Having a problem with handcarves...

[Mokes]

I thought maybe you guys could help on this.

I want to try through-wiring handcarves so I can use these in the Canal. I'm not too sure the screw-eyes even though Devcon'd in, will hold up to a fish+current.

I marked my holes last night, drilled the belly hole out and drew a center-line along the back to follow and I missed completely.

I used the blank before I started sanding. I just had it cut out with the bandsaw and had my tapers cut.

Is there a smarter way to drill these, so the holes are at least CLOSE instead of me holding the blank in my hand and using a cordless?

My other question is, (if I can actually manage the through-drilling) when I drill out the belly hole, what is a good size bit for it, if I want to use hook hangers? Seems like the size I use for the grommets would be too narrow?

[bennyraw]

I start my through hole on the lathe and finish with the hand drill, just like you would on a round blank. If you mark your centers the holes should line up. I don't usually use grommets on hand carves but there are some smaller belly grommets available.

[Mokes]

Originally Posted by bennyraw

I start my through hole on the lathe and finish with the hand drill, just like you would on a round blank. If you mark your centers the holes should line up. I don't usually use grommets on hand carves but there are some smaller belly grommets available.

I can't do that Benny on these. The wood is a thin rectangle and I have to cut the shape out first. I use a template to draw the basic design.

I may need to shorten the lip slot a hair and try to drill a more straight line to center instead of trying to pass over the lip at an angle. This is tougher than doing a swimmer, lol.

I don't want to use a grommet, I just wasn't sure what bit is right for a hook hanger. Never made one before. Gonna make a little jig to bend some wire cut-off's I have.

[WoodyCT]

Stan Gibbs used screw eyes on his famous 3 hook darters, so maybe yours will be OK provided the wood you used isn't too soft.

I dabbled with hancarves a while back and hit this same hurdle and fell on my face. I bet the type of drill bit is crucial for accuracy. Try one specifically forvdrilling end grain. Fuller and Morris Wood Tool make them.

Bit size for hangers? Does it matter if you will be filling the hole with epoxy putty?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

[Mokes]

Originally Posted by WoodyCT

Stan Gibbs used screw eyes on his famous 3 hook darters, so maybe yours will be OK provided the wood you used isn't too soft.

I dabbled with hancarves a while back and hit this same hurdle and fell on my face. I bet the type of drill bit is crucial for accuracy. Try one specifically forvdrilling end grain. Fuller and Morris Wood Tool make them.

Bit size for hangers? Does it matter if you will be filling the hole with epoxy putty?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Probably not on the size, more than how wide a hanger is. I tried making one last week and the thing was kind of huge, lol. I tried doing it by hand with my Knipex roundnose though. I think i need a mounted jig with nails or something to make it smaller.

I use AYC for these and only drill a really small starting hole, not too deep so the devcon 2 ton and threads can seat in well. Maybe I should just stick with that for these. They are only 5.75".

[Slipknot]

screweyes would be fine I bet

otherwise, I see no reason you need to thru drill at those angles, you should be able to drill a straight shot thru to the tail. If it goes thru the lip, all the better to help hold it in place.

my 2 cents

[the greek]

There are many ways and none are right or wrong but this is what works for me. Mark nose center and tail center and then through drill on the lathe. Then take a 1/4" forstner and drill your belly hole to where you bottom out just at the through wire hole. I don't like to be too deep. The 1/4" looks small but is plenty big, any bigger and your hangers will be bigger and tend to fold. Keep them small. You don't want the hanger to be too loose or you will have trouble keeping it centered when you fill it. I did a long post with pics at the other place on this [drilling and weighting handcarveds]. A small 1/8 inch s/s rivet head makes a great tail grommet for thin tailed baits. If you need metal for lips and some rivets pm me. I could throw a hanger or two in to let you see how I make them.

