Trump newest attack on environment

[wdmso]

Trump in his child like behaviour to un do anything Obama
Trump Poised To Roll Back Decades Of Clean Water Protections With New Rule
The new water rule, expected to be finalized this week, "will be the biggest loss of clean water protection the country has ever seen,”

the move represents a big win for industry groups

And offin DAVOS

Trump’s speech for failing to address the climate emergency beyond a commitment that the U.S. would join the tree-planting initiative. “He managed to say absolutely zero on climate change,”

Get ready to fish in love canal . They'll be springing up all over if he get reelected

[PaulS]

It's not like anyone here fishes.

[Sea Dangles]

Don’t believe the fake news. Trump is clearly the greatest president of our lifetime.
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[PaulS]

Government scientists, even those appointed by the Trump administration, say those concerns are justified. The E.P.A.’s Scientific Advisory Board, a panel of 41 scientists responsible for evaluating the scientific integrity of the agency’s regulations, concluded that the new Trump water rule ignores science by “failing to acknowledge watershed systems.” They found “no scientific justification” for excluding certain bodies of water from protection under the new regulations, concluding that pollutants from those smaller and seasonal bodies of water can still have a significant impact on the health of larger water systems.

[Got Stripers]

Trump couldn’t give a sh*t about clean water, clean air or future generations, all he wants is that stock market to keep climbing. Future generations will get the check and it’s going to be difficult to pay. SD is of the same mindset, he too sees only his hands in front of his face.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

Trump couldn’t give a sh*t about clean water, clean air or future generations, all he wants is that stock market to keep climbing. Future generations will get the check and it’s going to be difficult to pay. SD is of the same mindset, he too sees only his hands in front of his face.

Guys, there are scientists who say it's serious, there are scientists who say it's not. And there's a looooong list of predictions made by your side, which were laughably (and fortunatly) way off base. Which means the modeling is so heavily based on assumptions, some of which are off.

Trump doesn't breathe air or drink water?

[Got Stripers]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

Guys, there are scientists who say it's serious, there are scientists who say it's not. And there's a looooong list of predictions made by your side, which were laughably (and fortunatly) way off base. Which means the modeling is so heavily based on assumptions, some of which are off.

Trump doesn't breathe air or drink water?

Hard to see it with your head in the sand, pull it out and look around, your blind if you can’t see it. Climate change is very real and h happening faster every year and as much as I love getting 2-3 rounds of golf in every week in the middle of winter, future generations (your grand children) could be fuc*ked if we don’t address it aggressively.

[Sea Dangles]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

Hard to see it with your head in the sand, pull it out and look around, your blind if you can’t see it. Climate change is very real and h happening faster every year and as much as I love getting 2-3 rounds of golf in every week in the middle of winter, future generations (your grand children) could be fuc*ked if we don’t address it aggressively.

Keep golfing or join Greta to make a difference in the world.

Or u could shut up with the false emergency. Your choice.
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[scottw]

golfing is terrible for the environment..I would never do it

Golf courses are actually very controversial when discussing the environment, as there are prices to pay for those lush fairways and manicured greens.

The Problems With Golf

Among the primary concerns of environmentalists with regard to golf courses are: the use of non-native grasses in golf course construction, elimination or interruption of natural habitats, overuse of fertilizers, water and pesticides, overuse of gasoline in mowers and golf carts, the massive habitat upheaval inherent in constructing a golf course, and the interruption of natural waterways that may wreak havoc on coastlines.

[Got Stripers]

Originally Posted by Sea Dangles

Keep golfing or join Greta to make a difference in the world.

Or u could shut up with the false emergency. Your choice.
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The false emergency really that’s rich. So the overwhelming majority of the scientific community is waving a red warning flag, coastal cities are changing building codes in acknowledgement of the trouble on the horizon and they even just moved the world clock closer to midnight than it’s ever been. I know it’s all about you and your bank account, your grand children and they kids will put thank you flowers on your grave.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

Hard to see it with your head in the sand, pull it out and look around, your blind if you can’t see it. Climate change is very real and h happening faster every year and as much as I love getting 2-3 rounds of golf in every week in the middle of winter, future generations (your grand children) could be fuc*ked if we don’t address it aggressively.

i agree we don’t really have winters anymore. it’s changing. But “change” isn’t new. it’s not like things have always been exactly the same until recently. so unless nothing ever “changes”, that’s proof that you’re right?

i think things are changing, i think there’s a chance it’s because of
us. i want to study it. but i want the studies done by objective scientists, not activists.

