Striper Talk Striped Bass Fishing, Surfcasting, Boating

     

Left Nav S-B Home Register FAQ Members List S-B on Facebook Arcade WEAX Tides Buoys Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Right Nav

Left Container Right Container
 

Go Back   Striper Talk Striped Bass Fishing, Surfcasting, Boating » Striper Chat - Discuss stuff other than fishing ~ The Scuppers and Political talk » Political Threads

Political Threads This section is for Political Threads - Enter at your own risk. If you say you don't want to see what someone posts - don't read it :hihi:

 
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 10-22-2018, 05:35 PM   #1
Sea Dangles
Registered User
iTrader: (0)
 
Sea Dangles's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 8,718
Human caravan

Why do these folks want to come to the land of oppression? Just in time for elections too,nothing to see or more than coincidence:::::

PRO CHOICE REPUBLICAN
Sea Dangles is offline  
Old 10-22-2018, 06:36 PM   #2
spence
Registered User
iTrader: (0)
 
spence's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: RI
Posts: 21,181
How about because they’re desperate to flee violence. What would you do if it was your kids? How much Kool Aid have you drank this week?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
spence is online now  
Old 10-22-2018, 07:30 PM   #3
Raider Ronnie
Registered User
iTrader: (0)
 
Raider Ronnie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: On my boat
Posts: 9,683
Send a message via AIM to Raider Ronnie
Quote:
Originally Posted by spence View Post
How about because they’re desperate to flee violence. What would you do if it was your kids? How much Kool Aid have you drank this week?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
How many are you taking in your home since you are all for it ???
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
Raider Ronnie is offline  
Old 10-22-2018, 09:31 PM   #4
detbuch
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 7,688
Quote:
Originally Posted by spence View Post
How about because they’re desperate to flee violence. What would you do if it was your kids? How much Kool Aid have you drank this week?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
If they're seeking asylum as refugees, by UN law they must do so in the first country they enter, which, in this case, would be Mexico. They should be stopped at our border and returned to Mexico for the Asylum process. https://cis.org/Cadman/Why-Shouldnt-...-Asylum-Mexico

On the other hand, instead of being generous to 7-10 thousand at a time, we should just go ahead and import the entire populations of Honduras and Guatemala. That would finally take care of the reputedly serious problems for the millions of people that need to escape those dangerous hell holes where the people are starved and murdered and raped and enslaved (though they look pretty well fed in the photos and videos and must be in pretty good health to trek on such a long journey on foot, and they should, you know, for good and neighborly optics, wave American flags instead of those of the place from whence they are trying to escape and maybe not have signs and shouts that sound a bit threatening and demanding which might upset a little bit our fine folks here).

So doing that we would also solve our continuous problem of having to deal with caravans and coyotes and other pesky problems that politicians use as a wedge issue. And we could seriously virtue signal to the rest of the world that we are truly a compassionate people. And then the world would truly love us.

Maybe we could take in all the Mexicans too . . . and the Venezuelans . . . and

Last edited by detbuch; 10-22-2018 at 09:45 PM..
detbuch is offline  
Old 10-22-2018, 09:33 PM   #5
Sea Dangles
Registered User
iTrader: (0)
 
Sea Dangles's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 8,718
My oldest survived spring break in Mexico!

Seriously Jeff, I don’t drink kook aid. Don’t you find the timing of this spontaneous caravan curious? Do you think these folks have read about Chicago?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
Sea Dangles is offline  
Old 10-23-2018, 03:57 AM   #6
wdmso
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Somerset MA
Posts: 9,097
More conspiracy theories .. so to go along with it rather than it being a Dem plot How about a Republican plot

It seems to be a convent timing for the midterms to motivate Trumps base And give him a topic Tweet about .. and to show them how tough he is and his supports have run with it its evident here


Donald J. Trump

@realDonaldTrump
The Caravans are a disgrace to the Democrat Party. Change the immigration laws NOW!

