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Political Threads This section is for Political Threads - Enter at your own risk. If you say you don't want to see what someone posts - don't read it :hihi: |
03-17-2011, 01:01 PM
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#1
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BuzzLuck
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Brockton
Posts: 6,414
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Lybia
US urges UN to approve Libya airstrikes, no-fly zone
The UN vote is scheduled for 6PM ET today, anyone think the B2 bombers are already in the air to disable Gadahfi's air defense systems?
I need spell check, too: Libya
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Given the diversity of the human species, there is no “normal” human genome sequence. We are all mutants.
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03-17-2011, 01:52 PM
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#2
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: RI
Posts: 21,231
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Looks like the strategy is moving along well. I think Obama is playing this one perfectly...
-spence
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03-17-2011, 01:58 PM
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#3
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BuzzLuck
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Brockton
Posts: 6,414
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
Looks like the strategy is moving along well. I think Obama is playing this one perfectly...
-spence
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I think Gadahfi has a better strategy: recapture the key strategic areas of the country BEFORE the rest of the world, including the US, gets it act together!
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Given the diversity of the human species, there is no “normal” human genome sequence. We are all mutants.
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03-17-2011, 02:07 PM
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#4
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Registered User
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Location: RI
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I think it's taken some time to 1) build the consensus so there's an Arab face on this action rather than being seen as pure US intervention and 2) let it play out a bit. This deal would also give the Saudi Royal Family some cover as they crack down internally and help in Bahrain...NOTE: Both strategic US allies.
As Iran tries to stir the pot there's the Sunni/Shiite dynamic as well here. Iran would really like the (mostly Shiite) protests in Bahrain to be successful.
And the simple fact of what happened in Egypt will put pressure on even the US allies to reform faster.
Ultimately it's probably in our best interest to let these events push reforms more slowly without destabilizing the region or strengthening Iran.
Considering the complexity and variability of the situation, its actually not looking all that terrible. Obama seems to have been pretty careful to not make statements or promises we can't keep, something very different from Bush.
And if the UN does impose a no fly zone in Lybia, who's going to stand behind the Lybian Govt? The Sudan??? I'm not sure the regime can survive...
-spence
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03-17-2011, 02:34 PM
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#5
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sick of bluefish
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: TEXAS
Posts: 8,672
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why are we getting involved here?
I think we should stay away. All the neighboring countries have armies and air forces, why arent they sending them in?
US should stay out. We have nothing to gain there except get more blame from them for their problems
I know peoples memories are short but a year or so ago we were applauding Ghadafi for his support and now he is a brutal dictator? come on
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making s-b.com a kinder, gentler place for all
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03-17-2011, 02:46 PM
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#6
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Registered User
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Location: RI
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RIJIMMY
why are we getting involved here?
I think we should stay away. All the neighboring countries have armies and air forces, why arent they sending them in?
US should stay out. We have nothing to gain there except get more blame from them for their problems
I know peoples memories are short but a year or so ago we were applauding Ghadafi for his support and now he is a brutal dictator? come on
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I think we're trying to draw a line between the brutal regimes we want to support and the brutal regimes we think are ripe for accelerated reform.
While we don't want to get into a real battle, it does seem like Ghaddafi has crossed the line with his actions...they're going to squeeze him until he pops.
-spence
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03-17-2011, 03:04 PM
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#7
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Certifiable Intertidal Anguiologist
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Somewhere between OOB & west of Watch Hill
Posts: 35,134
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
I think it's taken some time to 1) build the consensus so there's an Arab face on this action rather than being seen as pure US intervention and 2) let it play out a bit.
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You're bleeping me? Give it more time. I am not a fan of intervention here (I think maybe Europe steps up on this one and we support that effort). But by the time the admin gets going, this will be all over. If you allow more time for Arab consensus it is long over. The only good new if the Arabs DO IT with an d ARAB face is that at least the Junior Varsity will be going against the Middle School squad. The action windows is nearly closed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
This deal would also give the Saudi Royal Family some cover as they crack down internally and help in Bahrain...NOTE: Both strategic US allies.
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Yes, tough nut to decipher on this one.
Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
As Iran tries to stir the pot there's the Sunni/Shiite dynamic as well here. Iran would really like the (mostly Shiite) protests in Bahrain to be successful.
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Speaking of Iran, arming AQ/Taliban now. And reports are going around that a ship bound for Hamas has been intercepted with Anti Ship Missiles (not RPGs) and a Chinese ship was intercepted with WMD components bound for Iran.
Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
Considering the complexity and variability of the situation, its actually not looking all that terrible. Obama seems to have been pretty careful to not make statements or promises we can't keep, something very different from Bush.
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Spencism Alert! Spencism Alert! Spencism Alert!
Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
And if the UN does impose a no fly zone in Lybia, who's going to stand behind the Lybian Govt? The Sudan??? I'm not sure the regime can survive...
-spence
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Well, you could have a repeat of the last two wars in the middle east. No Fly Zones do not occupy territory.
