Roy Moore / Al Franken

[detbuch]

Originally Posted by spence

I breathing quite fine thank you.

Hoo boy.

[Sea Dangles]

Holiday party Jeff?
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[spence]

Originally Posted by Sea Dangles

Holiday party Jeff?
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Care to add anything of substance?
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[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by PaulS

She was accussed of sexual assault or being a pedophile?

!

You tell me which of these is wrong...


She stayed married to a predator.

She lied to protect him (saying he was innocent, and that the vast right wing conspiracy was framing him)

She used her platform as first lady, to slut shame his victims on national TV.

Are those actions consistent with what liberals are saying (today) that we should be doing?

True or false, Paul? True or false?

Liberals are saying 'silence is consent'. She was a lot more than silent on the issue, she clearly sided with the abuser, and she did it out of greed and ambition.

And in one of the truly great deliveries of justice ever, the most inevitable presidential candidate since the invention of the word 'inevitable', is now wandering the woods alone, blabbering like an idiot, doing infomercials for her book.

Good riddance to bad garbage.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by PaulS

She didn't "slut shamed" She defended her husband as they both had been lied about for years and years by the right (maybe she did kill vince foster??). As has been stated, we (the collective we) did a crappy job dealing w/claims of sexual assualt and impropriety (back even bf Anita Hill). Times change and in this case for the better.

Don't tell me about moral authority when you seem to have no problem not calling for Trump to resign when the left called for Franken to resign. 650K Conserv. in Alabama just told us where their "moral authority" lies.

Bottom line - the conserv. have zero moral authority on this issue as long as Trump is still in office and no on calls for him to resign. The Dems have outplayed the Repubs on this issue and are showing they have zero moral authority. If you want to make the claim that both parties are equally crappy, I might agree but I doubt you are capable of making that claim.

"She didn't "slut shamed""

Oh. So when she referred to Bill's victims as "loony tunes narcissists", that was what?

"She defended her husband"

And what did she defend, exactly? His right to prey upon women...

"Times change and in this case for the better. "

Ah. And the fact that liberals didn't change their tine on abusing women, until Trump was elected and the Clintons became refuse, is what? A coincidence? As I said, selective outrage, is fake outrage. Not long ago, the pigs in Hollywood, led by Meryl Streep, gave a standing ovation to convicted child rapist Roman Polanski. I have something to learn from these hedonistic sodomites about how to treat women with respect?


"Don't tell me about moral authority when you seem to have no problem not calling for Trump to resign"

I said let's investigate.

There was photographic evidence of what Franken did, and he admitted it. You show me photos of Trump abusing women, I will scream at the top of my lungs for him to step down.

"The Dems have outplayed the Repubs on this issue"

Oh my yes, whch explains the results of all the elections since last November, of which the GOP lost one, and won several.

I cannot wait for 2018. The DNC is crapping their pants.

[PaulS]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

"She didn't "slut shamed""

Oh. So when she referred to Bill's victims as "loony tunes narcissists", that was what?

"She defended her husband"

And what did she defend, exactly? His right to prey upon women...

"Times change and in this case for the better. "

Ah. And the fact that liberals didn't change their tine on abusing women, until Trump was elected and the Clintons became refuse, is what? A coincidence? As I said, selective outrage, is fake outrage. Not long ago, the pigs in Hollywood, led by Meryl Streep, gave a standing ovation to convicted child rapist Roman Polanski. I have something to learn from these hedonistic sodomites about how to treat women with respect?


"Don't tell me about moral authority when you seem to have no problem not calling for Trump to resign"

I said let's investigate.

There was photographic evidence of what Franken did, and he admitted it. You show me photos of Trump abusing women, I will scream at the top of my lungs for him to step down.

"The Dems have outplayed the Repubs on this issue"

Oh my yes, whch explains the results of all the elections since last November, of which the GOP lost one, and won several.

I cannot wait for 2018. The DNC is crapping their pants.

Oh. So when she referred to Bill's victims as "loony tunes narcissists", that was what?

That's not sluts shaming. You've been reading into the sleazy Republican narrative so long it's clouded your mind. You should do a little research on what the woman accuses Hillary of doing to them.

"She defended her husband"

And what did she defend, exactly? His right to prey upon women.

The sleazy Republicans lied so much and for so long about the clintons that she didn't believe them. Do you think they had Vince Foster killed LOL. Maybe the clintons vandalized Wiley's car or threw a dead cat on her porch or whatever the other things they've accused the clintons of doing.

"Times change and in this case for the better. "

Ah. And the fact that liberals didn't change their tine on abusing women, until Trump was elected and the Clintons became refuse, is what? A coincidence? As I said, selective outrage, is fake outrage. Not long ago, the pigs in Hollywood, led by Meryl Streep, gave a standing ovation to convicted child rapist Roman Polanski. I have something to learn from these hedonistic sodomites about how to treat women with respect?

Those moral conservative had no problem electing a vile person who bragged on tape about assaulting women and walking in on naked women.

"Don't tell me about moral authority when you seem to have no problem not calling for Trump to resign"

I said let's investigate.

What's to investigate? we have him on tape bragging about assaulting women. How many times do we have to repeat it? What is more clear than his own voice on tape?

There was photographic evidence of what Franken did, and he admitted it. You show me photos of Trump abusing women, I will scream at the top of my lungs for him to step down.

You mean the picture of Franken with his hands hovering over a woman's breast but not touching them? You seem to be ignoring Trump's own words. In a court of law tape of someone's comments is very good evidence in case you didn't know that.

"The Dems have outplayed the Repubs on this issue"

Oh my yes, whch explains the results of all the elections since last November, of which the GOP lost one, and won several.

No that just shows that the Republicans did not care about all the assaults that Trump committed. As we've said many many times previously they had many people they could have chosen instead they chose somebody who brags about assaulting women. He thinks it's a joke and you moral conservatives elected him without giving it a second thought.

I cannot wait for 2018. The DNC is crapping their pants.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

[Sea Dangles]

Originally Posted by spence

Care to add anything of substance?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Hoo boy should meet your standards
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

[Got Stripers]

Originally Posted by detbuch

Exactly. Trump doesn't. Nor does he pretend to. Apparently the Dems now all of a sudden want it and claim that they have somehow made the big switch, like their fake claim that the Southern politicians made a switch on a dime from Democrat to Republican because of Nixon's Southern Strategy.

