Mass Saltwater License survey

[hardcore from shore]

I believe the Survey or question is a way to help assign a "value" to being able to fish. We all talk of the dollars we spend to pump up the recreational fishing industry, i.e. tackle, fuel, motels, guides etc.. This is another way to look at the value, ie. "what is it worth to you to fish". The fact is if recreational fisherman are to have a voice we need to have an economic argument. Warm and fuzzy feelings about fish and fishing etc. are nice, but we are dealing with businesses and politicans and money is what talks.
Here is what I wrote today to a Globe reporter on this topic.

"Personally as an avid saltwater fisherman, the value of the license, to be able to fish as well as to be able to be out fishing at sunrise or sunset or in the dark of night with the stars clearly visible is very high to me. Keeping 1 or 2 striped bass a year as a gift for a host is highly valuable to me as well. Just being able to have the opportunity to outwit them with a lure (especially a lure made by my 91 year old dad) is of a value that I cannot put dollars on.

It also allows me to pump up the economy, by paying for rods, reels and lures. Gas for my trips. Motels where I stay. I know I spend over $1,000 annually, maybe much more pursuing salt water fish in Massachusetts and throughout New England

Bill
Past President MSBA"

I not only love to be outdoors, be aconservationist and be a fisherman, I am also spending $ and lets face it today $$$$ talks.

The reality is, it is far cheaper to buy a pound of fish, then to outfit yourself and catch that pound of fish so there must be some real "value" to doing it. In my opinion, the survey is just trying to understand what that value is. I am a shore guy so my cost per pound of fish is probably lower than that of most boat guys, but I doubt the cost of owning a boat and outfitting it and using it to fish keeps boat guys from fishing so they must value it more than the out of pocket costs associated with doing it.

I belive the "cost" of the license is the least of the costs we are willing to pay to fish.

Bill

[Mr. Sandman]

As I said, it is already well known what the impact to the economy is. The rec contribution is very big. What's the point of the fishery dept's putting an accurate dollar figure on this? Their job is to PROTECT THE FISHERY and they are NOT doing it (by any measure). Determining what it takes to "buy out" a fishermen from fishing again is ridiculous.

Recreational fishing is a multi-billion dollar industry[1] In the USA, about 12 million recreational saltwater fishers generate $30 billion in economic impact and support 350,000 jobs.[2]

1)American Sportfishing Association

2)Recreational Fisheries Services

[bucko]

The NOAA/ DMF letter looks like “market research”. Businesses do it all the time to study consumer buying patterns.

[tunaless greg]

I support the direction they are heading. They are trying to get accurate data, to bring the long debated value of recreational fishing to the fore front of the discussions. The thing that everyone constantly forgets, is that there is no "right" to fish. Those fish are no different then lumber and minerals to the state and country. This fact, is why the most "american" thing to do in a free market Environment, is make every one pay for the fish they want to keep (whether rec/charter/commercial) and to utilize the resources for catch and release (since there is mortality in that process). The only way we are going to get there is by getting accurate data, is thru this process and logging on the rec side, and the continued logging and probably tracking(ais) on the commercial side. You get all the data, present it to the masses, and the decisions will be much easier, and make sense. So to the guys that want to wipe their ass with the survey, great job setting the tone for the rec group.
That reaction is why they have historically never listened in the past.

[Swimmer]

Originally Posted by vineyardblues

Anyone else receive the NOAA / Mass Marine survey in the mail for getting a license this year ?

WTF is question #7 A "hypothetical" question am I willing to pay $55.00 for my 2012 Saltwater fishing license

If we pay $55.00 for the license The Patrick Regime wont have to raise the soda and candy tax in vending machines 500%.

[Mr. Sandman]

No it is not the magnitude of the $ but the way it is couched in. Do we really need to pay a convenience fee?

[The Dad Fisherman]

Originally Posted by Mr. Sandman

No it is not the magnitude of the $ but the way it is couched in. Do we really need to pay a convenience fee?

you can go to the regional offices and get one and not pay the fee....or get it online and pay the fee. At least you're paying for something your using and its not a blanket cost that your paying whether you're using it or not.

if I'm not mistaken too.....they sub out that functionality to an outside vendor....so the state doesn't even see that money..it goes to the Vendor.

[Typhoon]

MARK MY WORDS: Money will be going to the MBTA budget shortfall.

At least the freshwater fees pay for re-stocking.