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~Fix the Bait~ ~Pogies Forever~
Striped Bass Fishing - All Stripers
Kobayashi Maru Election - there is no way to win.
Apocalypse is Coming:
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03-17-2011, 04:59 PM
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#8
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: RI
Posts: 21,231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnR
You're bleeping me? Give it more time. I am not a fan of intervention here (I think maybe Europe steps up on this one and we support that effort). But by the time the admin gets going, this will be all over. If you allow more time for Arab consensus it is long over. The only good new if the Arabs DO IT with an d ARAB face is that at least the Junior Varsity will be going against the Middle School squad. The action windows is nearly closed.
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We'll see how close they really are. Clearly the Admin is not going to go it alone, nor should we. I think the bigger piece is that Khadaffi is now seen as damaged goods by even much of the Arab leadership.
Quote:
Speaking of Iran, arming AQ/Taliban now. And reports are going around that a ship bound for Hamas has been intercepted with Anti Ship Missiles (not RPGs) and a Chinese ship was intercepted with WMD components bound for Iran.
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Never seen a report of Iran arming al Qaeda. Sending arms to Palestine is nothing new...
Quote:
Spencism Alert! Spencism Alert! Spencism Alert!
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No, it's just a remark. And one I think that's defend-able. Bush would have made some dramatic remarks about standing up for those who seek freedom, the neocons would have had a circle jerk, and then they'd do nothing.
Quote:
Well, you could have a repeat of the last two wars in the middle east. No Fly Zones do not occupy territory.
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I think the calculus in Libya might not be in Khadaffi's favor. The real end game may be to get regime ending concessions.
-spence
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03-17-2011, 05:31 PM
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#9
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Certifiable Intertidal Anguiologist
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Somewhere between OOB & west of Watch Hill
Posts: 35,134
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
We'll see how close they really are. Clearly the Admin is not going to go it alone, nor should we. I think the bigger piece is that Khadaffi is now seen as damaged goods by even much of the Arab leadership.
Never seen a report of Iran arming al Qaeda. Sending arms to Palestine is nothing new...
No, it's just a remark. And one I think that's defend-able. Bush would have made some dramatic remarks about standing up for those who seek freedom, the neocons would have had a circle jerk, and then they'd do nothing.
I think the calculus in Libya might not be in Khadaffi's favor. The real end game may be to get regime ending concessions.
-spence
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Window is closing. Center of gravity was Tripoli, now it is Benghazi. Window. Closing. No time for high end fencing around an issue. Not that I support it...
Quote:
Never seen a report of Iran arming al Qaeda. Sending arms to Palestine is nothing new...
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One of several reports but I'll use the NYTimes one: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/10/wo...st/10iran.html
China-Iran - take your pick (though it is earlier in this news story) Google
Obama when he doesn't do something or pick a side is good while displaying a certain elan and obvious high intelligence lost on the masses, Bush is bad - I get it.
Time will cost lives. Best to either get it on early or not at all.
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~Fix the Bait~ ~Pogies Forever~
Striped Bass Fishing - All Stripers
Kobayashi Maru Election - there is no way to win.
Apocalypse is Coming:
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03-17-2011, 06:04 PM
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#10
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BuzzLuck
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Brockton
Posts: 6,414
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It's a go for bombing!
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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03-17-2011, 06:12 PM
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#11
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Libtardia
Posts: 21,591
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labial rejuvenation
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03-17-2011, 06:29 PM
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#12
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........
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 22,805
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they (daffy) will target the oil field i bet b4 the bombers arrive
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03-18-2011, 02:14 PM
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#13
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sick of bluefish
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: TEXAS
Posts: 8,672
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so O is on TV threatening action against Libya. Not the UN, not the Arabs, us....can someone tell me WHY?
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making s-b.com a kinder, gentler place for all
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03-18-2011, 02:51 PM
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#14
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: RI
Posts: 21,231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RIJIMMY
so O is on TV threatening action against Libya. Not the UN, not the Arabs, us....can someone tell me WHY?
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Well, there seems to be pretty strong support from EU and the other Arab nations.
Justification is because the Libyan government has turned to using the military against their own people without much regard. It looks like they've been bombing and shelling killing just about anyone. I've really some really gruesome stories.
Fear is that atrocities will increase and cause a humanitarian crisis which would destabilize the region, especially considering the events in Tunisia and Egypt right next door.
At least that's the reasoning he gave when he spoke today.
-spence
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03-18-2011, 03:36 PM
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#15
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........
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 22,805
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RIJIMMY
so O is on TV threatening action against Libya. Not the UN, not the Arabs, us....can someone tell me WHY?
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it's for the campaign of course !
looking like our fearless leader big and bold
he da man ....photo op city (and sound bite)
a President in control as leader of the world
makes him APPEAR to be more re-electable
in a NUTSHELL
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03-18-2011, 03:39 PM
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#16
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Land OF Forgotten Toys
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Central MA
Posts: 2,309
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
Well, there seems to be pretty strong support from EU and the other Arab nations.
