Trump predictions

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by wdmso

"The new revenue erosion and higher pension costs together would swell the projected deficits to $1.5 billion next fiscal The chief culprits behind the latest declining forecast were the state income tax."

I don't know what that means.

http://ctmirror.org/2016/11/15/debt-...ext-ct-budget/

Paul, why do I need to pay anything for their pensions? If I have to find a way to retire on whatever I manage to save in my 401(k) (as does everyone in the private sector), why can't public servants do the same thing? If a teacher wants an annuity paying 75k a year starting at age 59, LET HIM PAY FOR THAT HIMSELF. if I have to fund my own retirement, why is it also my responsibility to fund theirs?

not to answer for paul.. however if you want their benefits do their job.. for 30 -35 years.. seems don't know many private sector guys that have been with the same company for that long in todays world 30years ago most of the NE did work in the same job same company 20 plus years who screwed who?

"you want their benefits do their job.. for 30 -35 years"

No, thanks, I don't want to do their job. I want to do my job, and spend what I earn on my kids. That is a very tired, thoughtless argument. Why don't you look at the numbers, see what it will take to actually fund those pensions, and ask yourself if it's fair to do that to your neighbors. We all want a fat pension that's mostly paid for by others. But few of us actually feel so entitled to other people's hard-earned wages. Also, we can't all work in the public unions. You need people in the private sector paying taxes, right?

If I have to make some sacrifices so that public servants don't have to live in trailer parks and eat cat food, I am happy to do that. However, if I have to make sacrifices so that public servants can cling to antiquated benefits that dwarf what's available to the public they claim to serve, that's something else. And the latter is what is happening.

WDMSO, I posted a link from the Hartford Courant showing that the unfunded liabilities here in CT are $19k per person. That means, in order to pay for those benefits, my family of 5 owes another $95,000 to the state of CT, on top of current tax rates, which are already absurdly high.

When tax rates that are among the highest in the nation, fall short of paying for those pensions by $19,000 per person, then those benefits are insane. If there is another explanation, go ahead and provide it. if you can tell me how the state can get another $95k from my family without destroying us, I'm all ears.

we all get that you want this pension. What you haven't done, is offered a way to pay for it. because there isn't a way to pay for it. You are reacting to what you want. I am reacting to the math. All you can see is what's best for you. I am looking at what's best for all of us, collectively.

"seems don't know many private sector guys that have been with the same company for that long in todays world 30years ago most of the NE did work in the same job same company 20 plus years who screwed who"

What difference does it make to you, if I stay at one company for 40 years, or if I switch every 10 years. It's my choice, and I have switched companies when it benefitted my family. That's called freedom.

[wdmso]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

"you want their benefits do their job.. for 30 -35 years"

No, thanks, I don't want to do their job. I want to do my job, and spend what I earn on my kids. That is a very tired, thoughtless argument. Why don't you look at the numbers, see what it will take to actually fund those pensions, and ask yourself if it's fair to do that to your neighbors. We all want a fat pension that's mostly paid for by others. But few of us actually feel so entitled to other people's hard-earned wages. Also, we can't all work in the public unions. You need people in the private sector paying taxes, right?

If I have to make some sacrifices so that public servants don't have to live in trailer parks and eat cat food, I am happy to do that. However, if I have to make sacrifices so that public servants can cling to antiquated benefits that dwarf what's available to the public they claim to serve, that's something else. And the latter is what is happening.

WDMSO, I posted a link from the Hartford Courant showing that the unfunded liabilities here in CT are $19k per person. That means, in order to pay for those benefits, my family of 5 owes another $95,000 to the state of CT, on top of current tax rates, which are already absurdly high.

When tax rates that are among the highest in the nation, fall short of paying for those pensions by $19,000 per person, then those benefits are insane. If there is another explanation, go ahead and provide it. if you can tell me how the state can get another $95k from my family without destroying us, I'm all ears.

we all get that you want this pension. What you haven't done, is offered a way to pay for it. because there isn't a way to pay for it. You are reacting to what you want. I am reacting to the math. All you can see is what's best for you. I am looking at what's best for all of us, collectively.

