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Old 02-03-2020, 06:41 PM   #1
Sea Dangles
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New rules

As of 2020 striped bass has been removed as a target species for the Martha’s Vineyard derby.

Congrats to Sauerkraut who cares enough to speak up

Last edited by Sea Dangles; 02-03-2020 at 07:11 PM..

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Old 02-03-2020, 06:54 PM   #2
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Now On The Water needs to step up
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Old 02-03-2020, 07:10 PM   #3
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That group will continue cutting off their noses and exploiting the resource.
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Old 02-04-2020, 06:35 AM   #4
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Chris is right. OTW will just keep supporting killing for their own gain.

No boat, back in the suds.
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Old 02-04-2020, 09:58 AM   #5
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Good decision for the Derby. Sad this was not addressed almost a decade ago when the warning signs were coming in

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Old 02-06-2020, 09:09 PM   #6
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Regarding the MV Derby and local culture: More advocacy and re education will probably be needed. What about the so-called "Private Derbies" run by tackle shops? Specific to the Vineyard, there has been a decades long Island extension of the MV Derby called October Fish.

Cudos to my MV friend Tommy Taylor who spent the last two MV Derbies trying to help is grandson win the junior boat bass division. They didn't. Despite the initial objections of said grandson, they never killed a single bass because they never caught the winner. No, they didn't kill a bass so Junior could win the Daily; or the Weekly; or worse yet... kill a bass so Junior could be eligible for winning the daily "Mystery Prize".

That kid has learned a lesson from a Guardian who knows how to teach it... by example.
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Old 02-06-2020, 09:57 PM   #7
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Regarding the MV Derby and local culture: More advocacy and re education will probably be needed. What about the so-called "Private Derbies" run by tackle shops? Specific to the Vineyard, there has been a decades long Island extension of the MV Derby called October Fish.

Cudos to my MV friend Tommy Taylor who spent the last two MV Derbies trying to help is grandson win the junior boat bass division. They didn't. Despite the initial objections of said grandson, they never killed a single bass because they never caught the winner. No, they didn't kill a bass so Junior could win the Daily; or the Weekly; or worse yet... kill a bass so Junior could be eligible for winning the daily "Mystery Prize".

That kid has learned a lesson from a Guardian who knows how to teach it... by example.
I am not sure the lesson of killing a prize winner is noble. Kudos to you Alan.
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Old 02-07-2020, 09:35 AM   #8
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Time For A Big Change

How many people would support a Striper License with a specified number of Tags similar to the way the State manages the Whitetail Deer Hunting. Lets say you pay $100.00 for the License and 10 tags. If you land and retain a fish you report it on line with dimensions and weight.
You could also report all the landed fish you catch and subsequently release. There could also be a Trophy Tag provision similar to Florida's Tarpon Tag program where for in the case of Florida its $50 bucks, you could keep a trophy Striper. All the funds generated from this would go to enforcement and administration of this program.You already need a Saltwater License so maybe it could be in the form of a Stamp like it is for Archery, Primitive Weapons and Waterfowl.Also how many support local Law Enforcement being mandated to assist in upholding the game laws? The State could also train and empower certain individuals to help in reporting and enforcing the regulations on a limited basis. The State needs to step up and record the Recreational Catch in order to have a Viable management plan going forward. At present its no more than by guess and by golly lets wing it
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Old 02-07-2020, 01:24 PM   #9
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I cant believe there isn't a mandatory reporting system in place already. I've mentioned it here and had guys laugh at me. the comms already have mandatory reporting using SAFIS. why cant recs do it. make it a simple and guys will use it. even if you only get 60% compliance that's better then the guesses that they make now. just figure out the compliance rate via a survey on the rec license application and extrapolate the numbers from there. I personally don't want a 100 dollar fee but there are so many rec striper anglers you could do it with a small endorsement fee. I've always liked the idea of no take every other year, solves a lot of problems pretty quickly but no one seems to like the idea. i'm cool with giving out X amount of tags per angler and when ur done, ur done.

my 1st wife didn't like me fishing so much
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Old 02-07-2020, 05:30 PM   #10
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I am not sure the lesson of killing a prize winner is noble. Kudos to you Alan.
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Totally agree about this, Mr. SD.... privately thinking. However, my zealot Abolitionist mindset cannot totally ignore the realities of basic human nature (Or, should I say base human nature).

Even I compete in the MV Derby!! : In my head: I follow the Shore Striped Bass and Shore Bluefish daily, and closely. I fish my own spots and beaches, mostly not on the Vineyard. I compare how I stack up against the "competition". So, last Derby, 2019, I "won" one Daily SSB; one 2nd place Daily SSB; AND I "won" the entire Shore Bluefish (SBF) for the Derby.
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Old 02-08-2020, 05:23 PM   #11
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So why not eliminate the bluefish entries also??

The bluefish have been in even more of a decline cycle than bass. But the whole mystique of the bass is higher than bluefish for some reason.

