Here is what I expect. Trump will take full credit for the sun rising, the moon moving our waters, the love fest that is the USA today, the best stock market EVER, the healthiest economy EVER, the lowest jobless rate EVER, being the smartest POTUS EVER, having the highest IQ of any POTUS EVER and you can fill in the rest of the blanks.

I don't know if I can get myself to listen to it. If he stays on the script that hopefully someone helps him write, I assume it will be palpable and hopefully more positive; although I don't know if he can help himself from going rogue. Especially in light of the investigation getting closer to the oval office, I'm not sure he won't take the opportunity to take a shot at the FBI and Mueller. Then he knows the porn star he paid off (I know fake news) is on Kimmel right after, so I suspect he might be taking a shot at the fake news media too. I don't know if we can expect him to reach across the isle to encourage cooperation moving forward to legislate a win-win immigration reform bill or health care fixes; he might just be himself and blame the DEMs for everything.

I will say, I'm enjoying the economy and the booming stock market and while Trump has made moves to get that rolling, we were headed in a positive direction long before he was elected. Still I have to give credit where credit is due and while I see us going backwards in time in many regards, we all win when the economy is strong.

which party is in worse shape?

Trump is giving a State of the Union address

and/or

yet another Kennedy? and Maxine Waters are giving the SOTU responses...

most entertaining will be Trumps responses to the responses

I voted for him, would do so again against Hilary, but I won't watch. Can't. It made me sick to watch Obama speak, it makes me sick to watch Trump speak.

Everything good is because of him, everything bad is someone else's fault. When was the last time we heard something other than that?

which party is in worse shape?



The dems haven't been this obscure in my lifetime.

The midterms will be fascinating, so many competing forces. Liberals tend not to vote in big numbers in midterms, which helps the GOP. But the Trump effect could offset that, which hurts the GOP. The president's party usually loses seats in the midterms (though rarely as many as Obama lost), which would seem to hurt the GOP. But the economy is rolling, which will help the GOP.

If I'm a republican, I hammer home this idea..."your paycheck is bigger because of the tax reform. Every single democrat in DC voted against that. Every single one of them, voted against our desire for you to keep a little more of your money", and never stop hammering that home. Never.

The GOP will keep the Senate. Most people say if the midterms were today, the Dems would re-take the House. These are the same exact people who convinced me that Trump was going to get creamed. SO who knows...

I forecast a speech that mimics Mussolini on queluds.
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I expect not one republican to sit the entire address . The next day it will be tweeted as the longest standing or most standing Ovations .. I can tell you
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I forecast a speech that mimics Mussolini on queluds.
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THAT I would watch!! But it will probably be the typical partisan state of the union speech with a generous sprinkling of Trumpian self love--so I won't.

I forecast a speech that mimics Mussolini on queluds.
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He's such a narcissist, maybe he'll claim that one day historians will view his inauguration, as the day the waters stopped rising and the planet began to heal. Oh wait, another President said that about himself...

I expect not one republican to sit the entire address . The next day it will be tweeted as the longest standing or most standing Ovations .. I can tell you
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Just out of curiosity, what do you think the Democrats did when Obama gave this address? Did they heckle him and throw fruit at him?

If the GOP gives 80 standing ovations instead of the 75 Obama got, you conclude what, exactly?

I forecast a speech that mimics Mussolini on queluds.
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would you pm me some powerball numbers for this week?

Quaaludes, AKA "ludes"
Wouldn't want you to end up with the wrong thing

What I’m certain is trump will be reading a TelePrompTer and someone else wrote it.
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What I’m certain is trump will be reading a TelePrompTer and someone else wrote it.
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I think that's the case for most formal addresses. But if Trump did decide to go off script and wing it how would you know :devil2: :hihi:

I think that's the case for most formal addresses. But if Trump did decide to go off script and wing it how would you know :devil2: :hihi:

No multisyllabic words, just the best, bigly ones :hs:

No multisyllabic words, just the best, bigly ones :hs:
He will certainly be saying what they think people want to hear...then contradict it all within the week.

I've always watched them regardless of who the president is. Feel its my obligation as an American citizen. I may or may not like what I hear but at least I made the effort to hear them out.

I've always watched them regardless of who the president is. Feel its my obligation as an American citizen. I may or may not like what I hear but at least I made the effort to hear them out.

This. And to give them a fair shake. We are in this together.

I'm also one who has watched every speech. Funny thing is probably 95% of them I end up saying great speech and then later saying on retrospect I disagree with this and I disagree with that.
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Enjoy

Enjoy
Very good ;)

First one I refused to listen to, at all. I just decided I did not feel like being lied to or being played for being stupid.... He will flip on some of the stuff he said anyway.

It wasn't bad - the sour puss's of certain people was worth it

Well played by Donald,almost could pass for presidential unless you actually follow him.
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It wasn't bad - the sour puss's of certain people was worth it

"It wasn't bad "

I was pleasantly surprised.


"the sour puss's of certain people was worth it"

Haven't enjoyed that much schadenfreude since the election. Princess Lie-awatha, in particular, seemed quite sour about the whole thing. Me think-um she want to live in tee-pee of Great White Chief.

And to show how forward-thinking the Democrats are, they trotted out a Kennedy to deliver the response. I guess no one in Chester A Arthur's family was available. As to the rumors he was drooling during the his response, I presume that in keeping with his heritage, there was a cute 13 year-old girl in the room.

I also thought his choice of special guests was truly inspiring. When that North Korean defector was waving his crutches during his standing ovation, I had massive goose bumps and was on the verge of tears. If you weren't moved by that, you don't have a soul.

And when they showed poor Otto Warmbler's parents, I just lost it. It's time that fat sh*t dictator gets what's coming to him, I think the world has had about enough of that.

I fore see Military action with in the year to boost lowest approval ratings ..

a lot of spending talked about ,, not sure how he's going to pay for it after cutting Taxes

labeled all immigrants as MS13 gang members ...

still wont move pass the NFL


"the sour puss's of certain people was worth it" He Childish as usual

but over all he stayed between the lines but still to Nationalistic for me

I fore see Military action with in the year to boost lowest approval ratings ..
Maybe, though disagree on the ratings part because you should know this is a real security issue. Be a real shame if you could not process pros and cons (the latter terribly severe) in a logical manner rather than as simply another hit piece.


a lot of spending talked about ,, not sure how he's going to pay for it after cutting Taxes

Tough call - with more people working and a cranking economy with greater growth than before - might just work.


labeled all immigrants as MS13 gang members ...
No he didn't. Statements like this is why we have Trump.



still wont move pass the NFL
Agree - move on


"the sour puss's of certain people was worth it" He Childish as usual

You missed the point - it was the sour puss face of all the Democrats (except for the few that occasionally forgot them selves and started to cheer before the daggers of reproach from fellow party members caught up to them.



but over all he stayed between the lines but still to Nationalistic for me

There is nothing he could do, short of resign, that would satisfy you.

labeled all immigrants as MS13 gang members ...



Can you show us the text where he said that, please?

Can you show us the text where he said that, please?

"For decades, open borders have allowed drugs and gangs to pour into our most vulnerable communities. They have allowed millions of low-wage workers to compete for jobs and wages against the poorest Americans.Most tragically, they have caused the loss of many innocent lives. Here tonight are two fathers and two mothers, Evelyn Rodriguez, Freddy Cuevas, Elizabeth Alvarado, and Robert Mickens. Their two teenage daughters, Kayla Cuevas and Nisa Mickens, were close friends on Long Island."
Now Long Island is one of our most vulnerable communities, granted Brentwood is not the nicest neighborhood on LI.