[Mokes]

Originally Posted by the greek

There are many ways and none are right or wrong but this is what works for me. Mark nose center and tail center and then through drill on the lathe. Then take a 1/4" forstner and drill your belly hole to where you bottom out just at the through wire hole. I don't like to be too deep. The 1/4" looks small but is plenty big, any bigger and your hangers will be bigger and tend to fold. Keep them small. You don't want the hanger to be too loose or you will have trouble keeping it centered when you fill it. I did a long post with pics at the other place on this [drilling and weighting handcarveds]. A small 1/8 inch s/s rivet head makes a great tail grommet for thin tailed baits. If you need metal for lips and some rivets pm me. I could throw a hanger or two in to let you see how I make them.

Thanks Ted, I will go look it up. I can make the lips, though mine are kind of cavemanish. I have 1 SS piece you gave me left and I have a huge sheet of it that is kind of dinged that was given to me last fall, but it's workable with a hammer.

I have a hard time imagining making hook hangers that small with my thorugh wire, but maybe I just need to make that jig and muscle it.

I can buy some rivets I'm sure. Probably pretty cheap? Can you find them at Home Depot you think?

[numbskull]

It is very easy to drill those interconnecting angles if you use a drill press and a center pin (which you move off center to intersect your target). Do a search, it is all there.

[bennyraw]

Get thinner gauge wire for your hangers, the prebent stuff is too stiff for hangers.

[FrankR]

I drill the thru wire hole after shaping the plug using the center pin/drill press method that numbskull recommends, and finish with a hand drill. Learned it from a post by rockfish.

On my larger handcarves I drill a 3/8" hole for my hangers, smaller sized holes on smaller plugs, down to 1/4", fill all holes with epoxy, no gromments.

I make my hangers using round nose pliers, real easy once you know how, learned from Ted.

Rivets are available from lure parts,they have two sizes, they are used on buzzbaits, both sizes are good to have.

I'll try and post a photo of the drill press method later, got to find them ?????

[FrankR]

Oh yeah, I use a 5/32" drill in the front, drill 1/2 way, then use a 1/8" from the rear end and hopefully meet in the middle. If you miss don't panic, using the drilled out belly holes usually you will be able the snake the wire thru. Some photos of the drill press set up.

[Rockfish9]

you can also use epoxy pockets.... I use them on my small darters and peanut bunker hand carves...

[JFigliuolo]

Originally Posted by Rockfish9

you can also use epoxy pockets.... I use them on my small darters and peanut bunker hand carves...

That would be my choice. I use them on some swimbaits. They are very strong.

[Mokes]

Never heard of an epoxy pocket?

[Rockfish9]

Originally Posted by Mokes

Never heard of an epoxy pocket?

yea well how long you been building.. you are a fast learner, but.... lots of techniques out there that are not discussed daily.... I had a nice display at pugfest the last two years showing the epoxy pocket and several other "forgotten" methods of attaching hooks and hangers... you could also pin them as well....

[Mokes]

Originally Posted by Rockfish9

yea well how long you been building.. you are a fast learner, but.... lots of techniques out there that are not discussed daily.... I had a nice display at pugfest the last two years showing the epoxy pocket and several other "forgotten" methods of attaching hooks and hangers... you could also pin them as well....

I think right now, it's a learning curve issue with drilling out the plug. It's big enough to handle it, but it's going to be a practice thing. For now I am content with where I've gotten in the design and all, but I know eventually, I need to shore up the weak points, or I'll be in for a sad day if the screw eyes fail.

I only drill a 1/4" into the wood and I dab Devcon 2 ton on the threads and screw them into the wood. I figured it would be smarter to have the screw make the hole instead on drilling too deep. I'm not certian how much the epoxy bonds the wood to the screw, but if it is as strong as I'm told it is...that wood SHOULD break 1st.

I have many years of learning ahead. It's hard to soak it all in and practice each technique. Much to learn.

[Rockfish9]

it's all a learning curve Grasshopper.... as my Dad used to say "you aint done learned everything 'till they put you in the ground"... words i live by...enjoy the ride..