3:14 PM - Oct 21, 2018


Trump on migrant caravan: 'It's not happening on my watch'Trump claims Democrats ‘allowed’ migrant caravan


Even Fox Trumps state news network is running stories about when the will arrive near election day as if they're going to vote

Louie Gohmert: ‘Perhaps Soros’ is ‘Funding’ Caravan for Midterms

suspected letter bomb found at the home of billionaire businessman George Soros Who could have sent it? the Proud Boys ?


Again classic Republican fear mongering

Last edited by wdmso; 10-23-2018 at 04:11 AM.. Reason: add ons
wdmso is offline  
Old 10-23-2018, 04:24 AM   #7
scottw
Registered User
iTrader: (0)
 
scottw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,632
Quote:
Originally Posted by wdmso View Post

More conspiracy theories .. so to go along with it rather than it being a Dem plot How about a Republican plot
this is accurate...trump and the republicans have encouraged and organized thousands of central americans to march to our southern border, funding them the entire way so that they can push their way across our border and demand acceptance regardless of how many others are waiting to enter the country through legal means....this will cause the base to turn out in big numbers in november, trump and the republicans will keep the house and senate, get a couple more supreme court judges and build a beautiful wall along our southern border....BRILLIANT!!!
scottw is offline  
Old 10-23-2018, 07:50 AM   #8
Jim in CT
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,428
Quote:
Originally Posted by spence View Post
How about because they’re desperate to flee violence. What would you do if it was your kids? How much Kool Aid have you drank this week?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
I can't imagine the desperation some of these people feel who are born into the worst places on the planet. But the sad fact is, we cannot come close to taking in everyone whose lives would be better here, we cannot come close to doing that. Do you agree?

What we can do, and should do, is work to make their home countries, less awful. I'm pretty sure that's what the UN was supposed to be for, maybe we can remind them of that.

Once again rather than honestly admit the facts, the left (you in this case) immediately portray those who disagree with you, as being hatemongers who have no empathy for these people. It's not remotely true. Right now, there are people waiting in line in other crappy places, waiting for their chance to come legally.
Jim in CT is offline  
Old 10-23-2018, 07:57 AM   #9
Got Stripers
Ledge Runner Baits
iTrader: (0)
 
Got Stripers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: I live in a house, but my soul is at sea.
Posts: 8,383
I think anyone believing this is a plot and organized for the mid terms has clearly been wearing a tin foil hat far too tightly. I'd also agree Mexico should be the country stepping up to offer asylum to these people.
Got Stripers is online now  
Old 10-23-2018, 08:02 AM   #10
Pete F.
Canceled
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vt
Posts: 13,067
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in CT View Post
I can't imagine the desperation some of these people feel who are born into the worst places on the planet. But the sad fact is, we cannot come close to taking in everyone whose lives would be better here, we cannot come close to doing that. Do you agree?

What we can do, and should do, is work to make their home countries, less awful. I'm pretty sure that's what the UN was supposed to be for, maybe we can remind them of that.

Once again rather than honestly admit the facts, the left (you in this case) immediately portray those who disagree with you, as being hatemongers who have no empathy for these people. It's not remotely true. Right now, there are people waiting in line in other crappy places, waiting for their chance to come legally.
@realDonaldTrump
Follow Follow @realDonaldTrump
More
Guatemala, Honduras and El Salvador were not able to do the job of stopping people from leaving their country and coming illegally to the U.S. We will now begin cutting off, or substantially reducing, the massive foreign aid routinely given to them.

5:57 AM - 22 Oct 2018

Frasier: Niles, I’ve just had the most marvelous idea for a website! People will post their opinions, cheeky bon mots, and insights, and others will reply in kind!

Niles: You have met “people”, haven’t you?

Lets Go Darwin
Pete F. is online now  
Old 10-23-2018, 08:05 AM   #11
Pete F.
Canceled
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vt
Posts: 13,067
Quote:
Originally Posted by Got Stripers View Post
I think anyone believing this is a plot and organized for the mid terms has clearly been wearing a tin foil hat far too tightly. I'd also agree Mexico should be the country stepping up to offer asylum to these people.
By taking on thousands of refugees, however, Mexico is relieving the burden on the overloaded U.S. courts. Mexico also detains large numbers of undocumented Central Americans who are not applying for refugee status here, and deports them back to their home countries. In fiscal year 2017, Mexico deported more than 94,000 Central Americans – even more than the 74,000 deported from the United States in the same time, according to figures from the Migration Policy Institute cited by the newspaper Reforma.

