Chrysler to file for bankruptcy - Striper Talk Striped Bass Fishing, Surfcasting, Boating

JohnnyD · 04-30-2009, 10:00 AM

Good. Now dissolve all contracts with the union, do some restructuring and re-open as Chrysler United or something similar.

buckman · 04-30-2009, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnnyD

Good. Now dissolve all contracts with the union, do some restructuring and re-open as Chrysler United or something similar.

There are 100's of smaller companies that will fall because of this. This is not good news at all.

JohnnyD · 04-30-2009, 12:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by buckman

There are 100's of smaller companies that will fall because of this. This is not good news at all.

100's huh? I disagree.

Financial reports show that Chrysler is still a viable company. They will file bankruptcy, burn their contracts with the UAW, restructure and hire everyone back. People will get laid off. More people will be hired back, and more than likely at similar or even higher pay due to the company not having to jump through Union hoops.

Dissolving the union contract will significantly reduce the per-worker overhead the company will face. It will also allow the company flexibility as they get back on their feet.

I'm surprised in you buckman. It's either they file bankruptcy or more of *your* money goes towards holding the company's head out of the water. Which do you prefer, people lose their jobs, or billions more in bailouts go to a failing business?

buckman · 04-30-2009, 01:57 PM

You said it was "Good". I just said it was not.
All the small and large feeder companies that depend on Ford will be screwed in a bankruptcy. They will get pennies on the dollar for whats owed them. Most are now on the brink of closing I'm sure.
Your optimistic veiw of what is going to happen is just not reality based.

JohnnyD · 04-30-2009, 02:07 PM

You stating that "Most are now on the brink of closing I'm sure" is not fact based, merely speculation.

I think you might be a bit confused as to what is actually happening.

Chrysler is not closing their doors. Economists are actually predicting that more people will benefit from the company filing bankruptcy and restructuring than if they continued down the road they are on.

Sure, companies are owed substantial amounts of money. However, you can't get water from stone. Chrysler doesn't have the money and no way to get it. The Debtors decided they didn't want to restructure the payment agreements to eventually get their money back, now they'll only receive what's left over after the bankruptcy hearings.

If they didn't file bankruptcy, the government would be giving them another blank check.

You position confuses me. You don't want to pay to save 60 teacher jobs in the town that you live in, something that has a direct effect on you and your kids. But you want to pay to save a company with a failing business model, where the effects of them failing will go largely unnoticed by you personally.

I think you're setting yourself up for another "I told you so" by me.

MarshCappa · 04-30-2009, 02:08 PM

I want to trade my jeep compass in for another jeep. Do you think I should do so before or after the filing or does it even matter?

buckman · 04-30-2009, 02:32 PM

JD, All I said was that them going bankrupt was not a good thing.

Here's the story
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_chrysler

Don't blame me for the teachers jobs. Obama and the teachers Union can restructure your contracts. I'm sure you will come out better

striperman36 · 04-30-2009, 03:11 PM

Buckman,
I thought you were for market forces and not the government controlling the fate of businesses.
You should be ecstatic not poo pooing it.

MarshCappa · 04-30-2009, 05:27 PM

spence · 04-30-2009, 05:36 PM

Sounds like Buck is pimpin for another bailout

-spence

Cool Beans · 04-30-2009, 06:19 PM

Kinda confused on this one, how do you restructure without the Unions, when the union is going to own over 50% of both Chrysler and GM? Both of these companies were beyond stupid when they took money from the government.

justplugit · 04-30-2009, 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cool Beans

Kinda confused on this one, how do you restructure without the Unions, when the union is going to own over 50% of both Chrysler and GM?

Ya, that confuses me too, which hasn't taken too much to do lately.

.

What was gained by a bailout except for the government getting their control in the company and postponing the inevitable bankruptcy any way.

Inquiring minds want to know.

buckman · 04-30-2009, 07:20 PM

I'll speak slower for ya...bankruptcy is not good. It is bad. Try doing it and see if it is good. I believe it is their only option, but it is BAD. I had hoped Obama's plan would help. I was wrong.

justplugit · 04-30-2009, 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by buckman

I'll speak slower for ya...bankruptcy is not good. It is bad.

Used to be a disgrace, now it's all the rage.

Screw the people who you owe.

Cool Beans · 04-30-2009, 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by buckman

I'll speak slower for ya...bankruptcy is not good. It is bad. Try doing it and see if it is good. I believe it is their only option, but it is BAD. I had hoped Obama's plan would help. I was wrong.

Tell me it ain't so! Buckman, you experienced Hope? I figured you of all people would have known better.

