Trumps WW1 memorial Trip

[detbuch]

Originally Posted by Pete F.

He knows he's blowing a dogwhistle and you respond every time, like a good obedient Trump Nationalist.

You could have said what I think you meant to say here without resulting to memes. And it's an idiotic meme. You don't need the notion of a dog whistle and me being a dog to say that I agree with much, not all, of what Trump means by nationalism. But if you had used plain, direct, non-symbolic, non-derogatory language, my agreement would have been perfectly rational and wouldn't have the negative connotations you wrap it in.

He's not a narcissist at all: "I would give myself, I would -- look, I hate to do it, but I will do it. I would give myself an A-plus, is that enough? Can I go higher than that?"

Why do you bring this up to me. I never said that he isn't a narcissist. I've said things like other Presidents being narcissists, even more so than Trump, but they were considered good or great Presidents anyway. No matter how important his narcissism is to you, your passionate concerns don't persuade me to care.

And when the media doesn't concur, he then judges them fake

I assume that he would know when the media says something about him that is not true. Fake is an operative word. Now, maybe the media in such cases is not false, just wrong. But he gets accused of lying when he is wrong. So I can see him giving their own chit back to them.

But I have pointed out egregious instances where media got it wrong, and did so intentionally, in my opinion. And those are just the tip of the iceberg of false or erroneous reportage that I have seen over a long period of time. "Conservatives," in general have been noticing this well before Trump. So we understand what Trump means. Not that he is always right.

And then you have Real news written by a Real president consisting of halftruths, falsehoods and a remark that would be expected from a sixth grader

Yes, well, your ranting does resemble a kid who thinks he deserves the toy his mama won't buy for him. Not that it is so. Just sayin'

So funny to see little Adam Schitt (D-CA) talking about the fact that Acting Attorney General Matt Whitaker was not approved by the Senate, but not mentioning the fact that Bob Mueller (who is highly conflicted) was not approved by the Senate!

Hopefully you can figure out the lack of truth in the tweet above, or perhaps in your's and Trump's America, Trumps claims outweigh the rule of law.

I can figure out the truth in what he said. Perhaps you can figure out for me the lack of it. And why it matters so much to you.

And maybe you can tell me what my America is. I haven't been hiding it, but, perhaps I'm lying to myself . . . you know . . . like Trump and me do. I would be interested in your opinion. Then, maybe, you can get me to think like you.

[Sea Dangles]

Originally Posted by spence

Not to mention disparaging such a respected and dedicated military hero. You have to wonder if he has any concept for patriotism, sacrifice, duty...
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Bring back the respect that Obama displayed.

I hear that he bent over for the military,or something like that.
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[PaulS]

Remember all the criticism Obama got for saluting one time with a coffee cup in his hand. The same people now seem to have lost their voice. Hippocrates.
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[Sea Dangles]

Originally Posted by PaulS

Remember all the criticism Obama got for saluting one time with a coffee cup in his hand. The same people now seem to have lost their voice. Hippocrates.
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What does this have to do with Ancient Greek medicine?
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[spence]

Originally Posted by Sea Dangles

Bring back the respect that Obama displayed.

I hear that he bent over for the military,or something like that.
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Did Obama disparage war heros? Please open up a little.
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[Got Stripers]

Originally Posted by detbuch

But he gets accused of lying when he is wrong

There have been so many lies and probably a easily a hundred fold mistruths, that it's hard to tell them apart any longer. I'm sure if you google how many outright lies or mistruths Trump has made since he took office the count is considerably higher than the huge number that was reported after his first year in office. How many this week, I loose track, from claiming he talked to the head of state in Finland about cleaning the forests to beating up on a highly decorated serviceman over his supposed support of Hilary.

Just think for a minute how the media's reporting of him would change had he not made all those statements which proved false or if he didn't use his twitter account to show us how civil he can be towards those he sees as his enemy. He keeps throwing dozens of live bunker into a pool filled with bluefish and he wonders why there is a constant feeding frenzy; come on you present yourself as an intelligent man and yet you don't see this? I think the fishing parallel might get the point across better, after all it is a fishing website.