Frasier: Niles, I’ve just had the most marvelous idea for a website! People will post their opinions, cheeky bon mots, and insights, and others will reply in kind!

Niles: You have met “people”, haven’t you?

Lets Go Darwin
Pete F. is online now  
Old 10-23-2018, 08:23 AM   #12
Pete F.
Canceled
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vt
Posts: 13,067
Here is a fairly non partisan look at what has and is occuring in Central America and why people are fleeing.

Tens of thousands of Salvadorans, Guatemalans, and Hondurans, many of them unaccompanied minors, have arrived in the United States in recent years, seeking asylum from the region’s skyrocketing violence. Their countries, which form a region known as the Northern Triangle, were rocked by civil wars in the 1980s, leaving a legacy of violence and fragile institutions.
https://www.cfr.org/backgrounder/cen...thern-triangle

Frasier: Niles, I’ve just had the most marvelous idea for a website! People will post their opinions, cheeky bon mots, and insights, and others will reply in kind!

Niles: You have met “people”, haven’t you?

Lets Go Darwin
Pete F. is online now  
Old 10-23-2018, 08:40 AM   #13
Jim in CT
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,428
Quote:
Originally Posted by Got Stripers View Post
I think anyone believing this is a plot and organized for the mid terms has clearly been wearing a tin foil hat far too tightly. I'd also agree Mexico should be the country stepping up to offer asylum to these people.
and i think if you feel this has nothing to do with politics, you have your head in the sand. who is feeding these people along the way? i don’t see anyone carrying a months supply of food.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
Jim in CT is offline  
Old 10-23-2018, 08:47 AM   #14
Jim in CT
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,428
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete F. View Post
Here is a fairly non partisan look at what has and is occuring in Central America and why people are fleeing.

Tens of thousands of Salvadorans, Guatemalans, and Hondurans, many of them unaccompanied minors, have arrived in the United States in recent years, seeking asylum from the region’s skyrocketing violence. Their countries, which form a region known as the Northern Triangle, were rocked by civil wars in the 1980s, leaving a legacy of violence and fragile institutions.
https://www.cfr.org/backgrounder/cen...thern-triangle
no one is denying that these people need help. but what liberals
don’t seem to grasp, is that we can’t take them all. we don’t have the space or the money.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
Jim in CT is offline  
Old 10-23-2018, 08:52 AM   #15
detbuch
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 7,688
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete F. View Post
By taking on thousands of refugees, however, Mexico is relieving the burden on the overloaded U.S. courts. Mexico also detains large numbers of undocumented Central Americans who are not applying for refugee status here, and deports them back to their home countries. In fiscal year 2017, Mexico deported more than 94,000 Central Americans – even more than the 74,000 deported from the United States in the same time, according to figures from the Migration Policy Institute cited by the newspaper Reforma.
From what you say here, it is apparent that Mexico could easily send the Central American caravan back to their homes. Why does Mexico allow them in their country? I've read that sympathetic Mexicans have been helping and cheering on the growing caravan as it continues north. But their sympathy doesn't seem to extend to offering the caravan sanctuary in Mexico.
detbuch is offline  
Old 10-23-2018, 09:07 AM   #16
DZ
Registered User
iTrader: (0)
 
DZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 2,571
Regardless of whether this is plotted or not. One thing is for sure is we cannot let any of them in.