Make it a bsb and scup event.
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Old 02-09-2020, 07:33 AM   #12
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Maybe you should just be allowed to keep a fish 28" to 34" over 48" and or 50 lbs (you would have to carry a Boga If you are trophy hunting) It would be made clear that the fish must weigh 50 or more pounds at any point it is in your possession, that eliminates "It was 50 when I caught it" scenario. It makes the holy grail of fishing attainable and protects the other 99.9% of breeders that are 15 to 49 pounds. Keeps tournaments alive and makes the charter captains happy. Personally I believe boats should not be allowed a trophy fish because it is rather easy to break 50 from a boat, no disrespect intended to anyone. From the surf it is an entirely different scenario, even at the canal. People will find a way to mount a 50 if they stick it and want to keep it. Maybe make the boat limit 60lbs and that would even things up with the shore guys somewhat.

Last edited by Headhunter; 02-09-2020 at 07:49 AM..
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Old 02-09-2020, 08:23 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Headhunter View Post
Maybe you should just be allowed to keep a fish 28" to 34" over 48" and or 50 lbs (you would have to carry a Boga If you are trophy hunting) It would be made clear that the fish must weigh 50 or more pounds at any point it is in your possession, that eliminates "It was 50 when I caught it" scenario. It makes the holy grail of fishing attainable and protects the other 99.9% of breeders that are 15 to 49 pounds. Keeps tournaments alive and makes the charter captains happy. Personally I believe boats should not be allowed a trophy fish because it is rather easy to break 50 from a boat, no disrespect intended to anyone. From the surf it is an entirely different scenario, even at the canal. People will find a way to mount a 50 if they stick it and want to keep it. Maybe make the boat limit 60lbs and that would even things up with the shore guys somewhat.
Just makes too much sense...….

No boat, back in the suds.
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Old 02-09-2020, 12:24 PM   #14
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hEADHunter /WTF are you trying to put me back in treatment ………………… 50# rather easy by boat

ENJOY WHAT YOU HAVE !!!

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Old 02-09-2020, 12:56 PM   #15
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hEADHunter /WTF are you trying to put me back in treatment ………………… 50# rather easy by boat
It's simple mike... you know that. Remember all those 50's we've caught!!!

WTF
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Old 02-09-2020, 02:01 PM   #16
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made me laugh too but if you fish the block at night. And especially if ur willing to ignore that pesky 3 mile line. Lot of boat lights way out there
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Old 02-09-2020, 05:31 PM   #17
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Again, no disrespect intended,
My boat 50's did not come from block and were daytime fish.
My 2'cd season with my 24 cc Albermarle I O, 14 over 40, 2 over 50 and more than 100 over 30. Sold the boat, No challenge in my opinion. Strictly surf for me. Boat= Go where the fish are, employ the correct techniques, catch big fish, not every time but it is only a matter of time. Good Comm guys do it every year, year in and year out, I would fish hard no doubt, put in 17 hours one outing as I remember.
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Old 02-09-2020, 05:56 PM   #18
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All the good comm guys couldn’t even fill the quota in Mass this year. I wonder what happened
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Old 02-09-2020, 10:31 PM   #19
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ya beat me to it Chris ><><

But no worries. after the meeting tomorrow …..with options for REC & the 3rd category / the poor charter boats that have their own set of rules ><.

you,ll be able to catch bass of approx. 10 to 25# &&& all the fish over & under that will have to be thrown back ...LOL
.. &&&&&&&&&& who catching 50,s & releasing them .

watch the [OTHER} market .kick in high gear . & depending what Ma does .it could be a massive xluster F U ck

Don,t go to the meeting & voice your opinion / that way ya all can continue to bitch on how things are working out …….. you can raise new option of a realistic one .BUT some of us have already been told by someone representing the state / what,s it going to be

ENJOY WHAT YOU HAVE !!!

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Old 02-09-2020, 10:34 PM   #20
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Joey Fu ck it …..why should you worry ……..you have your own special way of measuring fish ><>.

will eels live in a saltwater swimming pool


><>< O U C H ><

ENJOY WHAT YOU HAVE !!!

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Old 02-10-2020, 08:00 AM   #21
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If one really thinks about why the Derby committee eliminated striped bass as an eligible species, it might not sound as honorable as some (myself initially) were making it out to be. It was already known prior to last week's ASMFC meeting that MA did not submit any conservation equivalency measures which meant going into Tuesday's meeting they only had one option: 28 - >35 slot. Did the Derby committee "do the right thing" by eliminating striped bass or did they make an announcement that was almost inevitable being that no one will be able to keep a fish over 35 inches in Massachusetts beginning this year...

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Maybe you should just be allowed to keep a fish 28" to 34" over 48" and or 50 lbs (you would have to carry a Boga If you are trophy hunting)
I had a conversation with one of the ASMFC reps and asked about a trophy tag. Essentially there are two problems with such an option. First off, by giving a trophy tag, which would result in additional harvest, you need to make it up elsewhere meaning a smaller slot range, for example. Second, calculating how much harvest would need to be reduced elsewhere with the tag is very difficult. Supposedly it was discussed between the reps but was quickly shot down.