Nor is there actual evidence of Trump being as depraved as he is characterized by those who hate him. Someone mentioned the Howard Stern interviews with him as showing what a sexual pervert he is supposed to be. So I watched several of them. He was pretty consistently classy. He didn't really admit to all the stuff that was asked by Stern's typical sexually deviant questions. It was Stern who was, as usual, crude and intentionally provocative. Trump said he was always personally respectful to the ladies in his beauty contests. As the owner of those contests, he went into some dressing rooms for various reasons and saw some really beautiful women, wink, wink. OK, but he didn't harass them. With Stern, the interview will usually turn to some perverse sexual conversation. But that's on Howard. His guests go along with the banter. They were the type of interviews and answers one would expect on a Howard Stern show. Most macho men will wink, wink, along with mostly and intentionally false bravado to add to the entertainment.

Stern tried to push Trump in one video to say that he would leave Melania if she became disfigured, or fat and sagging from pregnancy. Trump insisted, in probe after typical Stern probe, that he would not. That she was special beyond her beauty, and would never leave her. Trump supposedly, according to a CNN clip, allowed Stern to call Ivanka a nice piece of a**. I saw that interview. Trump did not "allow" it. Stern does what he wants. Those who go on his show know that beforehand. Trump did not "agree" with Stern's remark. He, barely audibly because Stern was still finishing his remark, said nah, and went on to praise his daughter. You could see the beginning, in those Stern interviews, of Trump's view of the media being fake news.

There were two short videos cobbled by CNN with examples of supposedly crude or sexist Trump comments in the Stern interviews. I had actually watched the full interviews, and the out of context snippets shown by CNN distorted the tone and meaning of the whole conversations.

In the Billy Bush little dialogue, Trump said some women would "allow" you (which is the opposite of assault), if you were rich and powerful, to put your hands on their you-know-what. Which it seems is true. He didn't say he actually did, but one might assume he may have. And he admitted that he was interested in the lady in question, but when she didn't reciprocate, he went no further.

If you want to consider that all to be depraved in the context of the milieu that Trump travelled, you're probably either naïve or ignorant.

And that behavior in that milieu goes back to the beginning of that milieu. And a lot of our politicians, and several Presidents, have come from that milieu. As well did our media moguls and their star talking heads. As we are discovering.

But what Trump does want, not moral authority, but to change the nature and direction of our federal government. And while we are directed to focus on the junk, like that in this thread, he is doing, without much help and with great resistance, quite a bit of changing. The junk is meant to distract us from what he is accomplishing, and to bring him down in order to stop it and get back to creating that all powerful government we so desperately want and need.

Cracks me up that the core keeps waving the Trump flag, spouting the
party line and screaming foul over all the "fake news" and "fake accusations" the media puts out to tarnish the very fragile ego of Donald Trump. Inappropriate sexual conduct by Trump is far from his number one character flaw, but it's certainly in the top ten. I love all the fake news crying by Trump, when he in fact is the biggest liar and tweeter of untruths that we have seen in quite some time.

I personally don't have the time to fact check and view Stern interviews, as I understand there are over 15 hours and well over 100,000 spoken words, I've heard enough choice samples of those, along with the access Hollywood tape and all the filth coming out of his mouth throughout the campaign to form an opinion. I have no doubt many if not the majority of the accusations have some truth in them. Hey if you have the time and nothing better to do have fun, I may return in time to read your blue, red or yellow font of the day retort. If not I'm sure it will be extremely well thought out, highly researched and a very articulate response to somehow convince me my opinion must be in error.

I love the most recent lie coming out of his mouth, that the tax bill is really going to hurt Trump and his family, are you kidding me; he must take the average citizen to be an idiot if we believe that statement. If the discourse over the nuts and bolts of the bill are correct, the core that elected him are going to get the screwing once the rates go back up, if not immediately. Not to mention the hit to the deficit their children will inherit. Guess who pays for those ER or EMS services to the soon to be uninsured with the mandate going away.

Then today he's back campaigning and suggests the need to really rebuild our infrastructure after watching one of his 8 hour daily (don't you have a fing job, I'm retired and have time for a couple hours daily) TV viewings and catching the news about the Amtrak derailing; just where is that money coming from? I hope all the core Trump supporters are buying into this trickle down economics reasoning, all I can say is thank God I'm out of the work force and not worrying to much about taxes at this point. Russia is one of the few places on earth willing to loan the Trump family money, possibly his new found love Putin can throw us some infrastructure money; because I don't think the deficit can take another hit.

Did you happen to watch 60 minutes yesterday, that show was so on point and yet we are about to give the corporate pharmaceutical industry drug dealing SOB's who created the opioid problem a big Xmass present and pat on the back. One of the other interesting pieces was pointing out (I"m sure you will fact check that for me) that there were 74% more deaths in this country at the hands of white supremacist than radical Islamics. So while I agree that boarder security and proper vetting of immigrants is important, you would think the POTUS would do a better job at not contributing the divide that is in fact causing more trouble at home.

Don't get me started on show me your taxes Donald and if I hear him say there is no collusion one more time, I'd have to suggest to him; it ain't over until the fat lady sings. Even if you believe this clown (sorry that's my opinion) can clean the swamp (frankly I think he just really added a very foul odor to it), do you think he is the man you can trust with foreign policy and dealing with a world threat like NK or the middle east? He has shown the littlest things upset his ego, I only pray there are people serving in our military that will keep that child in check.

Twas the night before Xmass and all through the white house, not a creature was stiring not even Donalds spouse.

His tweets had been crafted with his usual care
in the hopes that tomorrow nobody would be spared.

When out on the lawn there rose such a terrible clatter
it interrupted a tweet so Potus sprung up to see what was the matter.

The partisan children would all snuggled in bed
with some hoping a new tax bill would bring in some bread.

Well you can fill in the blanks, but I suspect some of you children aren't getting those new shiny raises Trump suspects corporate american is going to hand down in thanks for the tax break.....coal all around....sorry Trump loves coal.....haha.

[Sea Dangles]

Originally Posted by PaulS

Oh. So when she referred to Bill's victims as "loony tunes narcissists", that was what?

That's not sluts shaming. You've been reading into the sleazy Republican narrative so long it's clouded your mind. You should do a little research on what the woman accuses Hillary of doing to them.

