mueller hearing

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by scottw

it appears that the democrats have stepped on yet another rake

big time. and more rakes to come.
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[Pete F.]

On the same day Mueller warned Russia is interfering in the 2020 election “as we sit here” & that accepting foreign assistance has become the “new normal”, Senate GOP blocked two election security bills, including one requiring campaigns inform FBI of offers of foreign help.
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[JohnR]

Originally Posted by nightfighter

Look, all you needed was uniforms to figure which party had the microphone and was on the clock.... Mueller was a dud, or ill.
Dems have to be disappointed.... despite calls from most of the announced 2020 candidates to proceed with impeachment proceedings.
Expecting a slam dunk, they got a face plant..
Trump treated the media to a victory lap... Gave them much more time and sound bites than they expected. See what they do with it. I didn't hear much there for them... And, said the guy who voted against HRC, he (Trump)still makes me sick.


So sick of the divisiveness....

In typical congress fashion, it was dividing on Party lines. Listened to part, watched some.

Mueller looked tired and lost his fastball. This is not to say he was a stooge or a liar or anything like that. Seems to underscore why he earlier asked not to be brought to the Hill to testify before Congress.

He did not bring anything new or sensational. This was the political equivalent of the Pats / Rams Superbowl. Little gain by both sides, low score

Originally Posted by Pete F.

On the same day Mueller warned Russia is interfering in the 2020 election “as we sit here” & that accepting foreign assistance has become the “new normal”, Senate GOP blocked two election security bills, including one requiring campaigns inform FBI of offers of foreign help.
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We need to do better, including FBI / NSA at blocking foreign digital influence. People also need to understand this is something Russia has done since long before Al Gore invented the Internet.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by JohnR

In typical congress fashion, it was dividing on Party lines. Listened to part, watched some.

Mueller looked tired and lost his fastball. This is not to say he was a stooge or a liar or anything like that. Seems to underscore why he earlier asked not to be brought to the Hill to testify before Congress.

He did not bring anything new or sensational. This was the political equivalent of the Pats / Rams Superbowl. Little gain by both sides, low score




We need to do better, including FBI / NSA at blocking foreign digital influence. People also need to understand this is something Russia has done since long before Al Gore invented the Internet.

i agree with all that. But is there any rational reason to believe, that the outcome of the election would have been any different, had Russia minded its own business? They didn’t hack into vote counting machines, they didn’t hypnotize us all with the Jedi mind trick.
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[JohnR]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

i agree with all that. But is there any rational reason to believe, that the outcome of the election would have been any different, had Russia minded its own business? They didn’t hack into vote counting machines, they didn’t hypnotize us all with the Jedi mind trick.
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I don't know if they created enough influence to change the out come of the election merely with their efforts of 2015 to 2016. If one goes far down the Russian Influence rabbit hole they surely could not offset all the pro-progressive, CPUSA influence they've generated over seven decades.

Clearly the Force Choke is still applied to some people

[spence]

Originally Posted by JohnR

He did not bring anything new or sensational. This was the political equivalent of the Pats / Rams Superbowl. Little gain by both sides, low score

Largely because he was ordered by the DOJ to not bring anything new or sensational.

That being said, what's in the report is already extremely sensational.

Russia meddled in the election to help Trump
The Trump campaign encouraged it and expected to benefit from it
Pretty much everyone involved including the President lied about it
When investigated Trump repeatedly tried to obstruct it
And now Russia (and others) are going to do it again and Republicans don't seem to care

Dems should have started impeachment hearings three months ago.

[JohnR]

Originally Posted by spence

Largely because he was ordered by the DOJ to not bring anything new or sensational.

That being said, what's in the report is already extremely sensational.

Russia meddled in the election to help Trump
The Trump campaign encouraged it and expected to benefit from it
Pretty much everyone involved including the President lied about it
When investigated Trump repeatedly tried to obstruct it
And now Russia (and others) are going to do it again and Republicans don't seem to care

Dems should have started impeachment hearings three months ago.

Neither the report, nor Mueller's testimony in front of Congress had anything sensational. No smoking gun. No Indictment.


Trump is a sheitty President. I get that and I agree. Someone give me a middle of the road, fair, honest, and high integrity politician than won't bankrupt our country, or take away my rights to give to others so I have an alternative. Right now I am at write in but the crazier the left gets the less unappealing being never Trump gets.

