Herd immunity is not a strategy, it is a biological fact [Archive] - Striper Talk Striped Bass Fishing, Surfcasting, Boating

Pete F.

10-08-2020, 02:34 PM

For every complex problem, there is a simple elegant and incorrect solution.
Congratulations on finding it
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Here's what some other scientists had to say about the simplistic solution proposed in Great Barrington.

“So I appreciate and understand the concerns and the sentiment behind this declaration, and of course other diseases are important and need attention, but without these anti-COVID-19 ‘tools’, I cannot see how they will achieve this ‘Focused Protection’ for these vulnerable groups in any practical, reliable or safe way.”

“An effective response to the Covid pandemic requires multiple targeted interventions to reduce transmission, to develop better treatments and to protect vulnerable people. This declaration prioritises just one aspect of a sensible strategy – protecting the vulnerable – and suggests we can safely build up ‘herd immunity’ in the rest of the population. This is wishful thinking. It is not possible to fully identify vulnerable individuals, and it is not possible to fully isolate them. Furthermore, we know that immunity to coronaviruses wanes over time, and re-infection is possible – so lasting protection of vulnerable individuals by establishing ‘herd immunity’ is very unlikely to be achieved in the absence of a vaccine. Individual scientists may reasonably disagree about the relative merits of various interventions, but they must be honest about the feasibility of what they propose. This declaration is therefore not a helpful contribution to the debate.”

“The Barrington Declaration is based upon a false premise – that governments and the scientific community wish for extensive lockdowns to continue until a vaccine is available. Lockdowns are only ever used when transmission is high, and now that we have some knowledge about how best to handle new outbreaks, most national and subnational interventions are much ‘lighter’ than the full suppressions we have seen for example in the UK across the spring of 2020.

“Those behind the Barrington Declaration are advocates of herd immunity within a population. They state that “Those who are not vulnerable should immediately be allowed to resume life as normal”, with the idea being that somehow the vulnerable of society will be protected from ensuing transmission of a dangerous virus. It is a very bad idea. We saw that even with intensive lockdowns in place, there was a huge excess death toll, with the elderly bearing the brunt of that, and 20-30% of the UK population would be classed as vulnerable to a severe COVID-19 infection. Around 8% of the UK population has some level of immunity to this novel coronavirus, and that immunity will likely wane over time and be insufficient to prevent a second infection. A strategy for herd immunity would also promote further inequalities across society, for example across the Black, Asian and minority ethnic communities. The declaration also ignores the emerging burdens of ‘long COVID’. We know that many people, even younger populations who suffered from an initially mild illness, are suffering from longer-term consequences of a COVID-19 infection.

“Independent SAGE are among the many scientists who have eloquently pointed out1 the many reasons why these initiatives are ultimately harmful and misleading as to the scientific evidence base. There are countries who are managing the pandemic relatively well, including South Korea and New Zealand, and their strategies do not include simply letting the virus run wild whilst hoping that the asthmatic community and the elderly can find somewhere to hide for 12 months. They have a proactive approach to ‘test and trace’ to reduce the impact of new outbreaks, and good public health messaging from the government to their populations. Ultimately, the Barrington Declaration is based on principles that are dangerous to national and global public health.

detbuch

10-08-2020, 02:49 PM

As I said, there are conflicting views. For the record, I have no idea which is the "correct" view. Just pointing out that there's this unanimous THE science is not true. And accusing someone of not following THE science is arbitrary, and, in my opinion, is politically motivated.

And, BTW, I wear a mask and social distance in public places.

Got Stripers

10-08-2020, 03:37 PM

Hey Mr. Stripper, thanks for telling me what happens on Friday night with g strings. I didn't know about that. Very interesting. I wish you well in these endeavors.

I know your a crappie fisherman but clearly you need a refresher course, stripers make there living in our ledges and white water, strippers make their living on poles in dark rooms smelling of scented oil. That you typed that easily makes me wonder if there are stripper web sites your trolling to get your message out. So do you go with singles or are you a fiver kind of guy?

detbuch

10-08-2020, 04:03 PM

I know your a crappie fisherman but clearly you need a refresher course, stripers make there living in our ledges and white water, strippers make their living on poles in dark rooms smelling of scented oil. That you typed that easily makes me wonder if there are stripper web sites your trolling to get your message out. So do you go with singles or are you a fiver kind of guy?