"She defended her husband"

And what did she defend, exactly? His right to prey upon women.

The sleazy Republicans lied so much and for so long about the clintons that she didn't believe them. Do you think they had Vince Foster killed LOL. Maybe the clintons vandalized Wiley's car or threw a dead cat on her porch or whatever the other things they've accused the clintons of doing.

"Times change and in this case for the better. "

Ah. And the fact that liberals didn't change their tine on abusing women, until Trump was elected and the Clintons became refuse, is what? A coincidence? As I said, selective outrage, is fake outrage. Not long ago, the pigs in Hollywood, led by Meryl Streep, gave a standing ovation to convicted child rapist Roman Polanski. I have something to learn from these hedonistic sodomites about how to treat women with respect?

Those moral conservative had no problem electing a vile person who bragged on tape about assaulting women and walking in on naked women.

"Don't tell me about moral authority when you seem to have no problem not calling for Trump to resign"

I said let's investigate.

What's to investigate? we have him on tape bragging about assaulting women. How many times do we have to repeat it? What is more clear than his own voice on tape?

There was photographic evidence of what Franken did, and he admitted it. You show me photos of Trump abusing women, I will scream at the top of my lungs for him to step down.

You mean the picture of Franken with his hands hovering over a woman's breast but not touching them? You seem to be ignoring Trump's own words. In a court of law tape of someone's comments is very good evidence in case you didn't know that.

"The Dems have outplayed the Repubs on this issue"

Oh my yes, whch explains the results of all the elections since last November, of which the GOP lost one, and won several.

No that just shows that the Republicans did not care about all the assaults that Trump committed. As we've said many many times previously they had many people they could have chosen instead they chose somebody who brags about assaulting women. He thinks it's a joke and you moral conservatives elected him without giving it a second thought.

I cannot wait for 2018. The DNC is crapping their pants.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Paul,She believed them. It wasn't the first time she heard he was banging anything that had a pulse,nor the last. Fair is fair,let's not act like it was an isolated incident.
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[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by PaulS

Oh. So when she referred to Bill's victims as "loony tunes narcissists", that was what?

That's not sluts shaming. You've been reading into the sleazy Republican narrative so long it's clouded your mind. You should do a little research on what the woman accuses Hillary of doing to them.

"She defended her husband"

And what did she defend, exactly? His right to prey upon women.

The sleazy Republicans lied so much and for so long about the clintons that she didn't believe them. Do you think they had Vince Foster killed LOL. Maybe the clintons vandalized Wiley's car or threw a dead cat on her porch or whatever the other things they've accused the clintons of doing.

"Times change and in this case for the better. "

Ah. And the fact that liberals didn't change their tine on abusing women, until Trump was elected and the Clintons became refuse, is what? A coincidence? As I said, selective outrage, is fake outrage. Not long ago, the pigs in Hollywood, led by Meryl Streep, gave a standing ovation to convicted child rapist Roman Polanski. I have something to learn from these hedonistic sodomites about how to treat women with respect?

Those moral conservative had no problem electing a vile person who bragged on tape about assaulting women and walking in on naked women.

"Don't tell me about moral authority when you seem to have no problem not calling for Trump to resign"

I said let's investigate.

What's to investigate? we have him on tape bragging about assaulting women. How many times do we have to repeat it? What is more clear than his own voice on tape?

There was photographic evidence of what Franken did, and he admitted it. You show me photos of Trump abusing women, I will scream at the top of my lungs for him to step down.

You mean the picture of Franken with his hands hovering over a woman's breast but not touching them? You seem to be ignoring Trump's own words. In a court of law tape of someone's comments is very good evidence in case you didn't know that.

"The Dems have outplayed the Repubs on this issue"

Oh my yes, whch explains the results of all the elections since last November, of which the GOP lost one, and won several.

No that just shows that the Republicans did not care about all the assaults that Trump committed. As we've said many many times previously they had many people they could have chosen instead they chose somebody who brags about assaulting women. He thinks it's a joke and you moral conservatives elected him without giving it a second thought.

I cannot wait for 2018. The DNC is crapping their pants.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

" That's not sluts shaming."

Oh. When Hilary goes on national TV and attacks the character of the women who accused Bill...you don't call that slut shaming. OK, pray tell, what is it, exactly?

"The sleazy Republicans lied so much and for so long about the clintons that she didn't believe them"

Oh, so she was pushed to lying by the "sleazy" GOP! Of course! Tell us, when she lied about getting shot at in Bosnia, can we assume that was also the fault of Republicans?

"we have him on tape bragging about assaulting women."

Did he admit to a specific crime?

"What's to investigate"

So in your mind, once allegations have been made, trials are unnecessary? Tell that to the Duke lacrosse players.

"In a court of law tape of someone's comments is very good evidence"

Let's have the trial or investigation (like with Hilary's emails), present evidence on both sides.

[detbuch]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

Cracks me up that the core keeps waving the Trump flag, spouting the
party line and screaming foul over all the "fake news" and "fake accusations" the media puts out to tarnish the very fragile ego of Donald Trump. Inappropriate sexual conduct by Trump is far from his number one character flaw, but it's certainly in the top ten. I love all the fake news crying by Trump, when he in fact is the biggest liar and tweeter of untruths that we have seen in quite some time.

I personally don't have the time to fact check and view Stern interviews, as I understand there are over 15 hours and well over 100,000 spoken words, I've heard enough choice samples of those, along with the access Hollywood tape and all the filth coming out of his mouth throughout the campaign to form an opinion. I have no doubt many if not the majority of the accusations have some truth in them. Hey if you have the time and nothing better to do have fun, I may return in time to read your blue, red or yellow font of the day retort. If not I'm sure it will be extremely well thought out, highly researched and a very articulate response to somehow convince me my opinion must be in error.

I love the most recent lie coming out of his mouth, that the tax bill is really going to hurt Trump and his family, are you kidding me; he must take the average citizen to be an idiot if we believe that statement. If the discourse over the nuts and bolts of the bill are correct, the core that elected him are going to get the screwing once the rates go back up, if not immediately. Not to mention the hit to the deficit their children will inherit. Guess who pays for those ER or EMS services to the soon to be uninsured with the mandate going away.

