required viewing tonight...

[spence]

Originally Posted by Flaptail

The Europeans are better off than we are

And the irony is that it may actually be true...after listening to the Right Wing rhetoric that the EU's socialist leanings are ripping it apart...

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/new...cle3617160.ece

A one-year investigation and analysis of 235 countries by Jane's Information Services has put the UK joint seventh in the premier league of nations with the US at 22nd and Switzerland, normally associated with wealth and untouchable stability, is rated 17th.

Here is the full list:

1 Vatican

2 Sweden

3 Luxembourg

4 Monaco

5 Gibraltar

6 San Marino

7 Liechtenstein

8 UK

9 Netherlands

10 Ireland

11 New Zealand

12 Denmark

13 Austria

14 Andorra

15 Germany

16 Iceland

17 Switzerland

18 Portugal

19 Australia

20 Norway

21 Malta

22 France

23 Canada

24 USA

25 Belgium

26 Spain

27 Italy

28 Japan

29 Finland

30 Czech Rep

31 Samoa

32 Falkland Islands

33 Singapore

34 Guam

35 Slovakia

36 Anguilla

37 Cyprus

38 Qatar

39 Montserrat

40 Costa Rica

41 Greece

42 St Pierre and Miq

43 UAE

44 Cayman Islands

45 American Samoa

46 Virgin Islands (UK)

47 Poland

48 St Lucia

49 Oman

50 Commonwealth of the Northern Mariana Islands

[Nebe]

but where are the 13 virgins i was promised?

[Nebe]

and the earth shattering kaboom?

sheesh.

[striperman36]

Nice,
Falling fast.

[scottw]

so why are we being inundated with people moving here from the countries listed and others and why aren't Americans flocking in hordes to all of these countries of wealth and opportunity, just wondering? Oh that's right , all of America is in a soup line...Just like Frontline, Al Gore, Michael Moore...grab something and report the part that moves forward your agenda, ya know, everytime I watch Frontline I notice that the object or their attack is always shown in unflattering black and white pictures with ominous music playing behind it, give me a break.. did you see the MORMON's bit...WHO ARE THEY? WHAT DO THEY REALLY BELIEVE? DO THEY REALLY EAT THEIR CHILDREN? Dark pictures and scary music, Frontline is a joke, I can't believe they get public money to produce this stuff... just as Al Gore who can not longer be found since the earth and it's oceans are no longer warming(check the story on the NPR website), he'll show up this summer when it's hot again probably claim credit for the internet again and stopping global warming in it's tracks, fraud...Michael Moore has been completely discredited

below are some of the remarks to the stable and prosperous countries list that were not included.....I wouldn't move to any of them...












For any would-be expats, you may also want to check the Gini coefficient which shows wealth distribution, transparency internationals corruption index and the economists quality of life index. This would give a balanced picture of how stability and prosperity can be measured.

Dan Hathway, san rafael, argentina

Some of these are not really independent countries at all- Montserrat, the British Virgin Islands and the Falkland Islands are British colonies or territories, while Guam and American Samoa are U.S. colonies- Their "stability and prosperity" is really as much a reflection of the countries which they are colonies of as it is anything else-

-Since when has Cyprus become "stable" by any definition?

Scott Benowitz, Rye, New York , U.S.A.

Up through the top 30, all these countries are so close to each other that someone traveling between each one would hardly notice any real (non-cultural) differences in prosperity.



Andy, Lexington, KY, USA

Nice to see Portugal coming in at a relatively lofty 18th position. Only just below Switzerland, with infinitely better weather and very much friendlier people. So at least i haven't "traded down" too significantly.

peter koeb, odeceixe, portugal

One must question the credibility and reliability of Jane's information Services when it does not include Bermuda in it's top ten list, let alone it's top fifty. Bermuda has one of the highest standards of living and has consistently been in the World Bank's, and other internation institutions, top ten countries in terms of wealth and quality of life countries.

Michael Mapp, New York, U S A

Btw, these 'prosperity' figures include the houses that we own - yes the very same ones that could well crash.....
it also doesn't include the £43billion of debt (including Northern Rock) that the UK is riding on.

Janes is UK based, and therefore susceptible to political bias and motivation. It is also not an accurate reflection of where this country will be in 18 months; ironically when Mr Brown is getting nearer to having to hold a general Election.

Drew, Manchester,

[RIJIMMY]

im just saying that these things have been going on for years, whats the truth, what is wacky consipracy theory. thats all

[Nebe]

you cant accept the truth

[RIJIMMY]

Originally Posted by Nebe

History has already defined itself. It has been proven over and over agian that the world was lied to about the reasons that we should have gone in there.

