I watched a commercial guy unload at the canal tonite. He had his limit but every fish was just over the size limit. I saw this happen with Cod in the early 90's. We killed them one year but they were all just over the limit. The next year we couldn't find a fish. If they keep wiping out the breeding size year class fish we will be back to nothing again. They should also drop to one fish a day for recreational fisherman. Maine has the strangest size limits I have ever seen. 20" to 26" is a kepper then anything over that has to be realeased until you get to 36" then you can keep it. They a taking fish before they can get to breeding size.:smash:

Hey....pack up yer wagon and move it along!!!!!:doh:

go to www.stripersforever.com and sign up

Originally posted by BigFish
Hey....pack up yer wagon and move it along!!!!!:doh:

Its a good idea bigfish. If there was more fish around you wouldnt get skunked so much:laughs:

Just signed that stuff...

MAKE STRIPERS GAMEFISH ONLY!

Originally posted by jugstah
Just signed that stuff...

MAKE STRIPERS GAMEFISH ONLY!

me too!

Personally - I agree that SB should be protected.

I don't want to take food off anyone's table but it seems to me that the way the fishery is managed is not achieving the objective. One very interesting proposal was detailed in a report on NPR last week -

Link to NPR Story (http://www.npr.org/features/feature.php?wfId=3443030)

Basically these marine scientists advocate managing the fisheries as a system - taking into account the interaction of the of the components of the ecosystem. So rather than having separate managers determining quotas for their species in a vacuum - using computer modeling / predictive technology - the interplay of various activities can be predicted. e.g. If the menhaden catch goes up - the effect on the SB population would be modeled by the program. On the surface, it seems to make sense..... It'll be interesting to see if this method is adopted.

B-assman,
The only problem with that is that the sceintists have very little idea, if any, of what all those thousands of interactions are.

Agreed - There is no way to perfectly model all the interactions - but an imperfect model that attempts to account for SOME of the major interactions between the variables is better than the current method.

The beauty of these systems is that they "learn" over time. At the beginning the factors governing the interactions are best guesses. Someone has to plug in a number for each variables impact on the other variables. Over time - as data are collected and results measured - the factors get refined and the model improves.

Can anyone really argue that pegging a number for the total catch of a species - without taking int account the effects on other species is really the best way to go??

Originally posted by CpCdtrucker
20" to 26" is a kepper then anything over that has to be realeased until you get to 36" then you can keep it. They a taking fish before they can get to breeding size.:smash:

by keeping small fish, you have a 50/50 chance of keeping a male. but, taking the larger fish, you are most likely taking a female as the further over 20#'s you get the less chance it is a male. if i remember correctly from my fisheries classes in college, population growth is regulated by the # of females in the population. it is actually better in the long run to take from the pool of small fish. if you really want to protect the species for the future, advocate a slot limit of only small fish allowed to be kept. no trophy level could be allowed. (before anyone jumps on me, i am not suggesting this) we are about as likely to see this happen as we are likely to never have the commercial/recreational debate on the site again.

Well I am one of them commercial guys that get his 30 or close to fish a day, and sometimes that is what you get, just leagle.

What is wrong with me getting 30, 34" fish and sell them to pay my bills and feed my family??

Don't you think it is better then watching the (Some not all) Recreational fisherman go out there with there light tackle and catch small and large alike bass and exhaust them to near death!!
Then stand there for 5 min taking pictures, then tossing the thing over board like a bag of trash!
What are the chances that fish will live?? 0%!!
Or all the gut hooked fish they rip the guts out of to save a .15 hook!! Will that fish live?? Nope not a chance!!
Last I new there are a whole lot more weekend worriers out there then the comm. guys and you X that buy the fish they kill and there are alot more fish wasted then there is caught and sold at market!!
The fish that is sold at market feeds my family and the familys of people that other wise would never get to eat a fish!

There is no perfect solution to the fishery!! But a Harvest keeps the stock healthy.

Try to go back 15 years ago and see how many fish were being caught!! The striped bass is healthy and strong!!

Throw your rod away!! Cause you have never killed or wasted a fish!! You think all fish that are released live?? Nope and I am sure your that you release don't all live eaither!!

