Gun Legislation

[Slipknot]

Your right to defend yourself is a God given right.
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[wdmso]

I just find it funny republicans are now considering better background checks... are they that afraid of Trump? or anything to make themselves look normal.. ask yourselves why now?

[Sea Dangles]

Originally Posted by Slipknot

Your right to defend yourself is a God given right.
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Truth
Just not sure god wants us shooting each other.
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[wdmso]

Originally Posted by Slipknot

Your right to defend yourself is a God given right.
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Then i guess to seek the reduction of the sales of miltary assault style weapon. Would be my god given right to defend my self and my family. Simple
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[JohnR]

Originally Posted by wdmso

Then i guess to seek the reduction of the sales of miltary assault style weapon. Would be my god given right to defend my self and my family. Simple
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You can use any legal means necessary to protect your family. And if you have to - beyond that I guess. I don't want YOU limiting my options from me. I can assure you I am Zero threat to your family or any other family.

[scottw]

looks like the Clinton's got another one...

[Pete F.]

Is it worth this to you?

“My son’s first day of Kindergarten included an active shooter lockdown drill this morning.

He’s five years old and that is what he will always remember from his first day of elementary school.“
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[The Dad Fisherman]

Originally Posted by Pete F.

Is it worth this to you?

“My son’s first day of Kindergarten included an active shooter lockdown drill this morning.

He’s five years old and that is what he will always remember from his first day of elementary school.“
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Boo-f u cking-hoo

tis better to shelter in place than shelter for life

[wdmso]

Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman

Boo-f u cking-hoo

tis better to shelter in place than shelter for life

it would be better if it didn't have to be done at all

but what ever it takes so people can buy what ever gun they want classic

[The Dad Fisherman]

Originally Posted by wdmso

it would be better if it didn't have to be done at all

but what ever it takes so people can buy what ever gun they want classic

2 things you can always count on.

Talk about immigration laws and you’ll eventually be called a racist, and talk about 2a law and you’ll eventually be accused of not caring about children.

Always leads to productive dialogue
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[wdmso]

Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman

2 things you can always count on.

Talk about immigration laws and you’ll eventually be called a racist, and talk about 2a law and you’ll eventually be accused of not caring about children.

Always leads to productive dialogue
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and things you can always count on is the rights willingness to ignore how they go about getting their message out (its an invasion or telling kindergarteners Boo-f u cking-hoo .) then act surprised when others respond negatively

[scottw]

Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman

Boo-f u cking-hoo

tis better to shelter in place than shelter for life

they had a drag queen reading to the kindergarteners at the library here the other day...I bet that was much more terrifying

[Sea Dangles]

I don’t think he acted surprised Wayne.
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[wdmso]

Originally Posted by Sea Dangles

I don’t think he acted surprised Wayne.
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your right I should have said indignant..

[The Dad Fisherman]

Originally Posted by wdmso

your right I should have said indignant..

Then you would have been correct
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[Sea Dangles]

Who thinks they can own any weapon they want?
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[JohnR]

Originally Posted by wdmso

this is bigger than MH issues which is a fraction of the issue

the majority of guns used in crimes are legally purchased but are stolen and not reported and with no digital data base near impossible to trace them back to an owner

The MH issues are the people shooting things up.

[afterhours]

Originally Posted by JohnR

The MH issues are the people shooting things up.

Bingo.
What is bigger than MH issues? If there were no MH issues this thread would NOT exist.

[afterhours]

So if AR's and AK's are banned and shootings are not reduced by any significant amount - what's next?

[spence]

Originally Posted by afterhours

So if AR's and AK's are banned and shootings are not reduced by any significant amount - what's next?

I think it's more about comprehensive reform -- not just banning one type of weapon -- and a willingness to see things through long haul.

[scottw]

Originally Posted by spence

I think it's more about comprehensive reform -- not just banning one type of weapon -- and a willingness to see things through long haul.

that's pretty deep......

[Pete F.]

Probably have to try Hannity's brilliant idea, though I think he stole it from the Red Chinese.

"I'd like to see the perimeter of every school in America surrounded, secured by retired police ... retired Secret Service ... military, and I want guys to donate 15 hours. I think we could cover every school, every hour, every day," Hannity proposed. "Add a metal detector, and I think we're going to have safer schools. Have one armed guard on every floor of every school, all over every mall, the perimeter, and inside every hall of every mall. ... We can do that with stores; we can do that in malls; we can do that pretty much anywhere the public is — courthouses — we can expand that out everywhere and keep Americans safe."

