Vegas and Automatic Weapons

[JohnR]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

I am hearing he had bump stocks. If thats true, and if they were never legal, perhaps a few more people would be alive. Is that worth giving up the freedom to own them? A lot of people say no. I am inclined to say yes, but the constitutional issue is troubling.

You are correct, no law would have prevented it. But possibly reduced the carnage...
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Don't know and good question.

One of the problems with gun control laws is that when some are made the anti-gun folks make a law, they try to expand its reach.

A lot of people that would support increased licensing / testing / mental stability screening don't because we know that politicians and bureaucrats will abuse that.

Constitution is fine.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by JohnR

Don't know and good question.

One of the problems with gun control laws is that when some are made the anti-gun folks make a law, they try to expand its reach.

A lot of people that would support increased licensing / testing / mental stability screening don't because we know that politicians and bureaucrats will abuse that.

Constitution is fine.

And the people who fear that there will be over-reach, are justified in feeling that way.

It all leads to gridlock. The right doesn't want to budge on guns. The left doesn't want to budge on things like committing the mentally ill, or curbing violence in the entertainment industry, or in curbing the notion that all weird human impulses are a cause for celebration., or letting up on mocking people like those who live in the Dakotas (where everyone has guns, and there is almost no gun crime...but they are "bitter clingers", not people to respect and emulate??)

I'd like to see some common sense gun laws, if they could pass the constitutionality test. I'd also like to see our moral compass get a tune up. Don't ask me how to do it.

[scottw]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

I'd like to see some common sense gun laws....

name one....or two...

[Got Stripers]

"I'd also like to see our moral compass get a tune up." Man have you got that right.

Look I get that one nut job is to blame, the guns he used aren't responsible, but because he's up there with those types of weapons and not a couple rifles intended to deer hunt; is why 58 people and over 500 were injured. You want to use the "don't blame the tool" argument, then let's talk cell phones and the highway deaths attributed to them. Again the phone wasn't to blame, but as a trend grows and more deaths result, law changes are required to prevent more deaths. I have no problem with a new law and tougher penalties for either idiots on the highway texting while driving, or much more involved vetting to purchase firearms or limiting what can be purchased to avoid the magnitude of these mass shootings. I have no doubt as many have stated, most are responsible gun owners, but a troubled teen stealing their parents 16ga or pistol isn't near as bad as running into the school with their AR and a dozen clips.

[PaulS]

Originally Posted by JohnR

One of the problems with gun control laws is that when some are made the anti-gun folks make a law, they try to expand its reach.

And the pro- gun crowd doesn't do the same?

Did anything happened in Feb. of this year w/background checks?

[Nebe]

I'm thinking in the house and senate there's a deal making process that goes like this- We will give up the fight to protect the right to seek abortions if you give up the right to own assault rifles and high capacity mags.. and vice versa.
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[Nebe]

The only way to shop a mass shooting is with another gun.
Everyone should be armed.
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[The Dad Fisherman]

Originally Posted by Nebe

The only way to shop a mass shooting is with another gun.
Everyone should be armed.
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That still wouldn't have stooped this one from happening. I doubt anybody with a handgun at the concert was going to hit this guy, who was 400 yards away, 32 stories up, in the dark, while people are bumping into you in a panic.

That's some Hollywood " Lethal Weapon" chit right there.
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[Nebe]

Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman

That still wouldn't have stooped this one from happening. I doubt anybody with a handgun at the concert was going to hit this guy, who was 400 yards away, 32 stories up, in the dark, while people are bumping into you in a panic.

That's some Hollywood " Lethal Weapon" chit right there.
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How about the people staying on the same floor as him? House keeping ? Seconds matter when a cop is 30 minutes away.

I don't carry but I see the logic
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[Sea Dangles]

It is terrible what happened but I really feel a need for a high caliber rifle. I see them at the range and get jealous.
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[tysdad115]

Originally Posted by Sea Dangles

It is terrible what happened but I really feel a need for a high caliber rifle. I see them at the range and get jealous.
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Lol.. I've wanted a high caliber rifle forever but I don't know what one is. Whatever it is it's going to have high capacity clips too. Because pew pew.
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[scottw]

Originally Posted by tysdad115

Lol.. I've wanted a high caliber rifle forever but I don't know what one is.

