Trump vs Amazon

[Pete F.]

How about the market compared to other presidents
http://www.macrotrends.net/2481/stoc...e-by-president

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by Pete F.

How about the market compared to other presidents
http://www.macrotrends.net/2481/stoc...e-by-president

When Trump came in, the stock market (thanks in part to Obama) was very high. It's harder to grow the stock market when it's high, and easier to grow the market after a crash.

That doesn't diminish what Obama did. But when he came in, the market had almost nowhere to go but up.

It's like golf. It's a lot easier to take 5 shots off your game when you are shooting 130, then it is when you are shooting 90.

Would it kill you to admit that he's been good for the economy? In all seriousness, what are you afraid will happen, if you are honest for 10 seconds?

[Pete F.]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

When Trump came in, the stock market (thanks in part to Obama) was very high. It's harder to grow the stock market when it's high, and easier to grow the market after a crash.

That doesn't diminish what Obama did. But when he came in, the market had almost nowhere to go but up.

It's like golf. It's a lot easier to take 5 shots off your game when you are shooting 130, then it is when you are shooting 90.

Would it kill you to admit that he's been good for the economy? In all seriousness, what are you afraid will happen, if you are honest for 10 seconds?

I always feel that I am honest, I just have a hard time with the emperor's attire.
It's a lot easier to make the market go up by cutting corporate taxes in the middle of an expansion phase, in fact it is likely the only way to hyperinflate the market in that case.
Honestly, I feel that it will make the coming market adjustment in the next two years worse.
Who Trump will blame that on remains to be seen.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by Pete F.

I always feel that I am honest, I just have a hard time with the emperor's attire.
It's a lot easier to make the market go up by cutting corporate taxes in the middle of an expansion phase, in fact it is likely the only way to hyperinflate the market in that case.
Honestly, I feel that it will make the coming market adjustment in the next two years worse.
Who Trump will blame that on remains to be seen.

The market went up long before the GOP passed the tax overhaul.

You can also hyperinflate the market by doing what Obama did, borrowing a couple of trillion and dumping it into the market.

" feel that it will make the coming market adjustment in the next two years worse.
Who Trump will blame that on remains to be seen"

OK, so when the inevitable correction/recession occurs, none of it will be connected to anything Obama did, all of it will be Trump's fault. That's "honest"?

When the market goes on a tear for 9 years, it typically gives back at some point. If Hilary had won, we'd still be due for a correction/recession. That's the cycle. Sure, there are things presidents can do to make it more or less severe.

You are right, assuming there's a correction/recession on Trump's watch, you can bet he will place all of the blame elsewhere.

[Pete F.]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

You can also hyperinflate the market by doing what Obama did, borrowing a couple of trillion and dumping it into the market.
What would you have suggested he do at that point in time? Wait for things to sort themselves out?



OK, so when the inevitable correction/recession occurs, none of it will be connected to anything Obama did, all of it will be Trump's fault. That's "honest"?
Since the claim is made that all things good are due to Trump's policies, surely the converse must be true?

When the market goes on a tear for 9 years, it typically gives back at some point. If Hilary had won, we'd still be due for a correction/recession. That's the cycle. Sure, there are things presidents can do to make it more or less severe.
Would that be like cutting taxes and increasing the deficit in the middle of an expansion. Sure you have a short term "good" but long term?

You are right, assuming there's a correction/recession on Trump's watch, you can bet he will place all of the blame elsewhere.

We agree on one thing

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by Pete F.

We agree on one thing

"What would you have suggested he do at that point in time? Wait for things to sort themselves out?"

See, this is the dishonesty I was referring to. Both Obama and Trump took significant steps to try and help the economy. Both took risks, that as of now, appear to be working. You are concerned about the potential downside to Trump's actions, yet you have no concerns about what Obama did, because in your mind his moves were brilliant and necessary.

As of right now, the evidence shows both have helped the economy. You give credit to one, and issue dire warnings about the other. The one you give credit to, is a democrat, the one you cannot bring yourself to give credit to, is (supposedly) a Republican.

That's honest?

If the economy crashes tomorrow, all the liberals will say it's all Trump's fault (nothing to do with Obama), and all the conservative purists will say it had nothing to do with Trump. The truth is in the middle somewhere, as usual.

"Since the claim is made that all things good are due to Trump's policies, surely the converse must be true?"

Who made that claim? I have said many times, including on this thread, that the economy did well under Obama. Again, are you being honest? Who said all good things are due to Trump? Show us who said that, or admit you made it up?

"Would that be like cutting taxes and increasing the deficit in the middle of an expansion. Sure you have a short term "good" but long term?"

OK so today, you are opposed to increasing the deficit. What was your stance on increasing the deficit, from, oh, say, 2009-2016?

[Pete F.]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

"What would you have suggested he do at that point in time? Wait for things to sort themselves out?"

See, this is the dishonesty I was referring to. Both Obama and Trump took significant steps to try and help the economy. Both took risks, that as of now, appear to be working. You are concerned about the potential downside to Trump's actions, yet you have no concerns about what Obama did, because in your mind his moves were brilliant and necessary.
When Obama did that the economy was in a tailspin, when Trump did that the economy was and had been growing. There is a big difference. Now we could discuss the fact that Trump claimed throughout his campaign, that all the economic statistics were false. When he was elected all of the sudden, without a change in methods or practitioners they became true.

As of right now, the evidence shows both have helped the economy.
Cite the evidence with dates that what Trump did produced a significant effect on the economy. You give credit to one, and issue dire warnings about the other. The one you give credit to, is a democrat, the one you cannot bring yourself to give credit to, is (supposedly) a Republican.

That's honest?

If the economy crashes tomorrow, all the liberals will say it's all Trump's fault (nothing to do with Obama), and all the conservative purists will say it had nothing to do with Trump. The truth is in the middle somewhere, as usual.

"Since the claim is made that all things good are due to Trump's policies, surely the converse must be true?"

Who made that claim?
I have heard Sarah Sanders say it numerous times, it is her standard line in every press conference.
“The economy is incredibly strong right now,” she said. “We’re infinitely better off today than where we were before the president took office, particularly on the economy. We have historically low unemployment and we actually have increasing wages for American workers.”
"The economy is stronger than it’s been in ages, ISIS is on the run, the remaking of the judiciary. Jobs are coming in at record numbers. There are historic things that have taken place in the first year."
“Lower taxes, higher pay and bonuses, more jobs and opportunity for all,” Sanders tweeted. “Trumponomics is Obamanomics in reverse.”
"Does the President have second thoughts about taking credit for a booming economy? Absolutely not," Sanders said.

This is the administrations standard message, I don't have to make it up, they make up plenty on their own.

I have said many times, including on this thread, that the economy did well under Obama. Again, are you being honest? Who said all good things are due to Trump? Show us who said that, or admit you made it up?

"Would that be like cutting taxes and increasing the deficit in the middle of an expansion. Sure you have a short term "good" but long term?"

OK so today, you are opposed to increasing the deficit. What was your stance on increasing the deficit, from, oh, say, 2009-2016?

End with a But ______________, typical gaslighting move.