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| Political Threads This section is for Political Threads - Enter at your own risk. If you say you don't want to see what someone posts - don't read it :hihi: |
10-26-2018, 07:19 AM
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#91
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Canceled
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vt
Posts: 13,429
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in CT
"Just because Arthur Brooks writes a book that says so doesn’t make it true"
And just because you hate the findings, doesn't make it false.
"A 2013 MIT study found charitable giving equal between liberals and conservatives "
Fine. SO no difference in generosity between liberals and conservatives. Is that what you're saying? I have no problem conceding that, none. Can you concede it?
"We’ll see how the latest Republican tax reform affects charitable giving since many people will have a harder time taking deductions"
Most people saw an INCREASE in take-home pay. True or false?
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I would tell you that there’s conflicting studies and it’s likely that political views are not reflected in charitable giving.
How does the increase in take home pay affect tax deductions for charitable giving?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device |
Frasier: Niles, I’ve just had the most marvelous idea for a website! People will post their opinions, cheeky bon mots, and insights, and others will reply in kind!
Niles: You have met “people”, haven’t you?
Lets Go Darwin
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10-26-2018, 07:38 AM
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#92
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,441
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete F.
I would tell you that there’s conflicting studies and it’s likely that political views are not reflected in charitable giving.
How does the increase in take home pay affect tax deductions for charitable giving?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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"it’s likely that political views are not reflected in charitable giving."
In other words, you have no basis whatsoever to claim that liberals are more generous, but you just can't bear to say it out loud.'
"How does the increase in take home pay affect tax deductions for charitable giving?"
Increases in take-home pay give us more disposable income with which to make donations. Is that really going too fast for you.
Pete, here is every single post you have ever made, boiled down to this...
liberal=good, conservative=bad.
I wonder what you'd say about why the state of CT is going bankrupt. |
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10-26-2018, 08:26 AM
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#93
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Canceled
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vt
Posts: 13,429
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in CT
"it’s likely that political views are not reflected in charitable giving."
In other words, you have no basis whatsoever to claim that liberals are more generous, but you just can't bear to say it out loud.'
Would it be possible that political affiliation has no demonstrable correlation with charitable giving? Or is everything driven by politics?
"How does the increase in take home pay affect tax deductions for charitable giving?"
Increases in take-home pay give us more disposable income with which to make donations. Is that really going too fast for you.
You do understand that deductions for charitable giving increase the amount you can give without affecting your spendable income, and that changing how deductions worked greatly reduced the advantages of giving.
Pete, here is every single post you have ever made, boiled down to this...
liberal=good, conservative=bad.
I wonder what you'd say about why the state of CT is going bankrupt.
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Of course it's the Liberals bankrupting CT, left to their own devices Conservatives would make it as good as Kansas.
Nothing will work well, till people work together. |
Frasier: Niles, I’ve just had the most marvelous idea for a website! People will post their opinions, cheeky bon mots, and insights, and others will reply in kind!
Niles: You have met “people”, haven’t you?
Lets Go Darwin
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10-26-2018, 09:06 AM
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#94
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 7,725
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete F.
Nothing will work well, till people work together.
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That's why communism works so well. |
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10-26-2018, 09:10 AM
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#95
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,441
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete F.
Of course it's the Liberals bankrupting CT, left to their own devices Conservatives would make it as good as Kansas.
Nothing will work well, till people work together.
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"You do understand that deductions for charitable giving increase the amount you can give without affecting your spendable income"
No I do not understand that, because it's absolutely false. There is a huge difference between a tax credit and a deduction. You are confusing the two.
If I donate $100 to charity, and I am able to deduct that $100 from my taxable income, and I'm in a 25% tax bracket, that means I get $25 back. I do not, not even close, get the whole $100 back. Deductions do not, not even close, restore your full disposable income. Deductions reduce the amount by which your disposable income decreases. Deductions do not make it 'free' to donate to charity.
The tax cuts give most of us more take-home pay. Many of us will give some of that to charity.