Then today he's back campaigning and suggests the need to really rebuild our infrastructure after watching one of his 8 hour daily (don't you have a fing job, I'm retired and have time for a couple hours daily) TV viewings and catching the news about the Amtrak derailing; just where is that money coming from? I hope all the core Trump supporters are buying into this trickle down economics reasoning, all I can say is thank God I'm out of the work force and not worrying to much about taxes at this point. Russia is one of the few places on earth willing to loan the Trump family money, possibly his new found love Putin can throw us some infrastructure money; because I don't think the deficit can take another hit.

Did you happen to watch 60 minutes yesterday, that show was so on point and yet we are about to give the corporate pharmaceutical industry drug dealing SOB's who created the opioid problem a big Xmass present and pat on the back. One of the other interesting pieces was pointing out (I"m sure you will fact check that for me) that there were 74% more deaths in this country at the hands of white supremacist than radical Islamics. So while I agree that boarder security and proper vetting of immigrants is important, you would think the POTUS would do a better job at not contributing the divide that is in fact causing more trouble at home.

Don't get me started on show me your taxes Donald and if I hear him say there is no collusion one more time, I'd have to suggest to him; it ain't over until the fat lady sings. Even if you believe this clown (sorry that's my opinion) can clean the swamp (frankly I think he just really added a very foul odor to it), do you think he is the man you can trust with foreign policy and dealing with a world threat like NK or the middle east? He has shown the littlest things upset his ego, I only pray there are people serving in our military that will keep that child in check.

Twas the night before Xmass and all through the white house, not a creature was stiring not even Donalds spouse.

His tweets had been crafted with his usual care
in the hopes that tomorrow nobody would be spared.

When out on the lawn there rose such a terrible clatter
it interrupted a tweet so Potus sprung up to see what was the matter.

The partisan children would all snuggled in bed
with some hoping a new tax bill would bring in some bread.

Well you can fill in the blanks, but I suspect some of you children aren't getting those new shiny raises Trump suspects corporate american is going to hand down in thanks for the tax break.....coal all around....sorry Trump loves coal.....haha.

Well done. I have to admit that I enjoyed your thoughts.

[spence]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

Cracks me up that the core keeps waving the Trump flag, spouting the
party line and screaming foul over all the "fake news" and "fake accusations" the media puts out to tarnish the very fragile ego of Donald Trump. Inappropriate sexual conduct by Trump is far from his number one character flaw, but it's certainly in the top ten. I love all the fake news crying by Trump, when he in fact is the biggest liar and tweeter of untruths that we have seen in quite some time.

I personally don't have the time to fact check and view Stern interviews, as I understand there are over 15 hours and well over 100,000 spoken words, I've heard enough choice samples of those, along with the access Hollywood tape and all the filth coming out of his mouth throughout the campaign to form an opinion. I have no doubt many if not the majority of the accusations have some truth in them. Hey if you have the time and nothing better to do have fun, I may return in time to read your blue, red or yellow font of the day retort. If not I'm sure it will be extremely well thought out, highly researched and a very articulate response to somehow convince me my opinion must be in error.

I love the most recent lie coming out of his mouth, that the tax bill is really going to hurt Trump and his family, are you kidding me; he must take the average citizen to be an idiot if we believe that statement. If the discourse over the nuts and bolts of the bill are correct, the core that elected him are going to get the screwing once the rates go back up, if not immediately. Not to mention the hit to the deficit their children will inherit. Guess who pays for those ER or EMS services to the soon to be uninsured with the mandate going away.

Then today he's back campaigning and suggests the need to really rebuild our infrastructure after watching one of his 8 hour daily (don't you have a fing job, I'm retired and have time for a couple hours daily) TV viewings and catching the news about the Amtrak derailing; just where is that money coming from? I hope all the core Trump supporters are buying into this trickle down economics reasoning, all I can say is thank God I'm out of the work force and not worrying to much about taxes at this point. Russia is one of the few places on earth willing to loan the Trump family money, possibly his new found love Putin can throw us some infrastructure money; because I don't think the deficit can take another hit.

Did you happen to watch 60 minutes yesterday, that show was so on point and yet we are about to give the corporate pharmaceutical industry drug dealing SOB's who created the opioid problem a big Xmass present and pat on the back. One of the other interesting pieces was pointing out (I"m sure you will fact check that for me) that there were 74% more deaths in this country at the hands of white supremacist than radical Islamics. So while I agree that boarder security and proper vetting of immigrants is important, you would think the POTUS would do a better job at not contributing the divide that is in fact causing more trouble at home.

Don't get me started on show me your taxes Donald and if I hear him say there is no collusion one more time, I'd have to suggest to him; it ain't over until the fat lady sings. Even if you believe this clown (sorry that's my opinion) can clean the swamp (frankly I think he just really added a very foul odor to it), do you think he is the man you can trust with foreign policy and dealing with a world threat like NK or the middle east? He has shown the littlest things upset his ego, I only pray there are people serving in our military that will keep that child in check.

Twas the night before Xmass and all through the white house, not a creature was stiring not even Donalds spouse.

His tweets had been crafted with his usual care
in the hopes that tomorrow nobody would be spared.

When out on the lawn there rose such a terrible clatter
it interrupted a tweet so Potus sprung up to see what was the matter.

The partisan children would all snuggled in bed
with some hoping a new tax bill would bring in some bread.

Well you can fill in the blanks, but I suspect some of you children aren't getting those new shiny raises Trump suspects corporate american is going to hand down in thanks for the tax break.....coal all around....sorry Trump loves coal.....haha.

Pretty much spot on. One item you missed was the POTUS being manipulated as a Russian asset and FOX News sinking to the point of an authoritarian run state media.

That Trump would lead like this doesn't surprise me. The fact that most of the GOP is complicit is astounding.

[scottw]

Originally Posted by spence

Pretty much spot on. One item you missed was the POTUS being manipulated as a Russian asset and FOX News sinking to the point of an authoritarian run state media.

That Trump would lead like this doesn't surprise me. The fact that most of the GOP is complicit is astounding.

good grief ....you've become the left's Alex Jones

[spence]

Originally Posted by scottw

good grief ....you've become the left's Alex Jones

Well, actually I heard that from former CIA and a Republican strategist not to mention what I've seen myself.

