Barack must be desperate for voters...

[spence]

Originally Posted by RIJIMMY

I dont want to blame everything on "O" but I think his attitude has made it worse.

While divisive politics certainly have a long history, it would seem as though the 1990's saw the current track we're on today really take hold.

Sure, the Dem's have had their moments, but the Republican efforts to maintain authority and destroy Clinton and Obama really has no equal, even considering left wing desires to impeach Bush for misleading the country into the Iraq war.

Obama might appear detached, but I don't think his attitude is a problem. From everything I've read he's completely engaged and works his ass off.

One thing I can say for Romney is he is a mature and moral person and believe he would bring dignity back to the office.

Agree, but I'm sure you could say that of a number of people who get to Washington and are soon corrupted even though they believe they're doing the right thing...it's not easy to lead when you're in a bubble.

-spence

[fishbones]

Originally Posted by spence

Obama might appear detached, but I don't think his attitude is a problem. From everything I've read he's completely engaged and works his ass off.

-spence

Doesn't matter how hard he works if he does a crappy job. There are no "A's for effort" in his position. And his childish remarks and smarmy attitude make people dislike him. That doesn't make him detached, but it makes him look like an ass.

[spence]

Originally Posted by fishbones

Doesn't matter how hard he works if he does a crappy job. There are no "A's for effort" in his position. And his childish remarks and smarmy attitude make people dislike him. That doesn't make him detached, but it makes him look like an ass.

The jury doesn't decide on the job he's done for another year. I think Obama can present a pretty effective presidency if he can get his PR together.

As for childish and smarmy remarks, I'm not sure there's much here to go on...unless you hated him to begin with.

-spence

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by spence

The jury doesn't decide on the job he's done for another year. I think Obama can present a pretty effective presidency if he can get his PR together.

As for childish and smarmy remarks, I'm not sure there's much here to go on...unless you hated him to begin with.

-spence

"As for childish and smarmy remarks, I'm not sure there's much here to go on."

on Sarah Palin..."you can put lipstick onm a pig, it's still a pig".

On blue collar Americans: they cling to their guns and religion because they are bitter and racist.

On the Cambridge police: I wasn't there, and I have no idea what happened, but it's fair to say the police acted stupidly.

On those who criticized him for his remarks about the Cambridge police: I'm sorry if people took my remarks as derogatory. (Is there another way to interpret the word "stupid"?)

On his bowling skills: I look like one of those special olympians out there (ha ha ha!!!! Boy, there's nothing funnier than making fun of handicapped people!)

on republicans: they need to get in the back of the bus.

This is just off the top of my head. Spence, care to comment on your assertion??

[fishbones]

Originally Posted by spence

The jury doesn't decide on the job he's done for another year. I think Obama can present a pretty effective presidency if he can get his PR together.

As for childish and smarmy remarks, I'm not sure there's much here to go on...unless you hated him to begin with.

-spence

You're not serious, are you? He'd need the miracle of all miracles to present an effective presidency. As for me hating him, nope. You're not gonna bait me with that old crap. I may not have voted for him, but I hoped he would succeed. You can find that in a post I made way back when he was elected. Even you can find plenty of instances where he's been smarmy and childish. Plenty to go on there.

[scottw]

Spence is hilarious

[spence]

Originally Posted by fishbones

You're not serious, are you? He'd need the miracle of all miracles to present an effective presidency.

Remember, his effectiveness will be judged relative to the challenges he's faced and the anticipated effectiveness of his challenger.

A tanking economy, two wars, 10 natural disasters etc...hell, this would have been tough first term for anyone.

The fact that we didn't slip into a depression, that we're exiting Iraq, that we've killed a heck of a lot of terrorists including OBL, expanded health care coverage, a lot of positive financial and military reforms, restrictions on lobbyists, incentives for small businesses etc...

There's a lot to sell the independent voter on. Obama's bigger worry should be that the left (and younger voters) feel he has led from the middle and might not mobilize like they did in 2008. But, it's looking like the GOP might have a similar problem getting the religious right to the polls as well.

In the end I think it's going to be a very tight race. Obama is a good debater and the debates will probably decide the election.