DZ
Recreational Surfcaster
"Limit Your Kill - Don't Kill Your Limit"

Bi + Ne = SB 2

If you haven't heard of the Snowstorm Blitz of 1987 - you someday will.
DZ is offline  
Old 10-23-2018, 09:11 AM   #17
Pete F.
Canceled
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vt
Posts: 13,067
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in CT View Post
and i think if you feel this has nothing to do with politics, you have your head in the sand. who is feeding these people along the way? i don’t see anyone carrying a months supply of food.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
It's pretty interesting how it started

https://www.thedailybeast.com/forget...gan?ref=scroll

Frasier: Niles, I’ve just had the most marvelous idea for a website! People will post their opinions, cheeky bon mots, and insights, and others will reply in kind!

Niles: You have met “people”, haven’t you?

Lets Go Darwin
Pete F. is online now  
Old 10-23-2018, 09:25 AM   #18
Pete F.
Canceled
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vt
Posts: 13,067
Quote:
Originally Posted by DZ View Post
Regardless of whether this is plotted or not. One thing is for sure is we cannot let any of them in.
We could not conform with international law and treaties and domestic law. There is likely nothing the rest of the world could or would do.
But if we want to live in a world where our word and the rule of law is important, not following laws and negotiated agreements is not a good precendent.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-a7552621.html

Frasier: Niles, I’ve just had the most marvelous idea for a website! People will post their opinions, cheeky bon mots, and insights, and others will reply in kind!

Niles: You have met “people”, haven’t you?

Lets Go Darwin
Pete F. is online now  
Old 10-23-2018, 09:33 AM   #19
Cool Beans
Registered User
iTrader: (0)
 
Cool Beans's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,044
Or we could just invite these hell hole countries to become new states. Then they wouldn't have to walk thousands of miles to vote.

If Guatemala and Honduras were US states, the automotive and other big industry could open factories there (in the US) paying a decent wage. If the hell holes cannot evolve into not hell holes, this problem will never end.
Cool Beans is offline  
Old 10-23-2018, 09:46 AM   #20
The Dad Fisherman
Super Moderator
iTrader: (0)
 
The Dad Fisherman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Georgetown MA
Posts: 18,177
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete F. View Post
We could not conform with international law and treaties and domestic law. There is likely nothing the rest of the world could or would do.
But if we want to live in a world where our word and the rule of law is important, not following laws and negotiated agreements is not a good precendent.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-a7552621.html
"That said, a person cannot claim asylum unless they are on US soil."

that's the key, they have to be here to claim it. It's not a violation to not grant it if they aren't here.

"If you're arguing with an idiot, make sure he isn't doing the same thing."
The Dad Fisherman is offline  
Old 10-23-2018, 09:55 AM   #21
DZ
Registered User
iTrader: (0)
 
DZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 2,571
Yep - they are safe in Mexico - otherwise they would have never taken the chance to March through it. The precedent we definitely don't want to set is letting them in. They can request permission and wait their turn - in Mexico. This is Mexico's problem.

DZ
Recreational Surfcaster
"Limit Your Kill - Don't Kill Your Limit"

Bi + Ne = SB 2

If you haven't heard of the Snowstorm Blitz of 1987 - you someday will.
DZ is offline  
Old 10-23-2018, 10:04 AM   #22
Pete F.
Canceled
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vt
Posts: 13,067
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman View Post
"That said, a person cannot claim asylum unless they are on US soil."

that's the key, they have to be here to claim it. It's not a violation to not grant it if they aren't here.
So if Mexico ignores treaties and laws it doesn’t count?
Or are you suggesting that like Don the Con’s good friend in North Korea, Central American countries should prevent their citizens from leaving?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Frasier: Niles, I’ve just had the most marvelous idea for a website! People will post their opinions, cheeky bon mots, and insights, and others will reply in kind!

Niles: You have met “people”, haven’t you?

Lets Go Darwin
Pete F. is online now  
Old 10-23-2018, 10:15 AM   #23
The Dad Fisherman
Super Moderator
iTrader: (0)
 
The Dad Fisherman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Georgetown MA
Posts: 18,177
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete F. View Post
So if Mexico ignores treaties and laws it doesn’t count?
Or are you suggesting that like Don the Con’s good friend in North Korea, Central American countries should prevent their citizens from leaving?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
Well, There's some serious word twisting there.

