Is Pelosi a liar or a lunatic?

[Jim in CT]

In her last press conference as speaker of the house, Nancy Pelosi said this...

"Deficit reduction has been a high priority for us. It is our mantra, pay-as-you-go. Unfortunately, that will be changed now. "

Deficit reduction has been the mantra of this Congress? During her 4 years as speaker, the federal deficit increased by $5 trillion. She added FOUR BILLION DOLLARS A DAY to the deficit, and then she stands there with a straight face and says that deficit reduction was her mantra?

She is either a liar, or she is a lunatic. There is no third option. This woman keeps getting elected every 2 years, and at one point was third in line for the presidency. This is one of the leaders of the liberal movement.

Yep, those liberal Democrats are very fiscally responsible. Next, they'll claim to be the champions of the unborn...

How will Spence come to her rescue, I wonder?

[Nebe]

Pay as you go? Lolz
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

[RIJIMMY]

Jim -
a brief view into my journey from liberal (or so I thought) to conservative.
Living in San Francisco, Im in my mid 20s. Most of my friends are dead head, hippy types. One Saturday they're on their way to a protest, i was hanging at their house. they were goign to protest the imprisonment of mumia jamal, a rasta type guy arested for shooting a cop. I pressed them on why he should be released. They go round and round about racism, blah, blah, blah. But I kept asking did he or didnt he shoot a cop? Rounds and rounds of nonsense and no one could explain if he did or didnt shoot a cop. My point is that this type of self inflated rightousness is what makes true liberals thrive. They have a battle that most are too ignorant to understand. Pelosi is in that vein.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by RIJIMMY

Jim -
a brief view into my journey from liberal (or so I thought) to conservative.
Living in San Francisco, Im in my mid 20s. Most of my friends are dead head, hippy types. One Saturday they're on their way to a protest, i was hanging at their house. they were goign to protest the imprisonment of mumia jamal, a rasta type guy arested for shooting a cop. I pressed them on why he should be released. They go round and round about racism, blah, blah, blah. But I kept asking did he or didnt he shoot a cop? Rounds and rounds of nonsense and no one could explain if he did or didnt shoot a cop. My point is that this type of self inflated rightousness is what makes true liberals thrive. They have a battle that most are too ignorant to understand. Pelosi is in that vein.

You are right of course, and that's why I say liberalism is a mental disorder. There is no other explanation.

I know all about Abu Mumia Jamal. I actually met Ed Asner once, and he is one of those Hollywood celebrities who thinks Mumia Jamal should be freed and made a hero. I asked the fat slob if he knew of any exculpatory evidence, or any issues of unfairness during the trial, and he couldn't think of anything. He was committed to the cause of freeing Abu Jamal, yet he had no idea why he should be behind that cause.

Abu Jamal didn't just shoot a cop, he killed a cop. In France, I swear to God, they made him (Abu Jamal) an honorary citizen. They bestowed an honor on a convicted cop-killer.

This is why I get nasty in some of these posts, I have no patience for these people anymore. I know some honest, fair, thoughtful liberals, but not many. Most liberals I know are of the brainwashed, thoughtless, intellectually dishonest type (you almost need to fit that description to buy into that agenda), completely unable to articulate why their ideas are better than conservative ideas, yet more than willing to attack conservatives...

[RIJIMMY]

crazy

[Nebe]

There are crazy right wingers as well..
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

[fishbones]

Originally Posted by Nebe

There are crazy right wingers as well..
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Crazy doesn't have a party affiliation. It runs ramant through society.

Why can't Pelosi be both a lunatic and a liar? I hate having to make tough decisions like having to pick just one thing when both options are fitting.

[RIJIMMY]

Originally Posted by Nebe

There are crazy right wingers as well..
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

true. But I think the crazy left is more mainstream, if that makes sense. I dont know any bible thumping right wingers but know plenty of looney lefties. Might just be cuz I live in MA.

[RIROCKHOUND]

Originally Posted by RIJIMMY

true. But I think the crazy left is more mainstream, if that makes sense. I dont know any bible thumping right wingers but know plenty of looney lefties. Might just be cuz I live in MA.

Bingo.
I spent a summer in western Virgina as an undegrad, and the ratio was flipped the otherway.

[Nebe]

Originally Posted by RIJIMMY

true. But I think the crazy left is more mainstream, if that makes sense. I dont know any bible thumping right wingers but know plenty of looney lefties. Might just be cuz I live in MA.

As hound said... Go south and go to the Midwest.
Git er done.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by Nebe

There are crazy right wingers as well..
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

I agree, I never said that conservatives have a monopoly on virtue.

But someone (Spence, RIRockhound) please tell me when one of the top 5 conservative politicians in the country, said something that obviously crazy and false. I can't think of anything, I just cannot. If John Boehner had a press conference and said "affirmative action is the mantra of the republican party", he would correctly be labeled as a lunatic and he would be rightly expelled from public service.