-spence

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by spence

Remember, his effectiveness will be judged relative to the challenges he's faced and the anticipated effectiveness of his challenger.

A tanking economy, two wars, 10 natural disasters etc...hell, this would have been tough first term for anyone.

The fact that we didn't slip into a depression, that we're exiting Iraq, that we've killed a heck of a lot of terrorists including OBL, expanded health care coverage, a lot of positive financial and military reforms, restrictions on lobbyists, incentives for small businesses etc...

There's a lot to sell the independent voter on. Obama's bigger worry should be that the left (and younger voters) feel he has led from the middle and might not mobilize like they did in 2008. But, it's looking like the GOP might have a similar problem getting the religious right to the polls as well.

In the end I think it's going to be a very tight race. Obama is a good debater and the debates will probably decide the election.

-spence

"The fact that we didn't slip into a depression"

You're giving Obama credit for something that is literally impossoble to prove. His explosion of the debt may yet push us into that depression, but you don't care about that...

"we're exiting Iraq"

According to the strategy put in place by the previous administration...

"we've killed a heck of a lot of terrorists including OBL"

Thanks to the programs put in place by the previous administration...

"Obama is a good debater and the debates will probably decide the election."

I pray you are right,particularly if Gingrich is the nominee. Obama is a horrible debater, he's good at deflecting attention away from his actual record, and instead focusing on some mythical boogeyman, which in 2012 will be successful white people. That works against a poodle like John McCain, who was too afraid of being called a racist to attack Obama in a debate. An angry pitbull like Newt will have no such concerns, and it will show loud and clear.

[spence]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

You're giving Obama credit for something that is literally impossoble to prove. His explosion of the debt may yet push us into that depression, but you don't care about that...

Well, the CBO certainly seemed to think the stimulus has a positive impact. If Bush gets to take credit for keeping Americans safe post 9/11 you'd think Obama would get credit for keeping us out of a depression (and no attacks also :hihi)

According to the strategy put in place by the previous administration...

Thanks to the programs put in place by the previous administration...

If Obama was the idiot you claim he had plenty of chances to screw up the timeline for an Iraq withdrawal. As for terrorism, Obama certainly wasn't following the Bush playbook.

An angry pitbull like Newt will have no such concerns, and it will show loud and clear.

Yep, at the voting booth. People don't want to elect an angry pit bull president.

-spence

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by spence

While divisive politics certainly have a long history, it would seem as though the 1990's saw the current track we're on today really take hold.

Sure, the Dem's have had their moments, but the Republican efforts to maintain authority and destroy Clinton and Obama really has no equal, even considering left wing desires to impeach Bush for misleading the country into the Iraq war.

Obama might appear detached, but I don't think his attitude is a problem. From everything I've read he's completely engaged and works his ass off.


Agree, but I'm sure you could say that of a number of people who get to Washington and are soon corrupted even though they believe they're doing the right thing...it's not easy to lead when you're in a bubble.

-spence

"the Republican efforts to maintain authority and destroy Clinton and Obama really has no equal"

Sorry, remember Sarah Palin? Libs weren't out to destroy her? MSNBC is STILL obsessed with her, and she isn't even running for anything.

"From everything I've read he's completely engaged and works his ass off."

Spence, let me get this right. If you "read" that Bush was awesome, obviously you would dispute it. But when you read that Obama works his butt off, that's good enough for you, it must be true?

Just trying to clarify.

[spence]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

"the Republican efforts to maintain authority and destroy Clinton and Obama really has no equal"

Sorry, remember Sarah Palin? Libs weren't out to destroy her? MSNBC is STILL obsessed with her, and she isn't even running for anything.

She's still quite influential in the GOP though...as odd as it may seem.

As for efforts to discredit her, these were a response to an open invitation. Her VP nod was a trick play and she was obviously not ready for the job, if she ever would be...although she's making a hell of a lot of money just hanging out there

"From everything I've read he's completely engaged and works his ass off."

Spence, let me get this right. If you "read" that Bush was awesome, obviously you would dispute it. But when you read that Obama works his butt off, that's good enough for you, it must be true?

Just trying to clarify.