GS, i build predictive models for insurance companies. the models are easy to build ( meaning the future is easy to predict), because we have so much actual, relevant data. i can accurately predict how much you need to charge 16 year olds for car insurance, because i have millions and millions and millions of records of data to tell
me exactly what kind of frequency and severity of accidents to predict.

Predicting the effects of climate change is not remotely similar. China and India have never been on the verge of industrializing before, so we have no idea what the effects will be. Not having any actual experience to rely on, you populate the models with assumptions.

the observed future accuracy of the models, tells you how good the assumptions were. The models have been laughably inaccurate up until now.

We are pumping more crap into the atmosphere. We know this. We don’t know with any certainty, the ability of the atmosphere or ocean currents to absorb it, or what will happen if they can’t.

i’m not a science denier. I build
predictive models for a living. But I’m not. zealot with a political agenda either. i’ll wager i jump through more hoops to spend more time on the water, under the water, and in the woods, than most people
here, and for sure i have a softer spot for animals that just about anyone. I’m absolutely persuadable on this issue, and i’m concerned about the issue. but not with unfounded gibberish.

if the models were accurate, North Dakota would be exporting pineapples by now. And if Al Gore really believed any of this ( as opposed to him seeing he could get filthy rich by saying we’re all going to die), he wouldn't live the way he does. Obviously he doesn’t believe what’s in the books he’s selling. which naturally makes
me skeptical.



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Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

[Got Stripers]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

i agree we don’t really have winters anymore. it’s changing. But “change” isn’t new. it’s not like things have always been exactly the same until recently. so unless nothing ever “changes”, that’s proof that you’re right?

i think things are changing, i think there’s a chance it’s because of
us. i want to study it. but i want the studies done by objective scientists, not activists.

GS, i build predictive models for insurance companies. the models are easy to build ( meaning the future is easy to predict), because we have so much actual, relevant data. i can accurately predict how much you need to charge 16 year olds for car insurance, because i have millions and millions and millions of records of data to tell
me exactly what kind of frequency and severity of accidents to predict.

Predicting the effects of climate change is not remotely similar. China and India have never been on the verge of industrializing before, so we have no idea what the effects will be. Not having any actual experience to rely on, you populate the models with assumptions.

the observed future accuracy of the models, tells you how good the assumptions were. The models have been laughably inaccurate up until now.

We are pumping more crap into the atmosphere. We know this. We don’t know with any certainty, the ability of the atmosphere or ocean currents to absorb it, or what will happen if they can’t.

i’m not a science denier. I build
predictive models for a living. But I’m not. zealot with a political agenda either. i’ll wager i jump through more hoops to spend more time on the water, under the water, and in the woods, than most people
here, and for sure i have a softer spot for animals that just about anyone. I’m absolutely persuadable on this issue, and i’m concerned about the issue. but not with unfounded gibberish.

if the models were accurate, North Dakota would be exporting pineapples by now. And if Al Gore really believed any of this ( as opposed to him seeing he could get filthy rich by saying we’re all going to die), he wouldn't live the way he does. Obviously he doesn’t believe what’s in the books he’s selling. which naturally makes
me skeptical.



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Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Insurance companies probably have a really good idea about what the financial impact is today vs ten years ago due to disasters that may likely be due to changing climate. Entire ecosystems are in jeopardy, glaciers are melting at a fast pace, a beach thousands walked on in my youth doesn’t exist now with water right up to the sea wall, what concerns me is that the scientific community predicts there may be a point reached soon where the change can’t be halted or reversed.

So in the business your in, you know full well that if that prediction is true, the impact to everyone and everything on earth will be devastating. It’s not like gambling like Boston did, that the T and it’s antiquated system will last another decade, this gamble will cost lives, ecosystems and if it can be fixed the price tag down the road will be ten fold or more beyond today’s cost of prevention.

