Black Monday here we come

[UserRemoved1]

S&P downgrades U.S. credit rating for first time - The Washington Post

Hold on to your hats boys n girls

Thank you O'bama. Another legacy for your presidency.

[buckman]

Damn Bush!!!

[spence]

Originally Posted by buckman

Damn Bush!!!

Congress more than anything. Your Tea Party infusion has resulted in the lowest congressional ratings ever.

Perhaps we can pray our credit rating back

-spence

[striperman36]

gold eft's

Have to call my broker now.

[buckman]

Originally Posted by spence

Congress more than anything. Your Tea Party infusion has resulted in the lowest congressional ratings ever.

Perhaps we can pray our credit rating back

-spence

So your blaming the tea party?? unfriggin real Spence. According to you they are a bunch of powerless fringe right nut jobs.

[scottw]

Originally Posted by spence

Congress more than anything. Your Tea Party infusion has resulted in the lowest congressional ratings ever.

Perhaps we can pray our credit rating back

-spence

really?

July 16, 2008

Congressional Approval Hits Record-Low

Congress' job approval rating has dropped five percentage points over the past month, from 19% in June to 14% in July, making the current reading the lowest congressional job approval rating in the 34-year Gallup Poll history of asking the question. The previous low was 18%, last reached in May.


Huffington Post 8/4/11
Strictly speaking, these new results are not the "lowest ever" for Congress, but they come close. Congressional approval as measured by a half dozen or more media polls has been trending downward since 2009, and also hit a similar low in the second half of 2008. Gallup found congressional approval as low as 14 percent in March 2010 and the CBS/New York Times poll tracked approval as low as 14 percent in the same month and at 12 percent in October 2008.

[RIROCKHOUND]

Originally Posted by buckman

So your blaming the tea party?? unfriggin real Spence. According to you they are a bunch of powerless fringe right nut jobs.

No.
I blame the stupid infighting and lack of anything getting done ON BOTH SIDES.

Out of Afganastan, Out of Irag, End the bush tax rates and things would be a lot rosier IMHO.

neither side has the balls to do that.

[BigFish]

The terrorists are winning.......in case nobody has noticed? Their 911 shenanigans has driven this country to financial ruin!!! Their attack went beyond taking down the towers and killing 3000 people....they have managed to change the way we live.....and are slowly draining our financial resources?!?!?!?? We just keep molly coddling these middle eastern countries though.....Kuwait....what have you done for us lately????? We are trying to free Iraq??? Hows that going??? We got Bin Laden so why the "F" are we not out of Afghanistan yet!?!?!?!?! ITS TIME TO START TAKING CARE OF THOSE WHO ARE US CITIZENS!!!!

[scottw]

Originally Posted by RIROCKHOUND

End the bush tax rates and things would be a lot rosier IMHO.

yeah...raising taxes as we slip into a double dip would be just brilliant

[spence]

Originally Posted by buckman

So your blaming the tea party?? unfriggin real Spence. According to you they are a bunch of powerless fringe right nut jobs.

I never said they were powerless. And yes, a lot of the blame should go to the Tea Party and an intolerant position that made it impossible for the House Speaker to do his job.

Boehner and Obama had a deal, they blew it up. The result is a credit downgrade that will further hut the economy.

Unfriggin real is right.

-spence

[RIROCKHOUND]

Originally Posted by scottw

yeah...raising taxes as we slip into a double dip would be just brilliant

Simpson Bowles.
Cuts and some increases in revenue are NEEDED.

[spence]

Originally Posted by scottw

really?

You can't compare results from different polls.

Here's a more interesting look.

Worst. Congress. Ever. - By Norman Ornstein | Foreign Policy

Also...