Go join PETA while you are signing up for things!!

You comm fisherman are worse then the Envirnonmental Whacko's on the other side!

Look at some of those statements.


Fear not CpCd...their days are numbered. SB will get protection from being exploited.

The problem is huge and is not the comm fishermans fault...they are just exploiting the systerm for their own personal gain. For some reason just cause they can they think they should.... It kind of shows you who has morals about the SB fishery.

FACT: This fishery has serious *management* problems (dispite numbers of fish our there) and the facts are that most species that have managed by these guys (comm biased folks) have driven the species to near collapse. During the the SB problem years They wanted to fish it until there was not one left in the sea....they NEVER wanted to stop comm fishing for any reason and it wasn't until it was forced down their throat. And look now...they are back comm harvesting at pre-collapse level. What have they learned....nothing.

What has to happen IMO

Stop ALL INSHORE comm fishing whatsoever.

Only offshore comm fishing is permitted and is serioulsy regulated.

INshore fish are there for rec anglers and growth of the species. (Limits are stickly enforced on recs with serious penelties if they are broken)


The amount of money that rec PUT INTO the economy is far more significant then what the comms PERSONALLY TAKE OUT in the 21 days of the fishery..

In the first week they have taken more then 1/4 of the quota already...

My response to you questions..
What is wrong with me getting 30, 34" fish and sell them to pay my bills and feed my family?? Because YOU DON'T NEED TO!! You CAN to something else. THis is an excuse by most of the comm fisherman. Most of these guys are not the poor hardship cases. No one told you you HAD to do this ...this only lasts 21 days..it doesn't have a financial impace for most fisherman.

Don't you think it is better then watching the (Some not all) Recreational fisherman go out there with there light tackle and catch small and large alike bass and exhaust them to near death!! Then stand there for 5 min taking pictures, then tossing the thing over board like a bag of trash!
What are the chances that fish will live?? 0%!!

Wrong!!! The FACTS (several) are that about 8% die...including the gut hooked fish. SB are actually a pretty hearty fish. Comms l;ike to make them out as some frail brook trout like fish.

Or all the gut hooked fish they rip the guts out of to save a .15 hook!! Will that fish live?? Nope not a chance!!

FACT: This just does not happen that often.

Last I new there are a whole lot more weekend worriers out there then the comm. guys and you X that buy the fish they kill and there are alot more fish wasted then there is caught and sold at market!!
The fish that is sold at market feeds my family and the familys of people that other wise would never get to eat a fish!
BS! last week they could not give this fish away...it is not that high in demand when the wholesale market was paying .95 now it is up to 2.50 or so still...lame.


There is no perfect solution to the fishery!! But a Harvest keeps the stock healthy.

So we should harvest more to keep it healthier?

Try to go back 15 years ago and see how many fish were being caught!! The striped bass is healthy and strong!!

Nope! 15 years ago was striper hell. Wrong again.

Throw your rod away!! Cause you have never killed or wasted a fish!! You think all fish that are released live?? Nope and I am sure your that you release don't all live eaither!!

yeah right. get your facts straight. Most fish live just fine.

Go join PETA while you are signing up for things!!

I hope your fishing income is 66 2/3 of your total income...else you will be done with fishing. Also NO TAX WRITE OFFS UNLESS YOU MAKE 66 2/3 % of your income from fishing..

Do you know If someone turns you in for tax evasion...and you are found guilty, they get 10% of what you owe in back taxes....


:eek:

comercial fisherman are the scum of the earth :af: :af: :af:

Last year I caught 75% of my income by fishing!! and 70% the year before!!
No one is getting rich on bass your right!! But the money from the bass,fluke, cod, sea bass, scup all add up to income!!

O well this will be a war so I end it now!!

But I will be sure to kill about 90 fish this week in your name! :laughs: all the way to the bank

seems there's no middle road here ,,,there are 3 types of people ..
the one's that want to stop the selling [so they can catch a fish, bring it home only to say..look what I caught,then dump it in the trash can]

the trophy hunters,,always after the big one to get it stuffed an hang on the wall .

comm. guys

EVeRYONE is killing bass...so it looks like to me that EVERYONE is fishing out of the same boat

Gamefish??? once that happens you won't even be able to take one home to eat......they'll suck you in to sign up...try reading the fine print , that's if they'll let you see it first.

