Fox tell Trump to arm Teachers - Page 8 - Striper Talk Striped Bass Fishing, Surfcasting, Boating

Jim in CT · 02-26-2018, 03:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PaulS

that and some laws regarding mental health and maybe age limits (21) would be a great start.

Agreed, though having an age limit higher than the minimum age to serve in the military could be viewed as strange...

I think violence in the entertainment industry ought to be a part of the discussion, too.

The Dad Fisherman · 02-26-2018, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

What law on the books, would have prevented Sandy Hook from happening with proper enforcement?

What new laws could be enacted to prevent a Sandy Hook from happening again. Prevent is the key word.

What we need to do is to look at each incident and figure out where it went wrong.

People screaming about banning AR-15's distracts from what actually needed to be fixed to possibly (nothing is 100%) deter the next one, and that was the flow of information that was reported and the inaction by agencies that had some this information. This is what we should focus on fixing right now.

If half of this was addressed that halfwit wouldn't have been able to legally get his hands on a gun.

scottw · 02-26-2018, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PaulS

that and some laws regarding mental health and maybe age limits (21) would be a great start.

I think 26 would be better since that's the age that they're consider adults now thanks to Obamacare....

The Dad Fisherman · 02-26-2018, 03:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scottw

I think 26 would be better since that's the age that they're consider adults now thanks to Obamacare....

But they still gotta be eligible to vote at 16...

scottw · 02-26-2018, 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman

If half of this was addressed that halfwit wouldn't have been able to legally get his hands on a gun.

quite a few adults, many with badges were aware that he had guns, was troubled and was threatening to do bad things with his guns over and over...no one did anything....and somehow it's Washington's job to fix it....looking for solutions in the wrong places

Jim in CT · 02-26-2018, 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slipknot

oh, so now we need laser guided missiles?

Jim, you don't get it that they take an inch, then another inch and keep on taking. Stand up for your rights.

blaming guns is like blaming the internet, cop out

As far as the thread title, I don't agree with Trump saying arm the teachers , but I don't agree with Biden making up gun free zones either. But taking away some teachers' choice if they wanted to carry is not cool. When I went to school there were some teachers that carried concealed and I bet there were when you went as well, you just did not know it. It did not end badly.

"nothing is foolproof"

I get that, I do. But this kid put up every imaginable red flag, and he passed the background check? We don't need to be flawless, but we need to be at least good enough to keep that kid from being able to buy a firearm, or we might as well pull the plug on the whole thing and arm everybody.

"Jim, you don't get it that they take an inch, then another inch and keep on taking"

You're right, I don't get that. I see zero reason to believe that it's an all or nothing situation. I haven't heard any liberal who has any meaningful influence, suggest they have their sights set on handguns and riles that aren't semi-automatic.

"Stand up for your rights"

I believe I do. I also have the burden of feeling obligated to stand up for the rights of others, not just mine. Including defenseless children.

"blaming guns is like blaming the internet"

I believe each plays a role in this. I am sure I am correct.

"I don't agree with Trump saying arm the teachers "

That's not really what he said...

"When I went to school there were some teachers that carried concealed and I bet there were when you went as well, you just did not know it"

I wonder. I went to Catholic schools, and on more than one occasion I was hit in the face with a ruler when misbehaving. I wonder what would have happened if they were armed...

"It did not end badly"

99.999% of the time it doesn't end badly. If you had a machine gun in your house, I would probably feel safe letting my kids sleep over. It's not you I'm worried about. The next Adam Lanza is out there. And he's not carrying a sign identifying himself as amass murderer.

Jim in CT · 02-26-2018, 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman

What new laws could be enacted to prevent a Sandy Hook from happening again. Prevent is the key word.

What we need to do is to look at each incident and figure out where it went wrong.

People screaming about banning AR-15's distracts from what actually needed to be fixed to possibly (nothing is 100%) deter the next one, and that was the flow of information that was reported and the inaction by agencies that had some this information. This is what we should focus on fixing right now.

If half of this was addressed that halfwit wouldn't have been able to legally get his hands on a gun.

"What new laws could be enacted to prevent a Sandy Hook from happening again. Prevent is the key word."

How about this. A law saying that if you live in a house with a person who has mental issues (like Adam Lanza's mother did), then if you want a gun, maybe you have to keep it in a gun range. Or maybe you can only have a gun with fingerprint id so no one else can shoot it.

You are correct, we can't legislate everything. The question is, are we doing enough? I'm not saying we aren't. But I'm saying it's past time for that conversation.

