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Old 08-03-2018, 07:21 AM   #61
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Old 08-03-2018, 07:30 AM   #62
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Originally Posted by zimmy View Post
I think there is a great misunderstanding about the waste cycle. Into the trash often times doesn't equate to into the landfill for eternity. Anyway, if people in Seattle don't like it, they will vote out the council or bring their own straws. They won't need the government to wipe anything for them.
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Improve the recycling

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Originally Posted by wdmso View Post
let bring this back a bit


Despite Strong Economy, Federal Deficit Soars


Corporate tax receipts are down for the year, while government spending is up. Even with a fast-growing economy, the Treasury Department expects to borrow more than $750 billion to pay its bills during the last six months of this year.
WTH were you the last dozen years?

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Old 08-03-2018, 08:32 AM   #63
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WTH were you the last dozen years?
yeah...didn't they call it "new normal" back then?
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Old 08-03-2018, 08:40 AM   #64
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Yup, now the deficit is important to Wayne.
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Old 08-03-2018, 10:46 AM   #65
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Improve the recycling


You willing to fund that with your tax dollars? It isn't in the interest of the recycling companies to do that. They recycle for profit. They have no incentive to upgrade all the machinery even if the technology existed The market in China for recycled material has dried up as it is. I understand people view this as solely a personal freedom issue, but when the stuff someone uses becomes an external problem, personal freedom has limits. The impact of plastic on wildlife, and fisheries in particular, is dramatic and the cost to purchase a straw or plastic bag doesn't come close to the economic impact associated with them as waste.

How about this? Tax the straws at a rate that will allow the recycling companies to upgrade the machinery to collect the straws for recycling. Probably end up being a few cents per straw given the 500 million a day that are used in USA. All the tax goes to fund upgrades. Temporary tax of a year or two, whatever is needed. Pretty sure a bunch of people that are upset about local ordinances banning straws would be equally upset about a tax to deal with the problem.

Last edited by zimmy; 08-03-2018 at 10:53 AM..

No, no, no. we’re 30… 30, three zero.
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Old 08-03-2018, 11:25 AM   #66
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"Tax the straws" !!!

Last edited by scottw; 08-03-2018 at 12:11 PM..
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Old 08-03-2018, 11:35 AM   #67
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I know you are a preteen, but don't make up quotes from me.
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No, no, no. we’re 30… 30, three zero.
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Old 08-03-2018, 11:43 AM   #68
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I know you are a preteen, but don't make up quotes from me.
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sticks and stones
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Old 08-03-2018, 12:09 PM   #69
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Where are quotation marks?
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Old 08-03-2018, 12:12 PM   #70
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Where are quotation marks?
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fixed it...
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Old 08-03-2018, 12:16 PM   #71
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fixed it...
Tough time in middle school for you I bet...
And your teachers didn't teach you how to selectively quote either.
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No, no, no. we’re 30… 30, three zero.
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Old 08-03-2018, 12:56 PM   #72
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Tough time in middle school for you I bet...
And your teachers didn't teach you how to selectively quote either.
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yeah....puberty and everything...tough time
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Old 08-03-2018, 01:17 PM   #73
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yeah....puberty and everything...tough time
Don't worry, it gets better eventually for most people.
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No, no, no. we’re 30… 30, three zero.
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Old 08-03-2018, 01:39 PM   #74
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Yup, now the deficit is important to Wayne.
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I dont care about deficits I clearly understand they are part of Running a country in the long term .... the point is Republican have stated they cared about deficits as well as some here ..until Trump took office that is ....


But the Tax cut and better GDP were sold as they would pay for themselves and reduce the deficit with an increase in Tax revenue because of the booming economy.... Seems not to be the case
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Old 08-03-2018, 04:34 PM   #75
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Originally Posted by zimmy View Post
You willing to fund that with your tax dollars? It isn't in the interest of the recycling companies to do that. They recycle for profit. They have no incentive to upgrade all the machinery even if the technology existed The market in China for recycled material has dried up as it is. I understand people view this as solely a personal freedom issue, but when the stuff someone uses becomes an external problem, personal freedom has limits. The impact of plastic on wildlife, and fisheries in particular, is dramatic and the cost to purchase a straw or plastic bag doesn't come close to the economic impact associated with them as waste.