Thats what I am talking about Capesams......all the folks who are for it better read up....if that ever happens....catching stripers will be nothing but a memory!!!!:smash:

Originally posted by CANAL RAT
comercial fisherman are the scum of the earth :af: :af: :af:

I think JohnR needs to keep children off the site.

...especially the hypocritical ones... By CANAL RAT

"i take my mack,herring,pogie and put them in a zip lock bag and take a thick thick!! freezer zip lock bag and double bag them squize the air out of the bags"

Have you thanked your commercial fisherman lately?

Originally posted by capesams
[B

Gamefish??? once that happens you won't even be able to take one home to eat......they'll suck you in to sign up...try reading the fine print , that's if they'll let you see it first. [/B]

Again..COMPLETE BS!

Sailfish are a GAMEFISH
Marlin are a GAMEFISH
Snook and Permit have similar protection
SB should be the same

I favor a slot . 1 small 1 trophy

Shouldn't this be on the conservation section thingie?


yes it should Flap, and tone down the swearing please

Gamefish??? once that happens you won't even be able to take one home to eat......they'll suck you in to sign up...try reading the fine print , that's if they'll let you see it first. [/B][/QUOTE]

I got sucked into it. Now, I'm going to have to change my signature on the pettition.

Notaro - that's not what the stripersforever petion says - It would allow for recreational catch and keep within bag limits set - Read it online at

Click Here (http://www.stripersforever.org/Info/gamefish)

FROM THE STRIPERSFOREVER WEB SITE
The fishing public, even restrained by very modest bag limits and moderately high minimum sizes, could easily harvest all that a well managed wild striper population can provide without any help from commercial fishermen. Making the striped bass a gamefish will simply mean that those who wish to catch their own will be given priority over those who want to buy their own at market. This is the way a free society should work. Personal harvest has historically been given preference over the market when the resource was too limited to provide both. The precedents are in place -- market gunning and freshwater commercial fishing were both outlawed in the United States when they threatened personal use access to public resources. And so it must be with the striped bass, which is far more valuable as a gamefish than as a commercially harvested commodity.

Okay, I got it, thanks, dude.

These threads turn into nothing more than ridiculous opportunities to launch personal assualts and show personal prejudices at any group of people that doesn't fish like you do.

The commercial quota is a small fraction of what we recs will kill, it is a hard capped quota and they stop when the quota gets filled. So get over it. These Pig-Piles are ridiculous. Live and let live. Go fishing and enjoy what you have.

Thanks Ed
:wave:

Look at the redfish crash that happened down south. They made the redfish a game fish, then added a slot limit.. the redfish is booming, and yes, you can still fish for them and you can still eat them, you just cant comercially fish for them.

Sorry, but for the poor comercial guy struggling to feed the family, if you cant afford to feed yoru family, how can you justify buying a boat? IMO its just an excuse. If you cant afford to boat fish and have to suppliment income by killing as many fish so you can buy your gps and radar gadgets, tackle, dockage, then hide behind the blanket that you cant afford to feed your family, and have to kill hundreds of bass, well.... you get no sympathy from me....This isn't aimed at anyone on the board, by the way, I just dont believe in the comercial harvest of a fish that was almost fished out. We made the mistake once and it seems many people can justify doing it agian:smash:

[QUOTE]Originally posted by macojoe
[B]Last year I caught 75% of my income by fishing!! and 70% the year before!!
No one is getting rich on bass your right!! But the money from the bass,fluke, cod, sea bass, scup all add up to income!!

Make a living doin something you love GREAT!!! I have a serious doubt that the SB will beacome a gamefish and a positive feeling that comm fishing will will never be removed. for the past 5 years I have continued to have " best years ever" and this year is far and away no exception.
I know for a fact I release FAR more fish a year than the average rec. and some comm. fisherman see in 2.(remember some of these guys only fish on sundays) so I see nothing wrong with someone else making a living by keeping them. Sometimes I think that the guy who fishes once a week goes out and doesn't catch a thing and thinks there are no fish to be had, wrong idea.

