TWO BASS FOR RI CHARTER AND PARTY BOATS?

[buckman]

Originally Posted by dannyplug1

As long as were talking, I find the concept of who is a charter captain and who is a commercial fisherman interesting. For the purpose of the IRS how many trips do you need to take before your a charter captain is it one per year or is it a certain amount? Point being: I get the feeling that there are guys out there that say they are charter captains but are really in another occupation and just supplement there income by chartering. I have some sympathy for someone whose full time profession is chartering vs. a part timer. Additionally on a different point. I am sick to death of the so-called commercial fishermen who have other full time real jobs and commercially bass fish. In specific I know full time fireman and policemen who beat the hell out of the bass. I wonder how many of the guys commercial fishing at the block last year? I would suspect very few. Most probably had other jobs which they supplemented by helping to destroy a public resource. And don't tell me that they are providing a public service to feed bass to people who don't have access to bass to eat. No their doing it for the money pure and simple. If your a real commercial fisherman or charter captain, meaning that's how you feed your family I have sympathy, but not for the others.

Nowadays a lot of people have two jobs. It's what people do to get by.
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[Mike P]

You know, I saw quite a few guys riding two big bass up to their trucks this summer while there was a cow blitz at a certain 400 yard stretch of Canal. No rods or gear on the bike. Then saw them a half hour later riding two more up there. On closed commercial days. Then riding back down to their gear and fishing again.

They all speak English pretty well. Like they were born here. Which, since I know most of them by sight if not by name, they were.
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[Redsoxticket]

MA Enviromental Police Hotline
800-632-8075

[thefishingfreak]

You are entitled to reap the benefit$ of this public resource just as much the next guy.
Just because you choose not to, doesn't make it wrong for others to do so.

[MakoMike]

Some folks in this discussion are truly delusional.

[ivanputski]

Yeah, money has a funny way of doing that to people.
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[Nebe]

You know what's delusional? Saying killing 2 fish is equal to killing 1 fish. Now that's delusional.
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[ivanputski]

Originally Posted by Nebe

You know what's delusional? Saying killing 2 fish is equal to killing 1 fish. Now that's delusional.
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Exactly
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[buckman]

Originally Posted by Nebe

You know what's delusional? Saying killing 2 fish is equal to killing 1 fish. Now that's delusional.
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It's the opportunity to catch two larger fish fish versus the opportunity to catch one smaller fish.
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[big jay]

Vineyard ?
Psssshhh- he must suck. My Bass money is going my new homestead on Nantucket.
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[Nebe]

Delusional
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[Bill L]

That's baloney, any charter worth his salt will put his client on large, much larger than 33 inches. One 30 lber is plenty, and they can keep catching all day and throwing them back. And if they need more meat, go for fluke, sea bass or scup, or stop at the fish market and buy them some fillets on top of the 400 dollar fee. And if you tell me you can't put your client on decent fish, that is an obvious sign the stock is in trouble
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[buckman]

Originally Posted by Bill L

That's baloney, any charter worth his salt will put his client on large, much larger than 33 inches. One 30 lber is plenty, and they can keep catching all day and throwing them back. And if they need more meat, go for fluke, sea bass or scup, or stop at the fish market and buy them some fillets on top of the 400 dollar fee. And if you tell me you can't put your client on decent fish, that is an obvious sign the stock is in trouble
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Most of those "other " fish are not easily obtained on our side of the ditch .
As you guys are aware, bass move, they migrate, they don't stay in the same spot . We had days where you could get bass at Racepoint and the very next day they had moved outside the three-mile zone.
Just because a charter can't catch 2/33 inch fish for every client ,every day does not mean the bass are in trouble nor does it mean the captain is not "worth his salt " (a phrase you guys particularly enjoy)
It will be good if the charterboats get 2 fish then you guys can continue to point fingers . ( something else you seem to particularly enjoy )
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[Slipknot]

a few more years of 2 fish being killed and there will not be any bass in the ditch or north of there either

time to sacrifice is now before it's too late

1 fish for all now, before it becomes no fish

[Nebe]

I said it once and I will say it again. This is really about charter captians and crew and SELLING bass.
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[afterhours]

Originally Posted by Nebe

I said it once and I will say it again. This is really about charter captians and crew and SELLING bass.
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make it a gamefish.

[thefishingfreak]

Originally Posted by Nebe

I said it once and I will say it again. This is really about charter captians and crew and SELLING bass.
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It's not against the law to sell charter caught bass.
However to your point, if the charter boats do not get 2 fish limit, there will be some sort of amended rule so they will be able to possess more then the 8 fish rec limit on commercial 15 fish days(Monday&thurs).
Right Now it's not an issue. they are allowed 16 fish with 8 guys.(15 can go to market)

If the rec limits on charter boats change to where they are only allowed 8 fish on a commercial day, you can bet there will be something coming to amend that from the commercial front.

[zimmy]

What is delusional is the idea that the population can be properly managed with maximum sustainable yield as the standard.