Some may say Bush was that wrong when he concluded that Iraq had WMD's, but a LOT of people agreed with Bush at that time. No one on the planet earth believes that there is a shred of truth to what Pelosi said. She is truly bizarre, and I submit that someone that disconnected from reality would not get elected speaker of the house as a republican.

Who will be the next Democratic speaker? John Hinkley?

[RIJIMMY]

Originally Posted by Nebe

As hound said... Go south and go to the Midwest.
Git er done.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

that and the awesome barbecue, I may just do it!

[PaulS]

If someone pledges to eliminate 100 billion from this year's budget are they a lunitic, a liar or just disconnected from reality?

[RIJIMMY]

Originally Posted by PaulS

If someone pledges to eliminate 100 billion from this year's budget are they a lunitic, a liar or just disconnected from reality?

They're someone that will move this country in the right direction. The journey of a thousand miles begins with a first step.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by PaulS

If someone pledges to eliminate 100 billion from this year's budget are they a lunitic, a liar or just disconnected from reality?

None of the above. Why?

[FishermanTim]

I think the third choice would be BOTH!

[Raven]

can't be both ...thats way to complex a title for her

she's a lying lunatic

[stcroixman]

Originally Posted by Nebe

There are crazy right wingers as well..
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Very true. Now they will be front and center and Pelosi won't be.

In the end - what about we the people? We vote and can't ever seem to get what we want or need. Too many special interests seem to influence all these polititcians.

Everyone knows we have Deficit issues and Economic issues and the new congress is targeting health insurance like the old congress did.

Why not cut the corporate tax and bring some jobs back to the USA?

[PaulS]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

None of the above. Why?

Well the Repubs. have 360 days to reduce this year's budget by the $100 billion that I heard they proposed. If not, then they'd have to be one of the 3 right? I think that they have already suggested $30 million - still a ways to go.

[Raven]

Originally Posted by stcroixman

Why not cut the corporate tax and bring some jobs back to the USA?

Excellent Idea in theory
but the corporate greed will prevail

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by PaulS

Well the Repubs. have 360 days to reduce this year's budget by the $100 billion that I heard they proposed. If not, then they'd have to be one of the 3 right? I think that they have already suggested $30 million - still a ways to go.

If the GOP says they'll try to reduce the deficit, and they try but Obama vetoes all legislation (for example) they wouldn't be any of those things.

If the GOP votes repeatedly to increase the deficit, and they still claim that their mantra was lowering the deficit, then they are one of the above. Pelosi is inarguably in one of those buckets. Time will tell if the GOP is any better. I don't see how they could be worse.

So Paul, you responded to my query by criticizing the GOP on their very first day. How about giving them a chance? And what do you say about Pelosi?

[justplugit]

Originally Posted by PaulS

Well the Repubs. have 360 days to reduce this year's budget by the $100 billion that I heard they proposed. If not, then they'd have to be one of the 3 right? I think that they have already suggested $30 million - still a ways to go.

Ya, what gives, they've already been in control of the House, for what 7 hours now.

[striperman36]

She's a nutjob. but most of them are so detached from their constituency that they have no clue what people really want.

Let them spend more time back home and have friggin web conferences.

JohnnyD can get the biz to set them up.

[JohnnyD]

Originally Posted by striperman36

JohnnyD can get the biz to set them up.

[spence]

Originally Posted by striperman36

She's a nutjob. but most of them are so detached from their constituency that they have no clue what people really want.

While I'm not a fan of her personally, one can't deny that on paper she's been a very effective Speaker.

And if you'd care to compare her to her peers, the other note worthy Speakers in the past few administrations, you have Tom Delay who was just convicted of money laundering in a Federal court and Newt Gingrich who was fined $300,000 and reprimanded for violating House Rules.

JUST IN CASE ANY OF YOU HAVE FORGOTTEN

What first struct me about Jim's post was that it mentioned "deficit" rather than "debt". I did a quick Google and noticed that most of the posts contained this error.

It did find it quite ironic that people who purport to be so fiscally minded wouldn't notice and correct this simple mistake.

While I'd say it was a silly comment to make, I do remember reading number of stories about Dems in the House pushing pay as you go. Not that they were very effective at actually implementing it.

Let's be real though and remember that the biggest reason we have a gigantic deficit today is because of bloated Bush spending that isn't being funded because of tax revenue short falls from the recession.

Obama has most certainly added to the problem (although when you take the Stimulus out of the equation not really that much, and I'd wager a months pay that McCain as President would have done exactly the same thing) but some reviews even by Harvard Business Review have limited the exposure by Obama to only about 15%.

The Net: Deficit (and debt) are a huge issue and Pelosi's comment was stupid and probably meant to provoke. But I don't think she's crazy and our balance sheet needs to be put in perspective.

The new House is going to have a bitch of a time actually following through on their promises. They still have to work with the Senate and Obama and there's still a cashflow issue at the IRS.

