The French attack

[Nebe]

My argument is that NOT ALL Muslims are bad. Weewee said that the only solution to solve this is to consider genocide. Genicide is the wiping out of an entire group of people.

Sure.. Let's nuke em all like a nest of cockroaches. I bet a lot of mouth breathers are thinking that is a good idea.
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[fishpoopoo]

What keeps me up at night (seriously) is a repeat of the Beslan school massacre. About 400 people (mostly children) were murdered by Chechen islamo jihadists.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beslan_school_siege

400.

Can you imagine that on U.S. soil?

But that's the reality we are looking at right now.

Have we forgotten?

The ocean that separates us from the muslim terrorists won't hold them forever.

Take some time to talk to your local police and homeland security agents.

Do you know how this is going to unfold?

Here's a scenario that will give you the chills.

Schoolbuses.

[fishpoopoo]

Originally Posted by Nebe

My argument is that NOT ALL Muslims are bad. Weewee said that the only solution to solve this is to consider genocide. Genicide is the wiping out of an entire group of people.

Sure.. Let's nuke em all like a nest of cockroaches. I bet a lot of mouth breathers are thinking that is a good idea.
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Nebe,

I said logically genocide is the only sure way. I didn't say that's what we should do, lol. Even I'm not that cranky.

Close the borders. Boot some of the f*ckers out. Don't give in to PC.

[Nebe]

There is no military solution to this problem. Has any one actually listened to what they want ?? They want western military to leave to area. Seems simple enough, no?
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[Nebe]

Originally Posted by fishpoopoo

Nebe,

I said logically genocide is the only sure way. I didn't say that's what we should do, lol. Even I'm not that cranky.

Close the borders. Boot some of the f*ckers out. Don't give in to PC.

I agree. Closed borders is a good step.
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[fishpoopoo]

Originally Posted by Nebe

There is no military solution to this problem. Has any one actually listened to what they want ?? They want western military to leave to area. Seems simple enough, no?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

I don't think bombing them does all that much. I'm pretty sure that ISIS was prepared for that when they planned the Paris attacks.

You have to have infantry go in and kill all of them. But it's hard when the rats scurry and melt into the general population.

That's why, from the perspective of prevention, it's important to seal the borders and keep a close eye on them (that means profiling) and booting the rabblerousers out.

Bring back the guillotine, while we're at it.

[fishpoopoo]

If ISIS stayed put and kept their crap within a defined area, I think the world could afford to say "not my problem."

But with what happened in Paris on Friday night, well, I don't think that's going to be very realistic.

This is foreign policy f*ckup squarely on Obama and Hilldog. They've owned it for 7 years.

[Nebe]

Obama is in charge of protecting France ? You lost me there.
But I'm in agreance with you 90%
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[fishpoopoo]

Originally Posted by Nebe

Obama is in charge of protecting France ? You lost me there.
But I'm in agreance with you 90%
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

No, but by abandoning Iraq he enabled ISIS to form and consolidate in strength.

That then started a cascade of events in Syria, with Obama supporting the anti al-Assad rebels, intensifying the civil war, which gave ISIS an opening to invade Syria, creating a humanitarian refugee crisis, allowing ISIS fanatics to sneak into western Europe.

Really, this is a big f*ckup.

[fishpoopoo]

Obama and Hilldog f*cked up Syria so bad that Putin felt he had to step in.

I don't like Putin, but he was justified in scolding Obama.

"Do you know what you did?!!!"

The dems have to realize that the middle east is not solveable by writing a white paper. Mooslims have been killing innocents and each other for thousands of years.

[RIROCKHOUND]

Originally Posted by fishpoopoo

Obama and Hilldog f*cked up Syria so bad that Putin felt he had to step in.

I don't like Putin, but he was justified in scolding Obama.

"Do you know what you did?!!!"

The dems have to realize that the middle east is not solveable by writing a white paper. Mooslims have been killing innocents and each other for thousands of years.

It is also not 'solveable' by committing 100,000's of troops for an indefinite amount of time per the hawks either. This is not solely on Bush, and not solely Obama's fault or either Clinton's.

I don't know what the answer is, most options suck.

[Nebe]

Ok. Agreed.
So much energy was focused on Iran and the nuke deal... No doubt this is a cluster #^&#^&#^&#^&. I'd love to see Russia go in there and do some muscle flexing on the ground.
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[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by Nebe

There is no military solution to this problem. Has any one actually listened to what they want ?? They want western military to leave to area. Seems simple enough, no?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Do you really believe that if the west removed its troops, the jihadists would lay down their arms? They hate everything we stand for, they hate that we let our womed go to school and we don't foirce them to dress like ninjas.

Israel made massive concessions, they turned over parts of Gaza, and they removed Israelis from disputed settlements. Yet the conflict goes on.

