New Gibbs lures

[Flaptail]

Originally Posted by NIB

It's not the same wire in BM.The wire is thinner an softer.Way softer.
The swivels are a joke.Not sure what happened but a few yrs ago they just started failing.Maybe the same reason the Hooks are garbage.Musso saw the difference 3 yrs ago an changed out to spro's.With today's no strech braid u need tougher hardware.It is NOT a PLOY.Yrs ago the hooks where better AND guys mostly used soft action glass rods with MONO.I am not making this stuff up I have seen it happen an had it happen to me.Of course we copy STAN's design's He was the Best a true Pioneer.What new design has the new regieme of gibbs come up with the 3 oz Darter.what a joke.Here's a thought.Go Back 35 yrs.
What do u think Stan Would say..I could just see him when the hooks on a Polaris straighten out.Then they sink after a 1/2 hr.He wouldn't use there crap.He would have to buy bigger dumpsters.

Tony I luv ya but without knowing the whole story your tirade here is way out of line. Gibbs makes a goog plug so does John but if we want to speak the truth here then so be it. Gibbs has on hand about between 9 and 10 thousand plugs in stock at all times. Done and ready for shipment, Someone else does not and can't ship regurlarly when customers demand needles and such, he is always up against the wall. He works 80 hours a week and is still behind and needs to hire competent help to help him out or he is gonna burn out fast and I think he is halfway there. I would hate to see that happen as that would be the end of HABS PLUGS!He makes an awesome plug and decidedly has the needlefish market in his grasp but if shops can't get them then what are they to do? VMC CANNOT SHIP in the numbers and with the reliability that Mustad, who is made in the USA still, can, Never has been able too and thats a fact, very fragmented. Shop owners will tell you the same.

Gibbs uses the same wire supplier that stan did and uses sugar pine at 8% moisture content and no knots which is very expensive. The Gibbs guys bought and run the company so that it would not go out of business, they will tell you that.

And lastly if you can come up with a truely "original" design in a plug these days I will blow you on YOUR town hall steps in NJ! It's all been done before and there ain't one plug maker out there that doesn't have problems in production or quality or components in way way shape or form. Reality what a concept heh?

[lurch]

[NIB]

Originally Posted by Flaptail

Tony I luv ya but without knowing the whole story your tirade here is way out of line. Gibbs makes a goog plug so does John but if we want to speak the truth here then so be it. Gibbs has on hand about between 9 and 10 thousand plugs in stock at all times. Done and ready for shipment, Someone else does not and can't ship regurlarly when customers demand needles and such, he is always up against the wall. He works 80 hours a week and is still behind and needs to hire competent help to help him out or he is gonna burn out fast and I think he is halfway there. I would hate to see that happen as that would be the end of HABS PLUGS!He makes an awesome plug and decidedly has the needlefish market in his grasp but if shops can't get them then what are they to do? VMC CANNOT SHIP in the numbers and with the reliability that Mustad, who is made in the USA still, can, Never has been able too and thats a fact, very fragmented. Shop owners will tell you the same.

Gibbs uses the same wire supplier that stan did and uses sugar pine at 8% moisture content and no knots which is very expensive. The Gibbs guys bought and run the company so that it would not go out of business, they will tell you that.

And lastly if you can come up with a truely "original" design in a plug these days I will blow you on YOUR town hall steps in NJ! It's all been done before and there ain't one plug maker out there that doesn't have problems in production or quality or components in way way shape or form. Reality what a concept heh?

Not really a inside info guy.All that BS makes no nevermind to me.This ain't about habs or bm or anyone else against Gibbs.So please don't read it as a tirade.My statements where regarding thier (Gibbs) plugs only.In response to the question asked in the begining of the thread.Perhaps I chime in to often on the merits Of Habs plugs thats why it seems that way.He makes a good plug plain an simple.Gibbs product on the other hand Is NOT a good product.Plain an simple.If they have 9k on hand maybe they need to make less an pay better attention.
Same wire supplier different wire.Take a old one a check it out for urself.I just did it along with a BM like capesams said. An I am correct.Not the same.I could live with the hook thing as I am used to changin em out.How bout the swivels.
Listen I like the whole history thing with Stan. I can appreciate what he did.I also appreciate what the new guys are trying to do if what they say is right.In fact,I confronted him at The Rissa show about blatently copyin Habs 3 oz needle.I went there with a head of steam an left a puppy dog. The guy is a good guy.I couldn't do it.I still won't buy one.
Ok they Use sugar pine how about sealing it.
No need for the last part.I ain't making anything new.
I am a realist. My statements come from my own occurances or ones witnessed first hand. Perhaps ur the one blinded by history.It's not a bad thing.I know u new Stan well.This should bother u more than I.Oh ya I still love ya also.