"Out there in the surf is where it's at, that's where the line gets drawn in the sand between those who talk fishing and those who live it."
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Old 02-10-2020, 08:21 AM   #22
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All the good comm guys couldn’t even fill the quota in Mass this year. I wonder what happened
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I believe RI did not get filled either. I am not saying all the commercial guys are good. There are seasoned surf guys that did not even break 20 pounds this past year. Not looking for an argument, just sharing my point of view from 30 years in the surf.

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Old 02-10-2020, 08:51 AM   #23
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I believe RI did not get filled either. I am not saying all the commercial guys are good. There are seasoned surf guys that did not even break 20 pounds this past year. Not looking for an argument, just sharing my point of view from 30 years in the surf.
I would have agreed with your original statement if the year were 2005. There are still isolated concentrations of quality fish available for competent boat anglers. These pockets of fish are becoming more of a rarity. Newport had a good year and they also did well outside Boston harbor. Block Island is essentially the OK corral. Twenty years ago you could do damage just about anywhere on the coast. The standard of what constitutes a trophy striped bass is about to change significantly.
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Old 02-10-2020, 11:54 AM   #24
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" The standard of what constitutes a trophy striped bass is about to change significantly."

sadly, I agree big time. last season I was truly appreciating fish that wouldnt even raise my heart rate 5 years ago.
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Old 02-10-2020, 02:02 PM   #25
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If one really thinks about why the Derby committee eliminated striped bass as an eligible species, it might not sound as honorable as some (myself initially) were making it out to be. It was already known prior to last week's ASMFC meeting that MA did not submit any conservation equivalency measures which meant going into Tuesday's meeting they only had one option: 28 - >35 slot. Did the Derby committee "do the right thing" by eliminating striped bass or did they make an announcement that was almost inevitable being that no one will be able to keep a fish over 35 inches in Massachusetts beginning this year...
My initial thought was that their hand was forced.
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Old 02-10-2020, 07:33 PM   #26
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" The standard of what constitutes a trophy striped bass is about to change significantly."

sadly, I agree big time. last season I was truly appreciating fish that wouldnt even raise my heart rate 5 years ago.
I think it wasn't until sept that I finally broke 20# from shore this past year and I was depressed. Way too many long hard nites of a lot of water covered by me and frank town with ideal conditions and absolutely nothing. And I mean not even flip flops or tiny blues. That is turf from canal to Newport. Felt like we were fishing in February. Ghost town. Seems fish have changed their patterns to more of the south shore and points north. Why? No idea. There was plenty of bait around. Just no fish. I think it is a combination of too many sea bass eating everything, seals, and sharks. Even canal was very sporadic other than 3 locations of about 100 feet of shore line that were a shat show. Witnessed what a joke law enforcement was in those 3 areas on several occasions as I watched English as a second language folks blatantly smuggling loads of fish out of those areas on non commercial nites on several occasions. It is a bad situation we are in both as recreational and commercial fisherman.
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Old 02-11-2020, 08:38 AM   #27
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Things are down rite bad as far as big fish are concerned. The shore line was littered with fish up to 24" or so from july thru the end of October. No news flash that the breeding population is in trouble. I am going to submit my recommendation for option 3, 28 to 35" NO SPLIT MODE. If we do not address this now the stripe bass fishery could be pushed to a point o no return. We need to suck it up for at least 3 years but prob more like 5 years. With that being said how do we keep the interest of all the surf, boat and people that book charters.
Allow fish 50 pounds and over to be harvested from the surf and fish 60 pounds and over harvested by boat. Everyone still has a shot and is motivated to spend the same money they have been spending every year for a shot at "The Holy Grail" of stripe bass fishing!! It evens the playing field for boat and surf fishermen also.

The experienced know that Stripe Bass over 16, or so, pounds do not taste as good and are not as good or you as the fish under 16 pounds. 28 t0 35" is just about perfect?
Educate the younger people and the boat clients to that fact.
We can change the mentality pretty quickly and we all will be better off for it.

I did not get the address last night to send my response to RIDEM. I am sure someone will have it here. I urge every surf person here and everyone you know to support option 3 if you want to be able to catch any stripe bass at all. I have a feeling a moratorium might be coming, it might be too late for this or any other option to work.

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Old 02-11-2020, 09:20 AM   #28
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Allow fish 50 pounds and over to be harvested from the surf and fish 60 pounds and over harvested by boat. Everyone still has a shot and is motivated to spend the same money they have been spending every year for a shot at "The Holy Grail" of stripe bass fishing!! It evens the playing field for boat and surf fishermen also.
See my above quote to you about why a trophy tag/fish was not brought into the discussion by the ASMFC.

"Out there in the surf is where it's at, that's where the line gets drawn in the sand between those who talk fishing and those who live it."
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Old 02-11-2020, 09:51 AM   #29
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The harvest of 50 and 60 pound fish would be negligible. The trophy tag considerations were probably more like 44" and above which would have a big impact. 50 and 60 pound fish would add what? Perhaps no doubt less than 100 fish in total to the harvest?
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Old 02-11-2020, 10:02 AM   #30
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Game fish status or a moratorium. Everything else is a band aid and when you pull a band aid off a cut they just bleed and get infected. That's exactly what will happen with all the current offering. JMO

No boat, back in the suds.
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