I'm also interested in laws that don't prevent, but possibly reduce the carnage. Like banning high capacity magazines.

"What we need to do is to look at each incident and figure out where it went wrong"

Correct, none are identical.

"If half of this was addressed that halfwit wouldn't have been able to legally get his hands on a gun"

In this case, I completely agree.

Maybe we pass laws saying that if you want an AR-15 because they are fun to shoot, fine, but you have to keep it at the gun range, you can't take it home with you.

The Dad Fisherman · 02-26-2018, 03:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

I wonder. I went to Catholic schools, and on more than one occasion I was hit in the face with a ruler when misbehaving. I wonder what would have happened if they were armed...

trust me, them nuns could decapitate a fly when they swing those yardsticks if they wanted to...they LET you live

Jim in CT · 02-26-2018, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman

trust me, them nuns could decapitate a fly when the swing those yardsticks if they wanted to...they LET you live

Oh, I hear THAT. No gold medal winning fencer was ever more accurate or deadly with his foil, than the nuns were with the yardsticks. Indigo Montoya from The Princess Bride, wasn't as good with his sword.

The Dad Fisherman · 02-26-2018, 04:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

How about this. A law saying that if you live in a house with a person who has mental issues (like Adam Lanza's mother did), then if you want a gun, maybe you have to keep it in a gun range. Or maybe you can only have a gun with fingerprint id so no one else can shoot it.

How do we define what mental health issues? Adam Lanza had Autism (Aspergers), that is hardly a violent mental illness. So a parent that has an autistic child loses their rights or has them infringed upon?

Columbine was just two angry A-Holes

Cruz from what I've read was a Violent Sociopath (and that should be a HUGE disqualifier).

When the towers fell on 911 we immediately changed airline security guidelines. Armed Marshalls, armed pilots, Metal detectors at every entrance, Steel doors on the cockpits

We didn't tell people they couldn't buy box cutters, we shored up security everywhere that could be a weakness.

A bunch of kids get killed and the gut reaction is to outlaw the "Box Cutters". Why wouldn't we put Armed Guards in the schools, Allow teachers to carry, metal detectors at the entrances to the school and secure doors on the classrooms. We need to change security procedures to ensure their safety.

They said on 911 that we were forever changed, I think with these school shootings we may need to change again

and of Note, since the Airlines implemented their Security procedures, I haven't seen another plane hijacked.

scottw · 02-26-2018, 04:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman

How do we define what mental health issues? Adam Lanza had Autism (Aspergers), that is hardly a violent mental illness. So a parent that has an autistic child loses their rights or has them infringed upon?

ADD, ADHD...

I was listening to my classical music station this morning and there was a doctor being interviewed regarding binge eating which is apparently now categorized as a serious mental illness and people with eating disorders apparently have the highest risk of suicide...according to her...

so we need to ban people with eating disorders(mental illness) from owning guns...this will be very effective because we know that the majority of the country is obese

if you are fat...no gun for you

Sea Dangles · 02-26-2018, 04:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PaulS

It looked like you were trying to make the point that guns don't kill people - people kill people.

Using that logic nukes don't kill people.

So why is it different between nukes and ARs?

Paul, if you get raped would you blame the penis?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

wdmso · 02-26-2018, 04:38 PM

Some lady on the radio put it this way..

there is a flood in America (availability of guns and violence that comes with them)

And all the Right can come up with is lets just put sandbags around schools .... (as if thats the only place kids get killed by fire arms)

they wont even try to stem the flow

In 1996, the Republican-majority Congress threatened to strip funding from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention unless it stopped funding research into firearm injuries and deaths. The National Rifle Association accused the CDC of promoting gun control.

why would they be afraid???

Jim in CT · 02-26-2018, 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman

How do we define what mental health issues? Adam Lanza had Autism (Aspergers), that is hardly a violent mental illness. So a parent that has an autistic child loses their rights or has them infringed upon?

Columbine was just two angry A-Holes

Cruz from what I've read was a Violent Sociopath (and that should be a HUGE disqualifier).

When the towers fell on 911 we immediately changed airline security guidelines. Armed Marshalls, armed pilots, Metal detectors at every entrance, Steel doors on the cockpits

We didn't tell people they couldn't buy box cutters, we shored up security everywhere that could be a weakness.

A bunch of kids get killed and the gut reaction is to outlaw the "Box Cutters". Why wouldn't we put Armed Guards in the schools, Allow teachers to carry, metal detectors at the entrances to the school and secure doors on the classrooms. We need to change security procedures to ensure their safety.