Take accounting 101. A tax credit is a dollar-for-dollar reduction is taxes owed. A deduction reduces your tax liability by pennies on the dollar, not dollar for dollar. |
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10-26-2018, 09:47 AM
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#96
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Canceled
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vt
Posts: 13,429
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in CT
"You do understand that deductions for charitable giving increase the amount you can give without affecting your spendable income"
No I do not understand that, because it's absolutely false. There is a huge difference between a tax credit and a deduction. You are confusing the two.
If I donate $100 to charity, and I am able to deduct that $100 from my taxable income, and I'm in a 25% tax bracket, that means I get $25 back. I do not, not even close, get the whole $100 back. Deductions do not, not even close, restore your full disposable income. Deductions reduce the amount by which your disposable income decreases. Deductions do not make it 'free' to donate to charity.
The tax cuts give most of us more take-home pay. Many of us will give some of that to charity.
Take accounting 101. A tax credit is a dollar-for-dollar reduction is taxes owed. A deduction reduces your tax liability by pennies on the dollar, not dollar for dollar.
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When did I say everyone gets it all back, as you say, your $100 donation costs you $75, because you are rebated $25. How does it reduce your spendable income $100 |
Frasier: Niles, I’ve just had the most marvelous idea for a website! People will post their opinions, cheeky bon mots, and insights, and others will reply in kind!
Niles: You have met “people”, haven’t you?
Lets Go Darwin
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10-26-2018, 10:08 AM
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#97
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 2,574
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Just saw a report that the Mexican government has been passing out flyers and announcing by bull horn to the caravan that the US has the military at the border and they will not be allowing anyone to enter. Also mentioned that the number has dropped from 7000-4000 (est).
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DZ
Recreational Surfcaster
"Limit Your Kill - Don't Kill Your Limit"
Bi + Ne = SB 2
If you haven't heard of the Snowstorm Blitz of 1987 - you someday will.
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10-26-2018, 10:25 AM
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#98
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,441
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete F.
When did I say everyone gets it all back, as you say, your $100 donation costs you $75, because you are rebated $25. How does it reduce your spendable income $100
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do you not even read what you post? you said that thanks to deductions, charitable giving doesn’t effect disposable income. that’s absurd, unless you are in a 100 percent tax bracket. which is something you’d probably endorse.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device |
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10-26-2018, 10:55 AM
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#99
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Canceled
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vt
Posts: 13,429
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in CT
do you not even read what you post? you said that thanks to deductions, charitable giving doesn’t effect disposable income. that’s absurd, unless you are in a 100 percent tax bracket. which is something you’d probably endorse.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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You're correct, there is a fault in my wording.
I should have written: You do understand that deductions for charitable giving can increase the amount you can give, dependent on your tax situation, without affecting your spendable income.
Why would you think that I would endorse that?
Last edited by Pete F.; 10-26-2018 at 10:57 AM..
Reason: ADD
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Frasier: Niles, I’ve just had the most marvelous idea for a website! People will post their opinions, cheeky bon mots, and insights, and others will reply in kind!
Niles: You have met “people”, haven’t you?
Lets Go Darwin
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10-26-2018, 11:44 AM
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#100
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 10,300
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in CT
do you ever get one right, even by accident? the conservative philosophy is to avoid wasteful spending to keep taxes for everyone, no higher than they need to be. try poking holes in that. if conservatives have no empathy or pity, why does the new york times admit that conservatives give more
money and time to charity, than liberals do?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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We've discussed this 20 times - the conserv. give $ to their church (like I do w/about 50% of my yearly donations). Take that out and factor in the amount of poor who vote D, then it is prob different.
Any your's and my donations can't make up for what the govern. does.
Fact is that the conserv. policies always try to cut back on spending to the poor. Shows their lack of empathy.
Both Tillerson and G. Cohen said that Trump has no empathy (and pity) and Trump pretty much owns the R party now.
And you always complain that the Ds. ripped Romney apart. They did - bc he said he didn't have to worry about 47% of the country (shows his lack of empathy although I don't want to put him in the category as Trump). If Obama said he didn't care about almost 50% of the country you would have posted that 500 times.
