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Political Threads This section is for Political Threads - Enter at your own risk. If you say you don't want to see what someone posts - don't read it :hihi: |
08-20-2018, 02:03 PM
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#91
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 2,573
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
I think as long as is practical. The baseline is that it's public info, where is goes from there is case by case.
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Yep.
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DZ
Recreational Surfcaster
"Limit Your Kill - Don't Kill Your Limit"
Bi + Ne = SB 2
If you haven't heard of the Snowstorm Blitz of 1987 - you someday will.
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08-20-2018, 02:06 PM
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#92
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,632
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete F.
At least as good as Trumps inlaws
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were they here illegally?
so would you like this to apply to all members of the military?...if they sneak someone across the border and marry them or marry someone who is here illegally they are exempt from our immigration laws?
most of the military members that i know go out of their way to follow our laws
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08-20-2018, 02:10 PM
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#93
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,632
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
I think as long as is practical. The baseline is that it's public info, where is goes from there is case by case.
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Captain Obvious again........the names and addresses and other info was requested by the far left media during jury deliberation, a jury that was feeling threatened already....that was the rub...not whether or not that info should ever be released
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08-20-2018, 02:19 PM
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#94
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Somerset MA
Posts: 9,197
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scottw
more stupid...nobody cares about Manafort beyond those that hope he somehow brings Trump down
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Whats really funny is you believe what you wrote
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08-20-2018, 02:29 PM
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#95
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,435
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
I think she was drawing on Trump's wannabe tyrant-ism and the abhorrent treatment refugees and migrants have suffered as Trump is rounded them up en mass and broken families with little concern that they are human beings. Clumsy and full of hyperbole but as evidence the press is the enemy doesn't really hold up...
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didn’t obama also break up families and put kids in cages?
what you think, is becoming less and less connected with reality.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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08-20-2018, 02:31 PM
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#96
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: RI
Posts: 21,231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in CT
didn’t obama also break up families and put kids in cages?
what you think, is becoming less and less connected with reality.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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Jim, we've covered this about 5 times now...
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08-20-2018, 02:35 PM
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#97
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,632
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in CT
didn’t obama also break up families and put kids in cages?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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yeah but Trump eats them for breakfast
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08-20-2018, 02:36 PM
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#98
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,632
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wdmso
Whats really funny is you believe what you wrote
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I love that you were amused
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08-20-2018, 05:31 PM
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#99
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 7,688
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[QUOTE=wdmso;1149180]
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottw
when they ask means nothing ... unless you wear a tin foil hat
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In the memorandum that the media who petitioned for names and addresses of jurors, requesting when the information should be released, they wrote:
"Therefore, the Media Coalition respectfully requests that the Court issue an order directing the clerk to make publicly available the names and addresses of the jurors and alternates who heard this case, at the latest immediately upon return of the jury of its verdict.
So, the media would have liked to get the info before the verdict, but no later than immediately after the verdict.
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08-20-2018, 05:35 PM
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#100
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: RI
Posts: 21,231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by detbuch
So, the media would have liked to get the info before the verdict, but no later than immediately after the verdict.
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It doesn't say that, they're just planning ahead for when the trial is over.
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08-20-2018, 05:37 PM
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#101
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,632
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
It doesn't say that, they're just planning ahead for when the trial is over.
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sounds like far left media collusion to me...that's a VERY odd way of wording "just planning ahead"
"
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08-20-2018, 05:40 PM
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#102
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,632
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[QUOTE=detbuch;1149238]
Quote:
Originally Posted by wdmso
"Therefore, the Media Coalition respectfully requests that the Court issue an order directing the clerk to make publicly available the names and addresses of the jurors and alternates who heard this case, at the latest immediately upon return of the jury of its verdict.
So, the media would have liked to get the info before the verdict, but no later than immediately after the verdict.