Side bar for all those claiming (Yeah I'm talking about you Donald and a few on this board) the stock market is the best it's ever been, if he had his wealth in stocks he'd be taking a worse beating than I am lately. I can't imagine what some are loosing, I'm at only a risk level of 3 on a 1-10 scale and my retirement is down 7% from a year ago.

[detbuch]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

There have been so many lies and probably a easily a hundred fold mistruths, that it's hard to tell them apart any longer. I'm sure if you google how many outright lies or mistruths Trump has made since he took office the count is considerably higher than the huge number that was reported after his first year in office. How many this week, I loose track, from claiming he talked to the head of state in Finland about cleaning the forests to beating up on a highly decorated serviceman over his supposed support of Hilary.

Just think for a minute how the media's reporting of him would change had he not made all those statements which proved false or if he didn't use his twitter account to show us how civil he can be towards those he sees as his enemy. He keeps throwing dozens of live bunker into a pool filled with bluefish and he wonders why there is a constant feeding frenzy; come on you present yourself as an intelligent man and yet you don't see this?

No, I see a lot of other things that you don't mention, and I don't see what are supposed to be hundreds of lies. I think I see some lies as well as a lot of truths and a host of gibberish. Perhaps I'm not intelligent.

I do care about other things that he's done that Hillary wouldn't have done. I am concerned with the constant and rapid Democrat shift toward socialism and hope that the Republican shift to the left can more easily be diminished than the Democrat shift can.

And I mostly care about preserving as much of what's left of our original constitutional form of government. Hope as well that the shift can actually be reversed. For me, Trump and the wobbly Republicans were by far the better choice. Trump's supposed lies seem rather innocuous in light of what was about to happen with a Hillary and the Democrats takeover of the federal government, especially to the Supreme Court.

If the Republican party can wither into a constitutional leaning Libertarian party to face off against the Dems, that would make me happy. For a while at least. In the meantime, I'll stick with the weak kneed and shifty Repubs.

I think the fishing parallel might get the point across better, after all it is a fishing website.

Side bar for all those claiming (Yeah I'm talking about you Donald and a few on this board) the stock market is the best it's ever been, if he had his wealth in stocks he'd be taking a worse beating than I am lately. I can't imagine what some are loosing, I'm at only a risk level of 3 on a 1-10 scale and my retirement is down 7% from a year ago.

The stock market has evolved into something separate from our actual market place. It seems to have become a market of its own. I have no trust in it. And when stocks began to skyrocket in value while the economy was stagnant or propped up by phony growth, even my lack of knowledge was telling me that stocks were becoming way over-priced, depending on nothing but Fed pumping and would eventually "correct" to some sane level. I suspect either that the level will be much lower than it is now, or the economy will have to be inflated to justify present stock values.

But that's just an ignorant guess. As I said above, I may not be intelligent.

[scottw]

Bush wasn't a "liar" or a white nationalist but "BUSH=Hitler and "BUSH Lied People Died" was a pretty common theme for the left and media narrative through the Bush years...

so no.....

Trump could be Jesus and the left and media would still portray him as a racist, misogynist, homophobic Nazi...because that's their narrative and they stick to it as demonstrated here daily

I recall the media and left telling us during the Clinton years that lying was OK, part of the human condition and almost essential for our survival....this was all backed up by academic studies...you know..."SCIENCE"...so I really don't know what the left is all worked up about with Trump

[wdmso]

Ivanka Trump used personal email for White House business

are we going to hear daddy start yelling lock her up?

So many Trump apologist here ... Sorry for using The term apologist kinda of like the term snowflake used by the Right .. All but forgotten when where and why they used it..


A Trump administration official told CBS News that Ms Trump's emails did not contain classified information, and what had occurred was basically a lack of understanding of the rules.

we have been told this before .... it needs to be investigated

[scottw]

Originally Posted by wdmso

Ivanka Trump used personal email for White House business


A Trump administration official told CBS News that Ms Trump's emails did not contain classified information, and what had occurred was basically a lack of understanding of the rules.

yeah I'd give Ivanka a pass....she's only been in Washington for what ...2 years...?

hell...