"seems don't know many private sector guys that have been with the same company for that long in todays world 30years ago most of the NE did work in the same job same company 20 plus years who screwed who"

What difference does it make to you, if I stay at one company for 40 years, or if I switch every 10 years. It's my choice, and I have switched companies when it benefitted my family. That's called freedom.

I love how you hide behind Freedom your not looking for freedom.. your looking for fairness .. your looking to remove freedoms (colective bargining ) because you dont have it .. some one looking for freedom does not reach in to others pockets .. you have freedom you made your choices now try accepting them.. do I think you shouldn't get Social security because I am not eligible to collect because I paying to my own pension and dont have the quarters .. of course not ,

again who screwed the American worker companies ..

The History of the Pension
For generations, pensions were the retirement plan standard for just about every employer. This may be hard to believe, but it wasn’t until the early 1980’s that 401(k)’s even existed. Ironically, 401(k)’s were originally added to the IRS code as a way for companies to offer additional retirement benefits to high ranking executives, above and beyond their defined pensions. This didn’t last long.

Over time, most employers have made the shift from defined benefit pensions to 401(k)’s. 401(k)’s were sold as the fresh new thing, giving employees all of the power to choose their own investments. In reality, they were often times a low to modest cost savings over their defined benefit counterparts. The combination of the appeal to the American individualistic ambition and cost cutting possibilities were the perfect storm to sell 401(k)’s over their elder relative.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by wdmso

I love how you hide behind Freedom your not looking for freedom.. your looking for fairness .. your looking to remove freedoms (colective bargining ) because you dont have it .. some one looking for freedom does not reach in to others pockets .. you have freedom you made your choices now try accepting them.. do I think you shouldn't get Social security because I am not eligible to collect because I paying to my own pension and dont have the quarters .. of course not ,

again who screwed the American worker companies ..

The History of the Pension
For generations, pensions were the retirement plan standard for just about every employer. This may be hard to believe, but it wasn’t until the early 1980’s that 401(k)’s even existed. Ironically, 401(k)’s were originally added to the IRS code as a way for companies to offer additional retirement benefits to high ranking executives, above and beyond their defined pensions. This didn’t last long.

Over time, most employers have made the shift from defined benefit pensions to 401(k)’s. 401(k)’s were sold as the fresh new thing, giving employees all of the power to choose their own investments. In reality, they were often times a low to modest cost savings over their defined benefit counterparts. The combination of the appeal to the American individualistic ambition and cost cutting possibilities were the perfect storm to sell 401(k)’s over their elder relative.

"your not looking for freedom.. your looking for fairness "

Freedom and fairness are not mutually exclusive. And if I am looking for fairness (which I agree I am), what are you looking for?

"your looking to remove freedoms (colective bargining ) because you dont have it "

Wrong. I would remove collective bargaining not because I don't have it, but because it leads to crushing debt. I have provided hard data to back that up, at least in my home state of CT.

"do I think you shouldn't get Social security because I am not eligible to collect because I paying to my own pension and dont have the quarters .. of course not "

Here's the difference...if you are not eligible for SS, that means you don't pay into SS. So my SS benefits do not impact you one cent, so you have no reason to care.

"they (401ks) were often times a low to modest cost savings over their defined benefit counterparts"

That might be the stupidest thing ever posted on the Internet. With 401ks, companies typically contribute 3% of a person's salary each year. You're going to say with a straight face, that my company could give me a pension with that same 3% contribution?

Here's an annuity calculator. I figured out that to pay for an annuity of 50k a year for 27 years,. assuming growth of 6% per year, you'd need to start with $700,000. You think you can accumulate that much, by putting 3% of your salary into an account each year?

http://www.bankrate.com/calculators/...alculator.aspx

[detbuch]

Originally Posted by wdmso

I love how you hide behind Freedom your not looking for freedom.. your looking for fairness .. your looking to remove freedoms (colective bargining ) because you dont have it ..