"For decades, open borders have allowed drugs and gangs to pour into our most vulnerable communities. They have allowed millions of low-wage workers to compete for jobs and wages against the poorest Americans.Most tragically, they have caused the loss of many innocent lives. Here tonight are two fathers and two mothers, Evelyn Rodriguez, Freddy Cuevas, Elizabeth Alvarado, and Robert Mickens. Their two teenage daughters, Kayla Cuevas and Nisa Mickens, were close friends on Long Island."
.

(1) I'll ask again, where in that statement did he say all immigrants are gang members?

(2) what in that statement, exactly, would you say is untrue? Do you deny that having an open border with Mexico has allowed drugs and gang bangers to come in and do harm?

Not all immigrants are criminals. But, and this may be news to you, some are.

(1) I'll ask again, where in that statement did he say all immigrants are gang members?

(2) what in that statement, exactly, would you say is untrue? Do you deny that having an open border with Mexico has allowed drugs and gang bangers to come in and do harm?

Not all immigrants are criminals. But, and this may be news to you, some are.
He's certainly playing racist cards to stoke anti-immigrant sentiment with disinformation. Goes right along with his lying about chain immigration and the lottery system. Ok, to be fair he may just not understand what the law really is.

What astounded me about his long-winded clap happy was the failure to mention anything about our democratic institutions...likely because Trump has no respect for them.

We're living in a time where the FBI and CIA are the enemy and Russia is the insider friend...this should terrify everyone.

He's certainly playing racist cards to stoke anti-immigrant sentiment with disinformation. Goes right along with his lying about chain immigration and the lottery system. Ok, to be fair he may just not understand what the law really is.

What astounded me about his long-winded clap happy was the failure to mention anything about our democratic institutions...likely because Trump has no respect for them.

We're living in a time where the FBI and CIA are the enemy and Russia is the insider friend...this should terrify everyone.


ok Maxine......

He's certainly playing racist cards to stoke anti-immigrant sentiment with disinformation. Goes right along with his lying about chain immigration and the lottery system. Ok, to be fair he may just not understand what the law really is.

What astounded me about his long-winded clap happy was the failure to mention anything about our democratic institutions...likely because Trump has no respect for them.

We're living in a time where the FBI and CIA are the enemy and Russia is the insider friend...this should terrify everyone.

"He's certainly playing racist cards to stoke anti-immigrant sentiment with disinformation"

What 'disinformation'? were those parents who lost their kids to illegal alien criminals, or not?

"failure to mention anything about our democratic institutions"

Such as? I saw a lot of pro-America verbiage in there. You're upset he didn't specifically mention the county clerk's office in Deluth?

"We're living in a time where the FBI and CIA are the enemy and Russia is the insider friend"

OK. So to you, it's fine if the FBI potentially interferes with our politics, but an issue if Russia does it.

Funny, who was the POTUS who mocked Mitt Romney for suggesting that Russia was a problem? Something about the 198s wanting their foreign policy back? Haw haw haw, that was so witty.

ok Maxine......

OK THAT was funny.

He painted immigrants as bad, much like people paint bait fisherman as slobs. Yes, some are but that does not make all fisherman slobs.

He painted illegal immigration as bad, much like people paint bait fisherman who leave their garbage everywhere as slobs. Yes, some are but that does not make all fisherman slobs.

fixed it

He painted immigrants as bad, much like people paint bait fisherman as slobs. Yes, some are but that does not make all fisherman slobs.


Not all immigrants, ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS !
100% of illegals are illegal.
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He's certainly playing racist cards to stoke anti-immigrant sentiment with disinformation.

The race card-- a card with the word racist or racism. When you play the card by putting it on top of the cards on the table, all the cards become racist or racisms regardless of their denominated values and labels. It seems that this card is played against Trump, not by him.

Goes right along with his lying about chain immigration and the lottery system. Ok, to be fair he may just not understand what the law really is.

What astounded me about his long-winded clap happy was the failure to mention anything about our democratic institutions...likely because Trump has no respect for them.

What is a "democratic institution" for you? And which ones did he not mention or should he have mentioned--voting, The Constitution, rule of law, checks and balances in government, the right to bear arms, religious liberty, the right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness? How has he not shown respect for any of those things?

Oh . . . freedom of the Press . . . you mean that . . . are you saying that criticizing the Press when it is not properly doing its job is disrespecting freedom of the Press?

It is the height of lunacy for someone who believes that our foundational democratic institution, The Constitution, is outdated, to ask for respect for our democratic institutions.

We're living in a time where the FBI and CIA are the enemy and Russia is the insider friend...this should terrify everyone.

Are you taking us back in time to the long reign of J. Edgar Hoover who the left despised? Or to all the instances that the left has accused the CIA of lying and sabotage as in stirring up wars in the Middle East? Or the long history of the Democrats actually being complicit with Soviet involvement in our own government as well as in Asia and Europe?

Who is saying that the FBI or the CIA are enemies? Is this just another or your type of exaggerations as in your use of "racism" or accusing Trump of saying "ALL" immigrants are this or that? Is it not possible to point out malfeasance by some at the top of the FBI without saying that the FBI is our enemy? It is terrifying to think we must not ever criticize those who have the power to destroy our lives.

I think it was a bad idea to have the car Teddy drove at Chappaquid#^&#^&#^&#^& in the background of the rebuttal

I think it was a bad idea to have the car Teddy drove at Chappaquid#^&#^&#^&#^& in the background of the rebuttal

I know which fake news you watch, not much different than other news orgs jabbing trump is it?

fixed it

No you didn't, you need to read the speech. And that is exactly the problem.

"Struggling communities, especially immigrant communities, will also be helped by immigration policies that focus on the best interests of American workers and American families.

For decades, open borders have allowed drugs and gangs to pour into our most vulnerable communities. They have allowed millions of low-wage workers to compete for jobs and wages against the poorest Americans. Most tragically, they have caused the loss of many innocent lives.

Here tonight are two fathers and two mothers: Evelyn Rodriguez, Freddy Cuevas, Elizabeth Alvarado, and Robert Mickens. Their two teenage daughters -- Kayla Cuevas and Nisa Mickens -- were close friends on Long Island. But in September 2016, on the eve of Nisa's 16th Birthday, neither of them came home. These two precious girls were brutally murdered while walking together in their hometown. Six members of the savage gang MS-13 have been charged with Kayla and Nisa's murders. Many of these gang members took advantage of glaring loopholes in our laws to enter the country as unaccompanied alien minors - and wound up in Kayla and Nisa's high school.

Evelyn, Elizabeth, Freddy, and Robert: Tonight, everyone in this chamber is praying for you. Everyone in America is grieving for you. And 320 million hearts are breaking for you. We cannot imagine the depth of your sorrow, but we can make sure that other families never have to endure this pain.

Tonight, I am calling on the Congress to finally close the deadly loopholes that have allowed MS-13, and other criminals, to break into our country. We have proposed new legislation that will fix our immigration laws, and support our ICE and Border Patrol Agents, so that this cannot ever happen again."

I know which fake news you watch, not much different than other news orgs jabbing trump is it?

FNN....:biglaugh:

I like the part where Trump boasted about how his tax cuts gave the average middle class worker 'thousands' in tax savings, but omitted mentioning who really got the lions share of the tax cuts... the super rich.

GOP agenda is to always tell the poor white man that he is better than someone else. That someone else in a worse situation is coming for him to steal his situation, while never ever ever mentioning who holds all the cards and is the true threat to the poor white man. The rich white man.

