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| Political Threads This section is for Political Threads - Enter at your own risk. If you say you don't want to see what someone posts - don't read it :hihi: |
09-25-2019, 07:19 PM
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#2
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: RI
Posts: 21,182
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in CT
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Dig deeper Jim.
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09-25-2019, 07:46 PM
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#3
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 7,688
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
Dig deeper Jim.
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09-25-2019, 08:27 PM
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#4
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Canceled
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vt
Posts: 13,069
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Senator Sasse (R-NE) after reading the whistleblower complaint: "...Republicans ought not to be rushing to circle the wagons to say there’s no there there when there’s obviously lots that’s very troubling there..."
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09-25-2019, 08:31 PM
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#5
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Canceled
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vt
Posts: 13,069
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Here’s a hint
Nobody protects a bully
As soon as the Republican Senators think their chances are better with Trump gone, he is
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09-25-2019, 08:32 PM
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#6
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,428
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pete, read my original post, and comment on it?
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09-25-2019, 08:40 PM
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#7
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Canceled
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vt
Posts: 13,069
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in CT
pete, read my original post, and comment on it?
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What do the Simpsons have to do with Trump?
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Frasier: Niles, I’ve just had the most marvelous idea for a website! People will post their opinions, cheeky bon mots, and insights, and others will reply in kind!
Niles: You have met “people”, haven’t you?
Lets Go Darwin
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09-25-2019, 08:59 PM
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#8
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Canceled
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vt
Posts: 13,069
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in CT
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From the WAPO article that the Daily Wire cites
On Tuesday, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) announced that Congress will initiate a formal impeachment inquiry over the Ukraine episode, a move Joe Biden endorsed in a speech, declaring, “It’s time for the Congress to fully investigate the conduct of this president.” Such an investigation will be far more damaging for Biden than the president. It will keep the story of Biden’s conflict of interest in the news through the 2020 election. Millions of Americans will learn the word “Burisma.” Senate Republicans can demand that Hunter Biden testify, and subpoena Obama White House aides such as Hochstein to explain under oath what the vice president knew and when he knew it.
Sounds like Biden isn’t scared.
Trump put his priorities in front of the countries and violated the oath of office he took.
Forget the whatabouts, no one else is President.
Watch the presser and look at Zelensky’s face when Trump #^&#^&#^&#^&s him. Do you think the rest of the world didn’t see that for what it was? Or are you that blind to what Putin’s Puppet is doing?
“I really hope that Russia—because I really believe that President Putin would like to do something—I really hope that you and President Putin can get together and solve your problem,” Trump said at the United Nations on Wednesday, as Zelensky sat stone-faced. “That would be a tremendous achievement, and I know that you’re trying to do that.”
“You’ve really made some progress with Russia,” Trump added, telling Zelensky that “it’d be nice to end that whole disaster.”
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Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device |
Frasier: Niles, I’ve just had the most marvelous idea for a website! People will post their opinions, cheeky bon mots, and insights, and others will reply in kind!
Niles: You have met “people”, haven’t you?
Lets Go Darwin
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09-25-2019, 09:05 PM
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#9
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Libtardia
Posts: 21,557
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It is impeachable to ask a foreign government to interfere in an election. Which is what happened.
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09-25-2019, 09:10 PM
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#10
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,428
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete F.
From the WAPO article that the Daily Wire cites
On Tuesday, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) announced that Congress will initiate a formal impeachment inquiry over the Ukraine episode, a move Joe Biden endorsed in a speech, declaring, “It’s time for the Congress to fully investigate the conduct of this president.” Such an investigation will be far more damaging for Biden than the president. It will keep the story of Biden’s conflict of interest in the news through the 2020 election. Millions of Americans will learn the word “Burisma.” Senate Republicans can demand that Hunter Biden testify, and subpoena Obama White House aides such as Hochstein to explain under oath what the vice president knew and when he knew it.
Sounds like Biden isn’t scared.
Trump put his priorities in front of the countries and violated the oath of office he took.
Forget the whatabouts, no one else is President.
Watch the presser and look at Zelensky’s face when Trump #^&#^&#^&#^&s him. Do you think the rest of the world didn’t see that for what it was? Or are you that blind to what Putin’s Puppet is doing?
“I really hope that Russia—because I really believe that President Putin would like to do something—I really hope that you and President Putin can get together and solve your problem,” Trump said at the United Nations on Wednesday, as Zelensky sat stone-faced. “That would be a tremendous achievement, and I know that you’re trying to do that.”
“You’ve really made some progress with Russia,” Trump added, telling Zelensky that “it’d be nice to end that whole disaster.”