And after the combative and exhaustive debt debate, it appears the American public agrees with him. Per a brand-new New York Times/CBS poll, 82% now disapprove of Congress’ job, which is a record high in that poll. A CNN poll also had Congress’ disapproval at an all-time high of 84%. Here are more numbers from the NYT/CBS survey: 72% disapproved how congressional Republican handled the debt negotiations, while 66% said that of congressional Dems and 47% said that of Obama; the Tea Party’s fav/unfav is now 20%-40%, compared with 26%-29% back in April; and by a margin of greater than 2-to-1, respondents said creating jobs should be a higher priority than spending cuts. The best news for Obama this entire week? His job approval (48%-47%) remains relatively unchanged. By comparison, however, House Speaker John Boehner’s disapproval rating has sky-rocketed to 57%.

First Read - First Thoughts: Better than expected

[spence]

Originally Posted by RIROCKHOUND

Simpson Bowles.
Cuts and some increases in revenue are NEEDED.

Simpson is a liberal uncle#^&#^&#^&#^&er.

-spence

[scottw]

Originally Posted by spence

You can't compare results from different polls.

...

right..just stick to the MSNBC<NYT< CNN< CBS polls

you said...

"Your Tea Party infusion has resulted in the lowest congressional ratings ever."

not true....as usual

[scottw]

Originally Posted by RIROCKHOUND

Simpson Bowles.
Cuts and some increases in revenue are NEEDED.

Obama's budget proposal earlier in the year told us what he thought of Simpson Bowles

the best way to "some increases in revenue" is to grow the economy....not increase taxes in an already bad economy....increased taxes and regulation inhibit economic growth...I know that these are new concepts...

[Jim in CT]

Ririckhound -

"Out of Afganastan, Out of Irag..."

That is happening, and this was factored into the debt downgrade.

"End the bush tax rates and things would be a lot rosier IMHO."

Does it mean anything to you, anything at all, that tax revenues collected were HIGHER after Bush cut all of our tax rates? First of all, are you aware of that fact? Second, if you are aware, then why don't you get the idea that tax revenues collected DO NOT always move proportionately with tax rates?

When a guy like Paul Ryan has the courage to say "we need to fix this", it's THE LIBERALS who respond by saying "YOU HATE OLD PEOPLE"!!!

What we need is consensus that we're on a disastrous track, but liberals keep saying we don't need to change medicare and social security. They are denying irrefuatble facts. Hence my often stated position that it's a mental disorder. No sane, rational person can say that we don't need major changes to medicare and social security.

Our current $14 trillion debt is PEANUTS compared to medicare, medicaid, and social security. Liberals, as a group, will not admit that. I don't know what planet they live on...

[striperman36]

Originally Posted by BigFish

The terrorists are winning.......in case nobody has noticed? Their 911 shenanigans has driven this country to financial ruin!!! Their attack went beyond taking down the towers and killing 3000 people....they have managed to change the way we live.....and are slowly draining our financial resources?!?!?!?? We just keep molly coddling these middle eastern countries though.....Kuwait....what have you done for us lately????? We are trying to free Iraq??? Hows that going??? We got Bin Laden so why the "F" are we not out of Afghanistan yet!?!?!?!?! ITS TIME TO START TAKING CARE OF THOSE WHO ARE US CITIZENS!!!!

Isn't that what Reagan did to the USSR?
So true Larry.

[spence]

Originally Posted by scottw

right..just stick to the MSNBC<NYT< CNN< CBS polls

No, it means if you want to compare numbers make sure they were captured in a consistent manner. Not rocket science.

"Your Tea Party infusion has resulted in the lowest congressional ratings ever."

not true....as usual

Read the article, it's interesting.

-spence

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by BigFish

The terrorists are winning.......in case nobody has noticed? Their 911 shenanigans has driven this country to financial ruin!!! Their attack went beyond taking down the towers and killing 3000 people....they have managed to change the way we live.....and are slowly draining our financial resources?!?!?!?? We just keep molly coddling these middle eastern countries though.....Kuwait....what have you done for us lately????? We are trying to free Iraq??? Hows that going??? We got Bin Laden so why the "F" are we not out of Afghanistan yet!?!?!?!?! ITS TIME TO START TAKING CARE OF THOSE WHO ARE US CITIZENS!!!!