Hillary was co-President for 8 years...a Senator, candidate for President...twice...and Secretary of State and we were constantly told that she was the "smartest woman in the world" and she couldn't figure it out...

[The Dad Fisherman]

Who’s Hillary?
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[PaulS]

Ivanka prob. didn't realize she shouldn't use her personal email.

[Nebe]

LOCK HER UP
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[Got Stripers]

Ignorance isn't an excuse for either Hillary or Ivanka and certainly with all the attention Hillary's use of personal emails, no fing way Ivanka didn't know that was a no no. Powerful people tend to make their own rules, been that way for centuries.

[Got Stripers]

Originally Posted by detbuch

and I don't see what are supposed to be hundreds of lies

You don't see the hundreds of lies or mistruths really, that just cracks me up, the Post recently had the number up over 3000, the New York Times had it well over 1000 just ahead of year one; but I know your going to just give us the party line it's all fake news. Or as you describe it, he's just "wrong", well I'm not all that comfortable supporting a president that is that wrong so many times. I'd have to count my fingers after shaking that man's hand.

[spence]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

You don't see the hundreds of lies or mistruths really, that just cracks me up, the Post recently had the number up over 3000, the New York Times had it well over 1000 just ahead of year one; but I know your going to just give us the party line it's all fake news. Or as you describe it, he's just "wrong", well I'm not all that comfortable supporting a president that is that wrong so many times. I'd have to count my fingers after shaking that man's hand.

I think it’s well over 7000 now.

His lying is problematic but what’s worse is his lack of concern for the truth. Trump just makes stuff up and doesn’t care like he’s holding court.
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[scottw]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

Ignorance isn't an excuse for either Hillary or Ivanka and certainly with all the attention Hillary's use of personal emails, no fing way Ivanka didn't know that was a no no. Powerful people tend to make their own rules, been that way for centuries.

you know that this is from September 2017 right...Wayne is just catching up...

[scottw]

Originally Posted by spence

I think it’s well over 7000 now.


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leads the league!!...WINNING!

[scottw]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

the Post recently had the number up over 3000, the New York Times had it well over 1000 just ahead of year one; .

it's amusing that the fake newsies are keeping track

[detbuch]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

You don't see the hundreds of lies or mistruths really, that just cracks me up, the Post recently had the number up over 3000, the New York Times had it well over 1000 just ahead of year one; but I know your going to just give us the party line it's all fake news. Or as you describe it, he's just "wrong", well I'm not all that comfortable supporting a president that is that wrong so many times. I'd have to count my fingers after shaking that man's hand.

Do you have a count on how many times the NYT has lied or been wrong? How about yourself, how many times have you been wrong?
If Trump was wrong 100 times about policies, that would concern me.

[Got Stripers]

Originally Posted by detbuch

Do you have a count on how many times the NYT has lied or been wrong? How about yourself, how many times have you been wrong?
If Trump was wrong 100 times about policies, that would concern me.

Not sure the jury is in yet on the success or failures of his policy decisions, those typically don't show either way for years. I'm sure you have already called them successes and while I'm in favor of some, many I see as bad long term decisions.

[spence]

Originally Posted by detbuch

If Trump was wrong 100 times about policies, that would concern me.

That shouldn’t be hard to tally up.
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[Pete F.]

Trump tweets:
Of course we should have captured Osama Bin Laden long before we did. I pointed him out in my book just BEFORE the attack on the World Trade Center. President Clinton famously missed his shot. We paid Pakistan Billions of Dollars & they never told us he was living there. Fools!..

Now what the fool said in his book was:One day we’re told that a shadowy figure with no fixed address named Osama bin-Laden is public enemy number one, and U.S. jetfighters lay waste to his camp in Afghanistan. He escapes back under some rock, and a few news cycles later it’s on to a new enemy and new crisis …

And it is comical how the things Trump hates most, tie back to one night in 2011.