I'm not Mr. Stripper. You are.

Got Stripers

10-08-2020, 04:52 PM

I'm not Mr. Stripper. You are.

The New England Journal of Medicine (where stripers live not strippers) never gets involved in politics, yet felt they needed to state this administration has turned a crisis into a tragedy. Herd Mentality should have been the focus of this post, this administration is full of lemmings following the worst president in our history off the cliff.

scottw

10-08-2020, 05:08 PM

lemmings

.

you dutifully repeat whatever the leftist spin of the day is all day everyday:rollem:

scottw

10-08-2020, 05:43 PM

The New England Journal of Medicine never gets involved in politics, .

5 year old article

Aug 12, 2015

The New England Journal Of Medicine Fact-Checks The Republican Debate

"In an editorial, the journal's editors attack the stance held by most of the Republican hopefuls that Planned Parenthood should be defunded. A separate opinion piece argues that there is nothing wrong with fetal tissue research, which helped ignite a firestorm that has led for Republican calls to defund Planned Parenthood, instead taking the position that anyone who opposes the research is a hypocrite unless they forego medical care. A third opinion piece argues that the military's decision to fund gender re-assignment surgeries for troops, a decision attacked during the debate as a waste of money by former Arkansas Governor Mike Huckabee, is legally mandated and such a small cost that it doesn't merit public discussion.

It's not news that the New England Journal tends to be left-leaning --"

Got Stripers

10-08-2020, 06:07 PM

scottw

10-08-2020, 06:26 PM

Got Stripers

10-08-2020, 07:03 PM

you want me to monday morning quarterback like you?

Thought so nada.

Pete F.

10-08-2020, 07:45 PM

Now tell us about what Tweety’s magic Remdesivr therapy was developed from......
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detbuch

10-08-2020, 08:57 PM

Scott spin me a positive view of how life in America is better due to this administrations handling of Covid and please don’t fall back to Jims lame partial travel ban saved so many lives, I’m pretty sure that ship has sailed.

This is a confusing question. The Trump hating premise is that he did not act soon enough. But you want to disregard one of the important sooner things he did. If the accusation that things are not better because he didn't act soon enough, and the soon enough doesn't count because your "pretty sure" (again with the pretty sure self validation) that the soon stuff's "ship has sailed," then on what basis are we supposed to judge whether things are better or worse?

scottw

10-09-2020, 02:34 AM

This is a confusing question. The Trump hating premise is ....

yes, it is the left's lunacy on display..."tell me why that POS, lying, racist white supremacist trump and his nazi followers are not the scourge of the planet!!!!!":wall:

and these people are demanding trump get a mental fitness test????:rotf2:

Got Stripers

10-09-2020, 05:59 AM

This is a confusing question. The Trump hating premise is that he did not act soon enough. But you want to disregard one of the important sooner things he did. If the accusation that things are not better because he didn't act soon enough, and the soon enough doesn't count because your "pretty sure" (again with the pretty sure self validation) that the soon stuff's "ship has sailed," then on what basis are we supposed to judge whether things are better or worse?

Since this is a fishing site it would be like stepping into a choppy surf with your brand new waders, but forgetting your belt to keep water out, but you think it’s safe enough. The waders keep the water out initially, but enough eventually splash in to the point it’s getting hard to move off the bar you fish only until the incoming tide gets to a certain point. Obituary says Scott died doing what he loved and DeBarr was tasked to say a few words as they heard he was a wordsmith extraordinaire.

scottw

10-09-2020, 07:29 AM

Since this is a fishing site it would be like stepping into a choppy surf with your brand new waders, but forgetting your belt to keep water out, but you think it’s safe enough. The waders keep the water out initially, but enough eventually splash in to the point it’s getting hard to move off the bar you fish only until the incoming tide gets to a certain point. Obituary says Scott died doing what he loved and DeBarr was tasked to say a few words as they heard he was a wordsmith extraordinaire.

is this the medication talking???

RIROCKHOUND

10-09-2020, 07:48 AM

is this the medication talking???

Only for Trump; he was a rambling loon yesterday both morning and evening interviews....

PaulS

10-09-2020, 07:55 AM

The idea behind herd immunity is that the strong survive, the weak will die and anyone who thinks they are vulnerable should just worry about themselves.

