Republican Party is...

[detbuch]

Originally Posted by wdmso

Republicans are pro life accept when it comes to Covid hummm?..
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This is one of the most pathetic comments you've made.

[Pete F.]

Originally Posted by detbuch

This is one of the most pathetic comments you've made.

Pales in comparison to your defense of Tweety.

Here’s the administration’s prolife stance, because in this case some should die so it doesn’t disrupt the lives of others or is it just plain money.

A top Trump appointee, Paul Alexander, repeatedly urged top health officials to adopt a "herd immunity" approach to Covid-19 and allow millions of Americans to be infected by the virus, according to Politico.

"We want them infected," he said.
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[wdmso]

Originally Posted by detbuch

This is one of the most pathetic comments you've made.

Usual reaction to the truth
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[detbuch]

Originally Posted by Pete F.

Pales in comparison to your defense of Tweety.

Here’s the administration’s prolife stance, because in this case some should die so it doesn’t disrupt the lives of others or is it just plain money.

A top Trump appointee, Paul Alexander, repeatedly urged top health officials to adopt a "herd immunity" approach to Covid-19 and allow millions of Americans to be infected by the virus, according to Politico.

"We want them infected," he said.

Infection is the natural process to achieve herd immunity. Vaccine is an artificial infection that is presumably safer than natural. Vaccine "infects" with a more harmless strain. Protecting the vulnerable while allowing the mass population -- of which 99% are not statistically at risk of dying from covid--is the way to achieve natural herd immunity. Having the vaccine here, in a phenomenally quick time, allows us to switch the method toward infection and herd immunity. Sweden went this route But it failed to protect the vulnerable--had they done that, it would have severely cut down on the number of deaths.

[Pete F.]

Originally Posted by detbuch

Infection is the natural process to achieve herd immunity. Vaccine is an artificial infection that is presumably safer than natural. Vaccine "infects" with a more harmless strain. Protecting the vulnerable while allowing the mass population -- of which 99% are not statistically at risk of dying from covid--is the way to achieve natural herd immunity. Having the vaccine here, in a phenomenally quick time, allows us to switch the method toward infection and herd immunity. Sweden went this route But it failed to protect the vulnerable--had they done that, it would have severely cut down on the number of deaths.

Sweden has admitted that they took the wrong approach largely because with the care needed by the vulnerable, they are not able to be isolated.

In this country achieving herd immunity without a vaccine is projected to kill between 1 and 2 Million Americans and could leave millions more with unknown lingering symptoms that would then qualify as uninsurable pre-existing conditions.

The long term effects of covid infection are not yet known.

Since December 2019, COVID-19 has killed more people in the U.S. than influenza has in the last five years.

Many more people are susceptible to COVID-19 because there is little preexisting immunity to the virus that causes it—SARS-CoV-2. Through vaccinations and previous infections, a portion of the population has some immunity to influenza, which helps limit the number of cases we see each year.

COVID-19 has a higher severe disease and mortality rate than influenza in all age groups, except perhaps children under the age of 12.

COVID-19 survivors report many more long-term effects of the infection than influenza survivors. Lingering symptoms like weakness, shortness of breath, trouble focusing and, in some cases, kidney and heart problems are much more common after COVID-19 than after influenza.

“Mild” COVID-19 illness has been described as “flu-like.” It’s important to remember that the flu is a pretty debilitating disease so “mild” COVID-19 is still a pretty significant disease.

With all infectious diseases, we focus on two main objectives:

1. Treat the infected people
2. Limit the spread of the infection in the population.

A large number of COVID-19 patients present with no or very mild symptoms, but those individuals can still transmit the virus to others, some of whom could have a much more serious course of illness. Every person who gets infected keeps the “chains of transmission” going, which can bring COVID-19 to those who are more vulnerable.

[scottw]

Originally Posted by wdmso

Usual reaction to the truth
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wayne, you believe everything you believe and regurgitate is truth and anything that disagrees with your truth is conspiracy theory.....that's self-delusion

[scottw]

Originally Posted by Pete F.

Sweden has admitted that they took the wrong approach largely because with the care needed by the vulnerable, they are not able to be isolated.

In this country achieving herd immunity without a vaccine is projected to kill between 1 and 2 Million Americans and could leave millions more with unknown lingering symptoms that would then qualify as uninsurable pre-existing conditions.

The long term effects of covid infection are not yet known.