[DZ]

After a meeting yesterday it appears NY will now also request a two fish bag from ASMFC for all fishermen. These decisions are creating lots of disillusioned recs who are now seeing that the ASMFC public hearing process last year was basically a waste of time. Massachusetts meetings this week - and RI appears to be waiting for the last minute so as to see what other states have done.

[Ed B]

Because recreational fisherman have so overwhelmingly been in favor of the one fish option, there have been discussions amongst recs advocating a boycott of the Party and Charter Boat Associations that are favoring the two fish option. With today's widespread communication capabilities along the coast it may just have some effect and if it's all about the money it would give the for-hire guys something to think about if they ostracize themselves from the recreational community.

Striped bass is a unique fishery to the recs and unlike other fisheries they've really got people's attention on this one.

[thefishingfreak]

Originally Posted by Ed B

recs advocating a boycott of the Party and Charter Boat Associations that are favoring the two fish option. With today's widespread communication capabilities along the coast it may just have some effect

If this isn't pure petty jealousy, I don't know what is.
If you don't get your way, then you're going to boycott.

[Ed B]

Originally Posted by thefishingfreak

If this isn't pure petty jealousy, I don't know what is.
If you don't get your way, then you're going to boycott.

There're plenty of Charter captains that do favor a one-fish option. They're not too popular with some of there associates right now but they have been speaking up commendably in the face of criticism. If you're going to take a charter it only seems logical to write your check out to someone who shares a similar attitude about the resource.

[Sea Dangles]

Originally Posted by thefishingfreak

If this isn't pure petty jealousy, I don't know what is.
If you don't get your way, then you're going to boycott.

Kind of what you said about the site
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[buckman]

Originally Posted by Ed B

Because recreational fisherman have so overwhelmingly been in favor of the one fish option, there have been discussions amongst recs advocating a boycott of the Party and Charter Boat Associations that are favoring the two fish option. With today's widespread communication capabilities along the coast it may just have some effect and if it's all about the money it would give the for-hire guys something to think about if they ostracize themselves from the recreational community.

Striped bass is a unique fishery to the recs and unlike other fisheries they've really got people's attention on this one.

Threats ??? Real class
I change my mind… When would you like to book the trip ??
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[Ed B]

Originally Posted by buckman

Threats ??? Real class
I change my mind… When would you like to book the trip ??
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It's a topic of conversation in circulation and it's not my idea. Not going fishing is not a threat. It's merely a decision not to lend financial support to a group that does not share a similar conservation ethic.

Thanks for the offer but I wouldn't like to book a trip.

[BasicPatrick]

A lesson in history and a question at the end.

History: Three years ago Gulf of Maine advocates were in a similar argument. We needed a Haddock reduction and privates wanted a ten fish limit while the charter fleet was stating they must have unlimited bag limit to sell charters. The charter fleet won and we stayed at unlimited for the 2013 season. When the catch data came in we caught more than 200% of our quota. This is why, even though our haddock quota recently more than doubled we are only going to have a bag limit of less than 5 haddock in 2015.

Current SB debate: IF MA can analyze, predict and manage split regulations NOW then they can surely can do so after the fact when there is more data.

It is known that if the fishery does not make the required 25% reduction we will be required to adjust regs again and next time there WILL BE closures. In New England I think this will be closures during at least part of May or September.

QUESTION: Are the 2 fish for the charter fleet advocates on this page willing to agree to split accountability measures? If your risky reg does not work (just like what happened with haddock) will you agree now to follow the data you are selling now and put into regulation a guarantee of split accountability?

[thefishingfreak]

Originally Posted by BasicPatrick

QUESTION: Are the 2 fish for the charter fleet advocates on this page willing to agree to split accountability measures? If your risky reg does not work (just like what happened with haddock) will you agree now to follow the data you are selling now and put into regulation a guarantee of split accountability?

It is my understanding based on the asmfc's math, that the only difference between option A&B is a small percentage.
Whereas one option is giving a 31% outcome and the other has a 29% outcome.
Now I understand that there will be mathematical differences if one group picks a different option than another group. so lets call it a 10% or maybe even 15% difference in that case.
If what your asking is will the "special group" live and die by the percentage difference they opted for? then I don't see why not.
However If you are equating 2 fish as a 100% increase and difference based on simply that 2 is 100% more than 1, Then no.
We all agree that 2 fish is more than 1 fish, but based on the options we are shown, it is not the same percentage.

[MakoMike]

FYI, it looks like NY is going to opt for two fish, one in a 28-34 slot and another over 38 (or so) inches, for all recreational anglers.

[Nebe]

Originally Posted by MakoMike

FYI, it looks like NY is going to opt for two fish, one in a 28-34 slot and another over 38 (or so) inches, for all recreational anglers.

Let me get this straight. The first fish can only be between. 28-34 inches and not above 38 and the second can only be over 38?
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[buckman]

Originally Posted by Nebe

Let me get this straight. The first fish can only be between. 28-34 inches and not above 38 and the second can only be over 38?
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Doesn't sound right to me either .
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