Last edited by PaulS; 10-26-2018 at 11:54 AM..
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10-26-2018, 12:43 PM
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#101
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,441
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulS
We've discussed this 20 times - the conserv. give $ to their church (like I do w/about 50% of my yearly donations). Take that out and factor in the amount of poor who vote D, then it is prob different.
Any your's and my donations can't make up for what the govern. does.
Fact is that the conserv. policies always try to cut back on spending to the poor. Shows their lack of empathy.
Both Tillerson and G. Cohen said that Trump has no empathy (and pity) and Trump pretty much owns the R party now.
And you always complain that the Ds. ripped Romney apart. They did - bc he said he didn't have to worry about 47% of the country (shows his lack of empathy although I don't want to put him in the category as Trump). If Obama said he didn't care about almost 50% of the country you would have posted that 500 times.
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" Take that out and factor in the amount of poor who vote D, then it is prob different."
Why take out church donations, much of which goes to help the poor? Can't imagine why you'd suggest to ignore that..
"They did - bc he said he didn't have to worry about 47% of the country "
He absolutely deserved criticism for that. I have no problem with fair criticism, as long as you also give credit where credit is due. There are many, many examples of Romney's empathy and generosity. The media also called him a sexist because he had women's resumes in a binder. That was asinine. But that is what CNN did, and it was a joke. |
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10-26-2018, 12:45 PM
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#102
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,441
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulS
Both Tillerson and G. Cohen said that Trump has no empathy (and pity) and Trump pretty much owns the R party now.
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So why did Trump, many years ago, donate his jet for a sick child to use, to fly all his medical equipment across the country? And how generous he has been with fallen cops? But Tillerson says he has no empathy, and by jiminy, that's good enough for you. |
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10-26-2018, 12:50 PM
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#103
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 10,300
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in CT
" Take that out and factor in the amount of poor who vote D, then it is prob different."
Why take out church donations, much of which goes to help the poor? Can't imagine why you'd suggest to ignore that.. Bc it is a little self serving. If I give $ for my church most people won't be able to benefit like I would. I can now sit in a nice new beautiful church and enjoy all the things my donation made possible (the coffee hour after church, the language classes, the sports programs, the bible study, etc).
"They did - bc he said he didn't have to worry about 47% of the country "
He absolutely deserved criticism for that. I have no problem with fair criticism, as long as you also give credit where credit is due. There are many, many examples of Romney's empathy and generosity. The media also called him a sexist because he had women's resumes in a binder. That was asinine. But that is what CNN did, and it was a joke.
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I am sure he is far far more generous than Pres. Trump - esp. being a Morman. But isn't that what people do during elections - find something and blow it up to make someone look bad? |
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10-26-2018, 12:52 PM
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#104
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 10,300
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in CT
So why did Trump, many years ago, donate his jet for a sick child to use, to fly all his medical equipment across the country? And how generous he has been with fallen cops? But Tillerson says he has no empathy, and by jiminy, that's good enough for you.
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Big deal - he did it many many years ago as you mentioned. There are not many examples of his being generous in NY. And I know you know how he has gotten in trouble for his foundation paying for fines and a painting out of its funds. I think NY is now suing him over more issues w/the foundation.
Last edited by PaulS; 10-26-2018 at 12:58 PM..
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10-26-2018, 01:13 PM
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#105
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,441
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulS
I am sure he is far far more generous than Pres. Trump - esp. being a Morman. But isn't that what people do during elections - find something and blow it up to make someone look bad?