"Their 911 shenanigans has driven this country to financial ruin!!!"

Wrong. Reckless, stupid spending is leading us to ruin. An Addiction to welfare and entitlements are leading us to financial ruin.

"We are trying to free Iraq??? Hows that going???"

It's going spectacularly well, in fact. Iraq is now a pro-western democracy (though still fledgling). Those people are way better off now, than they were before we stepped in. I'm not necessarily saying it was worth the price we paid, but the fact is, Iraq is the closest thing to a free democracy that there is in that region. Bush speculated the once democracy took hold in Iraq that it would "spread like pollen", and all the protests in neighboring countries seem to suggest he was exactly right on that score.

[BigFish]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

"Their 911 shenanigans has driven this country to financial ruin!!!"

Wrong. Reckless, stupid spending is leading us to ruin. An Addiction to welfare and entitlements are leading us to financial ruin.

"We are trying to free Iraq??? Hows that going???"

It's going spectacularly well, in fact. Iraq is now a pro-western democracy (though still fledgling). Those people are way better off now, than they were before we stepped in. I'm not necessarily saying it was worth the price we paid, but the fact is, Iraq is the closest thing to a free democracy that there is in that region. Bush speculated the once democracy took hold in Iraq that it would "spread like pollen", and all the protests in neighboring countries seem to suggest he was exactly right on that score.

If anyone here does not believe that 911 has cost the US untold TRILLIONS of dollars then you are a fool. We are running 2 different wars as a result....lives lost, dollars pissed away and YES....all because 911 happened....the rest is a drop in the bucket!

Once we "withdraw" from Iraq....they will soon resume their old ways and fall back into the way things used to be....do not kid yourself!

PS-Homeland Security ring a bell???? Trillions spent right there on measures to ensure our security....if thats at all possible.

[buckman]

Originally Posted by RIROCKHOUND

No.
I blame the stupid infighting and lack of anything getting done ON BOTH SIDES.

Out of Afganastan, Out of Irag, End the bush tax rates and things would be a lot rosier IMHO.

neither side has the balls to do that.

Hmmmm... you forgot Lybia and the cost of Obama care

[spence]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

"End the bush tax rates and things would be a lot rosier IMHO."

Does it mean anything to you, anything at all, that tax revenues collected were HIGHER after Bush cut all of our tax rates? First of all, are you aware of that fact? Second, if you are aware, then why don't you get the idea that tax revenues collected DO NOT always move proportionately with tax rates?

Haven't we covered this topic enough in earlier Debunking GOP Myths 101 sessions?

Bush cut taxes in 2001 and 2003 which immediately led to a DECREASE in tax revenues exacerbated by a slumping economy. It wasn't until 2005 that tax receipts were higher than when Bush took office. We all know that the 2005-2008 run up was being fueled by a credit bubble and not real organic growth.

In fact, I'm not sure there's much evidence that the Bush tax cuts did much more than redistribute wealth upwards and increase the size of the federal debt. Did the rich invest in job creation or just get richer? The growing income inequality during the 2000's is one measure.

So given that taxes are at an historic low and we have a massive deficit problem to solve...here's a good question.

If raising taxes was perfectly acceptable for Ronald Reagan, who did it 16 times I believe, why is it such a taboo subject that the GOP is shunning it's own conservatives who subscribe to the same pragmatic position?

Reagan seems to be the source of divine inspiration for the low tax pledge, and yet in practice he was a tax raising big spender?

Perhaps modern conservatism's foundation is weaker than one might imagine.

-spence

[scottw]

Originally Posted by spence

No, it means if you want to compare numbers make sure they were captured in a consistent manner. Not rocket science.


Read the article, it's interesting.

-spence

why would I bother to read crap that you link from biased sources to expound on another of your demonstrably false statements ?

[scottw]

Originally Posted by spence

Haven't we covered this topic enough in earlier Debunking GOP Myths 101 sessions?

