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Political Threads This section is for Political Threads - Enter at your own risk. If you say you don't want to see what someone posts - don't read it :hihi: |
03-17-2017, 09:35 AM
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#91
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 10,242
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in CT
"He liked leaks until it happened to him"
It wasn't the US Government that leaked emails from the DNC. true Here's a question that no one is asking about the Russians hacking the DNC. Were any of those leaked emails doctored? Was any of it untrue? If revealing things that the DNC did, hurt their campaign, isn't it fair to ask why they were engaging in those activities in the first place? Yes, the hacking was wrong and should be investigated. But if the Democrats weren't playing dirty, there would have been nothing to hack and nothing to leak. Nothing they did was illegal. Certainly they had a bias for Hillary and against Bernie. They thought she had a better chance.
" heard some people think it was related to a law suit where Trump sued "
I also heard Trump is an anti-Semite. Funny given that hos daughter Ivanka, who he clearly adores, is a Jew. So I'm not overly impressed with what you "hear" about him from the media Ok, I'll remember that. They have shed all credibility in their coverage of this guy.
"I believe Trump had to provide a tax form in the suit"
It's still illegal for anyone to share that without his permission.
How come all these people going bonkers over his taxes, couldn't care less that Obama didn't release his academic records from college, as most presidents have done? Not any concern at all about that. Have you "heard" anything about why that is.
"He is acting like a cartoon villain"
He is acting like a horse's ass. Very different from a villain. You watch MSNBC from 8:00 - 11:00 any night, and they will devote at least one-third of their air time dedicated to connecting him with the Russians. There is no evidence. There's no more evidence connecting him to the Russian hack of the DNC, than there is that Obama tapped Trump tower. Yet everyone is blasting Trump for accusing Obama for tapping him without evidence, bit no one is blasting the media for saying he is a KGB plant without evidence. They are not saying that so don't lie.
No double standard there. Nope.
Here is a crazy idea, Paul. How about we hold politicians to task when they are wrong, and we praise them when they do good. And we do that similarly, to people of both sides. Do you have any appreciation for how far away we are, from that? That only thing that comes close to that is on Foxnews, excluding Sean Hannity, who is a Trump puppet. And I remember all those post you praised Obama
I watched Lawrence O'Donnell interview Shirley McLane last night, the two of them talking about how Trump is the second coming of Hitler. It was like taking a trip deep into the Twilight Zone.
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The White House has tried to soothe an angry Britain after suggesting that President Barack Obama used London’s spy agency to conduct secret surveillance on President Trump while he was a candidate last year.
A spokesman for Prime Minister Theresa May said on Friday that “we’ve received assurances from the White House that these allegations would not be repeated.”
The GCHQ quickly and vehemently denied the contention in a rare statement issued by the spy agency on Thursday, calling the assertions “nonsense” and “utterly ridiculous.”
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03-17-2017, 09:50 AM
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#92
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 7,688
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It's amazing how we believe what spy agencies tell us.
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03-17-2017, 09:56 AM
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#93
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,435
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulS
The White House has tried to soothe an angry Britain after suggesting that President Barack Obama used London’s spy agency to conduct secret surveillance on President Trump while he was a candidate last year.
A spokesman for Prime Minister Theresa May said on Friday that “we’ve received assurances from the White House that these allegations would not be repeated.”
The GCHQ quickly and vehemently denied the contention in a rare statement issued by the spy agency on Thursday, calling the assertions “nonsense” and “utterly ridiculous.”
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"Nothing they (the media) did was illegal".
There is an amazing tendency of liberals, when backed into a corner, of answering a question that bears no resemblance to what was asked. I didn't ask if it was illegal. It was not illegal for CNN to get debate questions ahead of time to Hilary. But if when that story breaks, all you care about is how it broke, and you could care less about the ethics of what was done, that shows blatant bias. If the election was influenced by the email release, the blame doesn't lie with who revealed the truth, the blame lies with the folks who acted in a way that would offend portion of the electorate. Don't blame the messenger.
"They thought she had a better chance".
So who cares if a majority of registered democrats wanted someone else? That's the difference between the 2 sides. No one in the GOP thought Trump had the best chance. That didn't motivate us to rig the primary against him. When the leaders of your side put their thumbs on the scales to get the candidate they want, regardless of what the citizens want, please tell me how that's different from fascism?
