known to the publishers. Nor'east has its own website at Noreast.com where you can post your comments, or you can write or call them directly. Either way you opt to go, they (and I) will appreciate hearing your views. One thing puzzles me, and this is aimed at everyone, not just you. Why don't guys get pissed off when a tackle shop points out the places to go, why single out the print media?

[RIROCKHOUND]

Mike, I think the print and www are more wide spread, and as far as bait shops, I dont tell em nothing
I have known shops to give general info only on well known spots, but thats that shops I go to at least...

[snake slinger]

i sent OTW a email and they wrote me back that spot aticles are what there readers whant

[spence]

White buckets are kind of lame. I keep my eels in one of these...

-spence

[RIJIMMY]

That is pretty cool, do they make an aquaman one?

Hey! I'm over 1000 posts! I need to get a life.

[Karl F]

Originally Posted by snake slinger

i sent OTW a email and they wrote me back that spot aticles are what there readers whant

Hey, Good for you. At least you got a response.

I sent them the following email, and NO response:

Mr. Bourque,

I am sure you have a fairly good idea why I am sending this email.
Sometimes, too much info, can have adverse effects.
Mr. McKenna shared too much, and perhaps was not given good
advise from his editor, as to what to leave out.

Perhaps you disagree, if so, I am saddened by that. All locations
mentioned in the article have been mentioned before... yes.
However, there is a great deal of difference in saying that the fishing
is great at the West Wall, or Horseneck beach, without giving the
explicit instructions, complete with detailed maps, and where, and what,
and when to throw it!

My point isn't spots,exactly, it's undue pressure placed on them,
and the possible loss of access to all.

Especially if parking is an issue, and it is at some of these places.
Also, a small percentage of "spot chasers", are not true sportsmen,
they will leave trash, old bait, beer cans etc., and defecate, and urinate
on and around both public, and private property. This infuriates the
owners of the high priced shorefront real estate. They pay a premium
in RE tax, so, when they call to complain, and they will, the local board
of selectmen, the Chief of the local PD, will be all ears, and more than
happy to close access, or put strict and severe limits on access.

I've lived and fished on the Cape for over 35 years. I have seen way too much
access lost since the first time I tossed a rebel windcheater off the
jetty at Breakwater beach in Brewster, and reeled in my first striped bass.

I am aware that others long before this months issue of OTW, have torched
spots... the granddaddy of them all, was Daignault's Hot Spots, and even
though that book is 20 years old, it still stirs controversy.

I would appreciate it, if OTW set some kind of policy, limiting the detail
on locations. I think it would go a long way to limit pressure put on our
remaining favorite fishing spots.

I have always enjoyed OTW in the past, and I am sure I will in the future.
I will enjoy it even more, if I see no more detailed "spot" articles, as I did
this month.


Sincerely,
Karl Faivre

P.S.
If you have not read this yet, please do:
http://www.striped-bass.com/Stripert...ad.php?t=26111




It's not about Rhody "spots", or Cape "spots"... it's about Access...
torch them, explicitly, and they will go.. ROW issues, blocked paths, off the beach by 11, the noose will keep tightening, as more are led to each area.
OK, I agree, it will cool down after a while, people will go, and not catch right away, dismiss the article as BS and go away, some won't like a long hike, or slippery rocks, and not return,,, some... will catch, and maybe larger than they ever have, they will keep going back, and bring others, so, while the initial bump in traffic will have subsided, more will still go, increasing the pressure on that location.

I keep hearing, "well, I was told by others where to go when I started."
Yeah, I was too... I was told to go to hell, not in so many words, if you ever asked where did you catch, it was either an icy stare, or the pat answer... "In the water".... What happened to the hunt?, Or as some say, putting in your time... used to be if you went out, and looked, with just some plain old fashioned sense, you'd figure it out, and yes, sometimes, some kind old timer would point you,,, if he had seen you trying on your own...
It's all Instant Karma now, or the Mc'Fishermen, wants it spooned into him...

Rant off...
I'm done.

[Pete_G]

Originally Posted by RIROCKHOUND

Mike, I think the print and www are more wide spread, and as far as bait shops, I dont tell em nothing
I have known shops to give general info only on well known spots, but thats that shops I go to at least...