No you didn't, you need to read the speech. And that is exactly the problem.

"Struggling communities, especially (legal) immigrant communities, will also be helped by immigration policies that focus on the best interests of American workers and American families. yup

For decades, open borders have allowed drugs and gangs(illegally) to pour into our most vulnerable communities. They have allowed millions of low-wage workers(illegal) to compete for jobs and wages against the poorest (legal)Americans. Most tragically, they have caused the loss of many innocent lives. yup

Here tonight are two fathers and two mothers: Evelyn Rodriguez, Freddy Cuevas, Elizabeth Alvarado, and Robert Mickens. Their two teenage daughters -- Kayla Cuevas and Nisa Mickens -- were close friends on Long Island. But in September 2016, on the eve of Nisa's 16th Birthday, neither of them came home. These two precious girls were brutally murdered while walking together in their hometown. Six members of the savage gang MS-13 have been charged with Kayla and Nisa's murders. Many of these gang members took advantage of glaring loopholes in our laws to enter the country as unaccompanied alien minors - and wound up in Kayla and Nisa's high school. yup

Evelyn, Elizabeth, Freddy, and Robert: Tonight, everyone in this chamber is praying for you. Everyone in America is grieving for you. And 320 million hearts are breaking for you. We cannot imagine the depth of your sorrow, but we can make sure that other families never have to endure this pain. yup

Tonight, I am calling on the Congress to finally close the deadly loopholes that have allowed MS-13, and other criminals, to (illegally)break into our country. We have proposed new legislation that will fix our (legal)immigration laws, and support our ICE and Border Patrol Agents, so that this cannot ever happen again."

which part of that do you have a problem with?

Maybe, though disagree on the ratings part because you should know this is a real security issue. Be a real shame if you could not process pros and cons (the latter terribly severe) in a logical manner rather than as simply another hit piece.



Tough call - with more people working and a cranking economy with greater growth than before - might just work.


No he didn't. Statements like this is why we have Trump.



Agree - move on



You missed the point - it was the sour puss face of all the Democrats (except for the few that occasionally forgot them selves and started to cheer before the daggers of reproach from fellow party members caught up to them.




There is nothing he could do, short of resign, that would satisfy you.

And there is nothing he has done that can diminish your unwavering support ... I am amazed how easy it was to forget the past 8 years ... now the shoes on the other foot people on the right want others to be objective and stop picking on Trump.

Not all immigrants, ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS !
100% of illegals are illegal.
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He wasn't even bashing all illegals. He said that when we look the other way on illegal immigration, the side effect is that SOME of the illegals will be dangerous criminals. How can anyone disagree with that?

I know which fake news you watch, not much different than other news orgs jabbing trump is it?

whoever thought a Kennedy giving the rebuttal with a car in the background with the hood up was a good idea.... was not thinking clearly... :hihi:

GOP agenda is to always tell the poor white man that he is better than someone else. That someone else in a worse situation is coming for him to steal his situation, while never ever ever mentioning who holds all the cards and is the true threat to the poor white man. The rich white man.

.... you crack me up

OK. So to you, it's fine if the FBI potentially interferes with our politics, but an issue if Russia does it.


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
You officially have a GOP koolaid mustache. ... Nunes memo is nothing more than running interference for the potus .. and sending the country down a rabbit hole

You officially have a GOP koolaid mustache. ...

So why do I agree with Democrats on the death penalty and gay marriage?

... Nunes memo is nothing more than running interference for the potus ..

have you read it?

.... you crack me up

A quote from LBJ ( yes a democrat)

"If you can convince the lowest white man he's better than the best colored man, he won't notice you're picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he'll empty his pockets for you."

I see this mentality as an adopted tactic by the GOP

A quote from LBJ ( yes a democrat)

"If you can convince the lowest white man he's better than the best colored man, he won't notice you're picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he'll empty his pockets for you."

I see this mentality as an adopted tactic by the GOP

The gop just doubled the standard deduction, meaning more of those poor whites will pay no taxes. Every single democrat voted against that. But it’s the gop that’s picking their pockets, eh?
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Once again filled with boasts about all he has done, yet that facts and stats don’t lie, I’m surprised his own staff isn’t fact checking before he claims that crap.
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The gop just doubled the standard deduction, meaning more of those poor whites will pay no taxes. Every single democrat voted against that. But it’s the gop that’s picking their pockets, eh?
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They know its stealing from peter to pay paul in a way. Someone will have to pay for these tax cuts. Take a good look at your kids tonight when you kiss them goodnight. The GOP is screwing them in so many ways. public school education cuts, trashing the environment, federal debt.. its a shame that I am called a liberal because I care about the environment, about educating the future of this country, protecting the rights of our citizens, and being respected by the rest of the world.

They know its stealing from peter to pay paul in a way. Someone will have to pay for these tax cuts.

So when you were a Bernie supporter and he was giving everybody "Free" Education and stuff....no problem

But NOW........you're worried about somebody having to pay for this. :rolleyes:

So when you were a Bernie supporter and he was giving everybody "Free" Education and stuff....no problem

But NOW........you're worried about somebody having to pay for this. :rolleyes:

I was always worried about who was going to pay for it.
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So when you were a Bernie supporter and he was giving everybody "Free" Education and stuff....no problem

But NOW........you're worried about somebody having to pay for this. :rolleyes:


Bernie & his followers were betting on all the new tax revenue from legal weed
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Bernie & his followers were betting on all the new tax revenue from legal weed
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And what would be wrong with that?
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And what would be wrong with that?
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Taxation is theft

Taxation is theft

So is not paying your debts and obligations. (National debt)

So is not paying your employees a living wage and they have to rely on food stamps, yet you are a billionaire.
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have you read it?

Thats the key who's read it ...who alone wrote it and why and who has been promoting it all in an attempt to discredit the FBI and the muller investigation... seems obvious to even the casual observer

In early 2017, he was criticized for bias in a congressional investigation into Russian interference in the 2016 United States elections.[3][4] On April 6, 2017, he temporarily stepped aside from leading that investigation while the Office of Congressional Ethics investigates charges that he improperly disclosed classified information to the public, but he remains committee chairman for other purposes. Nunes has denied the allegations.[5][6] The Office of Congressional Ethics later cleared Nunes of allegations that he disclosed classified information to the public.[7][6] His attacks on the FBI and the investigation by independent counsel Robert Mueller have created concerns about GOP efforts to halt the investigation and to protect Trump from any allegations against him.[8]

But now he generates his own memo .... amazing

And what would be wrong with that?
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You don’t put out a fire by pouring fuel on it.
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What worries me is we have saved everybody from having to pay for Obamacare and have not even tried to fix the medical cost conundrum, are trillions in debt and now we need to build a wall to keep out immigrants and add to our roughly 5000 nuclear weapons because somebody else with bad hair has 10. Other than the Russians nobody has 10% of what we do currently. Look and see how many nukes the Chinese have, latest estimate I see is 260, probably plenty to F the world up.
Think about how this works. If I am a very rich man my illnesses might kill me but can never bankrupt me, even if i self insure. And as a rich man, I own stock in the companies that provide insurance, drugs and healthcare and make the profit I deserve(hey just because you don't have any capital its not my fault) I don't think I should have to help anyone else. But I need protection for the things I have and my way of life so i need you to fight for me for a pittance and finance my war machine. Oh by the way I make a lot more money from the military by supplying the armaments that you need to protect me.
Think about when you were a kid, who owned the store on the corner, the gas station, the butcher, the baker, the hardware store, etc. they lived in the community and made some money. Who owns those places now and where does the money go? I bet the manager in the convenience store you get coffee at makes a bit over minimum wage and your money goes to corporate america, not your neighbor and fellow local taxpayer.
So much for the top 10% and I assume the rest of you are with me in the bottom 90% of Americans.
What I want is to work together to control costs to a reasonable limit for Healthcare, Infrastructure, Military and other needs. Maybe that makes me a liberal, but I kinda think it makes me a reasonable person. Rant over

Thats the key who's read it ...