Well, you see Obama "hope" = change.
So that's exactly what happened.
Viable company with a few problems they could have worked through, as Ford is doing.

Good Company + Hope and Change = Government Owned Company
Government Owned + no profits = Bankruptcy

They received a full dose of Hope and Change. And now they will only have is hope that they can pay the bills and change left in their pockets.

What did they expect selling themselves to the Government? It makes about as much sense as borrowing money from a mobster and wondering why he breaks your legs for not paying him back.

Sweetwater · 04-30-2009, 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnnyD

100's huh? I disagree.

Financial reports show that Chrysler is still a viable company. They will file bankruptcy, burn their contracts with the UAW, restructure and hire everyone back. People will get laid off. More people will be hired back, and more than likely at similar or even higher pay due to the company not having to jump through Union hoops.

Dissolving the union contract will significantly reduce the per-worker overhead the company will face. It will also allow the company flexibility as they get back on their feet.

Spoken like a true "liberal".....what!?

JohnnyD · 04-30-2009, 08:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sweetwater

Spoken like a true "liberal".....what!?

Shhh... most of them don't know about my Conservative side. Don't spoil it for me.

Sweetwater · 04-30-2009, 09:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnnyD

Shhh... most of them don't know about my Conservative side. Don't spoil it for me.

They do now...you "conservative in liberal garb!" Why don't we hear your views on gun control..that should be interesting

JohnnyD · 05-01-2009, 09:51 AM

Initial reports state that the UAW will continue once Chrysler gets to the other side. This is disappointing to me because their wage expenses are a huge part of why the company is in this position.

With the Fiat deal moving forward, they have the potential to excel when gas prices skyrocket again. Fiat has developed some major improvements in fuel economy and has been very successful in Europe.

Unfortunately, Chrysler won't reach their full potential due to my first point. The UAW will continue to hold the company back. Allowing the UAW to stay is like Indians running the tribe instead of the Chief.

buckman · 05-01-2009, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnnyD

Initial reports state that the UAW will continue once Chrysler gets to the other side. This is disappointing to me because their wage expenses are a huge part of why the company is in this position.

With the Fiat deal moving forward, they have the potential to excel when gas prices skyrocket again. Fiat has developed some major improvements in fuel economy and has been very successful in Europe.

Unfortunately, Chrysler won't reach their full potential due to my first point. The UAW will continue to hold the company back. Allowing the UAW to stay is like Indians running the tribe instead of the Chief.

What's your feeling on Teacher Unions?

JohnnyD · 05-01-2009, 06:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by buckman

What's your feeling on Teacher Unions?

Same. Private schools get by just fine without them.

It disgusts me that teachers are allowed to do the minimum amount required of them and get their scheduled raises, can bump better teachers just because of seniority and not have a fear about losing their jobs. Some of these people get to year 25 and have no motivation to do anything and some don't give a damn about the kids.

This isn't the case for all teachers, but it for a large number that have been teaching 20+ years.

Maybe our education system would be a bit better if teachers were given performance-based raises and had to actually compete for new positions/promotions, as opposed to the most senior employees basically getting first choice of everything.

Edit for an addition: The teacher unions in Mansfield are partly to blame for why so many in Mansfield were laid off. The union refused concessions that even the teachers they represent agreed to.

buckman · 05-02-2009, 07:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnnyD

Same. Private schools get by just fine without them.

It disgusts me that teachers are allowed to do the minimum amount required of them and get their scheduled raises, can bump better teachers just because of seniority and not have a fear about losing their jobs. Some of these people get to year 25 and have no motivation to do anything and some don't give a damn about the kids.

This isn't the case for all teachers, but it for a large number that have been teaching 20+ years.

Maybe our education system would be a bit better if teachers were given performance-based raises and had to actually compete for new positions/promotions, as opposed to the most senior employees basically getting first choice of everything.

Edit for an addition: The teacher unions in Mansfield are partly to blame for why so many in Mansfield were laid off. The union refused concessions that even the teachers they represent agreed to.

spence · 05-02-2009, 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnnyD

Shhh... most of them don't know about my Conservative side. Don't spoil it for me.

Funny how some think there are a bunch of Liberals on this site. I can't think of one true Liberal here.

-spence

JohnnyD · 05-02-2009, 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spence

Funny how some think there are a bunch of Liberals on this site. I can't think of one true Liberal here.

-spence

That's because there are two definitions of Liberal - the conservatives definitions and the true definition.

The Conservatives definition is basically anyone who disagrees with them or says anything to contradict a conservative opinion.