[Redsoxticket]

The company doing the survey is out of VA. It could be that the survey is a template from another state where the fees are higher for example Virginia.
VA has saltwater fees that are of different cost for SW REC and SW REC BOAT. The cost associated for boat recs as it relates to piers, ramps, oil/gas cleanups and are higher then a shore angler. The shore angler only needs access therefore the higher cost if anything should be for the boat recs in all fairness.
Check out the VA license cost below

Individual SW, Resident#^&
$17.50

Individual SW,
Nonresident
$25.00

Individual FW/SW, Resident#^&
$40.00

Individual FW/SW, Nonresident
$71.00

SW 10-day temp, Resident#^&
$10.00

SW 10-day temp,
Nonresident
$10.00

FW/SW 5-day temp, Resident#^&
$24.00

FW/SW 5-day temp,
Nonresident
$31.00

SW Recreational boat, Resident#^&
$48.00

* SW Recreational boat, Nonresident

$76.00

Reissuance of SW Recreational Boat License
$5.00

** Tidal Boat Sport Fishing, Resident#^&
$126.00

** Tidal Boat Sport Fishing, Nonresident
$201.00

*** Individual Lifetime SW (Under 45), Resident#^&
$276.00

*** Individual Lifetime SW (Under 45), Nonresident
$500.00
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

[Rob Rockcrawler]

Wow, those are some hefty prices.

[BasicPatrick]

February 28, 2012
MarineFisheries Advisory

2012 MASSACHUSETTS SALTWATER ANGLER PERMIT SURVEY
The Division of Marine Fisheries (MarineFisheries) is collaborating with the National Marine Fisheries Service (NMFS) to collect information on the Commonwealth’s recreational saltwater fishery to measure its economic value. In addition to providing important information about the socio-economic value of saltwater fishing in Massachusetts, this federally funded study will help to validate frequently used economic evaluation methods by applying an innovative direct approach in which some saltwater permit holders are presented with a cash offer in exchange for giving up their permit and thus the right to fish in marine waters for the remainder of 2012. Other permit holders will receive a survey asking for either their willingness to sell their 2012 permit for a particular price or their willingness to have paid a different amount for their 2012 permit.
MarineFisheries is issuing this Advisory to attest to the legitimacy of this angler permit survey, including the cash offers that some individuals will receive, and to assure its constituents that in no way will the information from the survey be used to modify fees for Massachusetts’ recreational saltwater fishing permits.
Participation in the survey is voluntary; however, MarineFisheries highly encourages your response based on the important information that will be gathered. Past studies on the contribution of recreational fishing to the Commonwealth’s economy have considered the number of jobs and the amount of sales and incomes that are supported by the expenditures of saltwater recreational fishermen, but have not included the value that anglers place on being able to go saltwater fishing. This type of information holds great worth; for example, it would be necessary for a comprehensive estimate of economic losses to the recreational fishery if for some reason Massachusetts’ waters had to be closed to fishing.
MarineFisheries is maintaining a list of Commonly Asked Questions about the 2012 Massachusetts Saltwater Angler Permit Survey under the recreational permit page of its website: Massachusetts Division of Marine Fisheries. General questions about MarineFisheries’ involvement can be directed to Nichola Meserve (nichola.meserve@state.ma.us). Technical questions regarding the study should be directed to Quantech, Inc., the statistical analysis and survey research firm contracted by NMFS to conduct the survey. Please contact Daemian Schreiber at 800-229-5220 ext 7831, or mavs@quantech.com.

[Sgt Striper]

The Division of Marine Fisheries (MarineFisheries) is collaborating with the National Marine Fisheries Service (NMFS) to collect information on the Commonwealth’s recreational saltwater fishery to measure its economic value. In addition to providing important information about the socio-economic value of saltwater fishing in Massachusetts, this federally funded study will help to validate frequently used economic evaluation methods by applying an innovative direct approach in which some saltwater permit holders are presented with a cash offer in exchange for giving up their permit and thus the right to fish in marine waters for the remainder of 2012. Other permit holders will receive a survey asking for either their willingness to sell their 2012 permit for a particular price or their willingness to have paid a different amount for their 2012 permit.


"this federally funded study" I run when I see those words!!

[JohnnyD]

I'd take $500 to relinquish my permit. I'd have to be fined what, 5 times before it starts costing me money to fish? In the last 3 years, I don't think I've seen an Eviro Police officer 5 times.

[chaz]

its not worth 500 bucks to give up,i have invested plenty in my gear and plan on making use of it not to mention fishing is my best excuse to get away from the wife.

[maxum16]

These jackasses in government always coming up with ways of sticking it to the average person. I don't mind the freshwater license and at first i was a little pissed off about the 10 dollar SW license because I figured how can they charge you to fish in waters that no state owns. They don't own the bays and or Atlantic Ocean, but I figured whats 10 bucks no big deal and its supposed to help with data gathering ok fine. Now their asking people if they would paying 55 dollars for a SW license. WOW.. how about just asking people " hey would you mind if give you a shot of warm meat to the ass? Oh and by the way it gonna cost you 55 bucks.....!!!" God damn this government and there crooked ass ways of just sticking it to the average American...