Of course all these retired cops would gladly carry a gun for not having to pay taxes, most of the ones I know are actually working at something unless they are disabled.

And I'm sure all the 2a guys would be fine with a police state, wouldn't you? Remember someone will need to organize this s show.

[wdmso]

Originally Posted by afterhours

So if AR's and AK's are banned and shootings are not reduced by any significant amount - what's next?

there was an assault ban. for 10 years guess what party killed it

death toll from mass shootings went from 4.8 per year during the ban years to 23.8 per year afterwards.


it's hard to try and put the genie back in the bottle .. Republicans want to break the bottle completely

[JohnR]

Originally Posted by wdmso

so please show me how the Words support what the gun lobby is suggesting . 2a means

Ohhh I dunno, here is the Supreme Court's response:

District of Columbia v. Heller, 554 U.S. 570 (2008),[1] is a landmark case in which the Supreme Court of the United States held that the Second Amendment protects an individual's Right to keep and bear arms, unconnected with service in a militia, for traditionally lawful purposes, such as self-defense within the home, and that the District of Columbia's handgun ban and requirement that lawfully owned rifles and shotguns be kept "unloaded and disassembled or bound by a trigger lock" violated this guarantee. It also stated that the right to bear arms is not unlimited and that guns and gun ownership would continue to be regulated. It was the first Supreme Court case to decide whether the Second Amendment protects an individual right to keep and bear arms for self-defense or if the right was intended for state militias.[2]

Originally Posted by spence

I think it's more about comprehensive reform -- not just banning one type of weapon -- and a willingness to see things through long haul.

That is the problem why we do not get anything done. Each step that is completed by the left is one more step in that law, on its Long March to confiscation.

Originally Posted by wdmso

you guys keep mudding the waters .. I am not against gun ownership never have been .. I am against the idea that somehow the constitution says you can have whatever type of gun you want . mantra hidden by your unfounded fear there taking our guns...

the NRA went from gun safety and marksmanship .. to marketing and sales of guns as their primary driver






https://www.brennancenter.org//analy...waAiLIEALw_wcB


Today at the NRA’s headquarters in Fairfax, Virginia, oversized letters on the facade no longer refer to “marksmanship” and “safety.” Instead, the Second Amendment is emblazoned on a wall of the building’s lobby. Visitors might not notice that the text is incomplete. It reads:

“.. the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.”

The first half—the part about the well regulated militia—has been edited out.

Cough, see DC vs Heller above.

Originally Posted by wdmso

there was an assault ban. for 10 years guess what party killed it

death toll from mass shootings went from 4.8 per year during the ban years to 23.8 per year afterwards.


it's hard to try and put the genie back in the bottle .. Republicans want to break the bottle completely

And it is the same ustable people doing it, so the unstable problem has not been addressed. Though overall gun crime and deaths are down.

Progressives want to STEAL the bottle.

[Got Stripers]

Does anyone really feel there is any likelihood people with mental health, depression or radical ideas will reduce? If anything based on the current state of things, the likelihood financial and emotional burdens will radically increase with more large scale climate change induced disasters and the inevitable recession; we are seeing just the tip of the iceberg. But hey manufacture all the AR and high capacity long rifles you can, with the largest capacity magazines you can and while your at it; ask your kids how their shelter in place drills at school are working. Depression is out of control, between the pressures on our kids with social media and bullying, now you have to factor in the impact of fear of school shootings.

Look at the increase in road rage, hit and runs, people just don’t give a f*ck any more, let’s arm everyone, it will be the wild Wild West.
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[spence]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

Does anyone really feel there is any likelihood people with mental health, depression or radical ideas will reduce? If anything based on the current state of things, the likelihood financial and emotional burdens will radically increase with more large scale climate change induced disasters and the inevitable recession; we are seeing just the tip of the iceberg. But hey manufacture all the AR and high capacity long rifles you can, with the largest capacity magazines you can and while your at it; ask your kids how their shelter in place drills at school are working. Depression is out of control, between the pressures on our kids with social media and bullying, now you have to factor in the impact of fear of school shootings.

Look at the increase in road rage, hit and runs, people just don’t give a f*ck any more, let’s arm everyone, it will be the wild Wild West.
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^^^ this
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[JohnR]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

Does anyone really feel there is any likelihood people with mental health, depression or radical ideas will reduce? If anything based on the current state of things, the likelihood financial and emotional burdens will radically increase with more large scale climate change induced disasters and the inevitable recession; we are seeing just the tip of the iceberg. But hey manufacture all the AR and high capacity long rifles you can, with the largest capacity magazines you can and while your at it; ask your kids how their shelter in place drills at school are working. Depression is out of control, between the pressures on our kids with social media and bullying, now you have to factor in the impact of fear of school shootings.