[Karl F]

I'm glad ya still love each other, the whole vision of Flap on his knees on some Jersey Town Hall front steps.. well that's gonna make me chuckle the rest of the day (Thank You).. I still think NIB would need a milk crate to stand on to make it work, even with Flap on his knees...

[luds]

I just don't understand why anyone in their right mind would buy a Gibbs plug to save a couple bucks over another custom that costs $20. With Gibbs you don't know what you have until you put it in the water. With Hab's, Tattoo, SS, Aftehours, R.M. Smith, Surf Asylum, Stetzko, Eel Punt (I could go on but you get the point) you know what you're getting and if in the small chance you have a problem you can call them and in no time you've got a new plug and a free one for your efforts. They also actually seem to care about the feedback you give them when you see them at the shows. I might give gibbs a chance if they tried to fix their quality first rather than just putting some eyes on their plugs and copying another builders design. I also don't buy that crap about about how Gibbs is under staffed etc. When I go to work and do s h i*t t y job my boss lets me know about it. I'm not giving them any slack because their struggling and I'm definately not going to give them any of my money. The original Gibbs designs are great but until I'm conviced that they've improved their quality I won't buy another one.

[likwid]

Sam Adams isn't a microbrew....

[Karl F]

Originally Posted by likwid

Sam Adams isn't a microbrew....

Thank You

And I could go on and on about Sam Adams versus Bud.. but won't..
Not the best anology Mr. Habs, if you truly know both companys..
I'd take the Bud philosophy and business practise hands down.

[JHABS]

All right I made a Mistake, Should of used a different brewery...................

[NIB]

Originally Posted by Karl F

Thank You

And I could go on and on about Sam Adams versus Bud.. but won't..
Not the best anology Mr. Habs, if you truly know both companys..
I'd take the Bud philosophy and business practise hands down.

I was a bud Man.I didn't care about the behind he sence bs.

[JHABS]

Flap. yeah I've told you I'm tired, and I've told you I don't know how long I can keep it up. But I keep going and I keep producing more. I'm not going any where. I'm not the first person who works long hours to say they're tired. But I never said I don't enjoy doing it. Having plenty of work is a good thing. HAB'S

[Flaptail]

Originally Posted by NIB

Not really a inside info guy.All that BS makes no nevermind to me.This ain't about habs or bm or anyone else against Gibbs.So please don't read it as a tirade.My statements where regarding thier (Gibbs) plugs only.In response to the question asked in the begining of the thread.Perhaps I chime in to often on the merits Of Habs plugs thats why it seems that way.He makes a good plug plain an simple.Gibbs product on the other hand Is NOT a good product.Plain an simple.If they have 9k on hand maybe they need to make less an pay better attention.
Same wire supplier different wire.Take a old one a check it out for urself.I just did it along with a BM like capesams said. An I am correct.Not the same.I could live with the hook thing as I am used to changin em out.How bout the swivels.
Listen I like the whole history thing with Stan. I can appreciate what he did.I also appreciate what the new guys are trying to do if what they say is right.In fact,I confronted him at The Rissa show about blatently copyin Habs 3 oz needle.I went there with a head of steam an left a puppy dog. The guy is a good guy.I couldn't do it.I still won't buy one.
Ok they Use sugar pine how about sealing it.
No need for the last part.I ain't making anything new.
I am a realist. My statements come from my own occurances or ones witnessed first hand. Perhaps ur the one blinded by history.It's not a bad thing.I know u new Stan well.This should bother u more than I.Oh ya I still love ya also.

Tony let's get together for some fresh (not that smoked crap) Kielbasa smothered in Marinara sauce next time your up and discuss this further. ( Maybe KarlF can suggest a good wine to go with that?) We can even go to the Gibbs factory if you like and we can discuss this with Dennis and Dan, they are always willing to listen, good or bad, and bring your junk Pencils and they will make good on them, probably let you pick through yourself to find suitable repalcements. ( I am serious on that, they will do that). As you know all you have to do is send the bad ones back and they will replace them no questions asked.
I am sure you admire my loyalty as I admire yours. It's well placed on both points of view.