I think Bush was a disengaged President. He thought of himself as the "decider" and wanted to make a mark but really didn't want to own the decision making process. In all I think he's a decent guy who just gave up too much authority to those around him. The proof here is in the pudding.

Obama by contrast appears to put a lot more mental energy into the job. I don't think he has a bad attitude or hates America. If anything he's insulated himself too much from inside the beltway jabber and hasn't worked to control the debate. This has hindered his effectiveness.

There are limitations to both styles.

-spence

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by spence

She's still quite influential in the GOP though...as odd as it may seem.

As for efforts to discredit her, these were a response to an open invitation. Her VP nod was a trick play and she was obviously not ready for the job, if she ever would be...although she's making a hell of a lot of money just hanging out there




I think Bush was a disengaged President. He thought of himself as the "decider" and wanted to make a mark but really didn't want to own the decision making process. In all I think he's a decent guy who just gave up too much authority to those around him. The proof here is in the pudding.

Obama by contrast appears to put a lot more mental energy into the job. I don't think he has a bad attitude or hates America. If anything he's insulated himself too much from inside the beltway jabber and hasn't worked to control the debate. This has hindered his effectiveness.

There are limitations to both styles.

-spence

"Her VP nod was a trick play "

Read some actual facts. At the time of her nomination, she had the highest approval ratings of any governor in the country. Her nomination catapulted McCain ahead of Obama in every poll, and they stayed ahead till the economy collapsed.

[spence]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

"Her VP nod was a trick play "

Read some actual facts. At the time of her nomination, she had the highest approval ratings of any governor in the country. Her nomination catapulted McCain ahead of Obama in every poll, and they stayed ahead till the economy collapsed.

Do you think that just by repeating the word "facts" in all your posts it gives them more credibility?

Palin did have high marks as Governor, although I'm not sure I'd put the job on the same level as leading New York, Texas or even Iowa for that matter. We are talking about a state that has a tiny population and vast natural resources that by law benefit the voters. Big topics on the legislative agenda are the wolf population and how to allocate the 442 million Federal tax dollars they decided not to spend on the bridge to nowhere. Hell, that's more than a half million dollars per resident!

When she hit the spotlight it was clear that she was completely unprepared for the job. Yes, she's hot and delivers a solid snarky one liner, but beyond that there's not a lot of substance.

The media attention she attracted did help McCain in the polls, and the economy did have a big impact on their demise. But the simple fact is that the voters saw her as a novelty in the end. She was a trick play that gave McCain a bump, but when the reality of the next year became clear, voters had more confidence in Obama and Biden.

McCain blew it. Had he picked Joe Lieberman as is rumored to be his personal choice...they would have cleaned up.

-spence

[RIJIMMY]

Originally Posted by spence

While divisive politics certainly have a long history, it would seem as though the 1990's saw the current track we're on today really take hold.

Sure, the Dem's have had their moments, but the Republican efforts to maintain authority and destroy Clinton and Obama really has no equal, even considering left wing desires to impeach Bush for misleading the country into the Iraq war.

Obama might appear detached, but I don't think his attitude is a problem. From everything I've read he's completely engaged and works his ass off.

-spence

you're really nuts. Serioulsy. GWB never once responded to the deluge of criticisms on him from Iraq to Katrina while he was president. He never pointed fingers or whined. He acted above all the noise. "O" has lashed out time and time again on the right wing media, talk radio, critics, GOP, etc. He referred to the republicans as ENEMIES when making a latino campaign add. Whine and point fingers and this has done nothing but widen the divide. I dont care how hard he works, his actions and comments have led to a wider divide in this country,.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by RIJIMMY

you're really nuts. Serioulsy. GWB never once responded to the deluge of criticisms on him from Iraq to Katrina while he was president. He never pointed fingers or whined. He acted above all the noise. "O" has lashed out time and time again on the right wing media, talk radio, critics, GOP, etc. He referred to the republicans as ENEMIES when making a latino campaign add. Whine and point fingers and this has done nothing but widen the divide. I dont care how hard he works, his actions and comments have led to a wider divide in this country,.