But now he generates his own memo .... amazing


which you've not read but wrote


Originally Posted by wdmso View Post
... Nunes memo is nothing more than running interference for the potus ..



is this a Nebelike prediction or "fact" ?

Oh my god Pete, you sound like a commie pinko snowflake! ;)
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Oh my god Pete, you sound like a commie pinko snowflake! ;)
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Is that a good thing?

which you've not read but wrote


Originally Posted by wdmso View Post
... Nunes memo is nothing more than running interference for the potus ..



is this a Nebelike prediction or "fact" ?
Based on everything I've seen the Nunes memo is nothing more than a stunt, possibly coordinated with the White House.

The is the worst kind of political malpractice at the expense of the FBI.

Based on everything I've seen the Nunes memo is nothing more than a stunt, possibly coordinated with the White House.

The is the worst kind of political malpractice at the expense of the FBI.

YOU HAVEN'T SEEN ANYTHING

YOU HAVEN'T SEEN ANYTHING
A lot of very credible people have. Look at the drama around this and it's pretty clear what this is all about.

Oh my god Pete, you sound like a commie pinko snowflake! ;)
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Actually I just read Ron Paul’s tweets and they are better than the path we’ve been on the past twenty years But I can see a little control
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YOU HAVEN'T SEEN ANYTHING



FBI itself which complained of "material omissions of fact that fundamentally impact the memo's accuracy".


or in layman's terms complete BS

FBI itself which complained of "material omissions of fact that fundamentally impact the memo's accuracy".


or in layman's terms complete BS

ALTERNATIVE FACTS
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Based on everything I've seen the Nunes memo is nothing more than a stunt, possibly coordinated with the White House.

The is the worst kind of political malpractice at the expense of the FBI.

"Based on everything I've seen the Nunes memo is nothing more than a stun"

Given that all the "news" you see is from MSNBC and Al-Jazeera, I'm not surprised.

"The is the worst kind of political malpractice at the expense of the FBI"

Not at the expense of the entire FBI. At the expense of a small number of high-level people who are likely political appointees with a political agenda.

A lot of very credible people have. Look at the drama around this and it's pretty clear what this is all about.

"A lot of very credible people have"

And some of those credible people are saying there's a scandal there.

"Look at the drama around this and it's pretty clear what this is all about"

If the memo is, as you would say, a nothingburger, why is the left so desperate to prevent it from coming out?

If the memo is, as you would say, a nothingburger, why is the left so desperate to prevent it from coming out?
Jim, Trump's Republican appointed FBI Director doesn't want it released.

Sounds like it reveals highly classified methods and per the FBI's statement... “As expressed during our initial review, we have grave concerns about material omissions of fact that fundamentally impact the memo’s accuracy.”

What I found even more interesting is that the FISA request in question wasn't even new. Carter Page had been under investigation for some time as a suspected Russian stooge. This FISA request was simply to renew the surveillance order.

This is a stunt intended to undermine the FBI.

Sounds like it reveals highly classified methods

Well then get Hillary on it, she'll get that chit out to the known free world in no time.

and the Repub. are claiming that the reason for the FISA request was the Steele document but it makes no difference what caused the FBI requested it. It is just more noise. Pathetic.

Don't forget that the Repub. appointed FBI Director didn't only say concerns, he said "grave concerns".

Why not release the Dems. memo? The Repubs. will stop at nothing to protect Trump - even tear down our institutions.

I watched some of the speech again, and the democrats' reactions (mostly sitting there scowling, looking angry and sullen).

I have a LOT of issues with Trump. But I will say this, I have never seen anyone better, at making his opponents look stupid. There are times when Trump is the one who looks ugly, no doubt. But more often than not, he makes laughing stocks out of his adversaries, which makes them hate him more, and he loves it.

He praises a little boy for setting motion an effort to put thousands of American flags on the graves of deceased vets, and there are the Democrats, sitting there looking angry. He praises black unemployment being low, and there are the democrats, including the congressional black caucus, looking pissed.

You watch that, and unless you are a committed liberal, you ask yourself...what do these people stand for, and who do they represent? I think their entire political identity and agenda can be reduced to this...they hate Trump. And that's it. That's all they have. They have gone all-in on hating Trump, all their eggs are in that basket.

It may be enough to take back the house. Or it may blow up in their faces. If their entire political strategy is to say "I hate the guy who helped increase the size of your paycheck", America might not give a rat's azz.

Sounds like it reveals highly classified methods

Why would the Repub. care? They hardly uttered peep when
Trump revealed highly classified information to the Russian foreign minister and ambassador in a White House meeting. It jeopardized a critical source of intelligence on the Islamic State. They defended the outing of a US spy - Plame.

It comes down to this: Is it better to release it and expose possible agency corruption at the highest levels? Or is it better to not release it by keeping it classified and just sweep it under the rug?

IMO if you sweep this under the rug it's akin to letting the potential Russian collusion with Trump campaign slide from the beginning as that was also classified at one time. Basically the same thing as the current memo in question potentially shows Russian collusion possibly financed by the Democratic Party.

and the Repub. are claiming that the reason for the FISA request was the Steele document but it makes no difference what caused the FBI requested it.
Well no, the FISA request has to be thoroughly justified for a Judge to sign it. If the Steele document was the only basis for the request it would have never been approved from what I understand.

It's also unclear how Nunes even got the FISA request to begin with and there's suspicion now there was coordination with the White House in its creation.

Basically the same thing as the current memo in question potentially shows Russian collusion possibly financed by the Democratic Party.
Come on...really DZ?

Lol.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Come on...really DZ?

Dossier - correct?

Well no, the FISA request has to be thoroughly justified for a Judge to sign it. If the Steele document was the only basis for the request it would have never been approved from what I understand.

It's also unclear how Nunes even got the FISA request to begin with and there's suspicion now there was coordination with the White House in its creation.

"FISA request has to be thoroughly justified for a Judge to sign it"

First, can you tell us how you know what the standards are for FISA requests to be granted? I thought they were secret.

Second, it's possible that a knowingly false request could be presented to a judge, in order to meet the burden. No one is saying the judge didn't grant it, perhaps he granted it based on knowingly false information.

I'm not following this that closely. Sean Hannity is saying that Hilary's campaign paid for a dossier of lies to be put together which was presented to a FISA judge, for the purposes of spying on Trump. I wouldn't bet a nickel that's true. But I am curious. But it's impossible to know what's true.

It comes down to this: Is it better to release it and expose possible agency corruption at the highest levels? Or is it better to not release it by keeping it classified and just sweep it under the rug?

IMO if you sweep this under the rug it's akin to letting the potential Russian collusion with Trump campaign slide from the beginning as that was also classified at one time. Basically the same thing as the current memo in question potentially shows Russian collusion possibly financed by the Democratic Party.

How did the Dems. collude w/the Russians?

If you are in favor of releasing it bc you don't want it swept under the rug why not release the Dem. memo then? Read what the FBI director said. "we have grave concerns with material omissions of fact that fundamentally impact the memo’s accuracy". What exactly is the FBI director saying with that statement.