Saying that "collective bargaining" as it is practiced here is "freedom" is like saying that a group of your associates who are less well off than you and who depend on you to foot the bill for any group activity among all of you is "free," has a "right," to demand that you negotiate with them how much of your money must be spent on said funding and under what conditions they will participate in the activity with you. You also would not have the right to collude with other well off people, who enjoy the same activity and also subsidize their group of less well off friends, in order to have a combined agreement not to cave in to any demands. And you have no "right" or freedom to not practice the activity with them nor the freedom to stop paying for it, other than to stop doing that activity all-together. And if you did stop doing it all-together, your group of friends who depended on you to fund their activity could go over to the other well off people who fund the same activities for their associated group which could grow to take up the slack produced by the departure of you, their former benefactor.

The form of "collective bargaining" you're speaking of is forced by federal law on employers. They cannot refuse to bargain with their "collective" (union) workers other than to quit the business. Nor can the employers associate with a group of other employers to oppose an industry wide demand of employees even though the latter are free to associate collectively against a single employer, even with employees of other companies which are not even in the same industry as their employer if they belong to the same collective (union).

The "freedom" of association in collective bargaining applies only to the employees and their union. The companies are not free to associate with other companies. How can it be called freedom if it is dependent on government coercion? That would be an Orwellian freedom at best.

some one looking for freedom does not reach in to others pockets ..

Whose pockets are being reached into by collective bargaining?

again who screwed the American worker companies ..

I don't know what an American worker company is. Whatever it is, and however it was screwed . . . maybe "freedeom" screwed them?

The History of the Pension
For generations, pensions were the retirement plan standard for just about every employer. This may be hard to believe, but it wasn’t until the early 1980’s that 401(k)’s even existed. Ironically, 401(k)’s were originally added to the IRS code as a way for companies to offer additional retirement benefits to high ranking executives, above and beyond their defined pensions. This didn’t last long.

Over time, most employers have made the shift from defined benefit pensions to 401(k)’s. 401(k)’s were sold as the fresh new thing, giving employees all of the power to choose their own investments. In reality, they were often times a low to modest cost savings over their defined benefit counterparts. The combination of the appeal to the American individualistic ambition and cost cutting possibilities were the perfect storm to sell 401(k)’s over their elder relative.

My limited understanding of the difference between 401k's and the "standard" pensions you mentioned is that the latter is a defined benefit guarantee. A defined monthly benefit is guaranteed on retirement and the provider (company, municipality) is at risk for providing the benefit. On the other hand, the 401k is a defined contribution plan in which a given amount of pay can be invested by the employees as he wishes, and the employee is at risk in terms of what benefits she gets at retirement. The company is relieved of the cost of providing pension payments. So the cost savings to the employer are substantial.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by detbuch

So the cost savings to the employer are substantial.

The difference is massive. Which is exactly why almost the entire private sector made the switch.

[PaulS]

Trump just filed suit to block the PA recount despite saying earlier this week there was "massive fraud" and that "millions of people illegally voted for Clinton".

It is going to be a fun 4 years watching him.

[scottw]

Originally Posted by PaulS

Trump just filed suit to block the PA recount despite saying earlier this week there was "massive fraud" and that "millions of people illegally voted for Clinton".

It is going to be a fun 4 years watching him.

once again the difference between something being said...and something actually being done

wasn't the left and many on the right up in arms over the suggestion that he might not accept the outcome....where is the outrage over those who apparently have not accepted the outcome...??

trust me...it will far more fun watching the left and media reacting to Trump over the next 4 years....

[PaulS]

So what Trump says doesn't matter?

[scottw]

Originally Posted by PaulS

So what Trump says doesn't matter?

not generally

[PaulS]

have to agree with you there.

[detbuch]

H0W TRUMP COULD RUIN HIS PRESIDENCY

Ann Coulter | Thursday Dec 1, 2016 9:47 AM

Soon after Trump’s announcement speech, I said he would win the nomination and likely the election. It wasn’t that hard to predict. For anyone familiar with the Republican Party’s repeated betrayals of the American people, it was a 2-foot putt.