"They are not saying that so don't lie".
Hyperbole for laughs Paul. Is the media hellbent on connecting Trump to the Russians, despite the fact that there is zero evidence? How is that any different than Trump claiming that Obama wiretapped him, without evidence? Instead of taking my exaggeration literally, perhaps you could respond to the point that you well knew I was making?
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03-17-2017, 10:05 AM
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#94
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,435
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulS
The White House has tried to soothe an angry Britain after suggesting that President Barack Obama used London’s spy agency to conduct secret surveillance on President Trump while he was a candidate last year.
A spokesman for Prime Minister Theresa May said on Friday that “we’ve received assurances from the White House that these allegations would not be repeated.”
The GCHQ quickly and vehemently denied the contention in a rare statement issued by the spy agency on Thursday, calling the assertions “nonsense” and “utterly ridiculous.”
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"And I remember all those post you praised Obama"
Now who is lying Paul? I consistently gave him credit for stabilizing the financial market. I consistently gave him credit for aggressiveky continuing th ehunt for Bin Laden.
And unlike what the media is doing to Trump (the anti Semite)...when I criticized Obama, I didn't routinely make up jibberish to criticize him. I didn't need to, he gave me a lifetime of honest, accurate ammunition to club him over the head with.
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03-17-2017, 10:09 AM
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#95
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 7,688
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[QUOTE=Jim in CT;1118910
"They are not saying that so don't lie".
Hyperbole for laughs Paul. Is the media hellbent on connecting Trump to the Russians, despite the fact that there is zero evidence? How is that any different than Trump claiming that Obama wiretapped him, without evidence? Instead of taking my exaggeration literally, perhaps you could respond to the point that you well knew I was making?[/QUOTE]
There is a certain consistency in the big lie. If Trump is framed as a liar when he exaggerates, your hyperbole must also be called a lie. This is one of the many techniques that spymasters use. Also a technique of Alnskyites--i.e., current Democrats.
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03-17-2017, 10:25 AM
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#96
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,632
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funny that when Clinton's/Obama's said things...on video...we were constantly told they didn't actually mean what they said...on video....repeatedly... if it came off in a bad light...and now...when someone tweets...which is the most difficult form of communication to judge tone and tenor....we're supposed to hold tweeters accountable for every word tweeted....
we appear to hold artful liars in much higher esteem than the bumbling variety....
you shouldn't put much stock in anything you read in tweets...particularly if the tweeter is orange and has funny hair
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03-17-2017, 10:48 AM
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#97
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,435
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scottw
funny that when Clinton's/Obama's said things...on video...we were constantly told they didn't actually mean what they said...on video....repeatedly... if it came off in a bad light...and now...when someone tweets...which is the most difficult form of communication to judge tone and tenor....we're supposed to hold tweeters accountable for every word tweeted....
we appear to hold artful liars in much higher esteem than the bumbling variety....
you shouldn't put much stock in anything you read in tweets...particularly if the tweeter is orange and has funny hair
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"when someone tweets...which is the most difficult form of communication to judge tone and tenor....we're supposed to hold tweeters accountable for every word tweeted"
Which is exactly why someone should tell Trump to back off.
I'll give him some benefit of the doubt on tone sometimes, for the reasons you stated. But when he flies off the handle that Obama personally went all Jack Bauer on him, snuck into Trump Tower like a ninja, and installed wiretaps...and there is zero evidence of that...then you can assign any tone you want to that, it makes Trump look ridiculous. If he wants to whine about being treated unfairly, he can make a compelling case (at least in regards to the media) without making stuff up. he has plenty of facts on his side.
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03-17-2017, 10:51 AM
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#98
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,632
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in CT
it makes Trump look ridiculous.
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maybe you have not noticed but this appears to be his recipe for success and for frustrating his detractors
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03-17-2017, 11:01 AM
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#99
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 10,242
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in CT
"Nothing they (the media) did was illegal".
There is an amazing tendency of liberals, when backed into a corner, of answering a question that bears no resemblance to what was asked. You don't think the RNC. had some of the same type of emails about Trump? Breitbart just leaked a tape of Ryan saying he won't support Trump so why wouldn't he had sent the same message in an email? What makes you think the Reps. during the primaries didn't favor someone else? I didn't ask if it was illegal. It was not illegal for CNN to get debate questions ahead of time to Hilary. But if when that story breaks, all you care about is how it broke, and you could care less about the ethics of what was done, that shows blatant bias. If the election was influenced by the email release, the blame doesn't lie with who revealed the truth, the blame lies with the folks who acted in a way that would offend portion of the electorate. Don't blame the messenger. So you are saying the Russians are blamless?