I agree, any shop that knows better (and if they don't they will before too long) will give what's working, when, etc, but if they have any idea how to NOT piss off customers they aren't going to give out sensitive spots.

[kayaman]

Originally Posted by MakoMike

One thing puzzles me, and this is aimed at everyone, not just you. Why don't guys get pissed off when a tackle shop points out the places to go, why single out the print media?

the shops don't have such an immediate response to as many people so as to create an influx of people fishing in one spot... just one thought.....

[SeaWolf]

Originally Posted by MakoMike

I do a lot of writing for Nor'east, and I can tell you that they are not soliciting these types of articles. OTOH if someone throws that kind of manuscript "over the transom" they are unlikely to turn it down. Like it or not, it does provide valuable information to a lot of their readers. You are right on with your comments about making your views known to the publishers. Nor'east has its own website at Noreast.com where you can post your comments, or you can write or call them directly. Either way you opt to go, they (and I) will appreciate hearing your views. One thing puzzles me, and this is aimed at everyone, not just you. Why don't guys get pissed off when a tackle shop points out the places to go, why single out the print media?

mike, i do (get pissed off at tackle shops). i go into some of the shops i frequent and ask, beg, and at times almost demand that they dont put certain areas in their reports. mind you, these reports are a week old, but you will see an increase in the people fishing there after a report.

as far as the shops, i look at the reports they may give an angler coming in as their "reward" for shopping or buying some merchandise from them. maybe how much the person buys or if they think they will come back will dictate where they may send those anglers. but, not all owners think like that. they are making a living from their business. i do not see to many authors making a living from writing articles or posting reports on the internet.

turn that around now, what does the magazine that prints these detailed articles on spots really earn? well, more subscriptions and if they are lucky more magazines that month from the tackle shop they are in as the newstand price is more than the subscription. so, what about the author of the article, what are they gaining? money for an article? what, a couple hundred for an article, maybe? some may have a side business, which benefits from getting their name or business exposed. for others, it may be new friends to fish with? or teaching someone how to fish a spot they may have "graduated" from? or, just notoriety for saying they can say they wrote an article and learned that spot? it could be one, many, or none of the above.

like many things, you cannot group spots into one general "rule" for when to say it's ok and when it is not. some are very, very limited in parking or space to fish. others, there's private property to cross that many may not know about. others are well known and the public is welcomed. as an angler, it is your job to learn more about the spot you may be fishing.

if magazines are now asking for detailed spots articles, i think this is unfortunate turn for this media. as much as some may think it's ok, it may do more damage than good, as has been written hear and on the previous thread. to me, this also holds true the those websites that welcome this same information. my interpretation is that johnr is against that type of activity and i repsect him for it and putting up with those of those that may get hot when these issues arise. here on sb, i think the treand has been to TEACH you how to fish, not drive you there, put the lure on for you, and cast for you. thank you, johnr.

[Nebe]

Slipknot- my friend didnt read it word for word to me, he simply said what spots were mentioned and that it gave away alot... I figured it wasnt a big deal..

anyway, i am done wasting my energy over this. I'm bummed that there will be more people in those spots, but hey, thats life

[MakoMike]

[QUOTE=SeaWolf]mike, i do (get pissed off at tackle shops). i go into some of the shops i frequent and ask, beg, and at times almost demand that they dont put certain areas in their reports. mind you, these reports are a week old, but you will see an increase in the people fishing there after a report.

as far as the shops, i look at the reports they may give an angler coming in as their "reward" for shopping or buying some merchandise from them. maybe how much the person buys or if they think they will come back will dictate where they may send those anglers. but, not all owners think like that. they are making a living from their business. i do not see to many authors making a living from writing articles or posting reports on the internet.

turn that around now, what does the magazine that prints these detailed articles on spots really earn? well, more subscriptions and if they are lucky more magazines that month from the tackle shop they are in as the newstand price is more than the subscription. so, what about the author of the article, what are they gaining? money for an article? what, a couple hundred for an article, maybe? some may have a side business, which benefits from getting their name or business exposed. for others, it may be new friends to fish with? or teaching someone how to fish a spot they may have "graduated" from? or, just notoriety for saying they can say they wrote an article and learned that spot? it could be one, many, or none of the above.
[QUOTE]

