Lance the Doosh

[Pete_G]

Originally Posted by spence

He was diagnosed stage 3 when he was 25...I doubt he had been doing PEDs for that long by then. Never know for sure of course but its less likely.
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Floyd Landis, who is maybe not the best source for info, has said Michele Ferrari was concerned that doping had been the cause.

I'm guessing it's never something that can be proven anyways, but there's evidence it was going through some people's minds.

I suppose it doesn't really matter.

[Sea Dangles]

Livestrong was formerly referred to as the Lance Armstrong foundation. This was a charity Lance started before even his first tour win. My opinion is he did far more good than bad with his fame. Jimmys Dad is aperfect example of the inspiration he gave to others. He made a similar positive impact on countless other lives.I would be indebted to anybody who could provide comfort and levity for a loved one who was terminally ill and struggled on a daily basis,

[Nebe]

He should run for congress.
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[Swimmer]

Originally Posted by Nebe

He should run for congress.
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He would be right at home.

[ThrowingTimber]

Originally Posted by Nebe

He should run for congress.
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Wheelhouse!

[Nebe]

Are you defending this ass clown spence??
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[spence]

Originally Posted by Nebe

Are you defending this ass clown spence??
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No, just some perspective.

There could have been hundreds if not thousands of cyclists in his position had they had the skills and drive he did.

Lance is a shame as the entire sport had become a shame. That's the thing people don't seem to grasp, all the others are really just about as guilty. Lance was just higher profile because he was so good.
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[scottw]

Originally Posted by Nebe

Are you defending this ass clown spence??
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relativism on steroids he was a victim

[Nebe]

I agree. It's a shame everyone has to cheat to win.
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[Pete F.]

You tell me if the chicken or the egg was first, though if PEDs are as widespread as some claim in cycling they might make a good study group.


With all of those key facts unknown, I asked Dr. Philip Kantoff, Chief of the Division of Solid Tumor Oncology at Dana-Farber Cancer Institute in Boston, whether there could possibly be any link between taking performance-enhancing drugs and developing testicular cancer. Of course Dr. Kantoff has no personal knowledge of Armstrong’s history and our conversation was purely speculative. Here, slightly edited is what he said:

“There are no studies that prospectively look at testicular cancer with any of these drugs…Theoretically, of the drugs under consideration — I’m not sure he took human growth hormone — but of the potential performance enhancing drugs he may have taken, it’s conceivable that growth hormone could, theoretically, be linked to cancer but there is no study to support that…

[On the question of testosterone, Dr. Kantoff said the most common context for treatment with testosterone is this]…the guy that comes in, he’s a middle-aged man, a little depressed, his libido is down and his testosterone is slightly low. They give him enough to normalize his testosterone levels, but this is not in the category of enhancing, it’s normalizing levels. And again, there aren’t any definitive studies on this…there’s belief and then there are studies…

With performance enhancement, you take people with normal levels and gve them super high levels. It’s a whole understudied field. Nobody’s ever taken a look at 20-to-30-year-olds with normal testosterone levels and giving them super high levels and the side effects from that…

With human growth hormone, it’s conceivable — you can enhance the growth of cells — but there’s no data.”

About 5,000-10,000 men a year develop testicular cancer, Kantoff said. But it’s the most common cancer in men between 20 and 40 in the U.S. So what’s the bottom line in Armstrong’s case?

“Any conclusion that there’s a link would be a big leap here,” Kantoff said. “All of these things could cause harm when taken at super high levels, but nobody’s ever studied it.”

[Mike P]

Just to clarify---Livestrong has never raised a single cent in support of cancer research, nor have they ever claimed to. Their mission statement is to raise cancer awareness, and to work in support of cancer victims. They have donated money to victims to fund experimental treatments that typical health insurers won't cover. One aspect of support. It's a legit charity that unfortunately is one of several injured parties here.