Republican empathy at its finest.

scottw

10-09-2020, 08:07 AM

The idea behind herd immunity is that the strong survive, the weak will die .

I don't believe this is correct but if it makes you feel better

Pete F.

10-09-2020, 08:49 AM

The test looks like it's coming, and we can then see if herd immunity works.

I'll be one of those not following the lemmings off the cliff.

Dr. Fauci said in early August that we need to be at around 10,000 new infections daily by September or 'we’re going to have a really bad situation in the fall'—but now, we're at around four times that number and racking up over 700 deaths per day."

New York state has reached 1,000 infections per day for the first time since June. Boston just announced a pause in its school opening as positive COVID test rates jumped to 4 percent. Smaller states, like North Dakota, are already struggling to find enough ICU beds to care for critically ill patients.

scottw

10-09-2020, 08:56 AM

Nebe

10-09-2020, 08:59 AM

Yep. Round 2 is coming. But it’s just a hoax. Don’t let it rule your life. Yadayadayada.

3 people died at Benghazi and people loose their fu Kong minds. Trump seems to promote more deaths with this virus and the same people cheer on happily. I really don’t get it.
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scottw

10-09-2020, 09:02 AM

Yep. Round 2 is coming. But it’s just a hoax.

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has anyone ever thought round two wasn't coming?

RIROCKHOUND

10-09-2020, 09:05 AM

has anyone ever thought round two wasn't coming?

Besides Trump? No

Pete F.

10-09-2020, 09:18 AM

Don’t be afraid of the virus, immigrants they’re really scary.
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spence

10-09-2020, 03:30 PM

This whole thread is just stupid.

We still don't know if individuals can get re-infected with Covid. If letting a virus cull off most of our parents is a good strategy that's idiotic. Worse, it's looking like even healthy people are suffering lasting lung damage from even a moderate case. They say about 60% of the population would need to get it to think about herd immunity, that's a lot of lifetime disabilities.

detbuch

10-09-2020, 03:51 PM

RIROCKHOUND

10-09-2020, 03:59 PM

Did you watch the video? It supports quarantine of the vulnerable.

That probably limits fatalities but it doesn’t help with what Spence describes, plus the whole randomly throwing blood clots in healthy people thing... but WTH what’s a little lung damage among friends...
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Got Stripers

10-09-2020, 05:18 PM

We don’t have to concern ourselves with herd anything, Trump said there is a cure and we all know he never lies.

detbuch

10-09-2020, 05:59 PM

That probably limits fatalities but it doesn’t help with what Spence describes, plus the whole randomly throwing blood clots in healthy people thing... but WTH what’s a little lung damage among friends...
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What Spence was saying are unanswered questions or conjectured possibilities, much of which exist even with mass quarantining. As well, there are injurious health, mental, and economic side effects created by prolonged mass quarantine that may be just as, or more, harmful to present and future generations. A lot is not for sure positively known, and there are differences of opinion in the scientific community. Just pointing that out to those who say follow THE science. I'm not going to try to debate or advocate about something I don't have the knowledge to do so. But I don't want to be persuaded to vote for someone by one-sided arguments made out of partial or total ignorance. Especially if those arguments are based on biased politics.

Pete F.

10-10-2020, 10:05 AM

So when did Tweety last test negative?
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RIROCKHOUND

10-10-2020, 10:10 AM

So when did Tweety last test negative?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Pretty clearly they are not telling because the answer is worse than not telling people. Should we assume at this point it was likely before the debate and they were assuming he would stay asymptomatic?
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detbuch

10-10-2020, 10:42 AM

Should we assume . . .?

The difference between "should" and "could" is huge. And picking one over the other is very telling.

Got Stripers

10-10-2020, 11:03 AM

The difference between "should" and "could" is huge. And picking one over the other is very telling.

The fact there is no transparency and even the doctors won’t talk is also telling, that statement works both ways.

detbuch

10-10-2020, 11:18 AM

The fact there is no transparency and even the doctors won’t talk is also telling, that statement works both ways.

There has been a lot of transparency along with lack of it. "No" is not correct. As well, there has been a lack of transparency in the Biden campaign about what it's intentions are. Are we to assume (or is it better to say should we assume) that Biden is hiding something he does not want us to know?