[RIROCKHOUND]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

Guys, there are scientists who say it's serious, there are scientists who say it's not. And there's a looooong list of predictions made by your side, which were laughably (and fortunatly) way off base. Which means the modeling is so heavily based on assumptions, some of which are off.

Trump doesn't breathe air or drink water?

Jim,

Can you post the source about which scientists thought the clean water rule changes were not a Big deal? I read a few articles from different sources and didn't find that. That was the original topic in this thread before the tangents

(If you were talking climate change we have debated that enough, I don't have time do argue with you on that today and we can leave it as agree to disagree)
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[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by RIROCKHOUND

Jim,

Can you post the source about which scientists thought the clean water rule changes were not a Big deal? I read a few articles from different sources and didn't find that. That was the original topic in this thread before the tangents

(If you were talking climate change we have debated that enough, I don't have time do argue with you on that today and we can leave it as agree to disagree)
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i wasn’t talking about the clean water rule. we can debate as little or as much as you’d like, but know with all sincerity ( because tone can be difficult to discern) that i respect the way you think, i agree with you more than i disagree with you, i read every word you write and i think about every word you write. i don’t say that about too many people.
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[RIROCKHOUND]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

i wasn’t talking about the clean water rule. we can debate as little or as much as you’d like, but know with all sincerity ( because tone can be difficult to discern) that i respect the way you think, i agree with you more than i disagree with you, i read every word you write and i think about every word you write. i don’t say that about too many people.
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Appreciate on that.
Any thoughts on the original topic of the thread?
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[Sea Dangles]

I am
Making the same difference as you. Chew on that dingo.
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[wdmso]

Who said it

On a trip to Alaska, I heard about a national park visitor’s center that was built to offer a picture-perfect view of a large glacier. Problem is, the glacier is gone. A work of nature that took ages to form had melted away in a matter of decades

CONSERVATIVES use the same arguments over and over their doing it the impeachment trial. They make the argument it kinda happened , but your ears ,eyes, the thermometer, the Science , is all wrong and call it a hoax. Provide no scientific evidence no witnesses and use the bible to convince them of their opinion
Psalm 8:6). Humanity was to "subdue" the earth (Genesis 1:28)—we were to hold a position of command over it; we were placed in a superior role and were to exercise control over the earth and its flora and fauna. Mankind was set up as the ruler of this world. All else was subjugated to him

John suggested blance its a great idea but impossible when the side you seek blance with denies the problem even exist

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[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by wdmso

Who said it

On a trip to Alaska, I heard about a national park visitor’s center that was built to offer a picture-perfect view of a large glacier. Problem is, the glacier is gone. A work of nature that took ages to form had melted away in a matter of decades

CONSERVATIVES use the same arguments over and over their doing it the impeachment trial. They make the argument it kinda happened , but your ears ,eyes, the thermometer, the Science , is all wrong and call it a hoax. Provide no scientific evidence no witnesses and use the bible to convince them of their opinion
Psalm 8:6). Humanity was to "subdue" the earth (Genesis 1:28)—we were to hold a position of command over it; we were placed in a superior role and were to exercise control over the earth and its flora and fauna. Mankind was set up as the ruler of this world. All else was subjugated to him

John suggested blance its a great idea but impossible when the side you seek blance with denies the problem even exist

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"CONSERVATIVES both sides use the same arguments over and over "

Fixed it.

Are there any problems facing the world today, for which the solution isn't to give liberals more power?

"A work of nature that took ages to form had melted away in a matter of decades"

No one denies that glaciers are retreating in certain places (and ice is advancing in other places). The question is ,did we cause that, or is it a natural effect? Some time ago, there might have been volcanic lava on my property and a triceratops walking around grazing happily. Now they're all gone. Things change on their own sometimes.

Not long ago, we were warned of an ice age. Then that was debunked, so they called it global warming. Then that was debunked, so they fell back on "climate change", which can be fit to explain literally everything.

I have solar panels covering my entire roof. I've planted 11 trees on my property that weren't there when we built the house. These are things we can, and should, be doing.

[JohnR]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

Really SD can post Trump is the greatest president of our lifetime over and over, which to me is stupidity over and over again and I get it for posting what I knew to be a bit out there for effect. I know the clock is scare tactic, gee maybe that's why I used it, partly in jest and partly not.