Since December 2019, COVID-19 has killed more people in the U.S. than influenza has in the last five years.

Many more people are susceptible to COVID-19 because there is little preexisting immunity to the virus that causes it—SARS-CoV-2. Through vaccinations and previous infections, a portion of the population has some immunity to influenza, which helps limit the number of cases we see each year.

COVID-19 has a higher severe disease and mortality rate than influenza in all age groups, except perhaps children under the age of 12.

COVID-19 survivors report many more long-term effects of the infection than influenza survivors. Lingering symptoms like weakness, shortness of breath, trouble focusing and, in some cases, kidney and heart problems are much more common after COVID-19 than after influenza.

“Mild” COVID-19 illness has been described as “flu-like.” It’s important to remember that the flu is a pretty debilitating disease so “mild” COVID-19 is still a pretty significant disease.

With all infectious diseases, we focus on two main objectives:

1. Treat the infected people
2. Limit the spread of the infection in the population.

A large number of COVID-19 patients present with no or very mild symptoms, but those individuals can still transmit the virus to others, some of whom could have a much more serious course of illness. Every person who gets infected keeps the “chains of transmission” going, which can bring COVID-19 to those who are more vulnerable.

it's fun when peter tries to lecture

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by wdmso

Republicans are pro life accept when it comes to Covid hummm?..
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WTF are you talking about? Nancy Pelosi admitted that she blocked passing a smaller relief bill, but now that Biden won, she'll vote for it. She admitted that.

WHat is your evidence that democrats care more "people" than Republicans? Because the data shows clearly that conservatives are actually more likely to give money and time to charity, than liberals, and if you consider the role that religion plays on both sides, that is to be expected.

Also waiting for you to support your absurd claim that Republicans blame Biden for the recent covid spike.

Gov Cuomo killed thousands by forcing nursing homes to admit covid-positive patients, this was long after we all knew it was going to target the elderly. But you have nothing to say about that. None of you do.

republican=bad, democrat=good. We get it.

How about you think for yourself, for two consecutive seconds, and see how it feels? Just two consecutive seconds.

God you're a simpleton.

WHo started the Chicago fire, Wayne? Sarah Palin?

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by wdmso

Usual reaction to the truth
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Its truth, because you say it?

Here's some truth.

The New York Times of all places, published the results of a study that showed that conservatives are actually a little bit more charitable than liberals.

Explain how what you said is "truth", given this data please. We're ALL EARS.

https://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/21/o...21kristof.html

[Pete F.]

Ackshully, The victims are skyscreaming again
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[spence]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

Gov Cuomo killed thousands by forcing nursing homes to admit covid-positive patients, this was long after we all knew it was going to target the elderly. But you have nothing to say about that. None of you do.

Because your description isn’t really true.
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[Pete F.]

Is this Cuomo's fault, or are you claiming that because some other countries failed, that the USA being one of the worst in it's class despite being historically the most prepared and proactive is acceptable to you?

Just to show how much of an outlier the US is from better performing rich, developed countries, here are covid deaths per million people (adjusted for population) since the pandemic began:

Japan: 21
Australia: 35
South Korea: 12
Norway: 74
New Zealand: 5
Taiwan: 0.3

US: 948

[detbuch]

Originally Posted by Pete F.

Is this Cuomo's fault, or are you claiming that because some other countries failed, that the USA being one of the worst in it's class despite being historically the most prepared and proactive is acceptable to you?

Just to show how much of an outlier the US is from better performing rich, developed countries, here are covid deaths per million people (adjusted for population) since the pandemic began:

Japan: 21
Australia: 35
South Korea: 12
Norway: 74
New Zealand: 5
Taiwan: 0.3

US: 948

The U.S. was not the most prepared for covid because, neither at the federal level, nor, more importantly, at the state level, it had not maintained the required stock of supplies. And that lapse predated Trump and there is no evidence that Trump was briefed about it--rather it seems to have been an atrophy of neglect. And testing was delayed because of the built-in hurdles of regulation and protocol of the CDC. Trump had to assert a legal bypass of the regulatory and protocol demands in order to bring preparation and execution up to speed, as well as correcting the supply shortage. Which he did, but time was, systemically, lost.

And comparing those countries to the U.S. is meaningless if you don't consider the extreme differences in law, demographics, and culture between them and us.