The whole issue of the hunt for bin Laden may be a sore subject for Trump because the final countdown for the operation took place during the 2011 White House Correspondents' Dinner when Obama roasted Trump mercilessly for his penchant for spreading conspiracy theories, such as the so-called "birther" conspiracy, which claimed that Obama wasn't an American citizen.

During a break from rehearsing that speech for the correspondents' dinner, Obama called McRaven for a final status check.
"What do you think about the intel?" Obama asked. The intelligence that bin Laden was living in Abbottabad was entirely circumstantial.
"Well, if he's there, we're going to get him. If he's not, we won't," McRaven answered.
"Exactly! It's 50-50," Obama said, according to reporting from my book about the hunt for bin Laden.
The president wrapped up the call, saying, "I couldn't have any more confidence in you than the confidence I have in you and your force. Godspeed to you and your forces. Please pass on to them my personal thanks for their service and the message that I personally will be following this mission very closely."
The bin Laden raid was, of course, a success. Not only was bin Laden killed, but also thousands of important documents about al Qaeda were recovered during the operation. As a result, it is arguably the most successful special operations mission in American history.

[detbuch]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

Not sure the jury is in yet on the success or failures of his policy decisions, those typically don't show either way for years. I'm sure you have already called them successes and while I'm in favor of some, many I see as bad long term decisions.

Then I guess I'll have to wait "for years" to make a judgment on Trump. But until we can get the numbers on how many times the NYT, the Wapost, Hillary, Bill, Bush, Reagan, Kennedy, Biden, LBJ, John Kerry, CNN, NBC, CBS, Fox, all the Dems, all the Repubs, etceteraaaaaaa, have lied or been wrong, yet still managed to convince the rest of us how good they are . . . until then I'm going to pass on the importance of Trump's numbers.

The fact that media are spending more time on stuff like counting how many times Trump, according to them, lied, exhibits for me some form of desperation. I'm guessing, if they listed each lie, that the vast majority would be either a stretch or unimportant.

Long before Trump, I have noticed "lies" by politicians, Press, editorials and opinion pieces that are biased, ignorant, wrong, false, on a daily basis. If there could be a compilation of how many times these occurred, the number would be staggering. And I'm not talking party lines here. What is essentially propaganda disguised as facts crosses party lines. Just about every political article posted on this forum can be critiqued by someone as wrong, biased, or dishonest.

I don't apologize for not recognizing our Press and media as being unerring sources of truth when it comes to political matters. On the contrary, I view them primarily as promoters of agendas. So, for me, the agenda is what matters. The Progressive agenda is anathema to me in terms of what I consider the fundamentals, the foundations, of freedom.

I understand the foundation of Progressivism and how, and why it's superficial understanding of human nature has emotionally and morally gripped so many in our wealthy, technologically advanced Western civilization.

But I believe that it leads to the very opposite of that on which this nation was founded. That is what concerns me, not the number of what those who have an agenda consider to be lies--especially if those "lies" don't amount to a hill of beans.

[Sea Dangles]

Originally Posted by spence

Did Obama disparage war heros? Please open up a little.
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Not to my knowledge Jeff. But as always, actions speak louder than words. More than half the troops surveyed gave an unfavorable evaluation to Obama.It is well chronicled in a book titled Conduct Unbecoming : How Barack Obama is Destroying Our Military and Endangering our Security.
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[Pete F.]

Originally Posted by Sea Dangles

Not to my knowledge Jeff. But as always, actions speak louder than words. More than half the troops surveyed gave an unfavorable evaluation to Obama.It is well chronicled in a book titled Conduct Unbecoming : How Barack Obama is Destroying Our Military and Endangering our Security.
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Some guy wrote a book, it might be true.
Here's a contemporaneous article from Military Times and it is interesting to look at the things the rank and file was unhappy and happy about.

"President Barack Obama will step down after eight years as commander in chief with one of the most influential tenures leading the U.S. military, but not necessarily the political support of service members.