REMEMBER A QUOTA IS A QUOTA WHEN IT'S FILLED IT'S OVER.
THE REAL SCUMBAGS ARE PEOPLE WHO HIGHGRADE THEIR CATCH.



NEVER BELEIVE EVERYTHING U READ AT ANY "FOREVER " WEBSITE
DO ALL OF U BELEIVE THE PLOVER LOVERS????????

I don't think you can compare stripers to warm water fish from down south, that's a whole different scenario. Stripers migrate all along the whole east coast. The rules have to vary from state to state

Macojoe, go do us a favor.. go harvest all the bloofish, that'll work great in our favor and you get to cull the bluefish terror.. :)

Hey on a slow day I have taken Blues to pay for the gas!! .50 per pound adds up when your pulling them in like crazy!!

I am with the REAL Com guy and not the wannabe.

Maco actually does it/ give him a break. If you take one trip out east on the SHoals and look down on a smooth day, you cannot believe the amount of huge fish there are out there.

It makes me giggle sometimes to see statistics and hatred being the only motivators for making Bass a gamefish.
Because some people here have a hard time catching we start to believe that ther aren't any fish out there.

If this is all SO important then maybe we should completely ban fishing :laughs: :laughs: :laughs:

Damn...

beach burned my favorite fish watching spot. :af: :hihi:

Also great fun on a flats boat and big flyrods :D

Reminds me of tarpon fishing down south. :laughs:

I've noticed "Stripers Forever" is being thrown around here.I need to weigh in here.This "organizations"only motive is complete conservation without consequence.

What does that mean?If keeping no fish recreationally(never mind commercial) means more bass they're for it regardeless of how well bass are doing.They're damn close to being the PETA of striper fishing.If you believe otherwise you're fooling yourself.

And if you're counting on the RFA to help their only motivation is to increase the profit of anyone who makes money off of recreational fisherman.What does that mean........more people
fishing=more money.

The only people who'll make things right is us.Speak up and write your Reps and Senators.

Make the Striper a game fish,my A$$.I'm going fishing.

Guys, it's about SUSTAINABLE fisheries. If you can make the fishery SUSTAINABLE then it doesn't really matter WHO is catching as it is user group allocation at that point. The trick is to prevent OVERFISHING of a species. Personally, I wish the focus was on herring and especially bunker, get these fish fat again...

As long as the biomass numbers stay close to what the scientist / fishery managers hope for, we'll be OK. If they drop, there are triggers in place to rectify a down turn in the population of the striper. Toby is right about the slot limit. Taking smaller fish will add males into the pot and you could protect breeding classes longer.

Stripers Forever just wants more allocation for rec anglers - user grab (I am not comm and I have never sold fish). We, as anglers need to protect the forage first with reasonable TAC from all groups. Granted, comm bass fishing in Mass (and elsewhere) is screwed up and needs lots of work but its a small slice of what these fish are...

lets get one thing straight bluefish should be made a game fish striped bass should be made a game fish no fish is trash fish every thing in nature is interconnected that means pogies,sharks,stripers,"trashfish",cod,squid,whales. take away pogies stripers become weak these long liners,tralwers,netters scoop every thing up in the sea to get to one species such as swordfish,flounder,cod and destroy there bottom habitat then blame the rec guys for bad harvests i dont support the comercial guys i catch all my own bait and catch my own eating fish

So the 2 main fish focused on by most anglers on our coast should be moved into gamefish Status... THATS FUNNY.


I hear the same thing involved with the hunting part of my life when people in mass talk about us guys that hunt on crop damage permits and use all our doe tags up every year those who see verry little of what they seek think ......must be a shortage. I just fish but the Idea of a guy goin out and makin a living fishing is great

what about a guide who puts guys on fish day after day and lets tthem take their limit is he a bad guy please someone answer that one for me (NOT in my eyes he's not )

I good friend of mine, a guy I've fished with recreationally for many years, maintains his commercial license and caught over 400 lbs of stripers in a single day last week. He's got a great regular job and a beautiful house and doesn't need the money. Why kill so many fish, especially at only $1.60/pound! :af:

Meanwhile, about the same day, I released 10-12 bass, all in the 20-30lb range (didn't keep a one).