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immediately upon,,,,,,,like ....right away
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08-20-2018, 05:52 PM
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#103
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 7,688
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wdmso
(Quote: Originally Posted by detbuch
The claim is that "what many see here" is that some of the media is trying to intimidate the jury. Is that a false claim? Can you support that it is a false claim?)
Yes its called Normal! to request such information AKA precedent
You didn't answer my question. Breitbart did not directly say that the media request was intimidation. Breitbart claimed that "WHAT MANY SEE HERE" is an attempt at intimidation. Do you contend that many do not see that? That that is a false claim?
Can you support how this isn't a false claim or how the request is an attempt to intimidate the jury or how that would even happen
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Apparently, many do see it as intimidation. I certainly can't disprove that. Can you? The Judge has gotten threats and has U.S. Marshal protection. The jury was scared. I don't think it is a stretch to say that many can see, and do, that revealing the juror's names and addresses would be intimidating in light of threats already being made.
And did you read the entire Breitbart article, including the blue links embedded in the article which added to the credence of the Breitbart article?
And the jury is not sequestered, so it could have heard about the request to post their names and addresses. And the media requested the info AT THE LATEST immediately after the verdict. So, possibly, before that.
Last edited by detbuch; 08-20-2018 at 06:01 PM..
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08-20-2018, 06:03 PM
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#104
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: RI
Posts: 21,231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by detbuch
Apparently, many do see it as intimidation. I certainly can't disprove that. Can you? The Judge has gotten threats and has U.S. Marshal protection. The jury was scared. I don't think it is a stretch to say that many can see, and do, that revealing the juror's names and addresses would be intimidating in light of threats already being made.
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Where is a first hand report of the jury being scared?
Quote:
And the jury is not sequestered, so it could have heard about the request to post their names and addresses. And the media requested the info AT THE LATEST immediately after the verdict. So, possibly, before that.
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How is that in any way trying to influence the Jury?
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08-20-2018, 06:17 PM
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#105
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 7,688
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
It doesn't say that, they're just planning ahead for when the trial is over.
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I don't know from where you get your "interpretation." I know you subscribe to judicial interpretation by whim or personal opinion. Or, perhaps, you're just resorting to some sort of mental channeling?
I go by the memorandum's actual words, a sort of textual originalism,-- the media coalition requested the names and addresses "at the latest immediately upon return of the jury of its verdict."
If it was requesting the info only after the verdict was rendered, it would not require, in a legal memorandum of request, to add the words "at the latest". That clearly is a request to get it before "the latest" if possible.
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08-20-2018, 06:25 PM
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#106
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,632
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
Where is a first hand report of the jury being scared?
How is that in any way trying to influence the Jury?
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it's like the mafia letting them know they're being watched and they know where they live...typical leftist intimidation tactics lately...plenty of examples
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08-20-2018, 06:31 PM
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#107
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 7,688
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
Where is a first hand report of the jury being scared?
The judge said so. I don't know how many hands were involved. But he is pretty close to the jury's concerns.
How is that in any way trying to influence the Jury?
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The word being used was "intimidation." Not everyone is as self-assured, brave, with nerves of steel as you. My understanding is that the locality in which the trial is being held is anti-Trump. I can see how a juror wouldn't want some hot-head looney in that community to know his name and address if the verdict was not guilty. It might influence a juror to decide that discretion is the better part of valor, and discretely vote for conviction.
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08-20-2018, 06:47 PM
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#108
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: RI
Posts: 21,231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by detbuch
The word being used was "intimidation." Not everyone is as self-assured, brave, with nerves of steel as you. My understanding is that the locality in which the trial is being held is anti-Trump. I can see how a juror wouldn't want some hot-head looney in that community to know his name and address if the verdict was not guilty. It might influence a juror to decide that discretion is the better part of valor, and discretely vote for conviction.
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The judge didn't say anything about juror intimidation, he said he had personally received threats. I'm all for keeping them private for now but I would fear more from Trump supporters than I would from the media.