Well no, the FISA request has to be thoroughly justified for a Judge to sign it. If the Steele document was the only basis for the request it would have never been approved from what I understand.


I think we are in somewhat agreement. It is my understanding that if they used the Steele doc. in any way they still would have to provide other evidence.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slipknot
Taxation is theft

So is not paying your debts and obligations. (National debt)

So that would be double theft. Taxation and, as has been the case with the federal government for over 70 years, not paying its national debt. All it does is pay the interest as the debt keeps getting larger.

So is not paying your employees a living wage and they have to rely on food stamps, yet you are a billionaire.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

So you're against food stamps?

FBI itself which complained of "material omissions of fact that fundamentally impact the memo's accuracy".


or in layman's terms complete BS

The FBI has been very good at leaking "facts." It can leak the "material omissions" if it wants to correct the record.

How did the Dems. collude w/the Russians?

If you are in favor of releasing it bc you don't want it swept under the rug why not release the Dem. memo then? Read what the FBI director said. "we have grave concerns with material omissions of fact that fundamentally impact the memo’s accuracy". What exactly is the FBI director saying with that statement.

The DEMS memo will also eventually come out. Sounds like we'll all get to read them soon.

Nunes memo – actually that is funny. Didn’t we see what a sleazy person he was when Trump accused Obama of “wiretapped” Trump tower. Nunes came to Trump’s defense and lied and then later it was found out he actually got that info. from the Trump White House.

The DEMS memo will also eventually come out. Sounds like we'll all get to read them soon.

The House Intelligence Committee has voted not to make the Democratic memo public.

there's suspicion now there was coordination with the White House in its creation.

Just saw this

On Monday, Rep. Mike Quigly (D-IL) asked Nunes if his staffers worked with the White House on his memo. Nunes originally answered the question by saying “as far as I know” no one collaborated with the White House. Ultimately, though, he refused to answer the question — perhaps suggesting that there may actually have been some collusion there

The House Intelligence Committee has voted not to make the Democratic memo public.

Agreed, that's a bush league move, if you have nothing to hide, why wouldn't they release that.

Agreed, that's a bush league move, if you have nothing to hide, why wouldn't they release that.

If the FBI has concerns, I don't want either one released.

Here's the process in layman's terms if you are interested
In an article titled, “It Ain’t Easy Getting a FISA Warrant: I Was an FBI Agent and Should Know,” here’s what Rangappa wrote:

… As someone who obtained FISA warrants while conducting counterintelligence investigations for the FBI, I can attest to the fact that they not only don’t involve the White House, but the process includes too many layers of approval to be granted without strong evidence.

There are two ways to obtain a wiretap – also known as electronic surveillance – on U.S. persons (citizens and permanent residents), and both include the courts. For criminal investigations, the FBI can seek a warrant under Title III of the U.S. criminal code by showing a federal court that there is probable cause to believe the target has engaged, or is engaging in, criminal activity. This is a fairly high standard because of a strong presumption in favor of our Fourth Amendment right to privacy, and requires a showing that less intrusive means of obtaining the same information aren’t feasible.

The standard for electronic surveillance for foreign intelligence purposes, though, is a little lower. This is because when it comes to national security, as opposed to criminal prosecutions, our Fourth Amendment rights are balanced against the government’s interest in protecting the country. The Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA) allows the FBI to get a warrant from a secret court, known as the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court (FISC), to conduct electronic surveillance on U.S. persons if they can show probable cause that the target is an “agent of a foreign power” who is “knowingly engag[ing]…in clandestine intelligence activities.” In other words, the government has to show that the target might be spying for a foreign government or organization.

But even under this standard, it’s not like the FBI can just decide to stop by a FISC to get a FISA warrant after going through the McDonald’s drive-thru for lunch. To even begin the process leading to a FISA, the FBI has to follow several steps outlined in the Attorney General Guidelines, which govern FBI investigations. First, the FBI has to conduct a “threat assessment” in order to establish grounds for even opening an investigation on potential FISA subjects. If a threat exists, the FBI must then formally open an investigation into possible foreign intelligence activity.

What does this look like in practice? Well, say, hypothetically, that a group of U.S. persons seem to have not infrequent contact with diplomats known to be Russian spies, whom the FBI are already monitoring. (Pro-tip: While it’s possible that such contacts could be accidental – I mean, hypothetically, the Trump inner circle could be a riot to hang out with socially – spies, particularly Russian ones, are pretty good at what they do and don’t spend time with people unless there’s a good reason.) The FBI might determine that, if the U.S. persons have access to classified information or could otherwise be “developed” for intelligence purposes by a foreign spy service, a significant enough threat exists to open an investigation – this would require at least one layer of approval within the FBI, and possibly more if the investigation concerns high-profile individuals.

The case still wouldn’t be FISA bound. FISA warrant investigations can’t be opened “solely on the basis of First Amendment activities,” so mere fraternization, even with sketchy people, wouldn’t be enough. The FBI would have to gather evidence to support a the claim that the U.S. target was knowingly working on behalf of a foreign entity. This could include information gathered from other methods like human sources, physical surveillance, bank transactions or even documents found in the target’s trash. This takes some time, and, when enough evidence had been accumulated, would be outlined in an affidavit and application stating the grounds for the FISA warrant. The completed FISA application would go up for approval through the FBI chain of command, including a Supervisor, the Chief Division Counsel (the highest lawyer within that FBI field office), and finally, the Special Agent in Charge of the field office, before making its way to FBI Headquarters to get approval by (at least) the Unit-level Supervisor there. If you’re exhausted already, hang on: There’s more.

The FISA application then travels to the Justice Department where attorneys from the National Security Division comb through the application to verify all the assertions made in it. Known as “Woods procedures” after Michael J. Woods, the FBI Special Agent attorney who developed this layer of approval, DOJ verifies the accuracy of every fact stated in the application. If anything looks unsubstantiated, the application is sent back to the FBI to provide additional evidentiary support – this game of bureaucratic chutes and ladders continues until DOJ is satisfied that the facts in the FISA application can both be corroborated and meet the legal standards for the court. After getting sign-off from a senior DOJ official (finally!), a lawyer from DOJ takes the FISA application before the FISC, comprised of eleven federal district judges who sit on the court on a rotating basis. The FISC reviews the application in secret, and decides whether to approve the warrant.

Now, it’s true that since its inception in 1978, the FISC has approved the vast majority of the over 25,000 FISA applications it has reviewed – some estimates put the number at over 99 percent. But that’s not surprising given the extensive process described above. In fact, if some reports are true that the initial FISA applications submitted to the FISC were rejected, prompting the FBI and DOJ to change its targets to the Russian banks doing business with Trump associates rather than the associates themselves (which would only require showing probable cause that the banks are a “foreign power,” which by definition they are), then a FISA application for Trump Tower, if one exists, would have been subject to even more scrutiny than would normally be the case.

In short, the FISA warrant process is designed to protect against the very abuse of power that the President has accused his predecessor of exercising. You could even say that FISA applications go through an “extreme vetting” process before being granted – something that the Trump administration ought to support.

Trump and his lackeys are just diverting attention and trying to discredit the FBI and DOJ; can't imagine what they are worried about. Could it be the heat in the kitchen is starting to make them sweat and Mueller is getting a little too close for comfort.

What surprises me is that nobody, even Kelly, is standing up to this effort to release something that the FBI feels should not be made public for national security reasons. It's game show White House, you get too close and your FIRED or beaten up so badly on tweeter, you just would rather move on.