Justification is because the Libyan government has turned to using the military against their own people without much regard. It looks like they've been bombing and shelling killing just about anyone. I've really some really gruesome stories.
Fear is that atrocities will increase and cause a humanitarian crisis which would destabilize the region, especially considering the events in Tunisia and Egypt right next door.
At least that's the reasoning he gave when he spoke today.
-spence
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Well thankfully he got off the golf course and said something. Now he can send Hillary out in the world to do his bidding.
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I am the man in the Bassless Chaps
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03-18-2011, 04:29 PM
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#17
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: RI
Posts: 21,231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jackbass
Well thankfully he got off the golf course and said something. Now he can send Hillary out in the world to do his bidding.
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Quite thoughtful analysis. And you didn't even have to bring up his Islamic heritage!
-spence
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03-19-2011, 07:50 PM
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#18
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Afterhours Custom Plugs
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: R.I.
Posts: 8,611
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he's not golfing -he's in rio for carnivale! what a tool...
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03-19-2011, 08:02 PM
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#19
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: RI
Posts: 21,231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by afterhours
he's not golfing -he's in rio for carnivale! what a tool...
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Carnivale in Rio was over a week ago...tool.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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03-19-2011, 09:28 PM
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#20
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BuzzLuck
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Brockton
Posts: 6,414
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Wherever he is/was he gave the OK to launch 110 Tomahawk missiles at Libya!
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Given the diversity of the human species, there is no “normal” human genome sequence. We are all mutants.
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03-20-2011, 04:32 AM
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#21
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........
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 22,805
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project
O.D. well under way
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03-20-2011, 06:09 AM
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#22
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Permanently Disconnected
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 12,647
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I am starting to see a pattern here. I think Spence is really Obama.......
At the very least either his press secretary or the head groupie of his fan club
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03-20-2011, 06:51 AM
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#23
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: RI
Posts: 21,231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by #^^^^^^^^^^^&
I am starting to see a pattern here. I think Spence is really Obama.......
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Now that's a compliment
-spence
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03-20-2011, 06:57 AM
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#24
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Afterhours Custom Plugs
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: R.I.
Posts: 8,611
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my bad spencey...he's still a $%^%$ tool . how many times has he been on the golf course- close to 50. who's he think he is- tiger woods?
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03-20-2011, 07:05 AM
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#25
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: RI
Posts: 21,231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by afterhours
my bad spencey...he's still a $%^%$ tool . how many times has he been on the golf course- close to 50. who's he think he is- tiger woods?
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How many hours a day do you think he's actively working on average?
12?
14?
-spence
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03-20-2011, 07:07 AM
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#26
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Afterhours Custom Plugs
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: R.I.
Posts: 8,611
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
How many hours a day do you think he's actively working on average?
12?
14?
-spence
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since you know all obama, why don't you tell us...
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03-20-2011, 07:31 AM
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#27
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Land OF Forgotten Toys
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Central MA
Posts: 2,309
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My bad he was golfing while Japan was under water. I never said anything about Islamic heritage. I could really give a hoot what his religion is. Doesn't affect my world. I could care less. He was Picking out his brackets while Libya was burning.
None of it matters. Until people decide this country is more important than red or blue we are all going to spin our wheels. As long as people like you Spence sit back on your throne and justify and rationalize moves by politicians based on red or blue we are all screwed.
There is zero accountability in government anymore. There hasn't been for quite a while. Our officials are the new Celebrity and people believe what is put in front of them by Couric, Williams and others.
So enjoy sitting back writing your quippy remarks and feel good about how intelligent your responses are. After all you are debating politics with the people that are affected by them. Not the people that practice them. We are all the real world and we live and die in the confines of what has been laid forth for us and make the best of it.
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I am the man in the Bassless Chaps
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03-20-2011, 07:51 AM
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#28
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Bethany CT
Posts: 2,877
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Come on Spence, Obama missed the boat. He should have bombed Libya 2 weeks ago before K(G)hadafi attack his people. This week is too late. Now wait, acually he never should do it. let the arab countries deal with it? I mean, where is his leadership on this? Why does he spend so much time fishing and cutting brush on his range in Texas? Oh yeah, wrong guy. Why is he playing so much golf? There are only 24 hours in the day. The constitution mandates a 30 hour workday. Shouldn't he be working on that cold fusion problem. He has done nothing since he became president. Except all those things that I disagree with, like raise my taxes, but other than that he hasn't done anything.
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No, no, no. we’re 30… 30, three zero.
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03-20-2011, 10:39 AM
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#29
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........
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 22,805
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he most certainly did
he brought us change
he says the word every time he's on TV
several times
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03-20-2011, 10:58 AM
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#30
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Mansfield
Posts: 4,834
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jackbass
My bad he was golfing while Japan was under water.
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Clearly he hates Japanese people.
Sooooo, what's the exit statagy for Lybia? I think he set a date for the troops to withdraw though
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