How about this? Tax the straws at a rate that will allow the recycling companies to upgrade the machinery to collect the straws for recycling. Probably end up being a few cents per straw given the 500 million a day that are used in USA. All the tax goes to fund upgrades. Temporary tax of a year or two, whatever is needed. Pretty sure a bunch of people that are upset about local ordinances banning straws would be equally upset about a tax to deal with the problem.
I am already paying Taxes at an exhorbitant rate for tons of services I don't get (some of which I'm fine with, some not).

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I dont care about deficits I clearly understand they are part of Running a country in the long term .... the point is Republican have stated they cared about deficits as well as some here ..until Trump took office that is ....


But the Tax cut and better GDP were sold as they would pay for themselves and reduce the deficit with an increase in Tax revenue because of the booming economy.... Seems not to be the case
Small deficits are OK to run a country, not a deficit that is 6 times annual receipts.

The fact that YOU don't care about deficits clearly establishes your credibility when it comes to things financial ; ) and if one can further draw conclusions...

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Old 08-03-2018, 04:47 PM   #76
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I am already paying Taxes at an exhorbitant rate for tons of services I don't get (some of which I'm fine with, some not).
I agree, taxes are already high, the recycling companies have no financial incentive to upgrade equipment, and plastic is a problem. A local ordinance isn't THAT crazy.

Also, had to check and, no surprise,
https://www.rushlimbaugh.com/daily/2...-2/app-straws/

Wondered why guys in New England cared what localities on the west coast were up to.

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No, no, no. we’re 30… 30, three zero.
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Old 08-03-2018, 05:02 PM   #77
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Small deficits are OK to run a country, not a deficit that is 6 times annual receipts.

The fact that YOU don't care about deficits clearly establishes your credibility when it comes to things financial ; ) and if one can further draw conclusions...
Federal tax receipts are over 3 trillion in recent years, compared to Bush era deficts of over a trillion, Obama era deficits of 5-600 Billion or the mushrooming Trump deficits that will take us back over a trillion for the next decade.

While this doesn't seem to look good for Republicans it's nowhere near the 6x multiple you claim. The fact that YOU don't understand deficits clearly establishes your credibility when it comes to things financial ; ) and if one can further draw conclusions...
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Old 08-03-2018, 06:28 PM   #78
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recent years, compared to Bush era deficts of over a trillion, Obama era deficits of 5-600 Billion or the mushrooming Trump deficits that will take us back over a trillion for the next decade.

and if one can further draw conclusions...
I can draw the conclusion that you are a world class cherry-picker of data. If you ignore Obama's first 4 years, yes the deficits shrank. to half a trillion You conveniently left out that (1) his deficits were much larger in his first 4 years, and that the democrats controlled congress when the deficits were massive, and the GOP controlled congress (and this the budgets) when his deficits came down.

If you want to say conservatives are hypocrites about going berserk about deficits under Obama and now silent, that's 100% legitimate. But Obama added more to the debt than anyone before him.
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Old 08-03-2018, 10:02 PM   #79
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You should read this Jim, the whole thing.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/chuckjon...or-w-bush/amp/
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Old 08-03-2018, 10:34 PM   #80
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Federal tax receipts are over 3 trillion in recent years, compared to Bush era deficts of over a trillion, Obama era deficits of 5-600 Billion or the mushrooming Trump deficits that will take us back over a trillion for the next decade.

While this doesn't seem to look good for Republicans it's nowhere near the 6x multiple you claim. The fact that YOU don't understand deficits clearly establishes your credibility when it comes to things financial ; ) and if one can further draw conclusions...

Do all of Bush and all of Obama - don't cherry pick

P.S. - I was against both in this regard

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Old 08-04-2018, 12:28 AM   #81
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Federal tax receipts are over 3 trillion in recent years, compared to Bush era deficts of over a trillion, Obama era deficits of 5-600 Billion or the mushrooming Trump deficits that will take us back over a trillion for the next decade.