Nebe, if I thought a troop withdrawal would end the bloodhshed, I'd support it. There's no reason to suspect it would.

As Rockhound said, all options suck, but some suck less than others.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by Nebe

Ok. Agreed.
So much energy was focused on Iran and the nuke deal... No doubt this is a cluster #^&#^&#^&#^&. I'd love to see Russia go in there and do some muscle flexing on the ground.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Russia will, in retaliation for that downed plane. I suspect ISIS will find out that Putin isn't Eric Holder.

[fishpoopoo]

Originally Posted by RIROCKHOUND

It is also not 'solveable' by committing 100,000's of troops for an indefinite amount of time per the hawks either. This is not solely on Bush, and not solely Obama's fault or either Clinton's.

I don't know what the answer is, most options suck.

The middle east sucks. lol.

Every time we meddle there, however, we f*ck it up just a bit more. Hate to say it, but the region needs strong and brutal leaders to keep order amongst the two mooslim tribes. The Syria situation sits squarely on Obama and Hilldog. If we didn't take sides in the Syrian civil war and draw it out so much, maybe ISIS wouldn't have had the window of opportunity to step in.

It's really funny to say this, but Hillary Clinton really is a warmonger. I wonder if people are picking up on this.

More participation from other nations like Russia may not be a bad thing from the purely selfish perspective of saving American blood and treasure. Syria has been a Soviet/Russian client state for decades anyways. We can deal with the pernicious effects of Rooskie influence in the region later.

[Raven]

war is big business
lotta money in it

with prohibition
it requires Prisons (Clintons built-em)

with country skirmishes (campaigns)
it requires weaponry
that funds technology.... $$$$

bring on the drones
and bots with heat seeking
explosive darts

[Nebe]

#^&#^&#^&#^& is about to get real over there I think.
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[Fly Rod]

Nothing is going to get real over there.....the french used ten planes dropped 20 bombs, very few were killed.....what was the human kill number?.....big news was U S wart hogs destroyed oil tankers.....before strafing and bombing the tankers we dropped leaflets one hour before telling people to get away from their trucks.....my question is Y?....kill them!!!!.....we bomb empty buildings so that there R no civilian casualties....kill them!!!!....they did not care about killing civilians on 9/11

If U read between the lines of your presidents message yesterday he said...." hug an Isis."........lol

[Nebe]

We shall see....
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[Doover]

Originally Posted by Nebe

#^&#^&#^&#^& is about to get real over there I think.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Jeepers, in your mind, Kissy abandoning Iraq, Kissy trying to install the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt. Kissy drawing a red line in Syria and then ignoring his own demands, kisyy giving birth to ISIS, which creating a word wide refugee crisis...

IS NOT REAL??

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by RIROCKHOUND

It is also not 'solveable' by committing 100,000's of troops for an indefinite amount of time per the hawks either. This is not solely on Bush, and not solely Obama's fault or either Clinton's.

I don't know what the answer is, most options suck.

"It is also not 'solveable' by committing 100,000's of troops for an indefinite amount of time "

The "Surge", in Iraq, worked. Obama's removal of those troops, led to ISIS.

No one wants big numbers of troops over there for a long peropd of time. But it' sbetter to fight them there, than here. Better to figh tthem before they take out a city, than after. Correct?

"I don't know what the answer is, most options suck"

At a high level, I think the "what" is obvious and not complex - we have to kill all the jihadists, and everyone helping them. The "how" is going to suck. But it has to be done. Obama has no stomach for this, all he cares about is getting the hell out of office with poll numbers that meet his satisfaction, he's not up for this.

[spence]

Originally Posted by fishpoopoo

No, but by abandoning Iraq he enabled ISIS to form and consolidate in strength.

That then started a cascade of events in Syria, with Obama supporting the anti al-Assad rebels, intensifying the civil war, which gave ISIS an opening to invade Syria, creating a humanitarian refugee crisis, allowing ISIS fanatics to sneak into western Europe.

Really, this is a big f*ckup.

There's so much wrong here I'm not sure where to begin.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by spence

There's so much wrong here I'm not sure where to begin.

Fact - at the height of the Surge, Al Queda in Iraq was decimated. We have th ecommunications intercepts from their leaders, saying it was lost.

Fact - when Obama announced that he wasn't going to seek a SOF agreement, but was going to pull everyone out, many military experts advised him that bad things would happen in th evaccuum our departure would create. Ask the Cambodians if it's a coincidence that Pol Pot waited until we withdreew from Vietnam to start his genocide.

Fact - after we withdrew, ISIS filled that void.

Fact - Obama (who is always wrong, yet somehow never in doubt), called them "the junior varsity".