They can leave any country they want. I'm suggesting that the US not allowing them in isn't violating any International Law. No More, No Less

"If you're arguing with an idiot, make sure he isn't doing the same thing."
The Dad Fisherman is offline  
Old 10-23-2018, 10:19 AM   #24
scottw
Registered User
iTrader: (0)
 
scottw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,632
Quote:
Originally Posted by DZ View Post
Regardless of whether this is plotted or not. One thing is for sure is we cannot let any of them in.
I don't know...I'm thinking we have the military meet them at the border and airlift them to one of the many sanctuary cities and then cut off all federal aid to sanctuary cities and let them figure it out WIN....WIN
scottw is offline  
Old 10-23-2018, 10:20 AM   #25
Got Stripers
Ledge Runner Baits
iTrader: (0)
 
Got Stripers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: I live in a house, but my soul is at sea.
Posts: 8,383
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in CT View Post
and i think if you feel this has nothing to do with politics, you have your head in the sand. who is feeding these people along the way? i don’t see anyone carrying a months supply of food.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
If anyone's feeding them, it's likely the Mexican government, hoping they stay strong and truck right on thru to the US border so they don't have to deal with them.
Got Stripers is online now  
Old 10-23-2018, 10:29 AM   #26
Pete F.
Canceled
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vt
Posts: 13,067
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman View Post
Well, There's some serious word twisting there.

They can leave any country they want. I'm suggesting that the US not allowing them in isn't violating any International Law. No More, No Less
International law set by several treaties we signed and ratified says that if a person on your soil applies for refugee status, you have to deal with it (it's more complicated than that, of course) not that you have to grant it.
So is what you are suggesting, much like the boatloads of refugees crossing the Mediteranian to Europe, perhaps swimming the Rio Grande or boatloads in the Caribean to other parts of the US would be preferable to walking up to the border?

Frasier: Niles, I’ve just had the most marvelous idea for a website! People will post their opinions, cheeky bon mots, and insights, and others will reply in kind!

Niles: You have met “people”, haven’t you?

Lets Go Darwin
Pete F. is online now  
Old 10-23-2018, 10:38 AM   #27
Pete F.
Canceled
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vt
Posts: 13,067
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottw View Post
I don't know...I'm thinking we have the military meet them at the border and airlift them to one of the many sanctuary cities and then cut off all federal aid to sanctuary cities and let them figure it out WIN....WIN
Perhaps the 5th largest GDP in the world would say ok and cut off their aid to the federal government.

Frasier: Niles, I’ve just had the most marvelous idea for a website! People will post their opinions, cheeky bon mots, and insights, and others will reply in kind!

Niles: You have met “people”, haven’t you?

Lets Go Darwin
Pete F. is online now  
Old 10-23-2018, 10:44 AM   #28
scottw
Registered User
iTrader: (0)
 
scottw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,632
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete F. View Post
International law set by ....
so you want to let them all in Pete?
scottw is offline  
Old 10-23-2018, 11:10 AM   #29
DZ
Registered User
iTrader: (0)
 
DZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 2,571
This will be a very complex national emergency. By law it will come down to the governors of each border state to ask for federal assistance and the Posse Comitatus Act.
Here is a good article outlining scenarios of what could happen.
https://www.justsecurity.org/54529/m...key-takeaways/

DZ
Recreational Surfcaster
"Limit Your Kill - Don't Kill Your Limit"

Bi + Ne = SB 2

If you haven't heard of the Snowstorm Blitz of 1987 - you someday will.
DZ is offline  
Old 10-23-2018, 11:14 AM   #30
FishermanTim
Registered User
iTrader: (0)
 
FishermanTim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Hyde Park, MA
Posts: 4,152
They are either the smartest or the dumbest bulbs in the pack.

Choosing to make the trek as the weather gets colder?

Either play to public sympathy or take on public ridicule.....

I am a legend in my own mind!
FishermanTim is offline  
 

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:56 PM.


Powered by vBulletin. Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Please use all necessary and proper safety precautions. STAY SAFE Striper Talk Forums
Copyright 1998-20012 Striped-Bass.com