And one thing more, I want you to know I ripped off your flared nose design for my stubby needles so they would push even more water. It's a good idea and I had to incorporate it in my latest creation based of course on a previously thought up idea.

Does anyone here remember Tim Coleman expounding the virtue of white or all black stubby needles with long feather tails in a book in the late 70's? And before him Danny Pichney and before him the Mad Russian? And before him.......?

NIBFLAP

[NIB]

Coleman, Another NJ guy..
I copied that nose from Manzi..

[capesams]

[ flap]

" The Gibbs guys bought and run the company so that it would not go out of business, they will tell you that. "

this one I need to reply to....Jimmy had a buyer waiting in the corner to pick-up the co......me......6 time's he was reminded of that too. but the RI guy's somehow snuck in the back door without me knowing it....money was not a problem for the purchase....guess Jimmy just forgot to call...I'm very much sad to see what has happened to the co. now.

NIB....what I was saying about the wire is when the gibbs co. was still here on the cape, they were using 304 aniled[sp] wire 1/16" thick..I have 2 roll's of it and a lrg. bundle of pre-bent.....bm is the same as gibb's USED to be.

[NIB]

Got it.

[JHABS]

capesams, If you are going to Plug Night will bring the plastic you were looking for before...................

[Joe]

Why can't Habs just put himself on the duplicator and make some more of himself?

[DaveS]

Originally Posted by Joe

Why can't Habs just put himself on the duplicator and make some more of himself?

I'll call up the Goverments secret cloning lab and get the ball rolling
A new genetically superior Habs , able to spin out needle fish by the thousands! MUAHAHAHAAHAAAA!

[capesams]

Originally Posted by JHABS

capesams, If you are going to Plug Night will bring the plastic you were looking for before...................

I won't be,,but Mac will pick-up the items for me.....txs

[Joe]

Habs has a following so big that he can't keep up. He'll never be able to keep up given the size of the operation. There is a lot of money left on the table from vendors who can't get Habs, or not enough Habs.

So somebody was bound to try and capture that overflow of demand - any vacum in the marketplace gets filled eventually. But you can't just style the body a little diiferently and put on VMC's and say it's as good as Habs.

As so many people here have said - the new Gibbs owners did not need the money. They bought the company so it would not go under. It's a noble gesture, but tackle shops and fishing companies run by dilettantes who don't need the money are usually substandard enterprises. Sooner or later the luster of continuing a legacy will wear off and they'll go back the golf course. Personally, I'd rather the company was run by people who needed the money.

[Flaptail]

John this is stupid, all of it. I know you know where I am coming from in my defense of Gibbs. No Joe, the Gibbs Hab's-a-Like needles aren't as good they don't fish like a Habs but they do work.

As a customer I am frustrated by not being able to go to the local tackle shop and pick up one of John's when I need them. Last three weeks I would have killed for a purple black Habs needle and an Olive HAB'S Needle. I went to M&D's ask Mike, Powderhorn ask Andy, CMS ask Eric and Falmouth Bait and Tackle. All of these shops had Hab's plugs of some kind. NitenGales, some pencils and a few small needles in the colors I don't need ( which I would have bought if the were in the larger sizes and repainted).( I even prodded Don S. at Red Top why he doesn't stock them)

It totally frustrating. I have taken in the last 3 weeks more mid twenty pound to low 30 pound bass than I have had all year. They want needles and they want purple black or eel colored. Who makes the best needle, Habs. I got to get some, nope don't have any of those. I don't want pencils or nightengales or whatever I want needles and so do a lot of others.

I am sorry John. I have always respected you and I am and will still continue to be a fan of your stuff, which I will still gladly mention in anything I write that has anything to do with a needlefish being employed to take bass. Just need your best product and there ain't any.

(I still think that Hab's and Gibbs merger with John running the whole show and D&D as the backing would bring back Gibbs overall quality and give Hab's Plugs the means to satisfy demand and still put out the Mur-eels, Atom 40's and other classics. That would be the ultimate in a plug company.)

This is ended, peace out.

[Slipknot]

Originally Posted by JHABS

capesams, If you are going to Plug Night will bring the plastic you were looking for before...................

John, can you bring me a Cinto signed goo-goo please, I have my 35 bucks

[Slipknot]

I like Dennis too, he's a real good guy.

I like Bud too, my favorite beer

[Slipknot]

Flap, I understand your frustration about not being able to get what you need and want. I have not had a bass over 20 pounds in more than 6 weeks, I can easily barter some of those needles you mentioned for just one phone call invite you remember right? weather permiting of course.