My experience is that tackle shops have as many reasons for what they do as there are tackle shops. I do both the RI and offshore reports for Nor'east, so I talk to dozens of tackle shops every weekend. It's remarkable that very few of them single out individuals in their reports. There are only three in RI that regularly name people. But the one thing they all value is the publicity it gets them. By handing out specific reports they hope to increase their business.
As far as what does the writer get? Again there are probably as many reasons as there are writers. I do it for several reasons, money being at the top of the list, but I'm sure not making a living at it. Lots of charter guys do it for the publicity. When I do feature articles, as opposed to the weekly reports, I do name areas, but I don't give anyone the exact locations to fish. One reason is that fish have fins and tails and they swim. One day they may be at one set of numbers and the next at another. If I write about a specific set of numbers, and someone goees there and doesn't find fish, it hurts my credibility. So I avoid specfics. OTOH, when I'm doing the reports and a shop tells me that the fishing is hot a Quonny, that's what I'll write, and I don't feel guilty about it.

[Surfcastinglife]

after viewing such hatred for white buckets im officially painting mine black. i need to call my therapist now!

[BigFish]

Keep it white SCL....who cares what people think!

[BasicPatrick]

Seawolf,

I am not sure if we have ever met, however I know some guys that know you. Hence, I am assuming that you have been around for a while. It it this knowledge that has me baffled at your statement.

Magazines have been publishing articles like this for years and years and years. Just for SH%TS & GIGGLES I went into my files. You see I disect magazines when they are read and file certain articles that appeal to me. I have four articles from OTW & The Fisherman that give between 75% and 100% of the information contained in Mckenna's article on the Narrow River. I am not saying that these type of articles are good at all. All I am saying is that there is nothing new about this one. I think what has people all up in arms is who wrote it and not what was written. If this was Flap or Frank D, or even Fisheye I think the responses would be quite different.

Originally Posted by SeaWolf

continuing on from what's been said in this thread and the otw one, is this the beginning of what is to come from magazines such as otw, the fishermen, nor'east, etc.? are they asking for these types of articles to please a certain population of angler and not caring about the other caveats that may now arise? if so, i think it is poor judgement. in this day and age it is also the responsibility of these magazines to look out into all these msg boards (local ones for the region) for what is said, especially when they are the focus. also, anglers need to send their comments in. how many that were upset with the article still have not sent an email to otw editors? if not, dont complain. if you did, good for you and you may be part of the difference if one is decided.

while some say that they have seen more anglers fishing at spot x or z listed in that article, imagine seeing spot j or w or s that was hot the last 2 nights being posted continuously in report areas by one or several anglers. imagine seeing those day-late, dollar-short anglers now coming down asking where to cast and how it was as they heard about it on the internet. how does that taste? and i'm supposed to open my log book to them? you have a rod, there's the water, learn like the rest of us and learn to fish, not catch. you may just earn some respect from those around you as well.

[Sea Dangles]

I wonder how Steve and #^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^& would feel if I listed some of their "private" spots.

[jkswimmer]

The two of them have been talking about spots to people on the Cape for awhile now.

[Maloney]

Basic Patrick just hit the nail on the head.

[Slipknot]

Originally Posted by Sea Dangles

I wonder how Steve and #^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^& would feel if I listed some of their "private" spots.

If you have to wonder more than a second, than I guess you are not that bright

[RIJIMMY]

4 of the 5 spots McKenna describes are in Daignaults Striper Hot Spots Book, with MORE detail.
I brough this up when the posts first started.
For the Narrow, Daignault actually mentions a "better" place to park than McKenna. One that is more sensitive IMHO. Black and white for millions to read.
As others have said, I think folks are mad because Steve violated some secret Narr. surfcaster pact.
Newbies will go to the spots, get skunked and never return, no spots are guaranteed. I fished those spots, sometimes I caught, other times I didnt.