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you are a dumb ass....a high calibered rifel has lots of calibers and probably a silencer thingy so you can sneak up on people

[tysdad115]

Originally Posted by scottw

you are a dumb ass....a high calibered rifel has lots of calibers and probably a silencer thingy so you can sneak up on people

Oh I am a dumbass...no argument there. If your multi high calipered riffle has a shoulder thing that goes up you are a felon. Nobody needs one of those.
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[tysdad115]

Ross by definition it does not make it a full auto, it doesn't.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bump_fire
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[nightfighter]

Technicality and we both know it. It allows continuous gas cycling of the bolt and trigger override (re set). Consider the source of the definition and that another author could word it differently. Different means to reach the same end.

[spence]

Originally Posted by nightfighter

Technicality and we both know it. It allows continuous gas cycling of the bolt and trigger override (re set). Consider the source of the definition and that another author could word it differently. Different means to reach the same end.

Agree. He had 12 semi-auto rifles with bump stocks. To argue if it's really fully auto or not at this point defies conscience. Listen to the #^&#^&#^&#^&ing audio.
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[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by spence

Agree. He had 12 semi-auto rifles with bump stocks. To argue if it's really fully auto or not at this point defies conscience. Listen to the #^&#^&#^&#^&ing audio.
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100% correct. To deny that bump stocks can be used to make a semi auto achieve near full auto functionality...well it's hard to talk to someone who would deny that. As you said, all you need to do is listen to the audio, no human being can pull a trigger like that.
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[scottw]

Originally Posted by spence

To argue if it's really fully auto or not at this point defies conscience.

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

100% correct. To deny that bump stocks can be used to make a semi auto achieve near full auto functionality...well it's hard to talk to someone who would deny that.
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Quote:



so which is it? "really fully auto"..."or not"....or...."near full auto"....hard to talk to someone that can't even make a simple distinction


according to the bump stock website...it is "simulated full auto"...so there's another term you can act smart with


this effort to marginalize if someone is trying to make a simple distinction(and since the discussion is over legality) when you are engrossed in emotional verbal venting is...well....makes communication tough

[tysdad115]

I've shot them and I've shot some of the new select fire binary triggers where squeezing the trigger fires a round and releasing it fires another.. practice with each of those can really cook rounds out but they aren't "automatic" .
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[tysdad115]

I know full well exactly what they sound like. Nobody is arguing , the definition of full auto is defined and regulated by BATFE not me. There's thousands of these plastic stocks out there..
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[spence]

Originally Posted by tysdad115

I know full well exactly what they sound like. Nobody is arguing , the definition of full auto is defined and regulated by BATFE not me. There's thousands of these plastic stocks out there..
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Because they're not illegal. At least not in Nevada.

You know I'm not anti gun. I've actually been looking at buying a hand gun because shooting is a lot of fun. Like a lot of fun.

That being said...I don't see how high velocity weapons are useful for sport shooting, hunting or even home defense.

So what's the point? The argument to defend against an oppressive government is really just a pile of bull#^&#^&#^&#^&.
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[tysdad115]

Originally Posted by spence

Because they're not illegal. At least not in Nevada.

You know I'm not anti gun. I've actually been looking at buying a hand gun because shooting is a lot of fun. Like a lot of fun.

That being said...I don't see how high velocity weapons are useful for sport shooting, hunting or even home defense.

So what's the point? The argument to defend against an oppressive government is really just a pile of bull#^&#^&#^&#^&.
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There is so much fail in your statement . It's actually mind boggling.
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[detbuch]

Originally Posted by spence

You know I'm not anti gun. I've actually been looking at buying a hand gun because shooting is a lot of fun. Like a lot of fun.

That being said...I don't see how high velocity weapons are useful for sport shooting, hunting or even home defense.