The stocks are good and we all hope to keep it that way. I think we can sustain some commercial fishing, but I'd like to see the ratio go to something like 20/80 commercial/recreational.

Just my two cents.

Rip off your buddy's commerical fishing license. So he will start fishing for recreational.

Well 11 fish all over 34" total weight 171 # X 2.00 = a check for $342 - $55 expenses = $287 for 6 hours work = $47.50 per hour doing something I love!!
I add money to the area via Gas, Jigs, Rods, Reels, line, bait, and a bunch of stuff I can't begin to list!!

Yep your all right and I am joining PETA right now and get rid of everything!! So I can sit here and complain about fish feeling pain!!

:gf: :gf: :gf: :gf: :gf:

an there ya have:D good for u mac,,,,,try clammin[steamers fa those off ilander's] 1 tide about 3hr's work...3 totes=195lbs @ a bit over $2.00 a lb =$390.00+,,gas about $7.00 trainslates into about $100.00 + a hour....then ya got the rest of the day off.....let's turn clams into a game shellfish:rolleyes:

Sandeels $7.00 a pound at the local shops!

Originally posted by macojoe
Sandeels $7.00 a pound at the local shops!

I've never had any luck with "store-bought" eels. Who knows how long they sat in those little baggies rotting away.

Rake your own! The only way to go.

Yep I am sure it is!! I am not complaing I have been sandeeling and its alot of work. So I turn my $7 into a $100 with the bass :D

Sweetwater you need to make better friends with your local tackle shop!! Mine always the best!!

I've seen freshly raked sandeels outfish 24-hour old eels 5 to 1 or better. When there's a lot of bait around, the big bass won't touch an old sand eel.

For me, it's worth the time and effort. Eel rake? Never leave home without it. :D

I have a rake and when I am rec. fishing and have the time I will get them on my own. But when I am comm. fishing I don't have time for that so to the store I go.

macojoe, if you've got a good connection for very fresh eels and have had good luck with them, I'm envious because it is a lot of work. But I've watched commercial rakers drive their boats in circles grinding eels to a nice pulp.

Since I only do recreational I avoid bait store eels. Plus, it's nice to wade in the tepid cape cod waters in October and have a few waves crash over your head. :D

Maybe it's time to invest in AquaSkinz? :confused:

Those are the guys to fish near!! great chum there making there!!

I am not trying to argue with you!! The best bait is the freashest bait!! and your doing right!! :happy: :happy:

how often do you fish a year comm ? 4-5 months out of the year? so what do u do in the winter? collect unemployment? instead of juicing our system for you to collect unemployment,,why dont you go out and get a real job? because if you rely on fishing for an income thats just an excuse to be lazy. people change jobs all the time. isnt it time to find a new job?

Hey Killer Do you have a brain?? Cause you are talking out your A$$ !!!

Of corse we don't fish all winter and have other jobs !! No one said that they were making Huge living at it!! I for one last year made 70% my income from fishing and had to work a job like everyone else on top of it!!

Who in this world is not working 2 jobs or more!! If your not working 2 jobs then your wife has one.

So keep your yap shut and find some place else to BIT$H

People like you who have no idea what they are talking about is the ones that give fisherman and others bad names!!

Originally posted by killerlexus
how often do you fish a year comm ? 4-5 months out of the year? so what do u do in the winter? collect unemployment? instead of juicing our system for you to collect unemployment,,why dont you go out and get a real job? because if you rely on fishing for an income thats just an excuse to be lazy. people change jobs all the time. isnt it time to find a new job?

Who are you talking to, and what are you talking about? "collect unemployment"? "excuse to be lazy"?

You're off the mark here.

Some links that may be of further interest...

http://www.basspond.com/articles/general/burns_sws.shtml

http://www.basspond.com/articles/general/cca_flies_only.shtml

Before joining any group, I suggest that you learn what you can about it beforehand to see if it truly does share your interests.

Best,
Mike Flaherty
Wareham, MA