Hahaha ; )

I did not know you were doing this in jest. I thought there was more than a thread of belief.

I take no claim seriously when they say Obama was the greatest or Trump the greatest.

[scottw]

Originally Posted by JohnR

Hahaha ; )

I did not know you were doing this in jest.

.

He wasn’t
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[RIROCKHOUND]

Jim. Go read Ted Nordhaus' op-ed in the WSJ today 'Ignoring the Fake Climate Debate'.

I don't agree with every aspect he brings up but it is well researched and makes some good points. FYI when you get to the end, if we get to 3deg C it still ain't good......
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[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by RIROCKHOUND

Jim. Go read Ted Nordhaus' op-ed in the WSJ today 'Ignoring the Fake Climate Debate'.

I don't agree with every aspect he brings up but it is well researched and makes some good points. FYI when you get to the end, if we get to 3deg C it still ain't good......
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I read it. it was a moderate piece i guess, but skeptical of
anyone who is still
linking climate change with the australian fires, which as far as i know were caused by arson, not climate change.

Why aren’t we building nuclear plants as rapidly as we can? what’s a better solution that has any feasibility to it?
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[RIROCKHOUND]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

I read it. it was a moderate piece i guess, but skeptical of
anyone who is still
linking climate change with the australian fires, which as far as i know were caused by arson, not climate change.

Why aren’t we building nuclear plants as rapidly as we can? what’s a better solution that has any feasibility to it?
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1. https://www.factcheck.org/2020/01/se...ias-bushfires/

2. I am not anti nuke but we need significant improvements in how they transport and store nuclear fuel over geologic time....
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[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by RIROCKHOUND

1. https://www.factcheck.org/2020/01/se...ias-bushfires/

2. I am not anti nuke but we need significant improvements in how they transport and store nuclear fuel over geologic time....
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your article tries to link climate change to the fires by saying that hot, dry weather enables
fires to spread. that’s true. but it’s australia, and it’s summer there, right? hasn’t it always been hot and dry there in the summer? i
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[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by RIROCKHOUND

2. I am not anti nuke but we need significant improvements in how they transport and store nuclear fuel over geologic time....
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True. Just like we need controls
on long term storage of dead
lithium batteries and solar panels. lots of toxicity there, obviously not on the same page as
nuclear, but we’ll need a lot
if space for refuse batteries and panels. i understand they are tough to recycle, don’t know why.
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[wdmso]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

I read it. it was a moderate piece i guess, but skeptical of
anyone who is still
linking climate change with the australian fires, which as far as i know were caused by arson, not climate change.

Why aren’t we building nuclear plants as rapidly as we can? what’s a better solution that has any feasibility to it?
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The arsonist angle in Australia is another red herring conspiracy throw out by fox news and climate deniers

Lead in on American Greatness 1st time see them. There as far right as you get

Environmentalists Caused Australia’s Fires, Not ‘Climate Change’

How hard is the concept its climate change that caused the conditions and a spark or cigarette or an ember from a camp fire lit the fuse , like Trump and his supporters
Blame the whistleblower deny the evidence

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by wdmso

How hard is the concept its climate change that caused the conditions and a spark or cigarette or an ember from a camp fire lit the fuse , like Trump and his supporters
Blame the whistleblower deny the evidence

do you have any evidence that it was climate change? or do you just want it to be climate change to serve The Narrative? It’s hot and dry there, WDMSO, that’s not a new situation.
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[Sea Dangles]

Originally Posted by wdmso

The arsonist angle in Australia is another red herring conspiracy throw out by fox news and climate deniers

Lead in on American Greatness 1st time see them. There as far right as you get

Environmentalists Caused Australia’s Fires, Not ‘Climate Change’

How hard is the concept its climate change that caused the conditions and a spark or cigarette or an ember from a camp fire lit the fuse , like Trump and his supporters
Blame the whistleblower deny the evidence

Why did I know that you would link Trump to those fires?
🤡
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[wdmso]

Originally Posted by Sea Dangles

Why did I know that you would link Trump to those fires?
🤡
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To much weed it's a bit early ?