Bush cut taxes in 2001 and 2003 which immediately led to a DECREASE in tax revenues exacerbated by a slumping economy. It wasn't until 2005 that tax receipts were higher than when Bush took office. We all know that the 2005-2008 run up was being fueled by a credit bubble and not real organic growth.

In fact, I'm not sure there's much evidence that the Bush tax cuts did much more than redistribute wealth upwards and increase the size of the federal debt. Did the rich invest in job creation or just get richer? The growing income inequality during the 2000's is one measure.

So given that taxes are at an historic low and we have a massive deficit problem to solve...here's a good question.

If raising taxes was perfectly acceptable for Ronald Reagan, who did it 16 times I believe, why is it such a taboo subject that the GOP is shunning it's own conservatives who subscribe to the same pragmatic position?

Reagan seems to be the source of divine inspiration for the low tax pledge, and yet in practice he was a tax raising big spender?

Perhaps modern conservatism's foundation is weaker than one might imagine.

-spence

wow...a Spence OP Ed...we know what that's worth...

yes we have covered this and debunked all of your bunk

[justplugit]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

What we need is consensus that we're on a disastrous track, but liberals keep saying we don't need to change medicare and social security. They are denying irrefuatble facts.

...

They are also denying the fact that we are broke and can't afford
business as usual, that is reality. Everyone has to sacrafice to get
us back on track, including the 51% of those who don't pay any
taxes.

The way to bring in revenue is to create jobs and therefore put
more people on the tax rolls.

Oh and BTW, Spence, God is not mocked.

[RIROCKHOUND]

Originally Posted by buckman

Hmmmm... you forgot Lybia and the cost of Obama care

No, I didn't. I'm not sure what they can do w/ Lybia right now. They are in, I didn't want them to be, but now what?

[spence]

Originally Posted by justplugit

They are also denying the fact that we are broke and can't afford business as usual, that is reality. Everyone has to sacrafice to get us back on track, including the 51% of those who don't pay any taxes.

The way to bring in revenue is to create jobs and therefore put
more people on the tax rolls.

You can't have it both ways. Hit the middle class with a larger tax burden and there's no money to buy goods and services...supply side alone doesn't work.

To create more taxpayers through job growth will require innovation, education and inspiration.

Oh and BTW, Spence, God is not mocked.

I wasn't mocking God, I was mocking Michelle Bachmann. Oh, and God happened to think it was pretty funny

-spence

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by spence

You can't have it both ways. Hit the middle class with a larger tax burden and there's no money to buy goods and services...supply side alone doesn't work.

To create more taxpayers through job growth will require innovation, education and inspiration.


I wasn't mocking God, I was mocking Michelle Bachmann. Oh, and God happened to think it was pretty funny

-spence

Spence -


"Hit the middle class with a larger tax burden"

Who, exactly, hit the middle class with a larger tax burden? NOT BUSH, because afetr his tax cuts, the wealthiest Americans paid a HIGHER share of the total tax burden. That reduces the tax burden on the middle class.

Spence, please, get some facts. I could post a thousand links supporting my position...here is one...

Bush tax cuts - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"The Wall Street Journal editorial page states that taxes paid by millionaire households more than doubled from $136 billion in 2003 to $274 billion in 2006 because of the JGTRRA"

Spence, you are entitled to your own opinions, not to your own facts. It is irrefutable fact that wealthy Americans paid a HIGHER percentage of the tax burden, after the Bush cuts. Bush also lowered your tax rate, and mine, by the way...

[justplugit]

Originally Posted by spence

To create more taxpayers through job growth will require innovation, education and inspiration.

Oh, and God happened to think it was pretty funny

-spence

I agree, that's what it will take but I don't see any new innovative ideas
coming out of this administration.
Until that happens take the regulation cuffs off our companies, and do away with
Obama care so they will have the confidence to expand and hire.

Oh, and you are right, God has a GREAT sense of humor.

[buckman]

Originally Posted by RIROCKHOUND

No, I didn't. I'm not sure what they can do w/ Lybia right now. They are in, I didn't want them to be, but now what?

How about the old stand by?? Surge baby