[spence]

Originally Posted by JohnR

Neither the report, nor Mueller's testimony in front of Congress had anything sensational. No smoking gun. No Indictment.

Ok, so ordering your council to create a fake paper trail while you're under investigation is like, um, no big deal? The report is full of stuff like that.

[The Dad Fisherman]

Collins: At any time in the investigation was your investigation curtailed or stopped or hindered?

Mueller: No.

[spence]

Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman

Collins: At any time in the investigation was your investigation curtailed or stopped or hindered?

Mueller: No.

Clearly he's speaking internal DOJ process as the report states countless instances where witnesses lied, evidence was unavailable because of encryption, deception or refusal to cooperate and that's not even counting the cases of obstruction.

[spence]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

i agree with all that. But is there any rational reason to believe, that the outcome of the election would have been any different, had Russia minded its own business? They didn’t hack into vote counting machines, they didn’t hypnotize us all with the Jedi mind trick.
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Given the scale of interference outlined in the report it's hard to believe it didn't have an impact. Given the election was decided on pretty thin margins it's quite possible it did push Trump over the edge.

What should be more disturbing though is that even though it did happen, Trump and a lot of the GOP is still denying or downplaying the threat to our electoral system or opposing efforts to improve it.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by JohnR

Someone give me a middle of the road, fair, honest, and high integrity politician than won't bankrupt our country, or take away my rights to give to others so I have an alternative. .

the left and the
media make it almost impossible for such a person to get a fair shake. McCain was a senile old racist, Romney a heartless plutocrat. if you want someone to the right of Liz Warren, that person needs to be able to fight back, and effectively. i’m not saying it needs to be Trump, but it can’t be a gentlemanly milquetoast wimp
either. not until more of the media isn’t partial.
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[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by spence

Given the scale of interference outlined in the report it's hard to believe it didn't have an impact. Given the election was decided on pretty thin margins it's quite possible it did push Trump over the edge.

What should be more disturbing though is that even though it did happen, Trump and a lot of the GOP is still denying or downplaying the threat to our electoral system or opposing efforts to improve it.

yawn.
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[PaulS]

Originally Posted by spence

Clearly he's speaking internal DOJ process as the report states countless instances where witnesses lied, evidence was unavailable because of encryption, deception or refusal to cooperate and that's not even counting the cases of obstruction.

I believe he also said evidence was destroyed. And if Clinton ever refused to answer questions or not meet, the Repubs. would have been screaming.

"Throughout 2016, the report found, Paul Manafort, President Trump’s campaign chairman, gave private polling information to Russian agents and shared campaign strategy with them; in June 2016, Donald Trump Jr., the president’s son, arranged a meeting with Russians at Trump Tower in the expectation of getting “dirt” on the Hillary Clinton campaign; on July 27 of that year, candidate Trump publicly called on the Russians to hack Mrs. Clinton’s emails, five hours before they attempted to do just that; the campaign then devised its strategy and created its messages around WikiLeaks’s releases of stolen files from the Democratic National Committee"

[PaulS]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

yawn.
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When you start caring more for the Repub. party than America?

[scottw]

Originally Posted by spence

Dems should have started impeachment hearings three months ago.

that's exactly what I've been saying

[JohnR]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

the left and the
media make it almost impossible for such a person to get a fair shake. McCain was a senile old racist, Romney a heartless plutocrat. if you want someone to the right of Liz Warren, that person needs to be able to fight back, and effectively. i’m not saying it needs to be Trump, but it can’t be a gentlemanly milquetoast wimp
either. not until more of the media isn’t partial.
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The R Primary does the same thing so that is unfortunate for all too. The one recent time that the moderate rose to the general, Romney, he was flayed as a sexist binder ridden polygamist that was gonna pout 47% of all y'all in chains.

Originally Posted by PaulS

I believe he also said evidence was destroyed. And if Clinton ever refused to answer questions or not meet, the Repubs. would have been screaming.