Eb- but you're only listening to the sources that the media publishes, period. There are other sources, some very intelligent, credible people that do not support the Bush conspiracy therory. Not repubs, or pundits. My only point is dont take all that you see as true or proven, its ALL slanted.

[Nebe]

Jim, it is not a conspiracy. A conspiracy is when something is suspicious but it cant be proven otherwise. You really need to watch that documentary. Facts are facts.

[RIJIMMY]

heres a quick read - a stanford professor, so not a hub of republican thought

http://daily.stanford.edu/article/20...orTheWarInIraq

[RIJIMMY]

facts are facts? depends on who is telling the story.

[Nebe]

That was a good read. However, the fact remains that you need to watch the show.

[RIJIMMY]

I'll get the dvd, I promise.

[EarnedStripes44]

Originally Posted by Bronko

Wow. The gang is all lathered up today.

Thats right baby, Arm and Hammer. You better believe it, here to wash away faulty logic for the common good

[spence]

Originally Posted by RIJIMMY

heres a quick read - a stanford professor, so not a hub of republican thought

http://daily.stanford.edu/article/20...orTheWarInIraq

But he isn't really making a case for war, he's making the case that Saddam was a problem child.

Making the case for war requires making the case for urgency, that there are no other options. For Iraq the President had to prove Saddam was linked to al Qaida and harboring WMD.

We've now come to realize that there were really almost no facts the Administration was basing these assertions on, which diminished both the level of the threat and the urgency required for action. But like the good sheep we are, most of the Congress, most of the media and most of the American people fell right in line still shell shocked from 9/11.

The in effect made the war in Iraq not a "pre-emptive" war as it was billed, but rather a "pre-ventative" war in which we were stemming the problem before it really grew into one. The ethical issues with this notion of the use of US power are indeed extremely serious.

And that's ignoring the fact that a lot of Americans still believe the Iraq war was retaliation for 9/11!

-spence

[spence]

Originally Posted by scottw

so why are we being inundated with people moving here from the countries listed and others and why aren't Americans flocking in hordes to all of these countries of wealth and opportunity, just wondering?

A) because we have a giagantic and uncontrolled border.

B) because nobody can sell their house to move!

-spence

[scottw]

that's it, I'm packing up my family and moving to VATICAN... wait, is that ....The Vatican..... where the Pope lives or is that some country that I've never heard of before that is apparently doing very well in relation to the USA??

[spence]

Originally Posted by scottw

that's it, I'm packing up my family and moving to VATICAN... wait, is that ....The Vatican..... where the Pope lives or is that some country that I've never heard of before that is apparently doing very well in relation to the USA??

I'd wager the per capita income is pretty high

-spence

[scottw]

wow, USA 93 out of 100 (partly because of the proliferation of small arms owned by Americans and the threat to the population posed by the flow of drugs from across the Mexican border.)
, Iraq not at the bottom because of it's "relatively stable government "





The global check on every country recognised as an individual state or territory by the United Nations was carried out by Jane’s Information Group and is published today.

Christian Le Mière, managing editor of Jane’s Country Risk, which compiled the ratings, said: “The UK is a very stable country. But the top 20 or 30 countries are all stable. There are terrorist groups in the UK but there are effective security forces to deal with them. We took the July 7 bombings into account but the UK still came out very well.”

He acknowledged that it was a little unfair to put the Vatican at the top because it did not face the sort of threats and economic pressures of other countries. But under the rating system, which took into account each nation’s political structures, social and economic trends, military and security risks and external relations, the Vatican state scored an average of 99 out of 100. Sweden and Luxembourg were also rated 99, with the UK not far off, with an average of 97, but scoring 100 for its politics, economics and external relations.

Mr Le Mière said that the US had fallen down the scale, although it still scored an average of 93 out of 100, partly because of the proliferation of small arms owned by Americans and the threat to the population posed by the flow of drugs from across the Mexican border.

He explained that Iraq had managed to escape the ignominy of being in the bottom ten because, despite “extremely high levels of violence”, it had a “relatively stable Government” that controlled a significant area of the country and had good economic prospects. “Unlike Afghanistan, where – despite the presence of more than 40,000 foreign troops – the Government exercises poor control over large parts of the country and where 50 per cent of the economy is dependent on the opium trade,” he said.

[Joe]

The average Frenchwoman spends 20% of her clothes budget on lingerie. No wonder we hate them so.

[scottw]

hey Joe, according to his tax returns that's 19% more than Obama gives to charity...some lib...ooops, not allowed to call him that anymore either...