"They thought she had a better chance".
So who cares if a majority of registered democrats wanted someone else? That's the difference between the 2 sides. No one in the GOP thought Trump had the best chance. That didn't motivate us to rig the primary against him. You have no way of knowing - bc the Russians choose to hack the DNC and not the RNC. When the leaders of your side put their thumbs on the scales to get the candidate they want, regardless of what the citizens want, please tell me how that's different from fascism ?
"They are not saying that so don't lie".
Hyperbole for laughs Paul Ok I got it. When someone calls you out for a statement you come back and say it was sarcasm or hyperbole. Is the media hellbent on connecting Trump to the Russians, despite the fact that there is zero evidence Bc Trump's cabinet/advisors have had numerous contacts w/the Russians - including getting $ from them or surrogates. When asked, their answers have not fully answered the questions either. How is that any different than Trump claiming that Obama wiretapped him, without evidence? Instead of taking my exaggeration literally, perhaps you could respond to the point that you well knew I was making?
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It is not an exaggeration. Look at everythng w/Flynn. Now he is an foreign agent of Turkey and had gotten $ when he was in Trump's cabinet.
You're telling me that if the situation was reversed, the Rep. wouldn't be all over this?
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03-17-2017, 11:16 AM
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#100
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 7,688
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Part of the big lie is to establish an air of equivalency. If the other side would have done the same thing that we are doing, then we are absolved. The only time when it was wrong was when they were, or would have been, doing it. We, of course, are blameless. We are merely doing what they did, or would have done. So it is perfectly right and good that we are now allowed, by precedent, or presupposed example of precedent, to carry on as we do. You cannot question our integrity in doing what you would have done. And you would not have been right in doing it if you had done it, because you have bad intentions.
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03-17-2017, 11:23 AM
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#101
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,435
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scottw
maybe you have not noticed but this appears to be his recipe for success and for frustrating his detractors
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I have noticed. But what gives him high ratings as host of 'The Apprentice', isn't translating into approval ratings as POTUS. And the stakes are a wee bit higher in his role as POTUS. He wasn't the leader of the free world as the host of 'The Apprentice', he was essentially a clown.
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03-17-2017, 11:31 AM
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#102
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,435
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulS
It is not an exaggeration. Look at everythng w/Flynn. Now he is an foreign agent of Turkey and had gotten $ when he was in Trump's cabinet.
You're telling me that if the situation was reversed, the Rep. wouldn't be all over this?
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"Look at everythng w/Flynn. Now he is an foreign agent of Turkey and had gotten $ when he was in Trump's cabinet. "
And Flynn is also a liar. But we don't know what he discussed with the Russian ambassador, so we can't pretend to know they discussed collusion or influencing the election.
"You're telling me that if the situation was reversed, the Rep. wouldn't be all over this"
I'd be reacting to what I know, sure. I am not in the habit of putting on a tin-foil hat and pontificating wildly about crazy conspiracies. I don't claim that Obama was involved in faking the moon landing. But I think he was a racist who hated the traditional, Judeo-Christian, view of America. I can back that up all day long with irrefutable facts that support my conclusion.
Because the MSNBC release of his tax return actually made Trump look good, Maddow spent 10 minutes speculating that Trump only paid his taxes that one year, and only because Melania was applying for an updated immigration status, and Trump thought that would help if he paid his taxes for once. She had exactly zero evidence of this. Zip. But in her warped, frustrated mind, if he paid his taxes, there has to be a sinister reason behind it. She cannot accept that he might have paid what he owed simply because he had to, which is why everyone else pays their taxes. This is someone who calls herself a journalist, and hosts a prime time show on a network. And she is a lunatic. But considered mainstream within the liberal sphere.
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03-17-2017, 11:38 AM
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#103
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,632
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in CT
But what gives him high ratings as host of 'The Apprentice', isn't translating into approval ratings as POTUS.