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you make it sound like donations to your church mostly serve the parish. that’s not how a lot of churches handle donations. the catholic church spends a ton housing, feeding, and providing medical care, for the poor.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device |
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10-26-2018, 01:32 PM
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#106
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 10,300
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in CT
you make it sound like donations to your church mostly serve the parish. that’s not how a lot of churches handle donations. the catholic church spends a ton housing, feeding, and providing medical care, for the poor.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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I think most donations go towards the running/mortgage of the church. No doubt most churches do all they can - soup kitchens, etc. |
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10-26-2018, 02:02 PM
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#107
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Canceled
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vt
Posts: 13,429
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Church funds are interesting
You should ask, they will explain it
My wife has been a Church Treasurer for many years and not at the Church of The Ten Suggestions
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Frasier: Niles, I’ve just had the most marvelous idea for a website! People will post their opinions, cheeky bon mots, and insights, and others will reply in kind!
Niles: You have met “people”, haven’t you?
Lets Go Darwin
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10-26-2018, 04:17 PM
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#108
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Super Moderator
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Georgetown MA
Posts: 18,204
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wdmso
Eduardo Nunez talks about his massive 3-run home run to help clinch a Game 1 win for Boston
its fine he jumped the line and wasn't in a caravan
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Well he had a job and came on a work visa to come here, can you say the same about the caravan?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device |
"If you're arguing with an idiot, make sure he isn't doing the same thing."
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10-26-2018, 08:22 PM
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#109
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Canceled
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vt
Posts: 13,429
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman
Well he had a job and came on a work visa to come here, can you say the same about the caravan?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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So if Hispanics were not allowed to get visas to play baseball and steal jobs paying millions of dollars from Americans then Americans would be able to get better at baseball and have those jobs
Sound familiar?
That’s one argument against immigration
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device |
Frasier: Niles, I’ve just had the most marvelous idea for a website! People will post their opinions, cheeky bon mots, and insights, and others will reply in kind!
Niles: You have met “people”, haven’t you?
Lets Go Darwin
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10-26-2018, 08:30 PM
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#110
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Somerset MA
Posts: 9,381
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman
Well he had a job and came on a work visa to come here, can you say the same about the caravan?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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hitting a baseball or picking avocados... seems not many Americans are willing to do or are very good at either ,, both are in High demand.... but we only want the ones that help our sports teams not our farmers |
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10-26-2018, 08:33 PM
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#111
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Super Moderator
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Georgetown MA
Posts: 18,204
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete F.
So if Hispanics were not allowed to get visas to play baseball and steal jobs paying millions of dollars from Americans then Americans would be able to get better at baseball and have those jobs
Sound familiar?
That’s one argument against immigration
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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No, that's an argument against illegal immigration.
Say it, I know you can. ILLEGAL Immigration
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device |
"If you're arguing with an idiot, make sure he isn't doing the same thing."
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10-26-2018, 08:54 PM
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#112
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Canceled
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vt
Posts: 13,429
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman
No, that's an argument against illegal immigration.
Say it, I know you can. ILLEGAL Immigration
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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But why let someone have a visa to work here legally in a job that would gladly be performed by a citizen
This person is not a citizen, but they take very good paying jobs away from Americans
If they were coming here to provide menial labor we won’t give them a visa because some Americans claim that they are taking jobs away from low income Americans but it’s acceptable if they make millions?
Why is that acceptable?
Americans don’t want or can’t do those jobs?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device |
Frasier: Niles, I’ve just had the most marvelous idea for a website! People will post their opinions, cheeky bon mots, and insights, and others will reply in kind!
Niles: You have met “people”, haven’t you?
Lets Go Darwin
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10-26-2018, 09:00 PM
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#113
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Super Moderator
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Georgetown MA
Posts: 18,204
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete F.
But why let someone have a visa to work here legally in a job that would gladly be performed by a citizen
This person is not a citizen, but they take very good paying jobs away from Americans
If they were coming here to provide menial labor we won’t give them a visa because some Americans claim that they are taking jobs away from low income Americans but it’s acceptable if they make millions?
Why is that acceptable?
Americans don’t want or can’t do those jobs?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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So you're suggesting we halt all immigration, how unamerican of you.
And I knew you couldn't say "Illegal"
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device |
"If you're arguing with an idiot, make sure he isn't doing the same thing."