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08-20-2018, 06:56 PM
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#109
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,435
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
I'm not sue how her tax return story was in any way misleading, yes it was over hyped but the returns did confirm some Trump hypocrisy. It wasn't a nothing story.
A lot of people thought Hillary was going to rout trump.
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uh, she claimed she had a big scoop. i can only guess, that she didn’t even glance at the tax return until she revealed that he paid a boatload in taxes.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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08-20-2018, 07:02 PM
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#110
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,632
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
The judge didn't say anything about juror intimidation, .
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from the POLITICO article....for the second time
" the judge overseeing the case alluded to "threats" the jury may be receiving.
“I had no idea this case would incite this emotion,” U.S. District Court Judge T.S. Ellis III said in an open court hearing, responding to a motion from seven news organizations, including POLITICO, seeking access to sealed materials related to the trial that would have publicly identified the jurors.
Ellis denied the motion, telling the courtroom that jurors were "scared” and “afraid.” As a result, Ellis said, he didn’t “feel right” releasing the names of the 12-person jury.
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08-20-2018, 07:18 PM
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#111
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: RI
Posts: 21,231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scottw
from the POLITICO article....for the second time
" the judge overseeing the case alluded to "threats" the jury may be receiving.
“I had no idea this case would incite this emotion,” U.S. District Court Judge T.S. Ellis III said in an open court hearing, responding to a motion from seven news organizations, including POLITICO, seeking access to sealed materials related to the trial that would have publicly identified the jurors.
Ellis denied the motion, telling the courtroom that jurors were "scared” and “afraid.” As a result, Ellis said, he didn’t “feel right” releasing the names of the 12-person jury.
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Name one specific juror threat.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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08-20-2018, 07:20 PM
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#112
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,435
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
Jim, we've covered this about 5 times now...
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and what you said, is that obama did the same thing, but not quite as often. how big of a difference is that. the photo of kids in a cage that got everyone foaming at the mouth, was taken during the obama years. why let facts getnin the way if a good commie temper tantrum.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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08-20-2018, 07:24 PM
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#113
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,632
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
Name one specific juror threat.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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ask the judge dummy
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08-20-2018, 08:15 PM
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#114
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Super Moderator
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Georgetown MA
Posts: 18,189
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
I'm all for keeping them private for now but I would fear more from Trump supporters than I would from the media.
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Yes, the media is the problem...
You should repeat what you are about to post in front of the mirror and see if your own eyes roll before you submit reply
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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"If you're arguing with an idiot, make sure he isn't doing the same thing."
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08-20-2018, 08:58 PM
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#115
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Canceled
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vt
Posts: 13,075
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in CT
and what you said, is that obama did the same thing, but not quite as often. how big of a difference is that. the photo of kids in a cage that got everyone foaming at the mouth, was taken during the obama years. why let facts getnin the way if a good commie temper tantrum.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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This administrations policy was to Separate as a deterrent and that is pretty abhorrent to most Americans
Sessions said, “If people don’t want to be separated from their children, they should not bring them with them. We’ve got to get this message out.”
Commie no longer works for Trumplicans unless you’re just self identifying
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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Frasier: Niles, I’ve just had the most marvelous idea for a website! People will post their opinions, cheeky bon mots, and insights, and others will reply in kind!
Niles: You have met “people”, haven’t you?
Lets Go Darwin
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08-21-2018, 09:52 AM
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#116
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: RI
Posts: 21,231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in CT
and what you said, is that obama did the same thing, but not quite as often. how big of a difference is that. the photo of kids in a cage that got everyone foaming at the mouth, was taken during the obama years. why let facts getnin the way if a good commie temper tantrum.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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I never said Obama did the same thing, their policies are quite different. Do some homework Jim.
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08-21-2018, 01:51 PM
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#118
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: RI
Posts: 21,231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in CT
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Well aware of the Obama era photo, it does nothing to refute the reality that the policy and scope of the two administrations isn't vastly different on this issue.
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