[Mr. Sandman]

$500 to play. I told you that "free" or "nearly free" lic would not last very long.

What they want to do is "optimize" the amount of money they can get out of the fishermen. They call it determining the "economic value" of the resource( yeah but for whom???)...they think they are not getting their due. They know at some point, 500, 700, 1000 you will just say screw it and go play golf, but what is that point? They would like to determine the "sweet spot" and charge the optimum amount for their maximum gain. They brought in experts now using "innovative" approaches....watch out!!! They have their eye on your wallet!

If they spent half as much energy on trying to protect the resource itself we would not be in this predicament.

THEY ALL NEED TO GO, EVERYONE INVOLVED IN ANY FISHERY DEPT SHOULD BE LET GO, EVERYONE FROM THE TOP DOWN. Start anew and hire some folks with common sense as their primary attribute.

[FishermanTim]

Originally Posted by Mr. Sandman

$500 to play. I told you that "free" or "nearly free" lic would not last very long.

What they want to do is "optimize" the amount of money they can get out of the fishermen. They call it determining the "economic value" of the resource( yeah but for whom???)...

They are probably hoping that we mistakenly assume that the "resource" that they speak of is the fish, when in actuality it is US!!!

They don't give a rat's ass about the fisheries, but rather how much money can they screw us out of. They are more interested in raping the seas and sodomizing us all for a profit.

Exactly how much money is being wasted on this piss-poor excuse for an actual reseach survey? Who is paying for this waste of money?

All those in charge and involved in this lovely scam need to be removed from their position and literally thrown out on the streets.

I will re-assess my feelings on this when I see and read that they are doing something construictive and beneficial to the fisheries and not to their own damn bank accounts!!!!!

[Raven]

what do ya do when Jehovah witness people
knock at your door?

[vineyardblues]

did anyone receive money , ????
The guy who posted it was his first post .....

[judgejp]

I know it is hard to believe but it is real and I am holding the check in my hand From QuanTech/ Ma Economic Survey. I bet they sent other amounts out as well. How much would they have to pay for any of you to stop fishing for a year? $500 isn't enough for me.

[numbskull]

I bought licenses for my three sons last year, one didn't fish at all, the other two went twice (at night). Both of them are not going to be around this summer. I'm praying all three get surveyed.......it will come to my address

[Stewie]

As far as I know, no other state is pulling this crap. Let's all move to another state and see how the pols deal with ZERO income from us poor slobs. Except for the saltwater, this state has almost nothing to offer us anyway.

[Bill L]

With this economy, I can see some people being tempted to take the money to pay bills, which is BS as that is a togh decision to force someone to make (give up something they love, that shoudl be free anyways, for a little cash)

[chaz]

i just recieved this notice,it reads just like the post above written by basic patrick,think i will do the survey part ,as far as giving up my permit to fish this year..............Thats Not Going To Happen...........:liq uify:

[Raven]

it sounds very illegal to me.... to buy up someones right to fish....from them
and then your name would have to be placed in some form of registry.

but this $500 dollars...
is that supposed to be "FOR LIFE" or for a "YEAR"s Time?

why does it have to stop there......Buy away your right to Vote
to drive? whats next? SEX, your first born... your wife?

[saltyric]

In experiment, US offers up to $500 for fishermen not to fish - Business - The Boston Globe

[Raven]

from arthritis and multiple car wrecks, accidents ect

but even though i am not a hard core salt water guy
like many on S-B.com

i want to march against NOAA and demand that they protect
the herring and kick ass on seals, end their protected species status
and actually do something for new englands fishing community

this is absolutely INSULTING worthless and i believe unconstitutional.

[Ksnake]

When something like this happens, you have to wonder - What is their angle?

I don't care if they "say" they don't have an agenda, or if they give us some other BS line of crap about value. This is the same old type of corporate-speak that I have had shoved up my butt for years. It's just lies and they don't want you to know their real agenda so they tell you what you want to hear. And when you finally find out what their real agenda actually is, it's too late and you've already been F-ed.

See through the lies, all they want to do is to raise the price of our permits!

I hope a lot of people cash the checks. If they don't, then the message will be that we are willing to pay a LOT more than $10 to fish. But I suspect many will not cash them, which makes this whole thing total crap! I am laid off, and even without a job, I would not sell my permit even tho I really need the cash. Therefore, I know this scheme of theirs will work and the price of permits will be going up.

Would I pay more than $10? Yes, but not because that is what it's worth. If the money is being used for something good, then fine. But if they are only raising the price because "they can" it's total BS.

If nobody cashes their checks, I'll bet the permit price will go up ($55 ring a bell?) even tho they told us it wouldn't. Lies!

EVERYTHING about this survey and the checks sucks!