I am SOTS: MAKE STRIPED BASS A GAMEFISH!

[BasicPatrick]

Some thoughts:

The problem is not the amount of Striped Bass but where they are located.
and
The problem is not that the fish are not here but that they are wicked hard to catch because they are transitioning to forage that is hard to mimic.

I suggest the problem is that we have multiple crisis regarding forage species.

Some Examples:

The reason Buzzards Bay is spotty with big areas of bad fishing and a few good is because the Menhaden have been a target by rec and commercial operations for over a month.

I was recently speakign with Throsing Timber who informed me NArragansett was great fishign until the Menhaden operations went to work. After that, collapse of fishing.

The reason MV Sound/middleground/falmouth have all been sllllooooooww is that there have been very very little squid. Why? Commercial overfishing?????

Why is there a monsterous body of fish between Chatham and Ptown? Why have there been blitxes of twenty pounders on Race Poing for the first time in many years? The answer is the presence of sea herring. The seals are not the problem with back side fishing nor is it a lack of striped bass. The availability of bait is the problem. Right now the back side is loaded with micro to large sea herring and the stripers are there big time.

Why is there reports of great fishing in CC Bay. We appear to be off to a good start for sand eels.

Why no fish off the coast of Maine? It's a fact that the State lets every possible commercial operation beat the snot out of every possible species that can be used for lobster bait.

Why no fish off NC in January? Industrial trawlers work the three mile line off the NC coast for the full month of December and decimate mullet, menhaden, shad and all the other forage. The fishgin we keep hearing aobut in the EEZ dow there is a result of no bait inside 3 miles.

Why is there a major problem with shore fishing all over in late May and early June? I think the lack of River Herring might have something to do with it.

Besdies the bait problems...

Of course a commercial increase is insane and I continue to predict that once ASMFC scientists give an updated number for natural mortality caused by the evidence of mycobacteriosis in the coastal migrating population AND and increased number for fishing mortality that includes some estimate of eez poaching during the winter than we will get our cut back to one fish.

I do want to correct the miguided assumption that a cut to one ifsh at 28" will cut the amount of the rec catch by 1/2. In fact it does not cut that catch by much at all.


Please come fight for the bait...it's our key to a healthy Striped Bass Fishery

[JohnnyD]

Originally Posted by BasicPatrick

Some thoughts:

The problem is not the amount of Striped Bass but where they are located.
and
The problem is not that the fish are not here but that they are wicked hard to catch because they are transitioning to forage that is hard to mimic.

How can you know that? Consistently, it seems as though scientists' estimates on biomass are terrible at best. A couple of large schools of fish in CC Bay and a couple of other areas doesn't make up for what seems like a lack of fish in many other areas.

I completely agree with you that cutting the rec take to 1 @ 28" would be ineffective. That's why I think at a minimum, both the commercial take should be reduced (instead of the nonsense opinion by ASMFC that it should be increased) along with the Recs being limited to 1 @ 34".

On these boards and especially during the SF bill, you harped on the idea that we should trust ASMFC and that they will make the right decisions when it comes to managing Striped Bass. However, they have consistently demonstrated and continue to demonstrate that they either manage through the best interests of the commercial industry or are completely incompetent.

If ASMFC approves an increase to the commercial bass quota, it should be the final nail in the coffin of confidence in ASMFC ever effectively managing any species. Should that occur, MSBA should really re-evaluate their support of the regulating body, else there won't be any more stripers to have an association for.

[dannyplug1]

I am at the point where I say uncle. The commercials you know the ones who kill everything they can will eventually kill the striper. Literally every fish that has been commercially fished for is in bad shape. Look at the halilbut: up untill the late 1800's when had halibut on the east coast that were bigger than Alaskan halibut.... gone. Money wins over whats right finish off the bass and go on to the next species. Pretty soon we will be like england fishing for sand sharks and conger eels if any of them are left.

[BigFish]

Last I checked if you cut the daily rec take from 2 fish at 28 inches a day to 1 fish at 28 inches a day (1 @ 34" would be better) that equates to a half???????No???? If I put up 2 fingers.......and then put down one of the fingers......then I have half as many fingers as I did before?????

[RIROCKHOUND]

Originally Posted by BigFish

Last I checked if you cut the daily rec take from 2 fish at 28 inches a day to 1 fish at 28 inches a day (1 @ 34" would be better) that equates to a half???????No???? If I put up 2 fingers.......and then put down one of the fingers......then I have half as many fingers as I did before?????

The problem is Larry, while you are trying to be funny, most people don't take 2 fish anyways, either don;t need or can't catch two. so dropping it from 1 to 2 at the same size reduces it by some % less than half.... up the size.
1 @ 36", keep the comm open but crack down on enforcement.

[BigFish]

Most of the people I see do in fact take all they are allowed every time they go out! You may not be seeing it but I do! I can gaurantee the folks slaying fish earlier in the week at a certain spot were all taking their limit!