Have you taken a step toward the dark side? Didn't you once say that the purpose of a hand gun was to kill? Now its lots of fun? I congratulate your evolution of thought on the matter. Some do get a rush, lots of fun, firing high velocity weapons. Could be a higher order of gun sport. You might want to give it a try. Your guns as fun philosophy may evolve into a higher more refined perspective. Gun ranges could get permits to buy such guns purely to be used for sport shooting on the range.

Think on it. A boost for the economy. A peaceful way of asserting excess testosterone. Competitions evolving into a sort of American pastime. Available to all of the various genders, testosterone loaded or not. Televised tournaments at which the national anthem could be played and the Second Amendment read by a Monday Night type of cis-female. And thus another venue provided for those who wish to protest how America oppresses them. Competitions ranging first from the smallest size hand guns which can be hidden in the palm of a hand all the way to the grand finale of high velocity guns all ending with the roar of rapid fire in an All-American gun fest giving new meaning, usefulness, and appreciation for the supposed American love of guns.

So what's the point? The argument to defend against an oppressive government is really just a pile of bull#^&#^&#^&#^&.
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Right . . . right . . . just a pile of bull poop. History has shown that people never had to rebel or defend against various sorts of tyranny. Oh, that's right . . . we humans have evolved to a time where governments will forever be benevolent, peopled by humane, nice-guy rulers who have our best interests at heart. Who bend to our will rather than their own. With those minor exceptions, of course, when they know better than us what our best interests are. No doubt, after we are dis-armed, they will see the even greater need for them to protect us against . . . against . . . well, against ourselves, or even other bad nasty governments. And that bull poop piece of paper that limits their ability to protect and nourish us can be discarded.

Here's an interesting article showing how the strictest gun controls in Western society prevent mass killings:

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2017/...las-vegas.html

I know, I know, it is written by John Lott, so it must also be bull poop

[tysdad115]

"near full auto" not full auto. If you're going to split hairs about who can own what I'll split them in regards to what is factually a full auto and what isn't.
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[tysdad115]

Again this was a tragedy for sure , undoubtedly. This type of thing shouldnt happen ever. I don't know what transpired in the man's head to do so and I can't fathom performing this cowardly act.
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[Nebe]

And now we have a republican senator saying that the victims should have - "gotten small" to not get shot.

Wtf???
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[tysdad115]

Originally Posted by Nebe

And now we have a republican senator saying that the victims should have - "gotten small" to not get shot.

Wtf???
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Not quite as WTF as the CBS VP that said the victims didn't deserve sympathy. Just another D upset over the election still.

At least "get small" is sound advice, albeit terribly obvious and damn near not feasible in a run for your life scenario.

[PaulS]

Originally Posted by tysdad115

Not quite as WTF as the CBS VP that said the victims didn't deserve sympathy. Just another D upset over the election still

And to balance the hate- Carl Paladino, a western New York builder, one-time Republican candidate for governor of New York and political ally of President-elect Donald J. Trump, came under fire on Friday for racially offensive comments about President Obama and the first lady, who Mr. Paladino said should be “let loose in the outback of Zimbabwe.”

Mr. Paladino’s comments were published in Artvoice, a weekly Buffalo newspaper. They came in response to an open-ended feature in which local figures were asked about their hopes for 2017.

“Obama catches mad cow disease after being caught having relations with a Herford,” said Mr. Paladino, who ran unsuccessfully for governor in 2010, making an apparent reference to the Hereford cattle breed. He said he hoped the disease killed the president.

Asked what he most wanted to see “go away” in the new year, Mr. Paladino — who has a reputation in New York political and business circles for speaking in an unfiltered manner reminiscent of Mr. Trump’s — answered, “Michelle Obama.”


“I’d like her to return to being a male and let loose in the outback of Zimbabwe where she lives comfortably in a cave with Maxie, the gorilla,” he said.

[scottw]

Paul...wasn't that like a year ago?...surely you can find something contemporary

[PaulS]

Just an easy one to google.