"Throughout 2016, the report found, Paul Manafort, President Trump’s campaign chairman, gave private polling information to Russian agents and shared campaign strategy with them; in June 2016, Donald Trump Jr., the president’s son, arranged a meeting with Russians at Trump Tower in the expectation of getting “dirt” on the Hillary Clinton campaign; on July 27 of that year, candidate Trump publicly called on the Russians to hack Mrs. Clinton’s emails, five hours before they attempted to do just that; the campaign then devised its strategy and created its messages around WikiLeaks’s releases of stolen files from the Democratic National Committee"

I truly don't think they hacked Clinton's emails after Trump called for it, they had Clinton's emails for a long time already, as did the Chinese and god knows what other countries.

Originally Posted by PaulS

When you start caring more for the Repub. party than America?

When both the Reps and Dems care more about reelection than American, you mean?

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by PaulS

When you start caring more for the Repub. party than America?

never. i’ve said
if he committed a crime, i wNt h vine more than anyone. i was told a million times the mueller report would be the final say, but as always, the left can’t handle it when it doesn’t go their way.

do you or spence or pete or GS or wdmso care that the doj used a dossier paid for by hilary, to spy on an american citizen?

i’m concerned about trump. and i’m concerned that hilary used the doj as her personal private eye firm. i’m concerned about both of those things. are you? or do you only care about one?

you people
learned absolutely nothing in 2016. Zip.
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[PaulS]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

never. i’ve said
if he committed a crime, i wNt h vine more than anyone. i was told a million times the mueller report would be the final say, but as always, the left can’t handle it when it doesn’t go their way.You don't have a problem with Trump and his team's lying or trying to work with the Russians?

do you or spence or pete or GS or wdmso care that the doj used a dossier paid for by hilary, to spy on an american citizen? Who cares who paid for it? Isn't that missing the point? Who paid for it bf the Hillary's team?

i’m concerned about trump. and i’m concerned that hilary used the doj as her personal private eye firm. i’m concerned about both of those things. are you? or do you only care about one?You have no proof of that.

you people
learned absolutely nothing in 2016. Zip.
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And you seem to care more about 3.7% and 27,000 than that the Russians interfered in elections or the constant lying from this admin - nothing has been done to prevent the Russians from doing it again.

[Pete F.]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

never. i’ve said
if he committed a crime, i wNt h vine more than anyone. i was told a million times the mueller report would be the final say, but as always, the left can’t handle it when it doesn’t go their way.

do you or spence or pete or GS or wdmso care that the doj used a dossier paid for by hilary, to spy on an american citizen?

i’m concerned about trump. and i’m concerned that hilary used the doj as her personal private eye firm. i’m concerned about both of those things. are you? or do you only care about one?

you people
learned absolutely nothing in 2016. Zip.
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And just when would you suggest looking at political operatives involvement with Russia?

Popadopoulous told an Australian diplomat about info on Russians having emails and the Aussie had more sense than anyone in the Trump campaign, including Trump to date.

“All we did was report what Papadopoulos said, and that was that he thought the Russians may release information that could be damaging to Hillary Clinton’s campaign at some stage before the election,” Downer told Sky News. “Now, he didn’t have to tell me that. I didn’t go to the meeting thinking he was even going to mention Russia in a context like the election campaign, I had no idea he would say that.”

Papadopoulos had several meetings with foreign individuals overseas, including Downer and Maltese professor Joseph Mifsud, during the 2016 presidential election. Special Counsel Robert Mueller’s report stated that Mifsud told Papadopoulos that the Russians had “dirt” in the form of emails that could damage Clinton’s 2016 presidential campaign. Papadopoulos then told Downer about his conversations with Mifsud.

Papadopoulos has previously suggested that the Downer meeting was part of a plot to lay the groundwork for the Russia probe.

Downer said that Papadopoulos “chose” to share that information with him.

“I have no idea why he was blabbering this, but if you say that sort of thing to somebody who is part of the Five Eyes intelligence community, I mean, I would regard myself as a warrior for the western alliance, but if it is drawn to my attention that the Russians might be hacking into the campaigns of major candidates in western elections and then using that information to try to influence the outcome of those elections, that would really worry me,” he explained.

“Russia is not a friendly pal when it comes to western interests, and if they’re hacking into our elections, then that’s something we should try to stop,” Downer said. “I don’t know why he told me this, but he did and we reported it and the rest is history, but there is no defense for him saying it is some sort of weird conspiracy, I mean, it’s what he told me.”

