A Day Without Immigrants!

[spence]

Originally Posted by ScottC

Spence, the contribute 50 million right?

No, Billion...with a B.

I'm not saying that crossing the border should be legal...

But some of you are trying to make a case that illegal immigrants simply suck off the system and make no contribution.

Which isn't even open for debate...it's just not true. And instead of dealing with the real issues - you're ignoring reality.

There are millions of illegals in this country that contribute to our GDP and quality of life, and the vast majority of them aren't going anywhere...

It is what it is.

So how are you going to deal with it?

-spence

[ScottC]

Originally Posted by spence

No, Billion...with a B.

I'm not saying that crossing the border should be legal...

But some of you are trying to make a case that illegal immigrants simply suck off the system and make no contribution.

Which isn't even open for debate...it's just not true. And instead of dealing with the real issues - you're ignoring reality.

There are millions of illegals in this country that contribute to our GDP and quality of life, and the vast majority of them aren't going anywhere...

It is what it is.

So how are you going to deal with it?

-spence

Ok so say 80 Billion they are stealing from this country. You sound like my wife. She says " Hey Scott, I just saved 200 dollars shopping today!" and I say sure, you had to SPEND 800 to do so hahahah.

And I told you exactly how to deal with it, replace them with low risk criminals period end of story. Round them all up and deport them. the first order of business form our new founded prison work force should be to build a 25 foot wall accross the entire border. China did it before we has back hoes, so I think we could handle it.

[spence]

BigFish -

I'm saying your notion that illegals don't also contribute is false, not that they don't draw from the system. This shouldn't be that difficult a concept to process...

Scott -

All politics aside, deporting every illegal is just technically not possible. And your calculations are a bit wacky as well. Replacing migrant labor with a domestic workforce would have a huge inflation effect on most consumable goods.

-spence

[ScottC]

Originally Posted by spence

BigFish -

I'm saying your notion that illegals don't also contribute is false, not that they don't draw from the system. This shouldn't be that difficult a concept to process...

Scott -

All politics aside, that's just technically not possible.

-spence

HAHAHA, everything I said is easily done, it is not technically impossible, it is POLITICALLY impossible, you have it backwards. We need people is politics who are not afraid to do what is unpopular, and we need to make lobyist illegal.

[Flaptail]

Immigrants are not "bad" people. We are all descendents of immigrants unless you have Native American blood running through your veins, which I am blessed to have some running through mine. Talk about people who got screwed and still are. Anyway, my ancestors spoke only Polish/Russian/Lithuanian and French when they landed here. ( My Great x 6 Grandfather was A French Baron who escaped the Guilotine and came here and married a full blooded MicMac indian woman). Some of your might have been English or Irish or Scottish and knew English already (Irish and Scottish in a modified form), thats great.

Immigrants and the cultural mix is what made this country great. Otherwise we would be like a bunch of inbred dogs. Look at what happened to Irish Setters. The problem we have is that we need to set up better parameters for entrance into, stayiing in and becoming a citizen of, this country. It's too easy right now to enter from Mexico and latin America. My Grand father emigrated here at 13 speaking only Polish and Russian. He had to endure Ellis Island. He taught himself english and became a citizen. That's all these people need to do, especially in the dangerous age we live in.

Most of them work hard, very hard. Do we need the gangs like ms13 and such and the ones who choose to belong to them? No. But most of the Latino community would agree with that as well. All we ask is that they adopt a simple set of rules, they do not have to abandon thier culture or language but they do have to adopt ours and the principals we live by as Americans. Italians have Columbus Day, Irish have St. Patricks Day and so on, celebrating thier culture and it's great. The Latino community can too but we need rules and if they choose to stay here then take the final step and become a Latino-American. I think the fine proposed is the right step. It will be the impetus for them to finally make the decision to go or stay. They are more than welcome to stay.

Lastly the Spanish version of the National Anthem is not correct. We would never do that to the Mexican Anthem, the Brazilian anthem and so on. Although, as a child going to a Parochial school, we were forced by the Sister's of Saint Anne, a Canadian order of Nuns, to sing the Au Canada first each morning before the Star Spangled Banner and no one complained, Never sat right with me or anyone I went to school with but our parents, my mother especially, who was french Canadian, loved it. It was just wrong and so is a spanish Star Spangled Banner with wording changed.

That's my two cents on this issue.

[Karl F]

agreed Flap... however, my grandparents came in with papers.. as I am sure yours did... and they did not demand that people spoke their langauge, they adapted english, (not perfect, but worked on it as a lifelong chore, no prouder day for them, when the became "U.S. Citizens ), and assimilated to this country...