I issue this warning with the same certitude — in fact, for the exact same reason I knew anyone running on Trump’s platform would have unbreakable support from millions of voters.

What coalesced Trump’s base, what made his support tempered steel, was the fact that voters had been lied to, over and over again — on many things, but most smugly and repeatedly on immigration.

How many times did we have to see the GOP choke? There’s 30 seconds left in the game, Republicans are down by two, they move the ball up the court, have a man in position — and, every time, the GOP would do anything to avoid taking the 3-point shot.

That is the beating heart of the anger that voters felt toward the party. No one trusted Republicans to ever score when they had the ball.

It’s why Trump’s supporters stuck with him through thick and thin — his attack on war hero John McCain (he deserved it), his mocking a disabled reporter (a lie), his lazy first debate performance (totally true) and the “Access Hollywood” tape (oh well).

After he gave that Mexican rapists speech, and never backed down, Trump’s base would have brushed off six more “Access Hollywood” tapes. All because they think Trump will take the shot.

He’d better! As the popular vote proves, we don’t have 30 seconds on the clock. It’s only three.

But if he breaks a major campaign promise, his supporters will turn on him with a blind ferocity, dwarfing their rage toward Jeb! because Trump’s is the more exquisite con. He will have duped them. And he will never, ever, ever get them back.

Most of his promises can be kept with little trouble: He will appoint good judges, cut regulations, replace Obamacare and renegotiate trade deals. In other words, he’ll do all the things any Republican president would do — plus the trade deals.

But the moment Trump attempts to make good on his central promise — to remove troublesome immigrants and give us our country back — every major institution in America will declare war on him.

Trump knows that. In his Phoenix immigration speech, he said: “To all the politicians, donors and special interests, hear these words from me and all of you today. There is only one core issue in the immigration debate, and that issue is the well-being of the American people.”

If powerful interests were not furiously opposed to Trump’s idea that immigration should benefit Americans, rather than foreigners, our immigration policies would already do so.

It will surprise consumers of American media to learn this, but every promise Trump made on immigration is already the law. Why? Because politicians know that’s what the public wants. So they pass the laws — and then refuse to enforce them.

But if Trump doesn’t appoint the sort of people capable of fulfilling his campaign promises on immigration, he will fail. He’ll be just another lying politician, and his supporters will watch in horror as rapists, terrorists and drug dealers continue living in our country.

There will be no one person to blame. No one is ever to blame in Washington. They just won’t get it done.

Then, well into the Trump presidency, some Muslim will commit a machete attack, shoot up a community center, stage a mass slaughter at a gay nightclub or bomb a marathon. There’s no question but that the terrorist attacks won’t stop — unless Trump nominates people who know what needs to be done and aren’t intimidated by testy New York Times editorials.

There will be more Americans like Kate Steinle, Grant Ronnebeck and Joshua Wilkerson killed by illegal aliens. There will be more children addicted to heroin brought in by Mexican drug cartels. There will be more parents joining the Remembrance Project.

But this time, they’ll blame Trump.

And then it will be Trump’s opponents saying, “What is wrong with our politicians, our leaders — if we can call them that. What the hell are we doing?”

If Trump betrays voters on immigration, he can have as many rallies as he wants, but Americans will say, Been there, done that — you screwed us. He will never escape the stink of broken campaign promises.

So unless Trump has another 60 million voters hiding someplace, the appointments he makes today — to State, Defense, Homeland Security, Labor, even the IRS — will determine whether he is remembered as America’s greatest president, or if the Trump name becomes a cautionary tale in American politics.

At this precise moment — not after his inauguration, not in year two of his administration, but today, as he fills his Cabinet — Trump has to decide if he’s going to be like every other Republican and throw a brick or grab the ball and score.

Whether he’s listening or not, his supporters are screaming: TRUMP! NOW! TAKE THE SHOT!!!