But as Dangles would say thanks for proving my point.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

Cracks me up that the core keeps waving the Trump flag, spouting the
party line and screaming foul over all the "fake news" and "fake accusations" the media puts out to tarnish the very fragile ego of Donald Trump. Inappropriate sexual conduct by Trump is far from his number one character flaw, but it's certainly in the top ten. I love all the fake news crying by Trump, when he in fact is the biggest liar and tweeter of untruths that we have seen in quite some time.

I personally don't have the time to fact check and view Stern interviews, as I understand there are over 15 hours and well over 100,000 spoken words, I've heard enough choice samples of those, along with the access Hollywood tape and all the filth coming out of his mouth throughout the campaign to form an opinion. I have no doubt many if not the majority of the accusations have some truth in them. Hey if you have the time and nothing better to do have fun, I may return in time to read your blue, red or yellow font of the day retort. If not I'm sure it will be extremely well thought out, highly researched and a very articulate response to somehow convince me my opinion must be in error.

I love the most recent lie coming out of his mouth, that the tax bill is really going to hurt Trump and his family, are you kidding me; he must take the average citizen to be an idiot if we believe that statement. If the discourse over the nuts and bolts of the bill are correct, the core that elected him are going to get the screwing once the rates go back up, if not immediately. Not to mention the hit to the deficit their children will inherit. Guess who pays for those ER or EMS services to the soon to be uninsured with the mandate going away.

Then today he's back campaigning and suggests the need to really rebuild our infrastructure after watching one of his 8 hour daily (don't you have a fing job, I'm retired and have time for a couple hours daily) TV viewings and catching the news about the Amtrak derailing; just where is that money coming from? I hope all the core Trump supporters are buying into this trickle down economics reasoning, all I can say is thank God I'm out of the work force and not worrying to much about taxes at this point. Russia is one of the few places on earth willing to loan the Trump family money, possibly his new found love Putin can throw us some infrastructure money; because I don't think the deficit can take another hit.

Did you happen to watch 60 minutes yesterday, that show was so on point and yet we are about to give the corporate pharmaceutical industry drug dealing SOB's who created the opioid problem a big Xmass present and pat on the back. One of the other interesting pieces was pointing out (I"m sure you will fact check that for me) that there were 74% more deaths in this country at the hands of white supremacist than radical Islamics. So while I agree that boarder security and proper vetting of immigrants is important, you would think the POTUS would do a better job at not contributing the divide that is in fact causing more trouble at home.

Don't get me started on show me your taxes Donald and if I hear him say there is no collusion one more time, I'd have to suggest to him; it ain't over until the fat lady sings. Even if you believe this clown (sorry that's my opinion) can clean the swamp (frankly I think he just really added a very foul odor to it), do you think he is the man you can trust with foreign policy and dealing with a world threat like NK or the middle east? He has shown the littlest things upset his ego, I only pray there are people serving in our military that will keep that child in check.

Twas the night before Xmass and all through the white house, not a creature was stiring not even Donalds spouse.

His tweets had been crafted with his usual care
in the hopes that tomorrow nobody would be spared.

When out on the lawn there rose such a terrible clatter
it interrupted a tweet so Potus sprung up to see what was the matter.

The partisan children would all snuggled in bed
with some hoping a new tax bill would bring in some bread.

Well you can fill in the blanks, but I suspect some of you children aren't getting those new shiny raises Trump suspects corporate american is going to hand down in thanks for the tax break.....coal all around....sorry Trump loves coal.....haha.

"screaming foul over all the "fake news" and "fake accusations" the media puts out"

90% percent of the coverage of the man, is negative. Now, he's unique kind of jerk, so he brings much of this on himself. But the media is out to get him.

"there were 74% more deaths in this country at the hands of white supremacist than radical Islamics"

Come on, that's because we spend billions and billions to protect ourselves from jhadists, and for damn good reason. Would you feel better if a jihadist had set off a dirty bomb and thus killed more Americans than white supremacists?

"you would think the POTUS would do a better job at not contributing the divide that is in fact causing more trouble at home. "

He is extremely divisive. So was the last POTUS...

"do you think he is the man you can trust with foreign policy and dealing with a world threat like NK or the middle east?"

Him personally? Hell, no. But that's why we don't live in a monarchy, there are all kinds of limits to what he can do. At a macro-level, I prefer his ideas to hose of Hilary, but am disappointed with the results. I wanted a wall on the southern border, I wanted Obamacare replaced with something better, which the GOP had 7 years to prepare for.

"I hope all the core Trump supporters are buying into this trickle down economics reasoning"

Again, unless the wealthy burn their money or bury it forever in their yards, they will use it in a way that helps the economy. No one can refute that. There might be better ways to help the economy, but when wealthy people spend money, or invest it, or put it in the bank, or pay taxes with it, or give it to charity...those are all good things. Right? Don't all those things help the economy?

I cannot stand the guy. But he's not coming close to getting fair treatment by the media. And by 'fair', I don't mean they should never criticize him, because he is a deeply flawed individual. But how much time does the media spend talking about the Russia probe (which thus far has produced no evidence of collusion), and how much time do they spend talking about the stock market and low unemployment, which has done a tremendous amount of good for the nation? When Obama stoppped the unemployment bleeding, it was all over the news ho many jobs he created. Does Trump get that credit anywhere othet than at Foxnews? Nope.

It's pathetic, and hard to actually believe, how blatantly partisan it all is, how out of whack we all are. 90% of us cannot say anything negative about those we agree with, nor can we say anything positive about those we disagree with.

[Got Stripers]

I agree the media is not Trump friendly, but they aren't reporting "fake news", my God Trump feeds them daily with is wacky behavior, his borderline nut job tweets, his constant bashing of people inside his own administration and constant stream of untruths. If he shut down his twitter account, spent less than his 8 hours a day watching TV to see who he needs to lam-blast in the next tweet and focused more on the job; I think he'd find the press less abrasive to him.

I can't speak for all of corporate America, but that part I'm familiar with put more money in their pockets when business was good and not into the pockets or weekly paychecks of those responsible. Trump can rave about jobless rates and the stock market, but the economy was heading in this direction long before he took office, so he isn't totally responsible for what is happening today. Everything he is doing benefits corporate America and the top 20%, that is why the stock market is doing so well. I hope your correct and trickle down works, but I don't think we will see the benefits for years, if we do at all.

God help us all if he goes after medicare and social security to pay for the deficit bump.