Pete F.

10-10-2020, 05:45 PM

detbuch

10-10-2020, 07:28 PM

Are we just gonna breeze past that trump and Giuliani and others on the re-election effort spent weeks talking about how Biden must be on drugs, only to shortly after have Trump apparently #^&#^&#^&#^&ed up on steroids while leading the country
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Did Trump and Giuliani comment on how Biden must be on medicinal steroids? And are we just going to breeze past Biden's lack of transparency?

Pete F.

10-10-2020, 07:46 PM

Where are Melania, Ivanka, Jared, Bill Barr & whoever else I’m missing because they’ve been out of sight since the Rose Garden event?
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detbuch

10-10-2020, 08:30 PM

Where are Melania, Ivanka, Jared, Bill Barr & whoever else I’m missing because they’ve been out of sight since the Rose Garden event?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Only possible conclusion is they're on ventilators.

Pete F.

10-10-2020, 10:22 PM

detbuch

10-10-2020, 10:30 PM

Tweety says!
China has been working very hard to contain the Coronavirus. The United States greatly appreciates their efforts and transparency. It will all work out well. In particular, on behalf of the American People, I want to thank President Xi!

This gave me a chuckle. Your so desperate to come up with more and more anti-Trump stuff that you have to drag out some old stuff and put it in the present tense.

detbuch

10-10-2020, 11:14 PM

The idea behind herd immunity is that the strong survive, the weak will die and anyone who thinks they are vulnerable should just worry about themselves.

Republican empathy at its finest.

This also was a bit desperately funny. The three scientists in the video did not specify their political party affiliation or if they had one. One is a Swede, another is a Brit, and the third is of Indian descent and either a U.S. national or just working here. The Brit did claim, when they all actually disavowed any political motivations for their mission, that she was far from any Libertarian political leaning--the odds are they are not "Conservative," certainly two are not Republican, and that they are Progressive.

And what they mean by herd immunity as well as their proposal to achieve it does not comport with what you claim is the " idea behind herd immunity". They certainly don't say "vulnerable should just worry about themselves." They specifically say that the vulnerable should be protected. The Swede admitted that the one fault of the Swedish method of no lockdown was that they didn't protect (quarantine) those in the nursing homes in which the vast majority of deaths occurred.

And the title of this thread is a direct quote from one of the scientists in the video. They distinguished the notion of herd immunity being a strategy from the supposition that it is a goal. The goal is to achieve herd immunity via their strategy for doing so, and that herd immunity is ultimately the goal of any strategy. Vaccines are a way to achieve herd immunity. Flattening curve through lockdown is a temporary way of slowing down the virus so it doesn't overwhelm the hospital system until their are mitigations and cures developed. But it is not an attempt to totally remove the virus from the face of the earth. Once it's here, it will remain as do all the other colds and flu viruses, but for which we have created mitigating protocols. And from which we will have achieved a "herd immunity" in which antibodies are naturally or artificially created so the virus will not be a pandemic threat.

But then you probably didn't watch the video. And you saw an occasion to throw in a zinger about Republican empathy.

Pete F.

10-11-2020, 04:27 AM

For every complex problem, there is a simple elegant and incorrect solution.
Congratulations on finding it
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Still stands
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wdmso

10-11-2020, 08:03 AM

I know hold rallies not mandating mask or social distancing. Is all about Freedoms

Leaders lead by example ForTrumplicans his getting covid is leading by example their all f in the head

detbuch

10-11-2020, 11:28 AM

Still stands

On it's head.

detbuch

10-11-2020, 02:06 PM

I know hold rallies not mandating mask or social distancing. Is all about Freedoms

Leaders lead by example ForTrumplicans his getting covid is leading by example their all f in the head

He did lead by example. He showed that, under his leadership, we are on the path to beating this thing. And if the Dems gain control, they will "inherit" what has been done to put us on that path. And they will claim the success as theirs and brand his administration as a total failure.

And if they don't eff up the economy by going back to their high tax high regulation Progressive model, they will have a record recovery and a period of American renaissance--until they reinstate their Progressive agenda.

Got Stripers

10-11-2020, 02:21 PM

He did lead by example. He showed that, under his leadership, we are on the path to beating this thing. And if the Dems gain control, they will "inherit" what has been done to put us on that path. And they will claim the success as theirs and brand his administration as a total failure.