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10-26-2018, 09:29 PM
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#114
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Canceled
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vt
Posts: 13,429
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Why do you think I can’t say Illegal
Illegal
Illegal
Illegal
Illegal
A well thought out immigration policy and help for the people outside our borders who live in countries that have horrible issues is the solution to illegal immigration
People with hope don’t leave home. They might go and work elsewhere but their goal is to be at home with their relatives and friends. Is that so different than yours?
We need to enable those countries to succeed and make it a win win situation.
Help businesses in Central America replace businesses that make things we import from the Far East could be a start
Perhaps if Trump had gone to the Central American Summit and said: Let’s work together to solve these issues that affect us both, we could move forward
Read a little history and see what put Central America where it is today
We should help
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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10-26-2018, 09:37 PM
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#115
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Super Moderator
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Georgetown MA
Posts: 18,204
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete F.
Why do you think I can’t say Illegal
Illegal
Illegal
Illegal
Illegal
A well thought out immigration policy and help for the people outside our borders who live in countries that have horrible issues is the solution to illegal immigration
People with hope don’t leave home. They might go and work elsewhere but their goal is to be at home with their relatives and friends. Is that so different than yours?
We need to enable those countries to succeed and make it a win win situation.
Help businesses in Central America replace businesses that make things we import from the Far East could be a start
Perhaps if Trump had gone to the Central American Summit and said: Let’s work together to solve these issues that affect us both, we could move forward
Read a little history and see what put Central America where it is today
We should help
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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So are we talking about our refugee policy, our immigration policy, or our illegal immigration policy. Because you are blurring them all together.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device |
"If you're arguing with an idiot, make sure he isn't doing the same thing."
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10-27-2018, 04:16 AM
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#116
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Canceled
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vt
Posts: 13,429
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman
So are we talking about our refugee policy, our immigration policy, or our illegal immigration policy. Because you are blurring them all together.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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They are related
Every action has an affect on other things and that’s why governing is hard.
All those policies can be as harsh as the Constitution allows and we could build a wall
People will come as long as they perceive that they have an opportunity for a better life
Someone will fill the vacuum in those countries and the Chinese are willing to assume that role in the world including Central America
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device |
Frasier: Niles, I’ve just had the most marvelous idea for a website! People will post their opinions, cheeky bon mots, and insights, and others will reply in kind!
Niles: You have met “people”, haven’t you?
Lets Go Darwin
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10-28-2018, 11:03 AM
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#117
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 7,725
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No doubt some on this forum will consider this guy a crazy black nut job. But he makes some interesting analogies.
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10-28-2018, 12:57 PM
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#118
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Certifiable Intertidal Anguiologist
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Somewhere between OOB & west of Watch Hill
Posts: 35,273
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Pro Legal Immigration
Against Illegal Immigration
Common denominator? Whether or not it is legal. Legal is the baseline.
You want to allow more immigrants? Stop the illegal and make the legal more efficient and less burdensome.
BTW - stop the illegal immigration and I am all OK with expanding the legal immigration.Expand the asylum seekers, and refugees. But you have to stop the illegal immigration first, and reverse those that did not come here illegally.
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~Fix the Bait~ ~Pogies Forever~
Striped Bass Fishing - All Stripers
Kobayashi Maru Election - there is no way to win.
Apocalypse is Coming:
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10-29-2018, 06:58 PM
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#119
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 7,725
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10-30-2018, 04:05 AM
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#120
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Somerset MA
Posts: 9,381
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Quote:
Originally Posted by detbuch
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Seems the bomber and synagogue shooter has disrupted his message
Trump tweet
“Republicans are doing so well in early voting, and at the polls, and now this ‘Bomb’ stuff happens and the momentum greatly slows — news not talking politics. Very unfortunate, what is going on. Republicans, go out and vote!”
Trump’s allies had been speculating without evidence that the failed bombings — which exclusively targeted Trump antagonists — were actually part of a “false flag” leftist plot to make Republicans look unhinged.
US sends thousands of troops to border 1 week before the primaries
along with this new conference
This is what a false flag operation looks like this one is in plain view ^^^^^ |
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