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| Political Threads This section is for Political Threads - Enter at your own risk. If you say you don't want to see what someone posts - don't read it :hihi: |
10-04-2015, 04:55 PM
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#1
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Seldom Seen
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 10,406
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
What does it matter? You have the exact same issues around firearm regulations, waiting periods, mental health etc... that you do with many other firearm related deaths.
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Are you serious? Two thirds are accounted to people who choose to end their own life. If not a gun it would have been a knife, pills, whatever. And the issues, while some might overlap in regards to mental health, are not akin to the mass shootings recognized by the OP. Nor did the POTUS mention suicides in his discussion.To lump suicides in with violent crimes is stacking the deck unfairly without disclosing to what they include. That is skewed. |
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10-04-2015, 05:02 PM
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#2
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Seldom Seen
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 10,406
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Andy, from Wikipedia...... (my disclaimer for source of defending hard numbers as opposed to throwing them out, as some here are prone to do)
Gun violence in the United States results in thousands of deaths and thousands more injuries annually.[1] According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, in 2013, firearms (excluding BB and pellet guns) were used in 84,258 nonfatal injuries (26.65 per 100,000 U.S. citizens) [2] and 11,208 deaths by homicide (3.5 per 100,000),[3] 21,175 by suicide with a firearm,[4] 505 deaths due to accidental discharge of a firearm,[4] and 281 deaths due to firearms-use with "undetermined intent"[5] for a total of 33,169 deaths related to firearms (excluding firearm deaths due to legal intervention). 1.3% of all deaths in the country were related to firearms.[1][6]
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10-05-2015, 08:40 AM
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#3
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Super Moderator
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Georgetown MA
Posts: 18,178
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nightfighter
Andy, from Wikipedia...... (my disclaimer for source of defending hard numbers as opposed to throwing them out, as some here are prone to do)
Gun violence in the United States results in thousands of deaths and thousands more injuries annually.[1] According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, in 2013, firearms (excluding BB and pellet guns) were used in 84,258 nonfatal injuries (26.65 per 100,000 U.S. citizens) [2] and 11,208 deaths by homicide (3.5 per 100,000),[3] 21,175 by suicide with a firearm,[4] 505 deaths due to accidental discharge of a firearm,[4] and 281 deaths due to firearms-use with "undetermined intent"[5] for a total of 33,169 deaths related to firearms (excluding firearm deaths due to legal intervention). 1.3% of all deaths in the country were related to firearms.[1][6]
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out of those 11,208 homicides.....how many of those were actually by the legal owner of the gun....that might be a place to start looking. |
"If you're arguing with an idiot, make sure he isn't doing the same thing."
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10-04-2015, 05:12 PM
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#4
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: RI
Posts: 21,182
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nightfighter
Are you serious? Two thirds are accounted to people who choose to end their own life. If not a gun it would have been a knife, pills, whatever. And the issues, while some might overlap in regards to mental health, are not akin to the mass shootings recognized by the OP. Nor did the POTUS mention suicides in his discussion.To lump suicides in with violent crimes is stacking the deck unfairly without disclosing to what they include. That is skewed.
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Nice, so "some" suicides might overlap with mental health issues. Wow.
A lot of people trying to commit suicide don't succeed, but I'd wager most with guns do.
I never attributed the 30k number to person on person crime. It's simply the volume of people killed by guns...the context for the remark was tyd claiming insignificance... |
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10-04-2015, 05:21 PM
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#5
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Libtardia
Posts: 21,559
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
It's simply the volume of people killed by guns...the context for the remark was tyd claiming insignificance...
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The correct sentence structure is " it's simply the volume of people who have died by use of a gun".
Guns don't kill people. People kill other people with a gun.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device |
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10-04-2015, 05:39 PM
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#6
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: RI
Posts: 21,182
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nebe
The correct sentence structure is " it's simply the volume of people who have died by use of a gun".
Guns don't kill people. People kill other people with a gun.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
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You're splitting hairs...it's not relevant to the point at hand. |
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10-04-2015, 06:33 PM
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#7
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Libtardia
Posts: 21,559
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
You're splitting hairs...it's not relevant to the point at hand.
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It certainly is relevant. Just as a person could commit suicide by dropping a hair dryer in a bath tub, they could use a gun. The shooter in Oregon could have made a bunch of pipe bombs and Molotov cocktails instead of using a gun.
Guns are not the problem. It is the American way of life that is the problem.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device |
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10-04-2015, 05:21 PM
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#8
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Seldom Seen
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 10,406
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Not playing nice here. Some would be the correct word.
Guns are most effective as a deterrent. I would wager that thousands of suicide attempts are aborted after taking a good look down the barrel of a loaded gun..... Deterrent, as a case for open carry laws.....
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