And if they don't eff up the economy by going back to their high tax high regulation Progressive model, they will have a record recovery and a period of American renaissance--until they reinstate their Progressive agenda.

You have a different definition of beating this virus, but that’s to be expected, so when we reach 300,000 dead with still no comprehensive government plan or consistent messaging in place, will that be “winning”?

wdmso

10-11-2020, 03:19 PM

He did lead by example. He showed that, under his leadership, we are on the path to beating this thing. And if the Dems gain control, they will "inherit" what has been done to put us on that path. And they will claim the success as theirs and brand his administration as a total failure.

And if they don't eff up the economy by going back to their high tax high regulation Progressive model, they will have a record recovery and a period of American renaissance--until they reinstate their Progressive agenda.

you know the standards you set for progressives.. How about using the same standards on Trump .. that was you might not sound like a cult member to late "American renaissance" plz explain

detbuch

10-11-2020, 04:46 PM

You have a different definition of beating this virus, but that’s to be expected, so when we reach 300,000 dead with still no comprehensive government plan or consistent messaging in place, will that be “winning”?

There is no evidence that Biden, or Hillary, or any Dem, would have done better. If anything, Biden and the Dems and the WHO and the Press and China said he overreacted and was xenophobic with his travel bans--which strongly indicates that they all would not have acted as early as Trump. And the "messaging" of the Dems early on was to be carefree and mingle in crowds with no mention of masks.

And Trump sped up the process for producing and getting vaccines and cures ready. There's no evidence that the Dems would have done that. If anything, the Dem "messaging" was that Trump was putting us in danger by trying to speed up the process. The normal process would have taken years. To this day they still try to put doubt in any vaccine that is produced under this administration. Which doesn't seem to me to be concerned with the well being of our people or with defeating the virus.

So I see no evidence that any Dem would have done better. What they have done very, very well is "message" all manner of doubt and disbelief in anything Trump says or does--starting before he even became President. And they did anything from a constant barrage of negative and even lying press, to unproven and unfounded accusations of treason, a stupid show trial impeachment, claiming without proof that he mishandled the pandemic by not starting early enough, saying that he has no national plan when he obviously has had a plan but is limited by his constitutional powers and therefor letting the states do what they are constitutionally given the power to do, and a relentless portrayal of orange man bad to really really bad.

To me, the Dem "message" that Trump is totally responsible exposes the authoritarian nature of their Progressive ideal--an all powerful central government in charge of every aspect of our lives. And a dictatorial executive administration that assumes all the governmental powers of the nation.

It is obvious, as with those anti-Trumpers on this forum, that their mission was not to join in on suggestions or help in anything other than bringing Trump down. They have gone way beyond the usual obstruction of an opposing administration.

I said we are on "the path" to beating it, not that it has been beaten. And Trump has laid down a foundation for winning as proven by his speedy recovery with the aid of one of the medications resulting from his operation warp speed. . . if the Dems don't mess it up.

Got Stripers

10-11-2020, 05:44 PM

There is no evidence that Biden, or Hillary, or any Dem, would have done better. If anything, Biden and the Dems and the WHO and the Press and China said he overreacted and was xenophobic with his travel bans--which strongly indicates that they all would not have acted as early as Trump. And the "messaging" of the Dems early on was to be carefree and mingle in crowds with no mention of masks.

And Trump sped up the process for producing and getting vaccines and cures ready. There's no evidence that the Dems would have done that. If anything, the Dem "messaging" was that Trump was putting us in danger by trying to speed up the process. The normal process would have taken years. To this day they still try to put doubt in any vaccine that is produced under this administration. Which doesn't seem to me to be concerned with the well being of our people or with defeating the virus.

So I see no evidence that any Dem would have done better. What they have done very, very well is "message" all manner of doubt and disbelief in anything Trump says or does--starting before he even became President. And they did anything from a constant barrage of negative and even lying press, to unproven and unfounded accusations of treason, a stupid show trial impeachment, claiming without proof that he mishandled the pandemic by not starting early enough, saying that he has no national plan when he obviously has had a plan but is limited by his constitutional powers and therefor letting the states do what they are constitutionally given the power to do, and a relentless portrayal of orange man bad to really really bad.