[scottw]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

I agree the media is not Trump friendly, but they aren't reporting "fake news", .

you must have been absent a week or so ago...

[scottw]

Originally Posted by spence

Well, actually I heard that from former CIA and a Republican strategist not to mention what I've seen myself.

.

[detbuch]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

Cracks me up that the core keeps waving the Trump flag, spouting the
party line

This is sarcastic, inflammatory, divisive, symbolism over substance. And "cores" are usually characterized by their opposing "cores" as being laughable bumpkins, or worse. And "cores" of both parties do spout the party line. That's why they're "cores." What I like about Trump is that he battles his own party. No doubt, neither you nor I, on the other hand, are party line thinkers.

and screaming foul over all the "fake news" and "fake accusations" the media puts out to tarnish the very fragile ego of Donald Trump.

Trump does have a huge ego. It seems more to be a strong one rather than a fragile one. And that news which is fake is the usual, universal and historically consistent slanting and omission. That is to be expected in editorials, humans being what they are. But when the line between reportage and editorializing disappears and they become one, as in TV talking head "journalists," then even "reports" become slanted, one sided, omitting facts or opinions, thus reporting only that which seems favorable to a select point of view--in other words, biased. I find it to be very credible to call the "news," which is repeated every hour on the hour, to a great extent, fake.

Inappropriate sexual conduct by Trump is far from his number one character flaw, but it's certainly in the top ten. I love all the fake news crying by Trump, when he in fact is the biggest liar and tweeter of untruths that we have seen in quite some time.

That seems to be a bit biased, don't you think? Not totally accurate, and quite slanted.

I personally don't have the time to fact check and view Stern interviews, as I understand there are over 15 hours and well over 100,000 spoken words, I've heard enough choice samples of those,

That could be the problem. Choice samples selected out of interviews, especially typically salacious Howard Stern interviews, can be isolated out of the entire context to make someone appear more decadent than he is. That is what I found to be the case with the selected clips cobbled together in a couple of videos by CNN which were obviously selected out of their context and put together . . . oops, was interrupted here by a couple of Jehovah's Witness ladies knocking at my door. They were, as always, very warm, friendly, and concerned about my spiritual well-being. I graciously accepted their Watchtower magazine. Probably won't read it, but I like those people a lot. I'm sure they have to fight off the demons, sexual or other wise, that we humans have to control in our lives . . . and, as I was saying, the selected clips are put together in a montage of "samples" in order to exaggerate and thus create a far more depraved sexual demon than Trump actually, if at all, is. One could, and some have, make Trump out to be a loving, caring, responsible, family man, even by selecting various "choice samples" from his Howard Stern interviews.

along with the access Hollywood tape and all the filth coming out of his mouth throughout the campaign to form an opinion. I have no doubt many if not the majority of the accusations have some truth in them. Hey if you have the time and nothing better to do have fun, I may return in time to read your blue, red or yellow font of the day retort. If not I'm sure it will be extremely well thought out, highly researched and a very articulate response to somehow convince me my opinion must be in error.

I know that I will not convince you that you are in error. That is one of the things I enjoyed in reading this essay of yours. It is a well crafted portrayal of someone comfortably and confidently settled in a correct middle of things--an important character in Shakespeare's Hamlet named Polonius comes to mind. Polonius was a respectable, somewhat lovable guy who was comfortable and confident in his view on life, freely giving advice based on those views, and sure that he was right, and could not be convinced otherwise. Shakespeare didn't dislike Polonius. But, in the end, Polonius's counsel led to the death of his son and daughter.

What I love about great literature is that it can inform us more about life than all the TV talking heads put together do with their flawed and insufficient portrayal of it.

I love the most recent lie coming out of his mouth, that the tax bill is really going to hurt Trump and his family, are you kidding me; he must take the average citizen to be an idiot if we believe that statement.

I'm sure a "hurt" to a billionaire can be a life's income to the average man. Am I an idiot for believing that?

If the discourse over the nuts and bolts of the bill are correct, the core that elected him are going to get the screwing once the rates go back up, if not immediately.

Depends on which discourse. There are, actually, different ones. Some, even, that are not politically or anti-Trump motivated.

Not to mention the hit to the deficit their children will inherit. Guess who pays for those ER or EMS services to the soon to be uninsured with the mandate going away.

Deficits are not inherited. But debt is. The last time the national debt was lowered was under Calvin Coolidge. And his fiscal policies were the actual reason for that decrease in debt. But, trying to get a serious discussion on debt reduction modeled on Coolidge policy is a non-starter. Our previous president's and his party's pork fed policies doubled an already huge debt. And the President before him was not a mere piglet in that regard.

And guess who's paying for the various health care services to those who are subsidized under Obamacare? The same ones who paid for the ER and EMS services given to the uninsured before Obamacare. And paying even more than they did before Obamacare.

Then today he's back campaigning and suggests the need to really rebuild our infrastructure after watching one of his 8 hour daily (don't you have a fing job,

If the previous President's promise to use the stimulus money to rebuild the infrastructure was actually kept Trump wouldn't have to do that. And if Obama had done it, the economy might actually have been better during his administration. Maybe not.

And that omission part of fake news makes us believe that Trump is not doing his job, that he is not accomplishing anything, that the only thing he does is tweet nonsense and lies. He has actually done a lot, against the expected resistance from the Dems, and even against resistance from his party. http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/by...rticle/2643791

I'm retired and have time for a couple hours daily) TV viewings and catching the news about the Amtrak derailing; just where is that money coming from? I hope all the core Trump supporters are buying into this trickle down economics reasoning, all I can say is thank God I'm out of the work force and not worrying to much about taxes at this point. Russia is one of the few places on earth willing to loan the Trump family money, possibly his new found love Putin can throw us some infrastructure money; because I don't think the deficit can take another hit.

I see no indication that any of the mainline middle of the road politicians, if they exist, would have done anything to shrink the deficit or the debt. The record shows that any of them would raise the debt, not lower it. And everyone, including all of them, say that the infrastructure needs repair. That has been the case for some time. But we get their lip service and little to no structure service. Trump tries to keep his promises, whatever you may think of those promises.