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with the constant media and left barrage and his missteps or calculated landmines placed to cause reactions(no one seems to be able to figure out which) and the general divide in the country...I wouldn't anticipate he'll ever enjoy high approval ratings
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03-17-2017, 11:47 AM
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#104
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,435
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulS
It is not an exaggeration. Look at everythng w/Flynn. Now he is an foreign agent of Turkey and had gotten $ when he was in Trump's cabinet.
You're telling me that if the situation was reversed, the Rep. wouldn't be all over this?
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"Breitbart just leaked a tape of Ryan saying he won't support Trump so why wouldn't he had sent the same message in an email?"
The DNC took active steps to rig the primary. Not remotely the same thing as Ryan saying he doesn't support the guy.
"So you are saying the Russians are blameless?"
Again, you are unable to respond to the question that was asked. Here is what I said at 10:20 in this thread, an exact quote...
"Yes, the hacking was wrong and should be investigated"
From that, you infer that I hold the Russians "blameless". That's easier for you to claim (despite the fact that I explicitly said the opposite of what you claim I am saying), than it is for you to admit that I am obviously right, when I say that the majority of the blame lies with the people whose unethical actions were brought to light. If you are pissed that the email leak influenced the election, you should be pissed at the DNC and Hilary for doing things that offended the voters.
When Woodward and Bernstein broke the Watergate story, Americans didn't blame 'Deep Throat' (their informant) for revealing things, and ignore Nixon's actions, for God's sake They blamed Nixon, and they were right to do so. Your party has come a long way since then, in terms of determining responsibility. And I don't see it as progress.
"You have no way of knowing (that the RNC didn't tip scales for Trump).
I know this - we don't use 'superdelegates' whose sole purpose, is to make sure that the RNC always gets the candidate they want, despite the will of the voters.
I also know this...the DNC's actions weren't going to be revealed until the Russians did it, because the American media isn't interested in digging up dirt on Democrats. The media, with the exception of Foxnews, doesn't even ask tough questions to liberals.
You are suggesting that the RNC was rigging the election for Trump? Please explain all of the powerful conservatives who spoke against him, and who actively campaigned for any of the other candidates.
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03-17-2017, 11:50 AM
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#105
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,435
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scottw
with the constant media and left barrage and his missteps or calculated landmines placed to cause reactions(no one seems to be able to figure out which) and the general divide in the country...I wouldn't anticipate he'll ever enjoy high approval ratings
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Scott, I am not influenced by the media's pathetic and "sour grapes" attempt to portray Trump as a cross between Adolf Hitler and Darth Vader. But I really dislike the guy. I dislike him, because of the things he actually does. Not what NBC says he does.
Sure, many people's opinions will be shaped by the media narrative. But if you take the media out of it, his behavior often leaves me shaking my head, wondering how anyone can possibly act that way.
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03-17-2017, 12:05 PM
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#106
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,632
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[QUOTE=Jim in CT;11
behavior often leaves me shaking my head, wondering how anyone can possibly act that way.[/QUOTE]
I feel this way about most of the actors in a Washington...it's like sitting back and watching a good food fight
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03-17-2017, 12:09 PM
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#107
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 10,242
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in CT
"Look at everythng w/Flynn. Now he is an foreign agent of Turkey and had gotten $ when he was in Trump's cabinet. "
And Flynn is also a liar. But we don't know what he discussed with the Russian ambassador, so we can't pretend to know they discussed collusion or influencing the election.No, we don't and that is why they are investigating.
"You're telling me that if the situation was reversed, the Rep. wouldn't be all over this"
I'd be reacting to what I know, sure. I am not in the habit of putting on a tin-foil hat and pontificating wildly about crazy conspiracies. I don't claim that Obama was involved in faking the moon landing. But I think he was a racist who hated the traditional, Judeo-Christian, view of America. I can back that up all day long with irrefutable facts that support my conclusion.
Because the MSNBC release of his tax return actually made Trump look good, Maddow spent 10 minutes speculating that Trump only paid his taxes that one year, and only because Melania was applying for an updated immigration status, and Trump thought that would help if he paid his taxes for once. She had exactly zero evidence of this. Zip. But in her warped, frustrated mind, if he paid his taxes, there has to be a sinister reason behind it. She cannot accept that he might have paid what he owed simply because he had to, which is why everyone else pays their taxes. This is someone who calls herself a journalist, and hosts a prime time show on a network. And she is a lunatic. But considered mainstream within the liberal sphere.