Here's the process in layman's terms if you are interested
In an article titled, “It Ain’t Easy Getting a FISA Warrant: I Was an FBI Agent and Should Know,” here’s what Rangappa wrote:

… As someone who obtained FISA warrants while conducting counterintelligence investigations for the FBI, I can attest to the fact that they not only don’t involve the White House, but the process includes too many layers of approval to be granted without strong evidence.

There are two ways to obtain a wiretap – also known as electronic surveillance – on U.S. persons (citizens and permanent residents), and both include the courts. For criminal investigations, the FBI can seek a warrant under Title III of the U.S. criminal code by showing a federal court that there is probable cause to believe the target has engaged, or is engaging in, criminal activity. This is a fairly high standard because of a strong presumption in favor of our Fourth Amendment right to privacy, and requires a showing that less intrusive means of obtaining the same information aren’t feasible.

The standard for electronic surveillance for foreign intelligence purposes, though, is a little lower. This is because when it comes to national security, as opposed to criminal prosecutions, our Fourth Amendment rights are balanced against the government’s interest in protecting the country. The Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA) allows the FBI to get a warrant from a secret court, known as the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court (FISC), to conduct electronic surveillance on U.S. persons if they can show probable cause that the target is an “agent of a foreign power” who is “knowingly engag[ing]…in clandestine intelligence activities.” In other words, the government has to show that the target might be spying for a foreign government or organization.

But even under this standard, it’s not like the FBI can just decide to stop by a FISC to get a FISA warrant after going through the McDonald’s drive-thru for lunch. To even begin the process leading to a FISA, the FBI has to follow several steps outlined in the Attorney General Guidelines, which govern FBI investigations. First, the FBI has to conduct a “threat assessment” in order to establish grounds for even opening an investigation on potential FISA subjects. If a threat exists, the FBI must then formally open an investigation into possible foreign intelligence activity.

What does this look like in practice? Well, say, hypothetically, that a group of U.S. persons seem to have not infrequent contact with diplomats known to be Russian spies, whom the FBI are already monitoring. (Pro-tip: While it’s possible that such contacts could be accidental – I mean, hypothetically, the Trump inner circle could be a riot to hang out with socially – spies, particularly Russian ones, are pretty good at what they do and don’t spend time with people unless there’s a good reason.) The FBI might determine that, if the U.S. persons have access to classified information or could otherwise be “developed” for intelligence purposes by a foreign spy service, a significant enough threat exists to open an investigation – this would require at least one layer of approval within the FBI, and possibly more if the investigation concerns high-profile individuals.

The case still wouldn’t be FISA bound. FISA warrant investigations can’t be opened “solely on the basis of First Amendment activities,” so mere fraternization, even with sketchy people, wouldn’t be enough. The FBI would have to gather evidence to support a the claim that the U.S. target was knowingly working on behalf of a foreign entity. This could include information gathered from other methods like human sources, physical surveillance, bank transactions or even documents found in the target’s trash. This takes some time, and, when enough evidence had been accumulated, would be outlined in an affidavit and application stating the grounds for the FISA warrant. The completed FISA application would go up for approval through the FBI chain of command, including a Supervisor, the Chief Division Counsel (the highest lawyer within that FBI field office), and finally, the Special Agent in Charge of the field office, before making its way to FBI Headquarters to get approval by (at least) the Unit-level Supervisor there. If you’re exhausted already, hang on: There’s more.

The FISA application then travels to the Justice Department where attorneys from the National Security Division comb through the application to verify all the assertions made in it. Known as “Woods procedures” after Michael J. Woods, the FBI Special Agent attorney who developed this layer of approval, DOJ verifies the accuracy of every fact stated in the application. If anything looks unsubstantiated, the application is sent back to the FBI to provide additional evidentiary support – this game of bureaucratic chutes and ladders continues until DOJ is satisfied that the facts in the FISA application can both be corroborated and meet the legal standards for the court. After getting sign-off from a senior DOJ official (finally!), a lawyer from DOJ takes the FISA application before the FISC, comprised of eleven federal district judges who sit on the court on a rotating basis. The FISC reviews the application in secret, and decides whether to approve the warrant.

Now, it’s true that since its inception in 1978, the FISC has approved the vast majority of the over 25,000 FISA applications it has reviewed – some estimates put the number at over 99 percent. But that’s not surprising given the extensive process described above. In fact, if some reports are true that the initial FISA applications submitted to the FISC were rejected, prompting the FBI and DOJ to change its targets to the Russian banks doing business with Trump associates rather than the associates themselves (which would only require showing probable cause that the banks are a “foreign power,” which by definition they are), then a FISA application for Trump Tower, if one exists, would have been subject to even more scrutiny than would normally be the case.

In short, the FISA warrant process is designed to protect against the very abuse of power that the President has accused his predecessor of exercising. You could even say that FISA applications go through an “extreme vetting” process before being granted – something that the Trump administration ought to support.

I'm assuming that those on the House Committee know all this.

I'm assuming that those on the House Committee know all this.
Which makes some of their behavior all the more dubious.

Which makes some of their behavior all the more dubious.

Not if they saw something that indicates a corruption of the process.

Not if they saw something that indicates a corruption of the process.
If that was really the case why all the bi-partisan allegations of misrepresentation? Especially when the person central to the issue already has been caught pushing false conspiracy theories?

Conspiracy theories?
Well, i did hear that someone was actually born in East Germany and switched at a young age with the deceased grandson of a German immigrant. Might explain the fascination with eastern European women.

If that was really the case why all the bi-partisan allegations of misrepresentation? Especially when the person central to the issue already has been caught pushing false conspiracy theories?

Why all the conjecture by those who don't actually know what's in the memo?

Why all the conjecture by those who don't actually know what's in the memo?
The bi-partisan allegations of misrepresentation are from people who know what's exactly in the memo.

The bi-partisan allegations of misrepresentation are from people who know what's exactly in the memo.

What makes you so sure that their interpretation is the right one? And that those who claim otherwise is incorrect?

What makes you so sure that their interpretation is the right one? And that those who claim otherwise is incorrect?
Credibility or lack there of.

Credibility or lack there of.

That's nonsense--what you would call a deke. Credibility is in the eye of the beholder.

If that was really the case why all the bi-partisan allegations of misrepresentation? Especially when the person central to the issue already has been caught pushing false conspiracy theories?

if what you claim is true and the memo is a partisan hack job that will not be supported by the underlying intelligence and the author is a reckless partisan crazy then the release will result in the Whitehouse and Republicans effectively kicking themselves in the nuts(politically) ,...which I'd think you'd enthusiastically support

if what you claim is true and the memo is a partisan hack job that will not be supported by the underlying intelligence and the author is a reckless partisan crazy then the release will result in the Whitehouse and Republicans effectively kicking themselves in the nuts(politically) ,...which I'd think you'd enthusiastically support
In theory but that's now how social media and half ass news outlets work.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

In theory but that's now how social media and half ass news outlets work.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

but most work for the democrats sooo...they have an advantage and should be able to spin the proper tale on this one

This story is getting better (or worse) by the day. It's looking increasingly like Nunes has never even saw the FISA request. The White House leaked cherry picked elements, Nunes sent a staffer to the UK to investigate the Steele contribution, was told to pound sand, he came back and made the memo up based on what the White House told them.

This is the same Congressman who completely made up the "unmasking" scandal and was subsequently called out on it.

Not in my generation have I witnessed this level of government corruption here at home.

✔
@realDonaldTrump
The top Leadership and Investigators of the FBI and the Justice Department have politicized the sacred investigative process in favor of Democrats and against Republicans - something which would have been unthinkable just a short time ago. Rank & File are great people!