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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For the third time, why is it wrong for Trump to ask Ukraine to investigate his adversaries, but not for democrats in teh US Senate? Can't find a 10,000 word piece written by someone else to explain the naked double standrad there? |
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09-25-2019, 09:13 PM
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#11
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,428
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nebe
It is impeachable to ask a foreign government to interfere in an election. Which is what happened.
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Much of what they do, Nebe, is to help themselves politically.
When Obama told the Russian official who wanted to work on missile dfeense, to wait until after the election because Obama was afraid that what he planned to do would hurt hos chances at re-election, that's different? Obama asked a Russian official wo hold off on working on a project together, to help influence Obama's next election. After that election, Obama told the guy he'd have mre flexibility. That was OK. |
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09-25-2019, 09:26 PM
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#12
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Libtardia
Posts: 21,557
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Buuutobaaama
Please.
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09-25-2019, 09:28 PM
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#13
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 7,688
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nebe
Buuutobaaama
Please.
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What Jim is pointing out is called precedent. Or, in more common lingo, what goes around comes around. |
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09-25-2019, 09:37 PM
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#14
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Libtardia
Posts: 21,557
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it’s coming round all right.
The clown car is coming round the bend and pence can’t wait to take the wheel.
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09-25-2019, 09:41 PM
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#15
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 7,688
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nebe
it’s coming round all right.
The clown car is coming round the bend and pence can’t wait to take the wheel.
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Deep |
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09-26-2019, 06:23 AM
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#16
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,428
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nebe
Buuutobaaama
Please.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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please explain he difference between what obama
did, and what trump did.
in both cases, the president asked a foreign government for a policy favor which would
benefit him politically.
the difference i see, is that obama did it more blatantly, as he explicitly mentioned the consequences to his upcoming election.
take out your obama tampon, and tell me why what trump did is impeachable, but not what obama
did?
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09-26-2019, 06:24 AM
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#17
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,428
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nebe
it’s coming round all right.
The clown car is coming round the bend and pence can’t wait to take the wheel.
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how many times have you said this since 2017?
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09-26-2019, 06:35 AM
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#18
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Canceled
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vt
Posts: 13,069
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Telling someone you don’t want to discuss a possible policy till after you are elected is the same as telling someone who you are withholding aid from to “do me a favor” and look into Biden etc. We will have a great relationship yada yada
The difference is the latter is indictable.
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09-26-2019, 06:42 AM
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#19
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,632
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in CT
how many times have you said this since 2017?
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he's a great predicterator |
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09-26-2019, 06:56 AM
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#20
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,428
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete F.
Telling someone you don’t want to discuss a possible policy till after you are elected is the same as telling someone who you are withholding aid from to “do me a favor” and look into Biden etc. We will have a great relationship yada yada
The difference is the latter is indictable.
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both men asked foreign governments to take policy action which would benefit them politically. is that true or false?
when george w bush got a coalition of nations to help us in Iraq, that helped him politically. should he have been impeached because he asked foreign governments do something, which had the benefit of helping him politically?
for every talking head who says it’s impeachable, there’s someone who says it isn’t. it’s not anything close to objective or factual.
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09-26-2019, 07:24 AM
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#21
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Ledge Runner Baits
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: I live in a house, but my soul is at sea.
Posts: 8,393
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Quote:
Originally Posted by detbuch
What Jim is pointing out is called precedent. Or, in more common lingo, what goes around comes around.
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What Mr. Our Fore Fathers intentions need to be preserved thinks we can now bend their rules, say it isn’t so🤮
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09-26-2019, 07:31 AM
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#22
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,428
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Got Stripers
What Mr. Our Fore Fathers intentions need to be preserved thinks we can now bend their rules, say it isn’t so🤮
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obama asked the russians to help him politically. democrats senators asked the ukraine to investigate trump. did those bother you?
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09-26-2019, 07:43 AM
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#23
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Certifiable Intertidal Anguiologist
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Somewhere between OOB & west of Watch Hill
Posts: 34,970
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete F.
Telling someone you don’t want to discuss a possible policy till after you are elected is the same as telling someone who you are withholding aid from to “do me a favor” and look into Biden etc. We will have a great relationship yada yada
The difference is the latter is indictable.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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Highlighted: The reason that is highlighted is due to how fast CNN twisting facts goes viral.
CNN on video uses the first part of the quote where Trump asks "to do a favor" and then CNN states that Trump is asking Zelensky to look into Biden. But the Transcript shows Trump asking Zelensky to look into Crowdstrike (which has its own issues) and the DNC server from 2016. |
~Fix the Bait~ ~Pogies Forever~
Striped Bass Fishing - All Stripers
Kobayashi Maru Election - there is no way to win.
