XRA 1205 w/low rider guides

[JohnR]

Originally Posted by Saltheart

I doubt it would make any difference to you at all...

Figured as much but I had to ask anyway.

[Stroth]

Saltheart's points are right on.

I came back to write about the key rod length being 11 feet. Rods under 11 feet I do not really see how you could get them to work, that stripper guide is going to cause some issues.

Here's how I built the 1209:

SVSG
25, 20, 16, 12, 12, 12,

I think the 25 is 36 or so inches from the face of the reel. I find it lighter, easier to cast, & and I do feel there is added distance. I would not hesitate to throw 8 with it.

I do not use a shock leader, just a long leader made from 50 or 50 # mono or fluro. 30 inches or so long swivel, to breakaway...

This setup has worked well for me.

[numbskull]

Just a point of information, the low rider guide layout and the "new concept" layout are two different things.

The new concept system typically uses 3 standard guides (or the more streamlined BMNAG guides) to bring the line down to a choke point well short of the tip and then carry the line in a straight line through small guides to the tip. Its primary advantage is to reduce tip weight and make the rod more responsive. Supposedly it also reduces guide loops and maybe improves distance a little....but that's debatable. There is a set formula/method to follow and that method determines the guide height and placement needed. Anyone building a rod would do well to look into it and try a few test casts (you can use some of the same guides as you would use with the old cone of flight system....only you'll need a few extra 10's).

The low rider set up uses small guides (a 20mm is the largest LC guide) set to a different formula (and way out the rod) to quickly reduce line loops and channel them to the tip. For really fast line velocities with light braid (think carp fishing) this apparently has some major advantages. 40lb power pro is not "light braid" and ch#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&g an eel or pencil popper on a Lami is not generating "really fast line velocities" for most of us. Also sounds like it is fussy enough that it often ends up reel and line specific. The fuji site does show a method to use lowriders as the first three guides in a " semi-kinda new concept layout" on shorter rods, but again that is probably meant for small reels and light braid.

Of course, after learning all this crap and building a state of the art spinning rod.....it still feels twice as heavy as a conventional outfit of equivalent power (though I admit I can outcast my conventional with it).

[Back Beach]

Keep with a traditional layout or new guide concept layout on the 1205 blank. Same goes for any other 10' or less blank for that matter.
If you need to get out further, buy a wetsuit or a boat.

Over and out

[Headhunter]

I have to disagree with the smaller collector frames, although it might be old school. I can cast an eel an agerage of 80 yards. lots of the time I am throwing better than that. The 50 proberly could go, is there anyone getting better distance with smaller stripper? I wouldnt mind improving my distance.

[Headhunter]

I did just look at those ti sics 50 and 40, they will be on both my sticks next year.

[SeaWolf]

i doubt many will ever notice the different in casting distance of 10-20 yards at the distances you will be getting, no matter the guide layout. for most people, they are casting bait like eels or non-aerodynamic lures like metal lips, so distance is not important. those casting metal, poppers or needles will get distance.

one of the main purposes of the NGC layout is for a lighter and more responsive rod. there is a quicker blank recovery due to larger and heavier guides near the tip. the longer the rod, the more you will notice this, or if you use glass. as numbskul mentioned, lowriders were first built for lighter braids on long rods, > 12'. today, people are testing them on outfits as short as 9', 50# braid, and even 20# mono.

as far as what option is best for you, do some testing or settle on what one you feel you'll be most happy with. all are proven and all work for the purposes intended.

until fuij stops making a 50 collector, the COF method w/ 50mm collectors will be built for northeast surfcasters, who are really the only anglers using this guide.

[Saltheart]

As I said in post 7 , even a former world record holder who is averaging 210 meters per cast only got 6 extra yards with a low rider set up on a rod almost 13 feet long. 6 extra yards out of 210!! Not worth it at all if it interferes with fishability or causes even an occasional down time do to problems with a leader knot.

As mentioned the New Guide Concept NGC and the Low Rider layouts are two different things.

Anyway , I can build my own rods NGC or LR or Spiral or whatever I want and based on what I know about fishing in New England I choose the "Old Fashion" way for my own surf rods.