To me, the Dem "message" that Trump is totally responsible exposes the authoritarian nature of their Progressive ideal--an all powerful central government in charge of every aspect of our lives. And a dictatorial executive administration that assumes all the governmental powers of the nation.

It is obvious, as with those anti-Trumpers on this forum, that their mission was not to join in on suggestions or help in anything other than bringing Trump down. They have gone way beyond the usual obstruction of an opposing administration.

I said we are on "the path" to beating it, not that it has been beaten. And Trump has laid down a foundation for winning as proven by his speedy recovery with the aid of one of the medications resulting from his operation warp speed. . . if the Dems don't mess it up.

To use your typical argument might have means nada and by the way they aren’t running the show and it’s not going to be a top ten shoe, going down as the worst EVER!

detbuch

10-11-2020, 06:10 PM

To use your typical argument might have means nada and by the way they aren’t running the show and it’s not going to be a top ten shoe, going down as the worst EVER!

WTH are you talking about?

Got Stripers

10-11-2020, 06:17 PM

detbuch

10-11-2020, 07:51 PM

Thought you’d catch the meaning (no sleep last night your slipping) since your argument on anyone’s post using rhetoric like looks like, or might be, or maybe no evidence in your case just doesn’t hold water. To try to argue what a different administration may or may not have done in your own words is ludicrous and again Biden isn’t running this show and it’s a looser.

I didn't say there might be evidence nor that there might not be evidence. I definitively said there is no evidence. I even specifically pointed out in their own words and actions that Biden and the Dems would not have acted earlier than Trump since they criticized him for doing so. Are you claiming that the Dems were just being hypocritical? Your accusation that Trump didn't act soon enough is based on opinion with no fact or evidence. You didn't say that he might have acted too late. You definitively said he did. I gave you factual information that puts the lie to any argument that the Dems would have acted earlier. Those facts are not a "they might have happened." It's a "they did happen."

Your making the initial accusation that Trump didn't act soon enough. The burden of proof is on you. I am making a rebuttal saying that the Dems would not have acted sooner, with facts to support it. You are the one making a definitive accusation with no facts to support it. Your accusation is speculation.

And I stated the fact that Trump sped up the process of finding vaccines. And I pointed out the fact that the Dems criticized him for doing so. These are not "might have, looks like, maybe" speculations. They are "did happen" facts. In there own words the Dems were indicating that they would not have sped up the process . . . unless they were being hypocritical liars.

And since you keep insisting that Trump's messaging is destructive and inconsistent, I pointed out how the Dem's messaging was and is inconsistent and damaging, and yes, in my opinion, far more damaging and politically motivated than Trump's.

Got Stripers

10-11-2020, 08:06 PM

And yet with all you stay Trump did we are rapidly approaching 300,000 dead and initial actions by Trump were a bandaid on a hemorrhaging problem a partial ban followed by terrible mixed messaging even to this day, have resulted in a failed economy and attempt at handling this health crisis. To suggest you know how Biden or another administration would handle this by comments they made without the intel this current administration had is in your own words pure speculation. Keep it up DeBarr eventually someone might buy into your BS argument but it won’t be me.

detbuch

10-11-2020, 08:20 PM

Got Stripers

10-12-2020, 02:22 PM

detbuch

10-12-2020, 02:34 PM

The White House has repeatedly meddled with decisions by career professionals at the FDA, Centers for Disease Control and Prevention and other science-based agencies. Many of the nation’s leading scientists, including some of the top doctors in the administration, are deeply disturbed by the collision of politics and science and bemoan its effects on public health.

“I’ve never seen anything that closely resembles this. It’s like a pressure cooker,” Anthony S. Fauci, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, said in an interview.

You keep defending and I will keep chuckling and raising the flag. :bs:

Yeah, well the FDA and CDC have f*cked up many times. They are run by fallible humans not perfectly programmed robots. And many top doctors and scientists disagree with some of your favorite top docotors and scientists. And Fauci said that Trump did whatever his team asked for.

And your little BS flag ain't about chit.

Pete F.