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She is not considered mainstream. She is no better than Hannity or a host of the political entertainment division of Fox. Trump seems to say whatever Hannity said the day before (w/o confirming it). In fact, Hannity is prob. considered a moderate to the others Trump seems to follow.
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03-17-2017, 12:19 PM
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#108
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 7,688
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Down goes Flynn! Down goes Maddow! Next . . . .
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03-17-2017, 04:47 PM
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#109
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Ledge Runner Baits
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: I live in a house, but my soul is at sea.
Posts: 8,456
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Trump is moving to control the media even further then he has already, cherry picking who is allowed in or allowed to accompany Tillerson; it will be Trumps way or the highway and the battle continues.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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03-18-2017, 04:11 AM
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#110
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Somerset MA
Posts: 9,197
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President Donald Trump has stood by claims he was wiretapped under Barack Obama, telling visiting German Chancellor Angela Merkel: "At least we have something in common, perhaps."
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03-18-2017, 05:48 AM
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#111
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Ledge Runner Baits
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: I live in a house, but my soul is at sea.
Posts: 8,456
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If Trump was any colder towards her, she would have needed a parker, hat and some gloves to keep from freezing to death. Then to refuse the handshake and scowl and look like she's not even there, really POTUS; at least give us the appearance your presidential. At times he treats our allies as poorly as he treats the media and I'm not sure 4 years is long enough for a lot of leaders (except for Putin) to forget the nasty rhetoric coming from his mouth all throughout the campaign.
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03-18-2017, 06:50 AM
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#112
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Mansfield
Posts: 4,834
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You two would rather someone phony and you're just not used to someone who speaks and shows how he believes . Merkel Is a horrible leader . Maybe you would feel better if he just kissed everyone's ass and hope they like him / us and then the world will be good . 👎
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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03-18-2017, 07:29 AM
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#113
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,632
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buckman
You two would rather someone phony and you're just not used to someone who speaks and shows how he believes . Merkel Is a horrible leader . Maybe you would feel better if he just kissed everyone's ass and hope they like him / us and then the world will be good . 👎
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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yeah...hugging dictators and dissing our friends was a good thing, brilliant in fact, for the last 8 years
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03-18-2017, 07:53 AM
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#114
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Ledge Runner Baits
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: I live in a house, but my soul is at sea.
Posts: 8,456
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You don't need to like someone to show them some respect, if you feel that strongly why invite them to begin with or stage the media show to show us your Trumpness. I don't like Trump, but I'd show the man respect by extending my hand, taking the high road would have been better IMHO.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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03-19-2017, 04:23 AM
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#115
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,632
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03-19-2017, 08:50 AM
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#116
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Somerset MA
Posts: 9,197
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buckman
You two would rather someone phony and you're just not used to someone who speaks and shows how he believes . Merkel Is a horrible leader . Maybe you would feel better if he just kissed everyone's ass and hope they like him / us and then the world will be good . 👎
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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Buckman your idea of a stand up guy is very sad indeed
Being an ass doesn't equal Strength.. it usually just the opposite Weak unsecure people Talk #^&#^&#^&#^&.. confident people have a no need to be an ass
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03-19-2017, 09:35 AM
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#117
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Mansfield
Posts: 4,834
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wdmso
Buckman your idea of a stand up guy is very sad indeed
Being an ass doesn't equal Strength.. it usually just the opposite Weak unsecure people Talk #^&#^&#^&#^&.. confident people have a no need to be an ass
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You are decribing Obama
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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03-20-2017, 08:12 AM
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#118
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Ledge Runner Baits
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: I live in a house, but my soul is at sea.
Posts: 8,456
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Well if today goes as most think it will, there should be a very large twitter storm tomorrow, because regardless of what Comey testifies to today, Trump never apologizes and is never wrong.
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03-20-2017, 01:36 PM
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#119
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Mansfield
Posts: 4,834
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Got Stripers
Well if today goes as most think it will, there should be a very large twitter storm tomorrow, because regardless of what Comey testifies to today, Trump never apologizes and is never wrong.
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I have to agree .
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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03-20-2017, 01:43 PM
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#120
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: CT
Posts: 2,292
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Got Stripers
Well if today goes as most think it will, there should be a very large twitter storm tomorrow, because regardless of what Comey testifies to today, Trump never apologizes and is never wrong.
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during*
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