While this doesn't seem to look good for Republicans it's nowhere near the 6x multiple you claim. The fact that YOU don't understand deficits clearly establishes your credibility when it comes to things financial ; ) and if one can further draw conclusions...
Context Jeff
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PRO CHOICE REPUBLICAN
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Old 08-04-2018, 05:47 AM   #82
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Reagan

Started Presidency: $965 billion
Ended Presidency: $2.74 trillion
Increased 184% or 13.9% per year
H.W. Bush

Started Presidency: $2.74 trillion
Ended Presidency: $4.23 trillion
Increased 54% or 11.5% per year (only in office for four years)
Clinton

Started Presidency: $4.23 trillion
Ended Presidency: $5.77 trillion
Increased 36% or 4.0% per year
W. Bush

Started Presidency: $5.77 trillion
Ended Presidency: $11.1 trillion
Increased 93% or 8.5% per year
Obama

Started Presidency: $11.1 trillion
Ended Presidency: $19.85 trillion
Increased 78% or 7.5% per year
Trump
Started Presidency $19.85 Trillion
April 2018 $21.0 Trillion
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Old 08-04-2018, 06:31 AM   #83
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You should read this Jim, the whole thing.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/chuckjon...or-w-bush/amp/
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i can find as many articles as you want, written by people who say bush 43 wasn’t responsible for the subprime mortgage crisis. but people blamed him for what happened on his watch.

obviously, much of obama’s spending wasn’t discretionary, and he inherited a recession and he inherited a war. but he championed the stimulus bill which flopped, and obamacare which pretty much flopped.

again, all i ask is for some consistency. if liberals want to blame bush for the recession solely because it happened on his watch, then obama is also responsible for what happened on his watch. is that unfair? i don’t think so.
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Old 08-04-2018, 10:13 AM   #84
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Do all of Bush and all of Obama - don't cherry pick

P.S. - I was against both in this regard
Doesn't matter none of them were 6X
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Old 08-04-2018, 05:43 PM   #85
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Doesn't matter none of them were 6X
Ahhhh, I got ya.

Let me be more clear, the total debt is 6 times the annual revenue, and growing. The guv spends roughly 20-30% more annually than it takes in - that is unsustainable and has been my position since Junior was in office.


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Federal tax receipts are over 3 trillion in recent years, compared to Bush era deficts of over a trillion, Obama era deficits of 5-600 Billion or the mushrooming Trump deficits that will take us back over a trillion for the next decade.

Now on your point that Bush was a Trillion per year and Obama was half that is just ludicrous Spence. Bush had one year (2?) at 1 T (TARP/QE) that was the first year of Obama. Obama had 4 years over a T. Both were too much. But Bush did not have "era deficts of over a trillion, Obama era deficits of 5-600 Billion". That is just ludicrous, and you know it.

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Old 08-04-2018, 06:05 PM   #86
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Now on your point that Bush was a Trillion per year and Obama was half that is just ludicrous Spence. Bush had one year (2?) at 1 T (TARP/QE) that was the first year of Obama. Obama had 4 years over a T. Both were too much. But Bush did not have "era deficts of over a trillion, Obama era deficits of 5-600 Billion". That is just ludicrous, and you know it.
Bush left Obama with a massive deficit problem that Obama did a great job of whittling down even with the stimulus. Granted this was helped by economic growth. Trump inherited a deficit of under 700B and now its skyrocketing to over a trillion again for years to come...while we are experiencing decent growth as well.

Riddle me that? I’ve done my homework.
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Old 08-05-2018, 06:25 AM   #87
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Bush left Obama with a massive deficit problem that Obama did a great job of whittling down even with the stimulus. Granted this was helped by economic growth. Trump inherited a deficit of under 700B and now its skyrocketing to over a trillion again for years to come...while we are experiencing decent growth as well.

Riddle me that? I’ve done my homework.
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you got caught red handed cherry picking numbers to serve your agenda. leave it at that, don’t dig your hole deeper.

plenty of debt hypocrisy on both sides...for most people, their concern over deficits depends entirely on the party of the sitting president, it’s obvious.

interesting that you can see that trumps deficits will be this large for years to come. quite the prognosticator.

you forgot to mention, i wonder why, that a good chunk of bush’s deficits was because of the response to 9/11. he also managed, according to stanford university, to launch an aids initiative that is credited with saving over one million lives in africa. and almost nobody knows about it, because the media hates him.
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Old 08-05-2018, 06:54 AM   #88
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ludicrous Spence.
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