Dead-on, RIJIMMY. Harry Reid, the majority leader of the Senate, called Bush a "loser". Bush was insulted again and again, and he never responded in kind, he was too good a guy (to his detriment, in my opinion). For someone to suggest that conservatives have cornered the market on boorish behavior is, as you said, "nuts".

But you have to be like that to buy into the liberal ideology. You have to be willing to see only what you want to see, and to frequently ignore that which doesn't serve your agenda, even if what you're ignoring is hard, irrefutable, fact. Lefties viciously attacked the tea party (who almost never misbehaved), and compliment the occupiers (who have descended to violent anarchy almost everywhere).

"his actions and comments have led to a wider divide in this country"

There is no doubt we're more divided now, and Obama has done NOTHING to mitigate this. He has repeatedly shown that he has no time for anyone who isn't inclined to kneel down and kiss his ring.

I thought for sure he'd be a shoe-in for re-election. Hell, there was a time when I relished the thought of only 8 years of him, because I was afraid he'd re-write the constitution and anoint himself president for life. It's amazing to me that with the entire media (except for Foxnews) in his pocket, that his numbers have sunk to this level. His incompetence makes him very vulnerable.

[scottw]

Originally Posted by RIJIMMY

Whine and point fingers and this has done nothing but widen the divide. I dont care how hard he works, his actions and comments have led to a wider divide in this country,.

it's calculated

"An organizer must stir up dissatisfaction and discontent... He must create a mechanism that can drain off the underlying guilt for having accepted the previous situation for so long a time. Out of this mechanism, a new community organization arises....
"The job then is getting the people to move, to act, to participate; in short, to develop and harness the necessary power to effectively conflict with the prevailing patterns and change them. When those prominent in the status quo turn and label you an 'agitator' they are completely correct, for that is, in one word, your function—to agitate to the point of conflict." Saul Alinsky


it's going to get ugly in 2012

[spence]

Originally Posted by RIJIMMY

you're really nuts. Serioulsy. GWB never once responded to the deluge of criticisms on him from Iraq to Katrina while he was president. He never pointed fingers or whined. He acted above all the noise. "O" has lashed out time and time again on the right wing media, talk radio, critics, GOP, etc. He referred to the republicans as ENEMIES when making a latino campaign add. Whine and point fingers and this has done nothing but widen the divide. I dont care how hard he works, his actions and comments have led to a wider divide in this country,.

This isn't about criticism, it's about coordinated attacks.

-spence

[scottw]

Originally Posted by RIJIMMY

you're really nuts. Serioulsy. GWB never once responded to the deluge of criticisms on him from Iraq to Katrina while he was president. He never pointed fingers or whined. He acted above all the noise. "O" has lashed out time and time again on the right wing media, talk radio, critics, GOP, etc. He referred to the republicans as ENEMIES when making a latino campaign add. Whine and point fingers and this has done nothing but widen the divide. I dont care how hard he works, his actions and comments have led to a wider divide in this country,.

he blames...and then he distorts(lies)

When asked what he would say to the African American community now disappointed in him over what many perceive are failed policies, but who, nonetheless, may still support him, President Barack Obama stated:

“The reason they still support me is because they understand what an incredible mess had been made as I was coming into office and we’ve been spending the last three years cleaning it up. The good news is that the economy is starting to strengthen. We’ve seen some positive signs. The unemployment rate has ticked down.”

Really?

WASHINGTON – The unemployment rate fell to 8.6 percent in November, a number that offers the Obama administration a rare piece of good economic news -- but also masks a startling shift in the job market.

The Labor Department said Friday that employers added 120,000 jobs last month. With that, the unemployment rate dropped to the lowest level in more than two and a half years. But a key reason for the sharp drop was that about 315,000 people had stopped looking for work -- for the Labor Department's purposes, they were not counted as unemployed.

The report comes as Congress wrangles over several jobs proposals, including extensions of the payroll tax cut and unemployment aid. And it arrives in advance of the first Republican primaries and caucuses, a race that has revolved around the economy.

More than half the jobs added were by retailers, restaurants and bars, a sign that holiday hiring has kicked in.

This is what constitutes "good news" for Obama these days......if all of the unemployed would just stop looking for work, he could tell everyone he fixed everything and we're back to normal and claim victory...more "snake oil"