Is this the united states or Some alternate universe ?

love or hate him not sure how anyone can see these tweets as acceptable or not see them for what they are another attempt at the obstruction of our justice system and current investigation from the POTUS .. the lies and misinformation are never ending

Not in my generation have I witnessed this level of government corruption here at home.



are you moving back from Canada if he gets impeached?

This story is getting better (or worse) by the day. It's looking increasingly like Nunes has never even saw the FISA request. The White House leaked cherry picked elements, Nunes sent a staffer to the UK to investigate the Steele contribution, was told to pound sand, he came back and made the memo up based on what the White House told them.

This is the same Congressman who completely made up the "unmasking" scandal and was subsequently called out on it.

Not in my generation have I witnessed this level of government corruption here at home.

Don't forget he is being accused of changing parts of the memo after it was voted on.

Character matters with the Republicans.





That is the Democrat's character.

you guys are trying WAY too hard :scream:

Damn liberal FBI.

.

Not in my generation have I witnessed this level of government corruption here at home.

There are two sides pointing their fingers at each other. No one can come close to knowing for sure what the truth is, based on currently available facts. Let's find out the truth and react appropriately. Shockingly, you believe everything from the left and nothing from the right. That may turn out to be the reality. Let's find out.

Regarding Hilary and Trump, there is some supposed evidence of senior FBI officials acting out of political ideology, rather than a search for the truth. That would also be a level of corruption I'd think would you, but you're not bothered if Hilary was the beneficiary.

Damn liberal FBI.

You haven't seen any evidence that there were agents involved with Hilary and Trump, who might have been rooting for Hilary? McCabe's wife taking big campaign money from Democratic PACs for her senate run?

"The FBI" isn't liberal. There might be a few bad apples who had their thumbs on the scale for Hilary. Maybe, maybe not.

The left wouldn't be going berserk trying to block the release of the memo, if there was nothing there. If the memo is a Spence nothingburger, it will get spun as such on every network except one, and the GOP will look stupid.

The right would not have blocked the Democrat response if there wasn't anything there they didn't want us to see.

Who the heck knows what the truth is. Dirty stuff on all sides.

Time to hit the reset button.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Time to hit the reset button.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

giddayup

You haven't seen any evidence that there were agents involved with Hilary and Trump, who might have been rooting for Hilary? Sure there were. The agents aren't robots and have no opinion on things. One called Trump an idiot. Is that really different than Tillerson calling Trump a Moron?McCabe's wife taking big campaign money from Democratic PACs for her senate run? So no FBI agent's spouse should run for office.

"The FBI" isn't liberal. There might be a few bad apples who had their thumbs on the scale for Hilary. There has been no indication that anyone did anything wrong, no secret society.Maybe, maybe not.

The left wouldn't be going berserk trying to block the release of the memo, if there was nothing there. If the memo is a Spence nothingburger, it will get spun as such on every network except one, and the GOP will look stupid.Trump will use it to get rid of Rosenstien even if everything in it isn't true.

The right would not have blocked the Democrat response if there wasn't anything there they didn't want us to see. The response was written by Schiff - who read the intel. and they won't release it yet are releasing the Nunes memo even though he didn't read the intel.

Who the heck knows what the truth is. Dirty stuff on all sides.

The Repubs. all voted down a motion to have the FBI brief them on why the memo shouldn't be released.

I think we need to see the memo....if you are right, Trump and the Republicans are toast....right?

There are two sides pointing their fingers at each other. No one can come close to knowing for sure what the truth is, based on currently available facts. Let's find out the truth and react appropriately. Shockingly, you believe everything from the left and nothing from the right. That may turn out to be the reality. Let's find out.

Regarding Hilary and Trump, there is some supposed evidence of senior FBI officials acting out of political ideology, rather than a search for the truth. That would also be a level of corruption I'd think would you, but you're not bothered if Hilary was the beneficiary.


Jim you need to ask your self why are the republicans conducting these investigations.. and why now... and not while Obama was in office if this was such a concern "FBI officials acting out of political ideology"

No one can come close to knowing for sure what the truth is, based on currently available facts. Let's find out the truth and react appropriately.


Nothing in the Nunes memo deals with facts.. its a memo.. Republicans love to make claims of wrong doing or conspiracies then sell them as truth

So what Nunes has done is discredited or attempt to dis credit the FBI and the Justice Dept.. with a Memo . Trump supporters believe anything facts have never mattered ..

and here is the Rub WHO IS LEFT STANDING TO INVESTAGATE THESE ABUSE OF POWERS NUNES CLAIM TO HAVE HAPPENED?? IN HIS 4 PAGE MEMO.. THEIR ARE NO AGENCIES LEFT NO CIA ,JUSTICE DEPT OR FBI THAT TRUMP AND HIS ACCOMPLICES HAVEN'T TARRED AND FEATHERED.. TRUMP HAS BEEN PLANTING THE SEED OF DOUBT IN OUR GOVERMENT AGENCIES FROM 1 ST DAY OF HIS CANDIDACY .. A BLOODLESS COUP D'ETAT

http://billmoyers.com/story/trump-russia-timeline/

Nothing in the Nunes memo deals with facts.. its a memo..

this is not a factual statement...

The Repubs. all voted down a motion to have the FBI brief them on why the memo shouldn't be released.

"So no FBI agent's spouse should run for office"

No...But said agent should recuse himself if there is an appearance of a conflict

Jim you need to ask your self why are the republicans conducting these investigations.. and why now... and not while Obama was in office if this was such a concern "FBI officials acting out of political ideology"

No one can come close to knowing for sure what the truth is, based on currently available facts. Let's find out the truth and react appropriately.


Nothing in the Nunes memo deals with facts.. its a memo.. Republicans love to make claims of wrong doing or conspiracies then sell them as truth

So what Nunes has done is discredited or attempt to dis credit the FBI and the Justice Dept.. with a Memo . Trump supporters believe anything facts have never mattered ..

and here is the Rub WHO IS LEFT STANDING TO INVESTAGATE THESE ABUSE OF POWERS NUNES CLAIM TO HAVE HAPPENED?? IN HIS 4 PAGE MEMO.. THEIR ARE NO AGENCIES LEFT NO CIA ,JUSTICE DEPT OR FBI THAT TRUMP AND HIS ACCOMPLICES HAVEN'T TARRED AND FEATHERED.. TRUMP HAS BEEN PLANTING THE SEED OF DOUBT IN OUR GOVERMENT AGENCIES FROM 1 ST DAY OF HIS CANDIDACY .. A BLOODLESS COUP D'ETAT

"Jim you need to ask your self why are the republicans conducting these investigations.. and why now"

For the same reason that the media sat on Trump's Access Hollywood tape until they thought it would do the most damage...politics. The fact that the motive is political, doesn't mean the democrats didn't do anything. Same reason why the left is calling for an investigation between Trump and Russia...political damage

"Nothing in the Nunes memo deals with facts.. its a memo"

Not sure if you know what a "memo" is, but a memo can have elements of fact contained in it.

"So what Nunes has done is discredited or attempt to dis credit the FBI and the Justice Dept.. with a Memo "

If the memo were to show (and I am purely speculating) that the FBI knowingly relied on false information to get the FISA warrant, than the memo would indeed discredit the FBI and Nunes would be vindicated. True or false? And if that false information was paid for by the Clinton campaign, well that's a scandal. That's what some are alleging. I have no idea whether or not it's true, and neither do you.