They said on 911 that we were forever changed, I think with these school shootings we may need to change again

and of Note, since the Airlines implemented their Security procedures, I haven't seen another plane hijacked.

"How do we define what mental health issues?"

The same we define that label when deciding whether or not to involuntarily commit someone.

"Adam Lanza had Autism (Aspergers), that is hardly a violent mental illness."

It's not often associated with violence. He had other issues.

Screening for mental health isn't perfect. We will miss some crazy people, we will mis-diagnose some healthy people as being sane. Those are the con's. We will also likely save some lives. Those are the pro's. Let's have an honest conversation about whether or not the pro's outweigh the con's. Maybe they do, maybe they don't. But one side says every idea has nothing but con's, the other side says it has no con's. Zero honesty.

"So a parent that has an autistic child loses their rights or has them infringed upon?"

Maybe, if the impediment is severe enough. I'm not saying I am advocating for this. You asked what new laws might have prevented Sandy Hook, and this is what I came up with of the top of my head. I'm not a constitutional lawyer or a lawmaker or a mental health expert.

"Columbine was just two angry A-Holes "

Yep. I have said many times, there is no law that would stop every conceivable situation. But when you think any flaws mean a law is therefore not a good idea, then you are letting perfect be the enemy of good.

Speeding laws also aren't perfect. Because they don't stop everyone from speeding, and sometimes speeding is a good idea. When my wife gave birth to my middle son, we almost didn't make it to the hospital (he was born 14 minutes after we walked through the door, waddled in her case, if I went 25 mph we might not have made it). Despite the shortcomings of speeding laws, I have never heard anyone suggest we do away with them.

"We didn't tell people they couldn't buy box cutters, we shored up security everywhere that could be a weakness."

That's a completely valid point, and part of what we need to do, unfortunately, is fortify the schools. At the same time, we do have no-fly lists...

"and of Note, since the Airlines implemented their Security procedures, I haven't seen another plane hijacked"

You are correct again, it seems to be working. But there are a lot more schools than there are major airports, not sure if that makes it harder...

Not all mass shootings happen within the confines of a school building, either.

Slipknot · 02-26-2018, 05:02 PM

"How about this. A law saying that if you live in a house with a person who has mental issues (like Adam Lanza's mother did), then if you want a gun, maybe you have to keep it in a gun range. Or maybe you can only have a gun with fingerprint id so no one else can shoot it. "

Jim, Kevin commented on this but I want to add

Since analogies are a thing today, we don't make people who live with drunks have those breathalyzer kill switches installed in all their cars do we? But give it time and progressives will have that happening in the name of progress and safety.

Most gun shops can tell someone is a bit "#^&#^&#^&#^& when they try to buy a gun and they refuse, but plenty just see dollars so the whole background check stuff is a complicated issue for sure. There is room for improvement.

PaulS · 02-26-2018, 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sea Dangles

Paul, if you get raped would you blame the penis?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

My penis has a mind of its own
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

wdmso · 02-26-2018, 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slipknot

"How about this. A law saying that if you live in a house with a person who has mental issues (like Adam Lanza's mother did), then if you want a gun, maybe you have to keep it in a gun range. Or maybe you can only have a gun with fingerprint id so no one else can shoot it. "

Jim, Kevin commented on this but I want to add

Since analogies are a thing today, we don't make people who live with drunks have those breathalyzer kill switches installed in all their cars do we? But give it time and progressives will have that happening in the name of progress and safety.

Most gun shops can tell someone is a bit "#^&#^&#^&#^& when they try to buy a gun and they refuse, but plenty just see dollars so the whole background check stuff is a complicated issue for sure. There is room for improvement.

not sure why we haven't heard more about these

http://fortune.com/2015/04/22/smart-...-ready-are-we/

Biometric Trigger Guard or Biometric Guns are not far from being a reality we unlock our phones now with biometrics this would be a huge leap forward in Gun safety and should be a win win for 2a and gun control advocates ..

It does not solve the issue of some one wanting to commit murder , but would do much to prevent accidental shootings the stolen gun market

Sea Dangles · 02-26-2018, 05:57 PM

I still can't believe that I have to say I don't smoke pot to buy a gun but there are no questions about alcohol use.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Slipknot · 02-26-2018, 06:01 PM

Not reliable

do they work when your finger is the slightest bit wet? or very wet?

scottw · 02-27-2018, 03:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

But this kid put up every imaginable red flag, and he passed the background check?

what does this tell you?....we are going to learn why...you aren't going to like it.... and it will have nothing to do with the effectiveness of a background check......