10-12-2020, 07:23 PM

NEW: Erin Banco spoke to Fauci about the Trump campaign:

"By doing this against my will, they are in effect harassing me. Since campaign ads are about getting votes, their harassment of me might have the opposite effect of turning some voters off."
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detbuch

10-12-2020, 08:31 PM

detbuch

10-13-2020, 11:33 AM

For every complex problem, there is a simple elegant and incorrect solution.
Congratulations on finding it

Washington Examiner:

The World Health Organization’s special envoy on COVID-19 urged world leaders this week to stop “using lockdowns as your primary control method.”

“We in the World Health Organization do not advocate lockdowns as the primary means of control of this virus,” Dr. David Nabarro said to The Spectator’s Andrew Neil. “The only time we believe a lockdown is justified is to buy you time to reorganize, regroup, rebalance your resources, protect your health workers who are exhausted, but by and large, we’d rather not do it.”

Nabarro went on to point out several of the negative consequences lockdowns have caused across the world, including devastating tourism industries and increased hunger and poverty.

"Just look at what’s happened to the tourism industry in the Caribbean, for example, or in the Pacific because people aren’t taking their holidays,” he said. “Look what’s happened to smallholder farmers all over the world. ... Look what’s happening to poverty levels. It seems that we may well have a doubling of world poverty by next year. We may well have at least a doubling of child malnutrition.”

Earlier this week, thousands of medical health experts signed their names to a petition calling for the end of coronavirus lockdowns, citing the “irreparable damage” they’ve caused.

"As infectious disease epidemiologists and public health scientists, we have grave concerns about the damaging physical and mental health impacts of the prevailing COVID-19 policies, and recommend an approach we call Focused Protection,” read the petition, known as the Great Barrington Declaration. "Current lockdown policies are producing devastating effects on short and long-term public health."

In the United States, lockdowns have been tied to increased thoughts of suicide from children, a surge in drug overdoses, an uptick in domestic violence, and a study conducted in May concluded that stress and anxiety from lockdowns could destroy seven times the years of life that lockdowns potentially save.

For a more in depth study of the effects of stress from the lockdowns: https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/stress-from-virus-response-will-destroy-7-times-more-years-of-life-than-lockdowns-save-study

Got Stripers

10-13-2020, 11:44 AM

Pete F.

10-13-2020, 12:01 PM

detbuch

10-13-2020, 12:10 PM

Hey guess what everyone has been saying for a long time earlier action by governments, mask Wearing being essential, social distancing and limiting the size of gatherings would have saved lives. Basically everything a Trump has refused to do all along.

Trump has worn masks in certain situations. He has social distanced in certain situations. He has no authority to make people do it. That is a state responsibility. And he certainly hasn't said that we shouldn't follow mask and distancing guidelines,

When asked whether he would wear a mask, Trump told Fox Business in a White House interview, "Oh, I would. I have. I mean people have seen me wearing one. If I'm in a group of people where we're not 10 feet away -- but usually I'm not in that position and everyone's tested."

Under interstate commerce power:
July 3 (UPI) -- The Trump administration has issued guidance to airports and airlines to mandate the use of face coverings at all times as well as employ social distancing measures and minimize in-person interactions to prevent further spread of the coronavirus.

And Trump was right to call for a loosening up of lockdowns and freeing up the economy--which he was criticized for.

Pete F.

10-13-2020, 12:30 PM

detbuch

10-13-2020, 12:47 PM

The World Health Organization’s special envoy on COVID-19 Dr. David Nabarro in an interview stated lockdowns are not helpful as the primary means to control COVID-19. He advocated a middle path which means holding the virus at bay whilst keeping economy and social life going. It would require "high level of organization by governments and remarkable degree of engagement of people" with robust infectious disease control services or public health. He emphasized combining of several measures such as "physical distancing , face protection, hygiene, isolating the ill and protecting the vulnerable" as an effective method.

And then you have Covita's rally in a state with a remarkable disengagement of people and a a positivity rate that's 14% higher than 2 weeks ago, so if you don't do a, b, c, d and e you might end up needing to do a lockdown.

But he's immune

Oh, so now you don't think I found an incorrect solution?

And it is highly hypocritical to praise large outdoor "protests" in which there is no social distancing and many are not wearing masks, and to allow large indoor various studio audiences such as Progressive SNL shows where there is no social distancing or many without face masks.

Trump's rallies are outdoors. And there are some mask wearers. What's good for the goose is apparently not necessarily, for you, good for the gander.