Fact - hours before the Paris attack, Obama said that ISIS was contained, and that among our successes, has been increased security at international airports. Incredibky, he said that, while the fuselage of the downed Russian plane was probably still smoldering. Did no one on his staff tell him that happened?

[Fly Rod]

We drop leaflets and warn that we will attack oil trucks in 1 hr....we do not kill anyone.....russia attacks oil fields and kills about 600 isis....maybe trump is right,let the russians do it...

[spence]

Originally Posted by Fly Rod

We drop leaflets and warn that we will attack oil trucks in 1 hr....we do not kill anyone.....russia attacks oil fields and kills about 600 isis....maybe trump is right,let the russians do it...

Right.

[spence]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

Fact - at the height of the Surge, Al Queda in Iraq was decimated. We have th ecommunications intercepts from their leaders, saying it was lost.

But it wasn't destroyed. al Qaeda in Iraq was suffering largely because we were PAYING Sunni militants to push back against it. That's not a long term strategy...

Fact - when Obama announced that he wasn't going to seek a SOF agreement, but was going to pull everyone out, many military experts advised him that bad things would happen in th evaccuum our departure would create. Ask the Cambodians if it's a coincidence that Pol Pot waited until we withdreew from Vietnam to start his genocide.

As we've discussed a million times (perhaps you need a million +1) there already was a SOF agreement in place per the Bush administration. The new Iraqi government wanted us out, and the Bush policy of de-Bathification is a key reason we didn't have reasonable options.

I'm not sure what Cambodia has to do with this. Are you suggesting we should have left a small residual force?

Fact - after we withdrew, ISIS filled that void.

Not really. The first void that ISIS was able to take advantage of was more a by-product of the Syrian civil war. The second void was created by the Iraqi government using Shiite troops to guard Sunnis in Mosul.

Fact - Obama (who is always wrong, yet somehow never in doubt), called them "the junior varsity".

He did, and at that time they were the JV. I don't think he wanted to give them any more cred than necessary.

Fact - hours before the Paris attack, Obama said that ISIS was contained, and that among our successes, has been increased security at international airports. Incredibky, he said that, while the fuselage of the downed Russian plane was probably still smoldering. Did no one on his staff tell him that happened?

The context for that remark clearly was that ISIS was not capturing new territory and in fact appears to be losing some critical ground. I think the timing of recent terror events are a result of this pressure.

ISIS knows they can't win if the key powers unite to destroy them. They need to stir up a global backlash against Islam. Listening to most of the GOP candidates it sounds like we're starting down that path.

[ecduzitgood]

Originally Posted by spence

But it wasn't destroyed. al Qaeda in Iraq was suffering largely because we were PAYING Sunni militants to push back against it. That's not a long term strategy...

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2...-isis-fighters

How's that for strategy? $500 million for training and only 4 or 5 have entered the battle
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[spence]

Originally Posted by ecduzitgood

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2...-isis-fighters

How's that for strategy? $500 million for training and only 4 or 5 have entered the battle
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Old news...how are the Kurds with US assistance doing now?

[fishpoopoo]

Originally Posted by spence

There's so much wrong here I'm not sure where to begin.

And Washington D.C. disagrees with you.

This came out before the Paris attacks.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...ebel-training/

Senators tell Obama to halt Syrian rebel training

By Stephen Dinan - The Washington Times - Friday, October 2, 2015

President Obama’s program to train Syrian rebels is a total failure and needs to be scrapped, a bipartisan group of senators said in a letter to the administration Friday, saying it’s time the national security team acknowledge the disaster and come up with a new strategy.

As the centerpiece of Mr. Obama’s Syrian strategy, along with American airstrikes, the training has backfired — and some of the rebels the U.S. equipped turned around and struck a bargain to give ammunition and trucks to al Qaeda-backed forces in Syria, the senators said.

“The Syria Train and Equip Program goes beyond simply being an inefficient use of taxpayer dollars. As many of us initially warned, it is now aiding the very forces we aim to defeat,” the four senators — three Democrats and one Republican — said in their letter.

Defense officials admitted last month that they were falling far below their promise of thousands of fighters trained this year, and of the several dozen who had been trained, only “four or five” are actually on the battlefield. The others were killed or captured almost immediately upon being deployed.

The Pentagon says it has dozens more fighters in the pipeline, but said it will miss its targets. But officials rejected the need for a rethink, telling the Senate Armed Services Committee that the president and top Pentagon officials think they have the right mix.

One key to that was a decision to allow American warplanes to provide air cover for U.S.-backed rebels. But that could be more difficult now that Russia has committed its forces to the fight in Syria, complicating American military officials’ plans.

[fishpoopoo]

The results speak for themselves.

This is an Obama and Hillary policy screwup of huge proportions.