Miami Herald reported on Friday that, in November 2017, a tipster called the Broward Sheriff's Office (BSO) to say Cruz "'could be a school shooter in the making,' but deputies did not write up a report on that warning."

The Herald added that this tip came just weeks after a relative called urging BSO to seize his weapons. Two years prior, "A deputy investigated a report that Cruz 'planned to shoot up the school' – intelligence that was forwarded to the school's RESOURCE OFFICER, with no apparent result."

CNN's Jake Tapper cited the 23 incidents before the shooting that involved Cruz and questioned whether the PROMISE program might have been responsible for the inaction by the sheriff's office.

"It's helping many, many people," Broward County Sheriff Scott Israel said in defense of the program. "What this program does is not put a person at 14, 15, 16 years old into the criminal justice system."

In 2014, Scot Peterson was named School Resource Officer of the Year by the Broward County Crime Commission for handling issues "with tact and judgment."

some sad irony there....

http://www.miamiherald.com/news/loca...201887629.html

The Dad Fisherman · 02-27-2018, 06:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scottw

if you are fat...no gun for you

...or too skinny (Anorexia, Bulimia)

the list of people they can say No to just keeps growing

Pete F. · 02-27-2018, 08:02 AM

Here is a site, admittedly antigun, but it has a list of school shootings since Newtown. Look at the categories and see how many are Gun fired unintentionally with injury or death resulting.
It might make you think about having more guns in schools
https://everytownresearch.org/school-shootings/

spence · 02-27-2018, 08:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sea Dangles

I still can't believe that I have to say I don't smoke pot to buy a gun but there are no questions about alcohol use.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

True.

wdmso · 02-27-2018, 08:51 AM

Who says The NRA are not buying Politicians

"I will kill any tax legislation that benefits @Delta unless the company changes its position and fully reinstates its relationship with @NRA," Mr Cagle wrote on Twitter.

"Corporations cannot attack conservatives and expect us not to fight back."

Georgia lieutenant Governor Casey Cagle

So much for freedom of association

The Dad Fisherman · 02-27-2018, 09:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wdmso

Who says The NRA are not buying Politicians

"I will kill any tax legislation that benefits @Delta unless the company changes its position and fully reinstates its relationship with @NRA," Mr Cagle wrote on Twitter.

"Corporations cannot attack conservatives and expect us not to fight back."

Georgia lieutenant Governor Casey Cagle

So much for freedom of association

But yet if it was a Rainbow Cake......

zimmy · 02-27-2018, 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman

But yet if it was a Rainbow Cake......

I think you are confusing refusal of service with a discount.

The Dad Fisherman · 02-27-2018, 11:36 AM

I think you aren't seeing a business treating people differently based on what they believe, whether it be Gay Marriage or the 2nd amendment.

personally I believe they can both do whatever they want, just funny how nobody whips out the Hypocrisy word for this.

The Dad Fisherman · 02-27-2018, 11:37 AM

oops almost forgot the flag

zimmy · 02-27-2018, 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman

I think you aren't seeing a business treating people differently based on what they believe

No, they are treating them the same, just not special treatment. The analogy would be if Delta refused to sell NRA members plane tickets.

wdmso · 02-27-2018, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman

But yet if it was a Rainbow Cake......

Are there any Republican action or words or in this case threats that you dont support ? heres a site so you'll love

https://www.reddit.com/r/The_Donald/...es_to_boycott/

ORGANIZATIONS TO BOYCOTT:
Pepsico

MACY'S

Amazon - owned by Jeff Bezos

The NFL - this is a big one but has been requested multiple times. Any opposition?

GrubHub (CEO is a total cuck) and their subsidiary, Seamless

OREOS (moved production to Mexico)

CARRIER Air Conditioning (moved production to Mexico)

Moz

Dreamworks

Netflix - spreads propaganda for Al Qaeda

Lifeway Foods - CEO Julie Smolyansky trashed President Trump.

PacketSled *

ConAgra - they're closing up and moving to MEXICO

Comet Ping Pong, Besta Pizza, Terasol, Politics and Prose and Beyond Borders - see r/pizzagate

Required mention: social media such as Facebook, Google, Twitter, Imgur, YouTube - all censored pro-Trump stuff. If you use these to post pro-Trump stuff, weigh the benefits. Trump did use SM to win the election.

Disney - they're cucked and many are clamoring for them to be added.

Ben & Jerry's for supporting BLM

Starbucks (by popular demand)

Dell

Love that Info wars is on they support them section