I know several "legal" aliens.. all decent hardworking folk, who work hard to speak english, and live by the book.. they are peer pressured by their community tho, to support the illegals, kind of sad, in a way, that has to happen.. "Illegal's Rights"... kind of an oxymoron, I'd say....

"Jose, Can you see?"... yeah, leave the anthem alone, Please.

[Skip N]

Originally Posted by Karl F

agreed Flap... however, my grandparents came in with papers.. as I am sure yours did... and they did not demand that people spoke their langauge, they adapted english, (not perfect, but worked on it as a lifelong chore, no prouder day for them, when the became "U.S. Citizens ), and assimilated to this country...

I know several "legal" aliens.. all decent hardworking folk, who work hard to speak english, and live by the book.. they are peer pressured by their community tho, to support the illegals, kind of sad, in a way, that has to happen.. "Illegal's Rights"... kind of an oxymoron, I'd say....

"Jose, Can you see?"... yeah, leave the anthem alone, Please.

Bingo! Illegals have ZERO rights! They gave up thier rights when they decided to say F the system and sneek over the order ILLEGALLY. And you and me are paying for this illegal behavior..... Let them all stay home from work today, lets show them this country can run just fine without the illegals.

[Skip N]

No one cares about "legal" imigrants in this country. We encourage imagration when you do it the "legal" way. What Flaptail and many others like to ignore is the whole Legal vs. Illegal issue. Why are you guys trying to lump "illegal" imigrants in the same breathe as "legals"? There is a big differance guys. You come here the right way like my ancestors did or you dont come here at all. If you dont want to obey the laws of the US get the hell out. Do it right or stay the hell away.

I'm sick of people making excuses for the illegals and accepting thier behavior. These people are a slap in the face to the people who come to this country right way. Why the hell you people dont get that is beyond me. But then again you guys prob want open borders so everyone can flock to this country without the US doing any backround checks on these people or whatnot.

You come here legaly or you dont come here at all!

[Flaptail]

Originally Posted by Skip N

No one cares about "legal" imigrants in this country. We encourage imagration when you do it the "legal" way. What Flaptail and many others like to ignore is the whole Legal vs. Illegal issue. Why are you guys trying to lump "illegal" imigrants in the same breathe as "legals"? There is a big differance guys. You come here the right way like my ancestors did or you dont come here at all. If you dont want to obey the laws of the US get the hell out. Do it right or stay the hell away.

I'm sick of people making excuses for the illegals and accepting thier behavior. These people are a slap in the face to the people who come to this country right way. Why the hell you people dont get that is beyond me. But then again you guys prob want open borders so everyone can flock to this country without the US doing any backround checks on these people or whatnot.

You come here legaly or you dont come here at all!

Did you read the post coprrectly? I am not in favor of illegal immigration.

[spence]

Originally Posted by Flaptail

Lastly the Spanish version of the National Anthem is not correct.

I'm not sure what all the flap is over this Spanish version of our National Anthem, aside from zenophobia...

Jimi Hendrix ticked a lot of people off with his version, but guess what? It was simply Jimi expressing his love for America in his own way...it was his version...

If a hispanic person wants to express their feelings for America in Spanish I don't see what the problem is...it doesn't mean it has to be played at baseball games!

-spence

[Backbeach Jake]

From where I sit , I see a lot of folks coming here for a better life. They may be illegal, But our Government gives a nod and wink to Big Business whenever their legality comes up. Why? Because they compete with Legal Labor. They are our competition.They keep our wages in check. I don't hate them for it , they're taking what they can get. I AM pissed at out Government for allowing this to happen to keep us devided among our selves. The middle working class is disappearing in this Country and we're rapidly turning into Wealthy/Peasants. No Middle Class. We work harder and harder and get less and less. Because our illegal competition does without complaint. For my two cents, we all shoulda been in the streets today. We all deserve better.

[MAC]

Originally Posted by Backbeach Jake

From where I sit , I see a lot of folks coming here for a better life. They may be illegal, But our Government gives a nod and wink to Big Business whenever their legality comes up. Why? Because they compete with Legal Labor. They are our competition.They keep our wages in check. I don't hate them for it , they're taking what they can get. I AM pissed at out Government for allowing this to happen to keep us devided among our selves. The middle working class is disappearing in this Country and we're rapidly turning into Wealthy/Peasants. No Middle Class. We work harder and harder and get less and less. Because our illegal competition does without complaint. For my two cents, we all shoulda been in the streets today. We all deserve better.