His moves to slim down the armed forces, move away from traditional military might and overhaul social policies prohibiting the service of minority groups have proven divisive in the ranks. His critics have accused him of trading a strong security posture for political points, and for allowing the rise of terrorists like the Islamic State group whom the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan were supposed to silence.

But Obama’s supporters define him as the Nobel Peace Prize winner who ordered the elimination of Osama bin Laden and refocused military strategy while wrestling with an uncooperative Congress and unprecedented budget restrictions. They insist the military is more nimble now, and more prepared to deal with unconventional warfare against non-traditional threats across the globe.

More than half of troops surveyed in the latest Military Times/Institute for Veterans and Military Families poll said they have an unfavorable opinion of Obama and his two-terms leading the military. About 36 percent said they approve of his job as commander in chief.

Their complaints include the president’s decision to decrease military personnel (71 percent think it should be higher), his moves to withdraw combat troops from Iraq (59 percent say it made America less safe) and his lack of focus on the biggest dangers facing America (64 percent say China represents a significant threat to the U.S.)

But more than two-thirds support Obama's mantra that securing America means building strong alliances with foreign powers. And more than 60 percent think his use of drones and special forces teams for precision strikes — instead of large-scale military operations — has helped U.S. national security.

That’s a conflicted response to a president who entered the White House vowing to end U.S. involvement in Iraq and Afghanistan but instead leaves as the first American president to oversee two full terms with combat troops deployed to hostile zones."

[Sea Dangles]

Thanks Pete for helping demonstrate my point.
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[Got Stripers]

Originally Posted by detbuch

The stock market has evolved into something separate from our actual market place. It seems to have become a market of its own. I have no trust in it. And when stocks began to skyrocket in value while the economy was stagnant or propped up by phony growth, even my lack of knowledge was telling me that stocks were becoming way over-priced, depending on nothing but Fed pumping and would eventually "correct" to some sane level. I suspect either that the level will be much lower than it is now, or the economy will have to be inflated to justify present stock values.

But that's just an ignorant guess. As I said above, I may not be intelligent.

What is irritating to me is that Trump inherited a growing and pretty healthy economy, but with every bump in the stock market, he never once missed an opportunity if a mic was in front of him to take credit for the stock market rise. Now that it's lost over a year's worth of gains, now I'm down 8% after yesterday's continued down-slide, he isn't mentioning the stock market at all. He loves taking credit for what he hasn't controlled and he shuts his mouth (tough for him to do remember that) when it isn't going so good.

[Pete F.]

Originally Posted by Sea Dangles

Thanks Pete for helping demonstrate my point.
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They did Trump too
https://www.militarytimes.com/news/p...ew-poll-shows/

[detbuch]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

What is irritating to me is that Trump inherited a growing and pretty healthy economy, but with every bump in the stock market, he never once missed an opportunity if a mic was in front of him to take credit for the stock market rise. Now that it's lost over a year's worth of gains, now I'm down 8% after yesterday's continued down-slide, he isn't mentioning the stock market at all. He loves taking credit for what he hasn't controlled and he shuts his mouth (tough for him to do remember that) when it isn't going so good.

It's not clear at all that the economy he inherited was growing or even healthy. I forget which thread I posted a video by an economist who explained charts of various economic indicators which showed the Obama economy was fairly stagnant after a slow improvement of the economy he inherited. And rather than growing, the indicators predicted a downward trend. And that there was a dramatic spike upward after Trump that could not be explained by trends that were developing before he came to office.

I'm no student of economics and am uncomfortable getting into its weeds. I don't know what a President can do to seriously affect the economy except via taxes and regulations. Whether anything Trump has done has helped the economy or not, it has steadily improved in dramatic ways after the tax and regulation cuts, rather than the few intermittent spikes which didn't last under Obama.

But anything can happen to crash the economy again. Presidents are in peril of being blamed for poor economies, not just praised for good ones.

The stock market, in my uneducated opinion, is even less under the thumb of the President. So, yes, Trump is foolish, if not stupid, to have taken credit for the high stock prices. And when they keep dropping he'll have serious egg on his face. And many think that a larger correction is due.