Would you suggest we not investigate the unusual ties of several other Trump campaign aides to Russia. The early investigation focused on Papadopoulos, as well as Trump senior adviser Michael Flynn, campaign manager Paul Manafort, and foreign policy adviser Carter Page. Flynn had been paid $45,000 by Russia's state-sponsored television network RT for a 2015 speech in Moscow, where he was given a place of honor at the same dinner table as President Vladimir Putin. Manafort had been paid millions lobbying for pro-Russian interests in Ukraine. Page, an oil industry consultant who had lived in Russia for three years during the early 2000s, was already well known to the FBI. Russian spies had attempted to recruit him as an asset in 2013, after which a Russian operative was overheard in a wiretapped conversation telling his superiors that Page was "an idiot." As a Trump campaign aide, Page traveled to Moscow for three days in July 2016. While there, he gave a speech harshly criticizing the Obama administration's foreign policy toward Russia and met with officials of Rosneft, a state-run oil company. The FBI obtained a secret court order to wiretap Page in October, after he had left the campaign. That warrant from the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court has become one of the most controversial parts of the investigation.

After Trump fired FBI Director James Comey, citing "this Russia thing," special counsel Robert Mueller conducted a two-year investigation that concluded that Russia had interfered in the 2016 presidential election "in a sweeping and systematic fashion." Mueller found that several people close to Trump — including Manafort and longtime confidant Roger Stone — had had dozens of contacts with Russians and were "receptive" to offers of help. Mueller also found 10 instances in which Trump personally may have obstructed justice in trying to limit or shut down the investigation. Republican Sen. Marco Rubio, a member of the Senate Intelligence Committee, said the committee's work had convinced him that the FBI had no choice but to begin a probe. "There was a growing body of evidence that a foreign government was attempting to interfere in both the process and the debate surrounding our elections," Rubio said. "The [FBI's] job is to investigate counter-intelligence. That's what they did."

[Got Stripers]

Seems simple to me, both the report and Muellers testimony show Russian interfered in a major way, the Trump campaign while not proven guilty of conspiring with the Russians, they gladly accepted and in fact encouraged help from a long time enemy (very American of them). The report and testimony also proof Trump on multiple occasions made attempts to hinder, stop and then tamper with witnesses and the other reason he wasn’t charged was due to the guidelines under which Mueller was operating. That’s my interpretation of it and I don’t need a dozen posts to attempt to show where I’m wrong, because that’s as futile as my going beyond the above opinion to prove your wrong. Move on, Congress will either dig up more, get financial records, start proceedings to impeach or we move to the election and it’s decided there, I personally can’t wait for one or the other.
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[PaulS]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

Seems simple to me, both the report and Muellers testimony show Russian interfered in a major way, .
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And the Repubs. just blocked election security bills.

[scottw]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

Seems simple to me, both the report and Muellers testimony show Russian interfered in a major way,
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you know that was all during the Obama presidency ...right???

[Pete F.]

Here is the reason they put forth a bill to make this not only bad form but illegal.




And you can read the bill here
https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-...%5D%7D&r=1&s=3

[spence]

Originally Posted by scottw

you know that was all during the Obama presidency ...right???

According to Mueller they're still doing it today.

[scottw]

Originally Posted by spence

According to Mueller they're still doing it today.

muller didn't appear to know what day today was

[Sea Dangles]

The intention just was not there. Next witch hunt is looming
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[Got Stripers]

Originally Posted by Sea Dangles

The intention just was not there. Next witch hunt is looming
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The intent to conspire with the Russians maybe not, the intent to obstruct an investigation DEFINATELY!
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[PaulS]

WASHINGTON — The Senate Intelligence Committee concluded Thursday that election systems in all 50 states were targeted by Russia in 2016, largely undetected by the states and federal officials at the time, but at the demand of American intelligence agencies the committee was forced to redact its findings so heavily that key lessons for the 2020 election are blacked out.

Image
One section on recommended action was almost completely redacted.
One section on recommended action was almost completely redacted.
The report — the first volume of several to be released from the committee’s investigation into Russia’s 2016 election interference — came just 24 hours after the former special counsel, Robert S. Mueller III, warned that Russia was moving again to interfere “as we sit here.”


It also landed hours after Senator Mitch McConnell, the majority leader, personally stepped forward to block consideration of a package of election security bills.
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[Got Stripers]

Mitch is useless and time for him to go.
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