-spence

[detbuch]

Originally Posted by spence

Let's be real though and remember that the biggest reason we have a gigantic deficit today is because of bloated Bush spending that isn't being funded because of tax revenue short falls from the recession.

-spence

Isn't that the beauty of tax revenue shortfalls? There is no money to fund bloated spending. Doesn't this argue for spending cuts rather than tax increases as the method to reduce the deficit? Raising taxes will just pay for bloated spending. Parkinson's second law--expenditures always rise to meet income.

[spence]

Originally Posted by detbuch

Isn't that the beauty of tax revenue shortfalls? There is no money to fund bloated spending. Doesn't this argue for spending cuts rather than tax increases as the method to reduce the deficit? Raising taxes will just pay for bloated spending. Parkinson's second law--expenditures always rise to meet income.

I think this is true to a point, but am not sure the problem of the national debt can be solved with spending cuts alone over the next decade. This certainly seemed to be the opinion of the debt commission who know a hell of a lot more about this than I do (one would hope).

That being said, I do see wisdom in the Conservative idea that if the money is there it will get spent. This is as true as extra cash in your pocket or that tub of ice cream in the freezer (i.e. human nature). The key is restraint, and why I think most people don't trust either party, they're looking for responsibility which has been in short supply regardless of who's in charge of the pocket book.

-spence

[Chesapeake Bill]

Being from the area where Nancy grew up and knowing the family (and unfortunately Nancy) pretty well I can say that she is not crazy. She is, however, a part of the political machine in Maryland that, like the Kennedy family in Mass, has a stranglehold for years and maintains close ties. Nancy is the daughter of Tommy D'Alesandro, Jr. (Former Congressman) and brother of Tommy the 3rd. Both Tommy's were former mayors of Baltimore and powerful within the MD Democratic party. When Nancy lost the speaker's position Steny Hoyer (D-MD) was in line to become the Minotrity Leader. However, there was some sort of a deal cut to keep Nancy as Leader and put Steny as the Whip.

Crazy? No. Sly like a fox and out of touch? Yes.

[Jim in CT]

Spence -

"And if you'd care to compare her to her peers..."

Ah, the classic idiot (and Spence, you are now an undeniable idiot) response to proof that their heroes are in fact liars...you justify their bad behavior by pointing to other bad behavior. Instead of discussing the issue at hand, you point to bad behavior on the other side. That tactic would only have merit (and it most definitely has no merit) if I claimed that the GOP never had any lapses. Since I never said any such thing, Spence's point has no relevence whatsoever.

My point, Spence, is that we need a new breed of politician. I'm an independent, I say throw 'em all out and get people in there who truly see themselves as public servants.

Spence, you are the most predictable, boring, unoriginal thinker on this board. Everyone here knows exactly what you're going to say before you say it.

"I do remember reading number of stories about Dems in the House pushing pay as you go. Not that they were very effective at actually implementing it."

During the 4 years the Dems controlled the legislature, they added $5 trillion to the debt. Spence sums that up by saying they "weren't effective" at pay-as-you-go. That's like saying the maiden voyage of the Titanic "wasn't effective" at iceberg avoidance, but other than that, the voyage was a success.

"the biggest reason we have a gigantic deficit today is because of bloated Bush spending that isn't being funded because of tax revenue short falls from the recession. "

Ah, blame Bush. Spence, how many more years will you blame Bush for everything, before you conclude that dog don't hunt no more? Spence, even IF what you say is true (that most of the debt is a result of Bush's actions, not Obama's), please remember that Obama has only been in office 2 years. Did Bush add as much to the debt in any 2 year-period as Obama has in the last 2 years? I dodn't know, and I'm not sure I particluarly care. The issue in this post is the lunacy involved in Pelosi suggesting that deficit reduction has been her mantra.

"Obama has most certainly added to the problem (although when you take the Stimulus out of the equation not really that much,"

Spence, the cost of the healthcare legislation doesn't kick in for a few more years...nice dodge there. Here is what Spence is saying..."if you ignore all the money that Obama has actually spent, then he really hasn't spent that much..."

"I don't think she's crazy"

Then do you think she's a liar?? If she's not crazy, and she's not a liar, how could she claim that deficit reduction has been their mantra?

"The new House is going to have a bitch of a time actually following through on their promises. They still have to work with the Senate and Obama "

Oh, I see. And if the Democrats (Obama and in the Senate) block what the House republicans try to do, then will you, Spence, call them the party of "no"?

Spence, you don't need to reply to any of my posts anymore. Whatever I post, I'll assume your response is either...

(1) Bush stole the election!

(2) No blood for oil!

(3) it's Bush's fault!

(4) maybe the Democrats are bad, but the Republicans are worse!

Since everything you say is an elaboration on one of those points, you need not bother.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by spence

they're looking for responsibility which has been in short supply regardless of who's in charge of the pocket book.

-spence

And Spence, look up WHICH PARTY has controlled the purse strings (meaning, which party controlled the legislature, not the White House) since January 2006.