I think we need to see the memo....if you are right, Trump and the Republicans are toast....right?

exactly. Am I supposed to believe that the reason the democrats oppose the release of the memo, is that they know there's nothing there, and they don't want the republicans to embarrass themselves.

"So no FBI agent's spouse should run for office"

No...But said agent should recuse himself if there is an appearance of a conflict

Fair enough. I think he did recuse himself shortly bf the election. I don't know how long he worked on the email thing.

Fair enough. I think he did recuse himself shortly bf the election. I don't know how long he worked on the email thing.

Believe me, I don't know any of the actual facts either. Foxnews broadcasts one extreme, CNN broadcasts the other. Would be nice if we knew the actual truth, and gave the boot to whoever is lying, wouldn't it?

Believe me, I don't know any of the actual facts either. Foxnews broadcasts one extreme, CNN, NBC, ABC, CBS, MSNBC, NPR broadcasts the other. Would be nice if we knew the actual truth, and gave the boot to whoever is lying, wouldn't it?

fixed it

exactly. Am I supposed to believe that the reason the democrats oppose the release of the memo, is that they know there's nothing there, and they don't want the republicans to embarrass themselves.
Jim, just to be sure you get it...the most serious opposition to the memo is coming from lifelong Republicans.

fixed it

You can say that again.

Just take Russian lessons, when Trump finishes you will need them.
The things that have disappeared from the media
Ukraine
Russian meddling in elections
meanwhile we are trying to convince everyone that the FBI is full of either Democrats or Deep State agents

Russian meddling in elections
meanwhile we are trying to convince everyone that the FBI is full of either Democrats or Deep State agents
My understanding is that the DOJ has still done absolutely nothing to investigate further or take actions to inhibit Russian election interference.

the memos out and no evidence presented just more of the same conspiracies and innuendo

text messages, The Steele dossier, and new target in The Nunes memo Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein

from an article
this somehow proves that the investigation into the Trump campaign’s Russia ties is entirely based on support for Clinton within the FBI and anti-Trump animus.


the memo’s claims are impossible to evaluate without seeing the underlying intelligence it was based on.

so where is the evidence

maybe nunes should look at this time linehttp://billmoyers.com/story/trump-russia-timeline/

from hero to zero in the republican party Sen. McCain on the Nunes Memo


“The latest attacks against the FBI and Department of Justice serve no American interests ― no party’s, no President’s, only Putin’s,” McCain added. “The American people deserve to know all the facts surrounding Russia’s ongoing efforts to subvert our democracy, which is why Special Counsel Mueller’s investigation must proceed unimpeded. Our nation’s elected officials, including the president, must stop looking at this investigation through the lens of politics and manufacturing political sideshows. If we continue to undermine our own rule of law, we are doing Putin’s job for him.”

Now that the truth is out, we must demand that justice be done. If we could rely on our politicians, there would already be indictments.

*Drop the Mueller investigation immediately
*Investigate Obama, Lynch and Comey
*Investigate Hillary and her campaign
*Investigate all Never Trumpers in congress who aided this effort
*Investigate all FBI and DOJ holdovers from the Obama administration
*Investigate media collusion in support of this fraud

And for God's sake, immediately cease and desist all references to Russian collusion! And leave President Trump to his work, fighting for the American people!

from Trump base ... cult of personality

mccain didn’t say whyvthe attacks are baseless I noticed.
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sure has the whacky left in a tizzy...

mccain didn’t say whyvthe attacks are baseless I noticed.
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must stop looking at this investigation through the lens of politics and manufacturing political sideshows. If we continue to undermine our own rule of law,

seems clear to me

mccain didn’t say whyvthe attacks are baseless I noticed.
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isn't it funny how McCain is a demented old fool when he disagrees with democrats or runs for president but he's a brilliant and esteemed statesman when he says something that the think helps their cause

some fact checking :btu:


https://www.npr.org/2018/02/02/582828461/fact-check-read-the-gop-memo-released-by-house-intelligence-committee

some fact checking :btu:


https://www.npr.org/2018/02/02/582828461/fact-check-read-the-gop-memo-released-by-house-intelligence-committee

you are adorable

Comey, Muller and Rosenstein all Republicans all apointed by Trump and confirmed by Republicans

But are now enemy #1 (of the law and order party) because they are following the evidence and the Law... we're ever it leads them amazing

What's so amazing?

Trump took credit for the bull market during his first year, I wonder if he will take credit for what appears to be a long overdue correction in the market these past few days, which most thought was soon to come.

I sure did enjoy the run, but even the great and powerful OZ (Trump) can't stop what's happening now, but he probably will blame someone else for it.

Trump took credit for the bull market during his first year, I wonder if he will take credit for what appears to be a long overdue correction in the market these past few days, which most thought was soon to come.

I sure did enjoy the run, but even the great and powerful OZ (Trump) can't stop what's happening now, but he probably will blame someone else for it.

Not sure what he has to deflect blame for, tor what he should be trying to stop...the market is still up a lot on his watch.

Inflation has nowhere to go but up, interest rates have nowhere to go but up.

If the market keeps doing what it did today he will have much to answer for, nothing unfair about that. I heard the selloff was based on fear that they'd raise interest rates to head off inflation, and that inflation fears were stoked by a strong jobs/earnings report.

It's funny, you'd think a strong jobs/earnings report would be favorable to the market, which makes it a good thing I'm not a financial advisor.

As the tax cuts are realized, you have to think consumer spending will increase, could make inflation fears more legitimate.

Not sure what he has to deflect blame for, tor what he should be trying to stop...the market is still up a lot on his watch.
You are aware the market had its worst day ever today right? Down almost 5%.

Looks like the influx of stimulus from the tax plan was the worst thing possible considering the state of the economy.

Trump took credit for the bull market during his first year, I wonder if he will take credit for what appears to be a long overdue correction in the market these past few days, which most thought was soon to come.

I sure did enjoy the run, but even the great and powerful OZ (Trump) can't stop what's happening now, but he probably will blame someone else for it.

Actually, his pro-business policies have created an actual market on which stocks can be connected, rather than the free, cheap money created in the previous eight years by the Fed and its quantitative easing--money that was directed into the stock market rather than into business stimulation, which artificially inflated the value of stocks. The correction can now take place without disturbing the actual market--a market which has been stimulated to grow by Trump's economic policies which frees it to grow and expand. So now the price of stocks can be corrected to being more reflective of the actual market.

Actually, his pro-business policies have created an actual market on which stocks can be connected, rather than the free, cheap money created in the previous eight years by the Fed and its quantitative easing--money that was directed into the stock market rather than into business stimulation, which artificially inflated the value of stocks. The correction can now take place without disturbing the actual market--a market which has been stimulated to grow by Trump's economic policies which frees it to grow and expand. So now the price of stocks can be corrected to being more reflective of the actual market.
How long did you hold that hit in?

How long did you hold that hit in?

I've said a few times already on this forum that the stock market was overinflated due to the excess money created by quantitative easing being invested in it rather than being invested in business stimulation because the business climate was suppressed by Progressive anti-business policies.

I mentioned recently in another thread that I agreed with WDMSO that the booming stock prices were suspect during the Obama administration and during the nascent Trump administration . The speculators saw opportunities to make more money investing "stimulus" money in stocks which they could sell off for a profit when the market came back to life and they could then, with the big profits, invest in an actually strong business market, while those holding the excessively priced stocks that the speculators (on wall street, etc.) sold to them, would take the losses.

Just my opinion. What do you think was the cause of a booming stock market during a stagnant economy?

I started a thread on march 23, 2017 with this video, titling it Trumps bleak economic future:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=34&v=kRV4hrTj2KM