Did you happen to watch 60 minutes yesterday, that show was so on point and yet we are about to give the corporate pharmaceutical industry drug dealing SOB's who created the opioid problem a big Xmass present and pat on the back. One of the other interesting pieces was pointing out (I"m sure you will fact check that for me) that there were 74% more deaths in this country at the hands of white supremacist than radical Islamics. So while I agree that boarder security and proper vetting of immigrants is important, you would think the POTUS would do a better job at not contributing the divide that is in fact causing more trouble at home.

Nope. Most of that is nonsense to me. Stuck on stupid stuff. Those are all symptoms. Complaining about symptoms, then contributing to them by not getting at the basic, fundamental nature of what causes those symptoms is ignorant blather. But it keeps folks glued to the screen for the allotted hours of the day. And helps to shape those folks' mind in ways to keep them watching and, worse, to keep them believing in the "message."

The "divide" is between folks who believe crap and those who don't. POTUS ain't gonna fix that. And this POTUS didn't create it. He may, like all the others before him, capitalize on it. But politics as usual, which includes the divide, is the distraction which keeps us ignorant. My opinion is that in order to get rid of the symptoms we need to cure the disease. And the disease, in my opinion, is not the sexual proclivities of Presidents or politicians, but in the manner in which they govern. First principles made us great. Abandoning them has continuously devolved us into weakness, pettiness, ignorance, degradation of the individual, group think, identities who compete with and hate each other, greater separation from the productive and unproductive, decadence, more and more dependence on government which in turn gives it the power to keep us and more of us there.

Don't get me started on show me your taxes Donald and if I hear him say there is no collusion one more time, I'd have to suggest to him; it ain't over until the fat lady sings. Even if you believe this clown (sorry that's my opinion) can clean the swamp (frankly I think he just really added a very foul odor to it), do you think he is the man you can trust with foreign policy and dealing with a world threat like NK or the middle east? He has shown the littlest things upset his ego, I only pray there are people serving in our military that will keep that child in check.

As mentioned above, this is sarcastic, inflammatory, divisive, symbolism over substance.

Twas the night before Xmass and all through the white house, not a creature was stiring not even Donalds spouse.

His tweets had been crafted with his usual care
in the hopes that tomorrow nobody would be spared.

When out on the lawn there rose such a terrible clatter
it interrupted a tweet so Potus sprung up to see what was the matter.

The partisan children would all snuggled in bed
with some hoping a new tax bill would bring in some bread.

Well you can fill in the blanks, but I suspect some of you children aren't getting those new shiny raises Trump suspects corporate american is going to hand down in thanks for the tax break.....coal all around....sorry Trump loves coal.....haha.

Nice creative, bitter twist on an otherwise cheerful and uplifting Christmas poem. And the coal thing was cute. A little bit of the Scrooge and coal thing. If that is what you meant.

I enjoyed the discussion. Much better than "Hoo boy."

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

I agree the media is not Trump friendly, but they aren't reporting "fake news", my God Trump feeds them daily with is wacky behavior, his borderline nut job tweets, his constant bashing of people inside his own administration and constant stream of untruths. If he shut down his twitter account, spent less than his 8 hours a day watching TV to see who he needs to lam-blast in the next tweet and focused more on the job; I think he'd find the press less abrasive to him.

I can't speak for all of corporate America, but that part I'm familiar with put more money in their pockets when business was good and not into the pockets or weekly paychecks of those responsible. Trump can rave about jobless rates and the stock market, but the economy was heading in this direction long before he took office, so he isn't totally responsible for what is happening today. Everything he is doing benefits corporate America and the top 20%, that is why the stock market is doing so well. I hope your correct and trickle down works, but I don't think we will see the benefits for years, if we do at all.

God help us all if he goes after medicare and social security to pay for the deficit bump.

"they aren't reporting "fake news", "

If you watch prime time news, almost all the coverage is about Russian collusion. They are pushing that hard, and avoiding talking about the economy. It might not be "fake" news, but it's very, very distorted coverage. And all the coverage that he endorses or supports white supremacists, is fake news in my opinion. and that got a lot of play. everything negative gets over-reported, everything positive gets buried.

"If he shut down his twitter account,

He needs to grow up and stop spouting off, no doubt.

"I think he'd find the press less abrasive to him."

I'll respectfully disagree. The last 3 Republican presidential nominees were men of very admirable ethics (though not without flaws), and none of them got a remotely fair shake from the media. Bush was an idiot, McCain was a racist, Romney a heartless plutocrat. That's why Trump got the nomination, the party wanted somebody who would be willing, when the media took cheap shots, to punch back.

"I can't speak for all of corporate America, but that part I'm familiar with put more money in their pockets when business was good and not into the pockets or weekly paychecks of those responsible. "

I usually assume that business owners, and senior leadership (I am neither) help drive positive results, more than the entry level people. In any event, the wealthy don't just keep that money in their pockets, they spend it, invest it, or give it away. Those are all good things.

"the economy was heading in this direction long before he took office"

Not to this magnitude. He gets some credit for that, he has to. It's a lot easier to grow the economy after a crash, than it is when the market is already high. He has to get some credit for that.

"Everything he is doing benefits corporate America and the top 20%"

I don't recall poverty rates going down meaningfully under Obama. And 4% unemployment, helps a lot of people who are not at the top. And I believe the tax plan will do more to help average Joes like me.

"God help us all if he goes after medicare and social security to pay for the deficit bump"


Agreed!

[Got Stripers]

Originally Posted by detbuch

Nice creative, bitter twist on an otherwise cheerful and uplifting Christmas poem. And the coal thing was cute. A little bit of the Scrooge and coal thing. If that is what you meant.

I enjoyed the discussion. Much better than "Hoo boy."

As usual I knew you wouldn't disappoint, blue font today and I'm educated as to why my take on things is wrong, thank you for straightening me out it was nip and tuck there for a minute. I thought I'd logged into the wrong board on seeing your single line positive response, I was close to calling my eye doctor for glasses.

[spence]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

As usual I knew you wouldn't disappoint, blue font today and I'm educated as to why my take on things is wrong, thank you for straightening me out it was nip and tuck there for a minute. I thought I'd logged into the wrong board on seeing your single line positive response, I was close to calling my eye doctor for glasses.

Got, you should run for office.

[scottw]

Originally Posted by spence

Got, you should run for office.

and avoid writing poetry...