Look at the increase in road rage, hit and runs, people just don’t give a f*ck any more, let’s arm everyone, it will be the wild Wild West.
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We had actual bomb threats at my High School, by militant lefties.

Then get the kids off the XBox, out of their phones, and outside learning to play with others, get them off the effing antidepressants

Originally Posted by spence

^^^ this
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Haha - so with all the crazy people out there if I turn in my rifle, that will make you feel better?

[Got Stripers]

Originally Posted by JohnR

We had actual bomb threats at my High School, by militant lefties.

Then get the kids off the XBox, out of their phones, and outside learning to play with others, get them off the effing antidepressants



Haha - so with all the crazy people out there if I turn in my rifle, that will make you feel better?

If you think parents are suddenly going to understand the dangers of allowing their kids to continue playing the mindless video games that romanticize weapons of all types and desensitizing them to what death is, I think you are dreaming. The internet, smart phones and social media were once a blessing and now may becoming a curse. After bullied Johnny finishes a failed attempt at his favorite shoot them up game after another bad day at school, the lock on daddies gun locker better be able to stop junior with his bolt cutter or torch.
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[detbuch]

Originally Posted by wdmso

funny ...
There is not a single word about an individual’s right to a gun for self-defense or recreation in Madison’s notes from the Constitutional Convention. Nor was it mentioned,

What's "funny" is the notion that every specific thing that the Federal Government might possibly wish to abridge the citizens right to own should have been discussed during the Constitutional Convention. I'm not sure, but I don't think the right to a head of cabbage, for health or any other purpose, was discussed during the Convention.

What is not funny is that deceptive articles such as the one you linked actually persuade good people to believe that there is any significance to the idea that if some particular thing was not discussed, then there is no reason to believe that the Federal Government should be denied the power to control that thing.

To begin with, the Bill of Rights as a whole and as it was drafted, was not written during the convention. It was added to the Constitution afterwards in order to assure ratification by states whose representatives wanted a Bill of Rights. The reason that the majority of Representatives during the Convention voted down addressing a Bill of Rights was because the way the Constitution was written already denied the Federal Government the power to abridge the rights that a bill of rights would propose.

So your article's ruse of pretending that somehow the 2A is diminished in scope and meaning because "There is not a single word about an individual’s right to a gun for self-defense or recreation in Madison’s notes from the Constitutional Convention" is an idiotic tautology. Of course there was not a single word about and individual's right to a gun--because they did not discuss it during the Convention. And they didn't because, even if the 2A had not been created, the limitations that the original, pre-amended, Constitution would still have prohibited the government from infringing the right to arms. The Bill of Rights was not part of the original constitution. It was added later as an Amendment in order to assure Ratification.


or One addressed the “well regulated militia” and the right “to keep and bear arms.” We don’t really know what he meant by it. At the time, Americans expected to be able to own guns, a legacy of English common law and rights. But the overwhelming use of the phrase “bear arms” in those days referred to military activities.

This is a bald faced lie. We really do know what the Framers meant by those words. They are preserved, verbatim, as in the above links which it seems you did not read.


so please show me how the Words support what the gun lobby is suggesting . 2a means

I don't know what the gun lobby is suggesting. I know what the 2A says and what those who wrote it and discussed it and later commented on it meant.

I couldn't stand reading your whole article because it started out with lies and misinformation. It was an obvious progressive ploy to make us believe that the 2A, and the entire Constitution no doubt, can mean whatever a judge says it means. To which I say, then if that is so, what purpose does it serve? Why bother to have written it in the first place?

[JohnR]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

If you think parents are suddenly going to understand the dangers of allowing their kids to continue playing the mindless video games that romanticize weapons of all types and desensitizing them to what death is, I think you are dreaming. The internet, smart phones and social media were once a blessing and now may becoming a curse. After bullied Johnny finishes a failed attempt at his favorite shoot them up game after another bad day at school, the lock on daddies gun locker better be able to stop junior with his bolt cutter or torch.
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So because kids - particularly those with underlying mental health issues - can't adjust well to growing up and parents can't parent, other people, law abiding people, should give a constitutionally guaranteed right up and reduce their ability defend themselves and their family to accommodate one group of people? Rather than work to focus on the core issues of gun violence and keep firearms out of those hands, we'll punish everyone?