Apocalypse is Coming:
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09-26-2019, 07:54 AM
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#24
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Ledge Runner Baits
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: I live in a house, but my soul is at sea.
Posts: 8,393
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Hearing exurbs from the whistle blower complaint is really damning, you better circle those red wagons closer, this is going to be fun watching Trump and Rudy implode. I have no doubt the witch hunt and presidential harassment lines will be flying on the steps of the White House and in this board.
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09-26-2019, 08:14 AM
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#25
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: RI
Posts: 21,182
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09-26-2019, 08:44 AM
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#26
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,428
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Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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09-26-2019, 08:44 AM
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#27
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,428
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
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which you’ve said how many times before, which turned out to be zip?
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09-26-2019, 09:00 AM
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#28
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Libtardia
Posts: 21,557
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This raised my eyebrows. I copied this from a wall street journal article from this morning. -
The whistleblower complaint alleges that there was an effort within the White House in the days following the July 25 call with Mr. Zelensky to “lock down” all records related to it, “especially the word-for-word transcript of the call that was produced” by the White House Situation Room. White House officials told the complainant they had been “directed” by White House lawyers to remove the electronic transcript from the computer system that stores those transcripts and allows for distribution to Cabinet-level officials, the report staid.
“This set of actions underscored to me that White House officials understood the gravity of what had transpired in the call,” the complaint said.
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09-26-2019, 09:02 AM
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#29
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Canceled
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vt
Posts: 13,069
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnR
Highlighted: The reason that is highlighted is due to how fast CNN twisting facts goes viral.
CNN on video uses the first part of the quote where Trump asks "to do a favor" and then CNN states that Trump is asking Zelensky to look into Biden. But the Transcript shows Trump asking Zelensky to look into Crowdstrike (which has its own issues) and the DNC server from 2016.
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John, I edited that to make it shorter, likely CNN did the same.
There is no "smoking gun" here, nor does there need to be.
There are three main issues that stand out regarding the Memo and Trump's behavior
1. The question of a possible quid pro quo.
Days before the call, Trump ordered his acting chief of staff, Mick Mulvaney, to freeze a substantial package of military aid to Ukraine—a move that reportedly baffled and concerned officials in both the State and Defense Departments. Now consider how Trump sets the stage for his conversation with Zelensky by framing the U.S.-Ukrainian relationship in terms of reciprocity, suggesting that “the United States has been very good to Ukraine” but Ukraine may not have adequately reciprocated.
Thus when Zelensky comes in with his ask—for the president’s support for Ukrainian efforts to acquire defensive equipment from the United States—Trump is ready. He immediately pivots to an ask of his own, telling Zelensky that “I would like you to do us a favor though[.]”
But the favor in question is not a policy favor for the United States. It’s a political favor for Trump. This is where Trump raises the issue of Crowdstrike, asking Zelensky to “find out what happened with this whole situation with Ukraine.” Recall that the conspiracy theory regarding Crowdstrike involves casting doubt on whether Russia really hacked the DNC and, thus, on whether Russia interfered in the 2016 election at all. Trump appears to be asking for Zelensky’s help in amplifying this theory—which supports Trump’s understanding of the Mueller probe as a “Witch Hunt”—and finding evidence to support it. His request for a “favor”—immediately after Zelensky references a prospective purchase—is easily understood as the president’s connecting the U.S.’s provision of defensive equipment to Zelinsky’s willingness to assist Barr on a matter of personal concern to the president.
2. The clear evidence that the president solicited the Ukrainian president to deliver dirt on U.S. persons in a gross abuse of their civil liberties.
3. A clear attempt at soliciting foreign government intervention in a U.S. presidential campaign.
When Zelensky responds positively, stating that “all the investigations will be done openly and candidly,” Trump digs in further with another request: “[W]hatever you can do with the Attorney General would be great,” he says, pushing Zelensky to commit to investigating Hunter Biden and Joe Biden. He requests repeatedly that Zelensky speak to Giuliani, who at this time was publicly calling for the Ukrainians to investigate the Bidens.
To really understand the issues, a look at the timeline and the actors involved is needed. Lawfare did a timeline that looks to be complete.
https://www.lawfareblog.com/timeline...kraine-scandal |
Frasier: Niles, I’ve just had the most marvelous idea for a website! People will post their opinions, cheeky bon mots, and insights, and others will reply in kind!
Niles: You have met “people”, haven’t you?
Lets Go Darwin
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09-26-2019, 09:05 AM
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#30
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,428
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so doing an investigation when there’s obvious evidence of Biden nepotism, is nothing more than getting dirt.
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