South Korea, Taiwan, and Japan are much smaller landmasses with extremely homogenous populations which are culturally far more ready to unquestioningly do the will of their governments. And their governments are far more centralized under a basically unitary legal framework. The other countries, to varying degrees, have similar differences with us. We have a sprawling landmass populated densely in some places and loosely in most others by people of different cultures, ideologies, and levels of willingness to do what government asks or recommends. And each place, whether state or city, is a separate fiefdom united in a federated system which limits and encumbers the national government from dictating uniform types and levels of action.

Trump did his part well and more energetically than many of the other units of our federation. With the political division at all levels, including opposition to, and ridicule for, most anything he did or proposed, he did amazingly well. For instance, he was painted as some kind idiot for saying we might have a vaccine ready to distribute before the end of the year.

He was right, and was instrumental in getting that done.

[scottw]

Originally Posted by Pete F.

Just to show how much of an outlier the US is from better performing rich, developed countries, here are covid deaths per million people (adjusted for population) since the pandemic began:

Japan: 21
Australia: 35
South Korea: 12
Norway: 74
New Zealand: 5
Taiwan: 0.3

US: 948

Belgium 1582
Italy 1113
UK 978
France 912


pete likes to cherry pick...Norway...that's a good comparison

[Got Stripers]

DeBarr has spoken it must be true. Trump did his part are you fuc*ing kidding me, that is a joke. His messaging from the start has taken lives not saved lives, super spreader events, no national mask messaging and just sitting in the residence tweeting and brooding after the election loss.

[scottw]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

DeBarr has spoken it must be true. Trump did his part are you fuc*ing kidding me, that is a joke. His messaging from the start has taken lives not saved lives, super spreader events, no national mask messaging and just sitting in the residence tweeting and brooding after the election loss.

pretty sure he said masks are partiotic...that was way back in the middle of summer I beleive...they wear a lot of masks in california I hear and they are pretty obedient little leftists generally...they had like 50k cases the other day(On Thursday, the state reported a staggering 52,000 new cases in a single day)

[Got Stripers]

Originally Posted by scottw

pretty sure he said masks are partiotic...that was way back in the middle of summer I beleive...they wear a lot of masks in california I hear and they are pretty obedient little leftists generally...they had like 50k cases the other day(On Thursday, the state reported a staggering 52,000 new cases in a single day)

You two are predictable in defense, but Trump has missed so many opportunities to set a national messaging on this pandemic and hasn’t been the leader we needed, but you are o& course entitled to your opinion of his performance. I’d grade it as a D, not even a passing grade, always reactive due to pressure and never proactive based on facts and science.

[detbuch]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

You two are predictable in defense, but Trump has missed so many opportunities to set a national messaging on this pandemic and hasn’t been the leader we needed, but you are o& course entitled to your opinion of his performance. I’d grade it as a D, not even a passing grade, always reactive due to pressure and never proactive based on facts and science.

And you are totally predictable in making unsubstantiated proclamations. Wow--you grade it a D. Such an expert. Perhaps you missed this total beatdown of your expert opinion in the Maybe thread:

[Quote:
Originally Posted by Got Stripers View Post
Another really stupid question, let me schedule a meeting of my cabinet members. Let’s be realistic, in the past war was bloody, messy, expensive and cost lives. This is a new type of warfare and Trump is a weak leader, incapable of handling an attack on our country, he can’t even acknowledge it’s happened.]

This made me chuckle. Trump is accused by you guys of being a tyrant, a Hitler, an autocrat. Then you say he is weak.

He strengthened our military, added a new Space Force which will help the fight against cyber war and China's AI war with us. But you say he is incapable of handling an attack on our country.

As for this being a new type of warfare and Trump being a weak leader not capable of handling an attack and not acknowledging that we are at war, there's this from a June 23. 2019 NBC news article:

"The other side thought they could just walk all over us," said one expert. "There was a decision in this administration to impose consequences." "With little public scrutiny, the U.S. military has drastically stepped up its secret hacking of foreign computer networks in a new effort to keep China, Russia, Iran and other adversaries on their heels, current and former U.S. officials tell NBC News.

Empowered with new legal authority from both Congress and President Donald Trump, the military's elite cyber force has conducted more operations in the first two years of the Trump administration than it did in eight years under Obama, officials say — including against Russia, despite Trump's well-documented affinity for Vladimir Putin.