Also, you have to know the difference between Livestrong.org, the non-profit that Armstrong established to raise cancer awareness/support, and Livestrong.com, which is Lance's personal money maker for Lance. That is the one that sells the Livestrong rights to companies that make cycling paraphrenalia (Nike jerseys, Giro helmets with the Livestrong colors/logo, sports drinks, etc).

[Nebe]

Liestrong
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[fishsmith]

Southpark has already covered this. USA TODAY
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[Piscator]

Anyone know if this was an illegal act punishable by fine/imprisonment?

Also, he sued people who were telling the truth about it.
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[spence]

Originally Posted by Piscator

Anyone know if this was an illegal act punishable by fine/imprisonment?

Also, he sued people who were telling the truth about it.
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The doping or the lying?

Doping laws vary by country, but I doubt he could get in additional trouble at this point.

There's speculation he could be at risk for perjury and additional lawsuits to get back money he either won or was awarded in his own suits.

-spence

[Nebe]

Lance reminds me of a surfcaster I know. Catching a 50 liber wasn't good enough, so he had to go out and take more pictures in different clothes and claim it was a 60 lber. Sociopaths love sports and competition.
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[spence]

Yes, I'm mixing it up with the plasticizer I believe he also was accused of testing positive for.

If you follow cycling the Hamilton book is interesting. I think I read the entire book on two flights, it's not deep material.

What's astonishing is that even if some of the book isn't accurate the rest is still pretty crazy and from what we've seen in the USADA report is likely accurate.
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[Mike P]

Originally Posted by spence

Yes, I'm mixing it up with the plasticizer I believe he also was accused of testing positive for.

If you follow cycling the Hamilton book is interesting. I think I read the entire book on two flights, it's not deep material.

What's astonishing is that even if some of the book isn't accurate the rest is still pretty crazy and from what we've seen in the USADA report is likely accurate.
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According to what I've read, the co-author only included thing that he could verify independently of Hamilton.

Going back to that 25 km finishing time trial in 1989, LeMond made some tactical decisions that gave him the win, independently of the extraordinary effort. He decided that he wouldn't get his interval splits from his team car, preferring to just ride blind. The course was primarily downhill, and while it was downwind, there was also a quartering tail wind. So he decided to only have a solid disc wheel on the rear, keeping a conventional spoked wheel on the front, which he thought would be more stable in that cross wind. He also fitted his bike with aero bars. Fignon's team lodged a grievance, but the governing body approved their use. Instead of adding aero bars himself, Fignon rode with conventional drop bars. He also had a solid disc wheel on the front, which might have resulted in him expending more effort in holding a line. LeMond also wore an aero helmet, while Fignon rode bare headed. Fignon had long hair and tied it into a ponytail. Although I don't put much stock in the theory, some pundits claim that it added enough drag to affect the outcome.

If picture is worth 1000 words, this one is an encyclopedia. You can see how devastated Fignon was at his loss.

[RIJIMMY]

the lance armstrong story is of a guy who against all odds beat cancer and then to take it even further became an amazing athlete and win more TDF races than anyone. he was the best of the best. Thats what 99% of the Americans walking around believed and the story they knew. its all that I knew about the guy but it was a story I loved. The guy was a f'in hero. Many of you said - everyone knew he was doping - thats crap, average people that knew of armsotrong had no idea. They, like me only knew lance the hero. Lance the hero is what propelled livestrong, its what enabled his charity and all the branding. Period - lance the hero.
Well, lance the hero is a fraud, he won by cheating. he is just a guy that beat cancer, many do. they dont create a story for themselves and lie. Lance the hero was the inspiration to people, the whole package, not just the TDF wins, they whole story is what made him special and enabled his success.
Some of Madoffs investors redeemed with a profit and actually made money. Hamas does amazing things for palistinians but also blows up babies. the end DOES NOT justify the means. His lies will hurt more people than any good he created. DOOOOSHH BAAAAG !
Tiger Woods lied to his wife, his business is not mine. Last I checked he is still golfing, no? Lance planning any races anytime soon?

[Sea Dangles]

Jimmy,Hamas?
stay out of the sun and drink lots of liquids.