[detbuch]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

As usual I knew you wouldn't disappoint,

I try to be dependable . . .

blue font today

Thank you for noticing. Unlike others, you are wise enough to see that the color is significant. The color perfectly absorbs emanations and radiations from the aura of knowledge which surrounds the forum and is in tune with specific waves which otherwise would remain trapped in cosmic dark space . . . thus empowering me to absorb various remnants of thought traveling through the ethosphere and enabling me to transfer them onto the electronic papers of the forum.

and I'm educated as to why my take on things is wrong, thank you for straightening me out it was nip and tuck there for a minute. I thought I'd logged into the wrong board on seeing your single line positive response, I was close to calling my eye doctor for glasses.

Oh no. I know I cannot educate you. You are strong and certain in what you know. What you know is what you know and shall ever be. Your confident, inflexible rhetoric is an agreeable touchstone for my developing thoughts.

[wdmso]

Democrats are far more likely than Republicans to admit there’s an issue close to home. Sixty percent of Democrats say their party has at least a somewhat serious problem with sexual harassment, while just 18 percent say that it does not. By contrast, Republicans are close to evenly split, with 40 percent saying sexual harassment presents a somewhat or very serious issue for the GOP, and 43 percent say that it’s not very or not at all serious.

Democrats say, 37 percent to 29 percent, that Franken should resign, with the rest uncertain. Republicans are divided on Moore, with 37 percent saying he should drop out and 40 percent that he should remain in the race. (Polling on both Moore and Franken has varied across outlets.)

Hillary Clinton voters say by a 42-point margin, 53 percent to 11 percent, that the accusations against Bill Clinton are credible, with the remaining 36 percent unsure.Trump voters almost universally find the accusations against Bill Clinton credible, but are far less likely to believe O’Reilly or Trump mistreated women. A 52 percent majority of Trump voters outright dismiss the allegations against Trump.

Basically Republicans don't care about sexual harassment we also see that here

[detbuch]

Originally Posted by wdmso

Democrats are far more likely than Republicans to admit there’s an issue close to home. Sixty percent of Democrats say their party has at least a somewhat serious problem with sexual harassment, while just 18 percent say that it does not. By contrast, Republicans are close to evenly split, with 40 percent saying sexual harassment presents a somewhat or very serious issue for the GOP, and 43 percent say that it’s not very or not at all serious.

Democrats say, 37 percent to 29 percent, that Franken should resign, with the rest uncertain. Republicans are divided on Moore, with 37 percent saying he should drop out and 40 percent that he should remain in the race. (Polling on both Moore and Franken has varied across outlets.)

Hillary Clinton voters say by a 42-point margin, 53 percent to 11 percent, that the accusations against Bill Clinton are credible, with the remaining 36 percent unsure.Trump voters almost universally find the accusations against Bill Clinton credible, but are far less likely to believe O’Reilly or Trump mistreated women. A 52 percent majority of Trump voters outright dismiss the allegations against Trump.

Basically Republicans don't care about sexual harassment we also see that here

Clearly.

[spence]

Originally Posted by detbuch

Clearly.

Hoo boy.

[Sea Dangles]

What percent of democrat voters would help heal Hillarys bullet wounds from the carnage she suffered in Kosovo?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

[detbuch]

Originally Posted by spence

Hoo boy.

Yeah, but I did it in one word. It took you two . . . but then . . . mine was seven letters long, yours only six . . . you win.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by wdmso

Democrats are far more likely than Republicans to admit there’s an issue close to home. Sixty percent of Democrats say their party has at least a somewhat serious problem with sexual harassment, while just 18 percent say that it does not. By contrast, Republicans are close to evenly split, with 40 percent saying sexual harassment presents a somewhat or very serious issue for the GOP, and 43 percent say that it’s not very or not at all serious.

Democrats say, 37 percent to 29 percent, that Franken should resign, with the rest uncertain. Republicans are divided on Moore, with 37 percent saying he should drop out and 40 percent that he should remain in the race. (Polling on both Moore and Franken has varied across outlets.)

Hillary Clinton voters say by a 42-point margin, 53 percent to 11 percent, that the accusations against Bill Clinton are credible, with the remaining 36 percent unsure.Trump voters almost universally find the accusations against Bill Clinton credible, but are far less likely to believe O’Reilly or Trump mistreated women. A 52 percent majority of Trump voters outright dismiss the allegations against Trump.

Basically Republicans don't care about sexual harassment we also see that here

"Democrats (the party that worshipped at the feet of the Clintons and the Kennedys) are far more likely than Republicans (the party in which many influential members openly denounced Trump) to admit there’s an issue close to home"

If you had some data to support that, I would be all ears.

"Sixty percent of Democrats say their party has at least a somewhat serious problem with sexual harassment"

The other 40% are the harassers...

"By contrast, Republicans are close to evenly split, with 40 percent saying sexual harassment presents a somewhat or very serious issue for the GOP"

Oh. So because Republicans think we have a cleaner house, you have concluded that we are in denial. What if the GOP actually has less perversion, and therefore the respondents you are citing are merely telling the truth?

"Democrats say, 37 percent to 29 percent, that Franken should resign, with the rest uncertain. Republicans are divided on Moore, with 37 percent saying he should drop out and 40 percent that he should remain in the race"

Franken has admitted his guilt. Moore has not. Remember the Duke lacrosse case? Remember how sure liberals were that they were right? Or the cops accused by Tawanna Brawley? Or the poor Ferguson cop whose life is ruined? We cannot have trials in the media. It's absolutely antithetical to our concept of justice.

"Hillary Clinton voters say by a 42-point margin, 53 percent to 11 percent, that the accusations against Bill Clinton are credible"

Who are the 11% that think he is innocent? He admitted it, we have DNA evidence.

"A 52 percent majority of Trump voters outright dismiss the allegations against Trump"

Bill Clinton's case is comparable to the case against Trump? Clinton admitted his guilt, and was found guilty of perjury after an investigation. With Trump, all we have is accusations. When we have DNA evidence that Trump did anything appropriate, then we do a poll, and those defending Trump are insane. Not until then.

"Republicans don't care about sexual harassment we also see that here"

Interesting theory.

Count me among the Republicans who think there is far more sexual impropriety among Democrats. That doesn't mean I don't care about harassment. It means I have common sense. There is a reason why Hollywood and the Democrats love each other. Your party does everything it can to mock family values and to celebrate the notion that "if it feels good, do it". Now you want to say you are the party of Puritanism? Please...