[numbskull]

Larry, I believe that the majority of the recreational take is attributed to assumed/estimated catch and release mortality.
That won't change even with a 1 fish limit.

[Eric Roach]

Spots in NH & ME that have held small schoolies since the recovery have been disturbingly quiet the past few years. To catch small fish is notable -- especially in abundance.

Our fall blitzing activity up here has really been minimal the past three seasons...There haven't been enough fish around to drive any widespread, sustained surface feeding.

Conservative measures are needed. Even if exactly what's going on is uncertain, wouldn't taking a conservative stance on striped bass mortality make sense?

One major concern is the Gulf oil spill. With a collapse of that region's fisheries, striped bass will be more valuable than ever. Think it's a tough fight against the $$ now? It'll get worse.

[Surf Caster]

Originally Posted by Eric Roach

Spots in NH & ME that have held small schoolies since the recovery have been disturbingly quiet the past few years. To catch small fish is notable -- especially in abundance.

Our fall blitzing activity up here has really been minimal the past three seasons...There haven't been enough fish around to drive any widespread, sustained surface feeding.

Conservative measures are needed. Even if exactly what's going on is uncertain, wouldn't taking a conservative stance on striped bass mortality make sense?

One major concern is the Gulf oil spill. With a collapse of that region's fisheries, striped bass will be more valuable than ever. Think it's a tough fight against the $$ now? It'll get worse.

taking the conservative route would make way to much sense.... so you can count that out...

unfortunately, it feels like nothing substantial will be done about this until its too late.

[BasicPatrick]

Johnny,

I do not know what science you are referring. Biomass estimates are down, they are not "terrible at best". Is there a reason to be concerned...yep. Does that mean close the fishery...nope. If the arguements/theories in this thread were carried over we should all be argueing to close Tuna Fishing period, or at least demand Tuna are Gamefish.

ASMFC has taken no action as of yet. They are considering an action and just like before, this action will fail. Sure it's a PIA but that is what we get when we have a democratic system. Just because there is a proposal does not mean the sky is falling

One thing for sure is that if this was a legislative decision (ie...SF proposal) we would have already lost so I stand by all that I argued for in the S-F debate.

[JohnnyD]

Originally Posted by BasicPatrick

Johnny,

I do not know what science you are referring. Biomass estimates are down, they are not "terrible at best". Is there a reason to be concerned...yep. Does that mean close the fishery...nope. If the arguements/theories in this thread were carried over we should all be argueing to close Tuna Fishing period, or at least demand Tuna are Gamefish.

ASMFC has taken no action as of yet. They are considering an action and just like before, this action will fail. Sure it's a PIA but that is what we get when we have a democratic system. Just because there is a proposal does not mean the sky is falling

One thing for sure is that if this was a legislative decision (ie...SF proposal) we would have already lost so I stand by all that I argued for in the S-F debate.

What I meant by "terrible at best" is the way in which they estimate the stock and mortality. As you said, biomass estimates are down and there's a reason to be concerned, yet ASMFC has a proposal to increase the commercial take?? How does that even make sense?

Let me try and understand... biomass estimates are down and we should be concerned, but the problems people are having with catching fish aren't because of the number of bass around, it's because of the bait? 2 + 2 just doesn't = 4 for me here.

If this were a legislative decision, who exactly would have lost - recreational fishermen, rod & reel commercial, charters? In my opinion all of us (as in everyone that fishes for SB) and the striped bass population will lose completely if ASMFC is allowed to continue its reckless management of the species.

[BatesBCheatin]

Please explain why cutting the rec limit to 1 fish would not have a great impact on the total catch.

I understand why it would not be cut by 50%, but I would think that a 1 fish limit would be make an appreciable difference.

Originally Posted by BasicPatrick

I do want to correct the miguided assumption that a cut to one ifsh at 28" will cut the amount of the rec catch by 1/2. In fact it does not cut that catch by much at all.

[RIROCKHOUND]

Originally Posted by BatesBCheatin

Please explain why cutting the rec limit to 1 fish would not have a great impact on the total catch.

I understand why it would not be cut by 50%, but I would think that a 1 fish limit would be make an appreciable difference.

For Rec and charter: 1 Fish 36"
Period

[piemma]

Originally Posted by RIROCKHOUND

For Rec and charter: 1 Fish 36"
Period

Bry, You got a better cance of shoveling snow in Narr in July. They just will not listen

[afterhours]

[QUOTE=BasicPatrick;773789]Some thoughts:
I do want to correct the miguided assumption that a cut to one ifsh at 28" will cut the amount of the rec catch by 1/2. In fact it does not cut that catch by much at all.


patrick, please correct this for me, i guess i'm under that misguided assumption. i agree on the bait issue.

[RIROCKHOUND]

Originally Posted by BasicPatrick

Some thoughts:
I do want to correct the miguided assumption that a cut to one ifsh at 28" will cut the amount of the rec catch by 1/2. In fact it does not cut that catch by much at all.

broken record.
one fish @ 36"

if 1 @ 28 doesn't cut it, I bet 1 @ 36" does...