[Mike P]

Originally Posted by RIJIMMY

Tiger Woods lied to his wife, his business is not mine. Last I checked he is still golfing, no? Lance planning any races anytime soon?

Rumors about Tiger and HGH have been out there for quite a few years, now. Just sayin'. Guy went from being whipcord thin to ripped.

There are many who believe that this whole "confessing" thing is part of a plan to get re-instated. Not in pro cycling, but in triathalon. Lance thinks he can contend for the Ironman title. He may be right. He'd dominate the cycling stage, even in his mid-40s. He was gearing up for a crack at it before all the #^&#^&#^&#^& hit the fan.

He competed in triathalons before he became a pro cyclist.

[ThrowingTimber]

Originally Posted by Mike P

Rumors about Tiger and HGH have been out there for quite a few years, now. Just sayin'. Guy went from being whipcord thin to ripped.

There are many who believe that this whole "confessing" thing is part of a plan to get re-instated. Not in pro cycling, but in triathalon. Lance thinks he can contend for the Ironman title. He may be right. He'd dominate the cycling stage, even in his mid-40s. He was gearing up for a crack at it before all the #^&#^&#^&#^& hit the fan.

He competed in triathalons before he became a pro cyclist.

Agreed. He is doing the "I did bad, now how long will it take to forgive me?" routine.

[Swimmer]

Originally Posted by Mike P

Rumors about Tiger and HGH have been out there for quite a few years, now. Just sayin'. Guy went from being whipcord thin to ripped.

It well could have precipitated the emotional collapse in Florida, the extended use of it that is.

[striperman36]

something to be said about coming out after all this. I think you hit Mike.

[Raven]

i experiment with many performance enhancing Vitamins but don't mess with "whoremoans" because they can cause weird side effects.
I have successfully discovered a formula that turns limp wood to Tigerwood but not petrified wood that hurts for 4 hours.

Does that make me not a hero...i think not...and it's ALL
perfectly legal.

My Cardio Echo exam yesterday indicates that i am right on the money and ahead of the Game.

[Mike P]

EPO can make your blood the consistency of molasses, and cause a stroke. More than one athlete has died from taking too much. Usually happens in their sleep, when the body's metabolism slows. The same is true of adding extra blood to a full tank.

While it's true that there is no causal link between steroids/HGH and testicular cancer, there is some evidence that excess HGH can speed the metastisis of cancer to other organs. Lance's cancer had spread from his nuts to his brain.

[Dick Durand]

Just finished watching the segment on 60 Minutes dealing with Lance Armstrong. As much as I wanted to think well of the guy, his culpablity is far more pervasive than I ever would have imagined. It's so much more than just an individual athelete trying to beat the odds.

[nightfighter]

Originally Posted by #^&#^&#^&#^& Durand

Just finished watching the segment on 60 Minutes dealing with Lance Armstrong. As much as I wanted to think well of the guy, his culpablity is far more pervasive than I ever would have imagined. It's so much more than just an individual athelete trying to beat the odds.

You could include fraud ($90 mil from USPS contract ie. taxpayers), witness tampering, intimidation, and ruining people's careers/lives.

I wonder how much Sheryl Crow knew, and when she knew.... Think that might have been the reason she and Lance split?

[Slingah]

I watched the 60 Minutes segment too....if all that chit turns out to be true, he's a SUPER doosh!

[Mike P]

Originally Posted by nightfighter

You could include fraud ($90 mil from USPS contract ie. taxpayers), witness tampering, intimidation, and ruining people's careers/lives.

I wonder how much Sheryl Crow knew, and when she knew.... Think that might have been the reason she and Lance split?

It was only $30 million that USPS spent to fund the cycling team over the years, and I think that the team was in existence before Lance started winning TdFs. Lance rode for the Discovery team for at least his last yellow jersey. In his two comeback years, 2009/2010, he rode for Astana in 2009, and Radio Shack in 2010.

The $90 million comes from the fact that in a qui tam whisteblower suit, the court can award triple damages.