[Sea Dangles]

Originally Posted by Slipknot

If you have to wonder more than a second, than I guess you are not that bright

Hey, for a moderator to be flaming is not a good example. You still owe me a plug.Also; it is then not than if you are speaking English. Please forward my plug.

[Slipknot]

come get it
I am not an english major, I am a fisherman
I didn't quote you as a moderator, just pointing out the obvious.
nebe says it's poor form to point out my poor form

[Nebe]

Originally Posted by Sea Dangles

I wonder how Steve and #^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^& would feel if I listed some of their "private" spots.

could you please elaborate on what #^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^& has to do with the article??? why should he be chastized for anothers actions??? What is your fasination with #^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&??? is it pennis envy? jealousy? or is it simply plain ignorant hatred?
and furthermore, what has #^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^& done to you?

[Flaptail]

I know one thing! We need more Cowbell!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[bassmaster]

flap u spot burner

[SeaWolf]

Originally Posted by BasicPatrick

Seawolf,

I am not sure if we have ever met, however I know some guys that know you. Hence, I am assuming that you have been around for a while. It it this knowledge that has me baffled at your statement.

Magazines have been publishing articles like this for years and years and years. Just for SH%TS & GIGGLES I went into my files. You see I disect magazines when they are read and file certain articles that appeal to me. I have four articles from OTW & The Fisherman that give between 75% and 100% of the information contained in Mckenna's article on the Narrow River. I am not saying that these type of articles are good at all. All I am saying is that there is nothing new about this one. I think what has people all up in arms is who wrote it and not what was written. If this was Flap or Frank D, or even Fisheye I think the responses would be quite different.

bp, i hear you. yes, i've been around. yes, we probably know many of the same people. i'd love to sit down and talk with you, or anyone for that matter, about these types of issues. shoot me a pm or email.

i am confused about what you mean about being baffled.

i finally received my otw magazine yesterday, but i actually was at a shop and read it late last week. now, i may fish some of those spots, i may not. that was never my issue of contention. my issue, and what i thought the theme of the otw thread, was about the idea or ethics about doing just that, putting spots (maybe detailed, and maybe lesser known) in magazines, on-line reports, on-line msgs boards and is it right and what good or bad is that now doing? are you really helping an angler out or not? are these articles taking the "hunt" out or surffishing?

as far as steve writing that particular article in otw this month, it appears he was asked for those types of articles (spots) previously by otw. i also know these are the same spots he talks about in his seminars, so it may not be anything new for those that have been to them. i have a problem with otw asking for those types of articles. i also have a problem w/ steve agreeing to do that. i may be in the majority or i may be in the minority on the sides of this issue. steve had the option of not accepting otw's position on these "how to/detailed article" and not giving his article. he chose to accept their concept. now, he is on the hook for it. my position may not be the right one, it may not be the wrong one, but it is mine and i put in my .02 and the subject from my experiences. i was trying not to b!---h about it, but put out ideas to think about.

yes frank, flap, others on this site or other sites, other authors, etc., have done similar articles recently and thru the years. i dont agree that the feedback may have not been the same if it was another author. it may have been worse, it may have been lighter. who knows. i remember frank taking a lot of heat when he wrote the striper spots book. some people and places declined to be mentioned just for some of these very reasons. maybe in years past the only way of venting on these issues was going right to the author (if you knew them), mailing the magazine, or going to a tackle shop. now, the internet has opened up all this. more and more forums open up each year. these issues will only continue in the future.

i amalso aware that there are people that may not post at all on these threads due to their business, relationship w/ that magazine, etc. i can respect that. maybe what they have read here may change their opinion. maybe it will not.

there is one thing that i have seen over the years about these types of threads, there are many opinions on it. some are 100% against, some are 100% for, some are middle of the road. where do you draw that line? will that line ever be drawn?

[tynan19]

Jimmy I keep them in a 3way bucket for transport also but when I get to the area I am fishing, they go in a soft sided cooler with a frozen plastic ice block. Then you can just throw this on your shoulder. Better mobility than having to carry a bucket around.

[RIJIMMY]

Hmmm, I like that T, may have to give it a shot.
I have a little soft side cooler I can use too, the eels dont sufficate with the lid closed?