You hit the nail on the head Fred. (a little carpenter humor) Soon it will be the "HAVES" and the "HAVE NOTS". And guess where the average blue collar guy will be. Don't get me wrong. I have nothing against anyone here legally. My mothers side of the family came here in 1634. And my fathers side came here in the 1800s. We are all of immigrant descent wether it be 2 years ago or 300 years ago. The big difference is that they stayed and made this home. They didn't just come here to make a bunch of "duckets" and skedaddle home to live more comfortably than their neighbors.

[stripersnipr]

Why do some people refuse to use the word illegal when talking about criminals who have purposely defied and violated our immigration laws by entering our country ILLEGALY? Its a slap in the face to those who have entered our country through the rightful process and "contribute" in an above board manner.

[Backbeach Jake]

Stripersnipr, this is how they devide us. The law says that they are illegal. Those in power do absolutely nothing about it and as a matter of fact they encourage it back handedly. We legals are outraged that they are here not that we're getting screwed. We're being PLAYED against one another. All they want is a chance. Just a shot at a better life. And our politicians(whores) are selling themselves , the illegals , and us.

[Skip N]

Originally Posted by stripersnipr

Why do some people refuse to use the word illegal when talking about criminals who have purposely defied and violated our immigration laws by entering our country ILLEGALY? Its a slap in the face to those who have entered our country through the rightful process and "contribute" in an above board manner.

Right on Bro They dont use the ILLEGAL word becuase it doesnt fit thier agenda. They know damn well what this debate is about, but they try an lump all imigrants in with the Illegals. Anyone who talks like you stated is a disshonest liar. People see right through thier lies thankfully. Well most of us do anyway....

[Duke41]

Wow we have a lot of characters on this board and I am one of them. Bigfish I know you were not insulting my grand dad I was just making a point that spainish and indians speaking folks are here for the same reason your and my ancestors came. For a better life. I am sure there are some, a small percentage that play the system as do plenty of Americans, but I am also certain that many come here for a fresh start in a free country. I always try to keep that in mind when I deal with these folks. So have a nice day and keep on spreading the love.

[spence]

Originally Posted by ScottC

HAHAHA, everything I said is easily done, it is not technically impossible, it is POLITICALLY impossible, you have it backwards.

Horse hockey.

Aside from the logistical issues of deporting 11 million people, you have to replace their jobs with legal workers who are protected by different state and federal laws.

The impact to our economy would be devistating and impossible to counter...Unless you have a 100 year plan...

-spence

[ScottC]

Originally Posted by spence

Horse hockey.

Aside from the logistical issues of deporting 11 million people, you have to replace their jobs with legal workers who are protected by different state and federal laws.

The impact to our economy would be devistating and impossible to counter...Unless you have a 100 year plan...

-spence

It would not be devestating at all, and I already handed you a place to get these workers, and do not have to be protected by anything, you do know minimum wage is more than 2 bucks a day right? The ACI workers get paid less than illegals already, and there is absolutely no shortage of inmates in the USA. Sure it would be hard to deport 11 million people, but if we do not, then we might as well burn our constitution and bill of rights as they mean nothing. We were able to invade and occupy two countrys in less than 2 years, and they had weapons! You mean to tell me our armed forces could not make a huge dent in the illegal alien problem in our own country? You gravely underestimate the power we wield.

[spence]

Originally Posted by ScottC

It would not be devestating at all, and I already handed you a place to get these workers, and do not have to be protected by anything, you do know minimum wage is more than 2 bucks a day right? The ACI workers get paid less than illegals already, and there is absolutely no shortage of inmates in the USA. Sure it would be hard to deport 11 million people, but if we do not, then we might as well burn our constitution and bill of rights as they mean nothing. We were able to invade and occupy two countrys in less than 2 years, and they had weapons! You mean to tell me our armed forces could not make a huge dent in the illegal alien problem in our own country? You gravely underestimate the power we wield.

I love it, your reference for feesability are two military actions where the desired outcome ended up killing tens of thousands of innocent people

And according to the DOJ there are only about 2.1 million inmates, not quite the numbers necessary for your plan. Given you probably don't want the harder criminals out in the fields, the pool is quite a bit smaller than that.

Besides, what would happen if crime rates fell! Would we have to enact tougher laws to ensure the prison population was able to supply the needed people-power to keep the produce flowing

-spence

[Notaro]

My ex-girlfriend jsut got her citizenship and her mom and brother hasn't gotten their yet. They have been here for more than five years when leaving Vietnam. So should they be deported, too?