The general in charge of the push, Paul Nakasone, has spoken about the new policy in cryptic terms such as "persistent engagement," and "defending forward," without explaining what that means. Multiple current and former American officials briefed on the matter say military hackers are breaking into foreign networks, striking at enemy hackers and planting cyber bombs that would disable infrastructure in the event of a conflict. The officials declined to confirm or deny a New York Times report that an element of these classified operations included hacking into Russia's power grid, but they said that such a move would be a standard response to similar behavior by Russia and China. U.S. officials have said that those countries have for years planted malware that could turn out the lights in parts of the U.S.

"This is no different than a spy satellite," one senior U.S. official briefed on the matter told NBC News. "What this is is finding vulnerabilities in people's military and civilian infrastructure. That's how you should think of it."

Over the last decade, U.S. responses to foreign cyberattacks "have been tenuous, they have been episodic, we really haven't done anything," said Nakasone, who is both the commander of U.S. Cyber Command and the director of the National Security Agency, during a question and answer session at the Marshall Forum in April. "We are going to ensure that our adversaries know that there are limits within which they can operate…. No longer are we going to be on the sidelines."

I asked you "What swift and severe punishment are you recommending?" You came up with nothing.

[wdmso]

Originally Posted by scottw

wayne, you believe everything you believe and regurgitate is truth and anything that disagrees with your truth is conspiracy theory.....that's self-delusion

It has nothing to do with disagreeing on an actual point..

But iam sorry if I refuse to entertain lies and falsehoods presented as actual facts..
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[wdmso]

The January 6th Plan is going into operation. Senator Tuberville is onboard whether Rand Paul is or not.

If the January 6th Plan should fail to produce a Trump victory then he will declare martial law and rerun the election under military supervision in the disputed swing states.

We all know who doesn’t disagree with this plan ....
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[scottw]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

but you are o& course entitled to your opinion of his performance. I’d grade it as a D, not even a passing grade,

I believe a D is a passing grade...

[scottw]

Originally Posted by Pete F.

here are covid deaths per million people (adjusted for population) since the pandemic began:

Japan: 21
Australia: 35
South Korea: 12
Norway: 74
New Zealand: 5
Taiwan: 0.3

US: 948

dear pete....

states and dictators with strict measures
NJ 2054
NY 1862
Mass 1684
CT 1565
RI 1534

states and governors maligned for not having stricter measures
Fl 950
TX 885
Sc 946
GA 973

[scottw]

Originally Posted by wdmso

The January 6th Plan is going into operation.
..
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this is very exciting!!

[Pete F.]

Originally Posted by scottw

dear pete....

states and dictators with strict measures
NJ 2054
NY 1862
Mass 1684
CT 1565
RI 1534

states and governors maligned for not having stricter measures
Fl 950
TX 885
Sc 946
GA 973

Don’t worry they are catching up
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[scottw]

Originally Posted by Pete F.

Don’t worry they are catching up
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maybe....probably not

yesterday new deaths

CA 278 #1
TX 262
PA 229
Il 221
NY 121
FL 108
NJ 51
GA 38
SC 29

new york , mass and nj are on the upswing...california is worse than most countries...probably even worse than Norway

RI had a good number yesterday!...of course the state testing facilities were closed the day before due to snow storm but our idiot governor spun that into success for her brilliant strategizing...she's a piece of work

[Pete F.]

You do know that deaths without any correlation to population is meaningless.

California would be one of the top 50 countries in the world by population and is almost ten times Norway’s.
NY and NJ are both doing relatively well in infection rate and that’s what counts in controlling a pandemic.
I do see that Tennessee is #1 followed by California and Rhode Island.
Must have some virulent Trumplicans down there.
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[scottw]

Originally Posted by Pete F.

.

NY and NJ are both doing relatively well in infection rate and that’s what counts in controlling a pandemic.

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don't hold your breath

[wdmso]

QAnon scored its first national political victory on Tuesday when Marjorie Taylor Greene,

Taylor Greene: Assange, Snowden Risked Their Lives to Expose Deep State

the Republican party where the truth goes to die

[detbuch]

Originally Posted by wdmso

QAnon scored its first national political victory on Tuesday when Marjorie Taylor Greene,

Taylor Greene: Assange, Snowden Risked Their Lives to Expose Deep State

the Republican party where the truth goes to die

I don't have a dog in the QAnon hunt, but could you explain, precisely, what is not truthful about "Assange, Snowden Risked Their Lives to Expose Deep State"?

[scottw]

Originally Posted by wdmso

QAnon

forgot about Q...what's the latest?