And BTW, I wish he would ask all those coming to his rallies to wear masks. As the speaker, he would have to remove a mask. And it is outdoors, and he is several feet removed from the audience. But he leaves it up to them, as is their constitutional right. If they are breaking a state mandate, then the state should prosecute them.

And he was right to push for opening up the society and economy.

And I am optimistic that his warp speed agenda will soon produce the medical mitigations to help us reach an eventual herd immunity. And I like his economic agenda way better than the economy choking Dem agenda. And I like what he has done with foreign economic treaties. And that he has not got us into a bunch of stupid never ending wars.

Overall, for me, especially considering the fate of our Republic and its Constitution and our unalienable rights if the Progressive agenda is not checked, a Republican electoral victory is the better choice, by far.

Pete F.

10-13-2020, 01:01 PM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D6gAUO86TuM

Pete F.

10-13-2020, 01:04 PM

And I am optimistic that his warp speed agenda will soon produce the medical mitigations to help us reach an eventual herd immunity.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p58I3Xs0v-c

detbuch

10-13-2020, 01:10 PM

Covita in July: "We have one of the lowest, maybe the lowest, mortality rate anywhere in the world

New study: "The proportion of Americans dying from coronavirus infections is the highest in the developed world"

Quite a way to make America great again

So you use a July quote, nice. It's a worldwide pandemic and it is resurging just about everywhere,

Oct. 11 (UPI) -- "Nations are reporting record daily coronavirus cases, mainly in Europe after largely controlling the pandemic, with the world adding around 1 million new infections every three days.

On Saturday, a total of 355,909 new cases were reported worldwide, slightly less than the record 358,354 the day before and the fourth day in a row with more than 300,000. One-third of those new cases were in Europe.

On Sunday, Europe added 88,488 cases with 242,197 globally so far Sunday."

And when you take the economic and health factors (including long term) caused by the lockdowns, the U.S. does not compare badly as the purely covid count stats suggest. We'll get over this and be better off in the long run than most others--if we keep the Trump economic policies in place and don't revert to the Progressive tax and regulation policies and don't go back to self-destructive trade policies.

Pete F.

10-13-2020, 02:44 PM

So you use a July quote, nice. It's a worldwide pandemic and it is resurging just about everywhere,

Oct. 11 (UPI) -- "Nations are reporting record daily coronavirus cases, mainly in Europe after largely controlling the pandemic, with the world adding around 1 million new infections every three days.

On Saturday, a total of 355,909 new cases were reported worldwide, slightly less than the record 358,354 the day before and the fourth day in a row with more than 300,000. One-third of those new cases were in Europe.

On Sunday, Europe added 88,488 cases with 242,197 globally so far Sunday."

And when you take the economic and health factors (including long term) caused by the lockdowns, the U.S. does not compare badly as the purely covid count stats suggest. We'll get over this and be better off in the long run than most others--if we keep the Trump economic policies in place and don't revert to the Progressive tax and regulation policies and don't go back to self-destructive trade policies.

Your quote has nothing to do with what I posted about deaths, demonstrating just as much empathy as Covita

New study: "The proportion of Americans dying from coronavirus infections is the highest in the developed world"

And don't worry with Covita's rallies in the most virulent parts of the US, he will make sure we are #1

detbuch

10-13-2020, 02:54 PM

Your quote has nothing to do with what I posted about deaths, demonstrating just as much empathy as Covita

New study: "The proportion of Americans dying from coronavirus infections is the highest in the developed world"

And don't worry with Covita's rallies in the most virulent parts of the US, he will make sure we are #1

My post was putting your post in a less pessimistic perspective. You want to point out every selective negative data you can get your brain on.

Here's this dose of optimism from the NYT's Science and Health Reporter:

A reporter for The New York Times wrote Monday he was surprised to find America’s recovery from the coronavirus pandemic appears to be unfolding faster than experts initially anticipated.

In “A Dose of Optimism, as the Pandemic Rages On,” science and health reporter Donald G. McNeil Jr. argued the coronavirus death toll in the U.S., standing at around 250,000, is far below the initial 2.2 million Americans initially projected to die by mid-October.

“Since January, when I began covering the pandemic, I have been a consistently gloomy Cassandra, reporting on the catastrophe that experts saw coming: that the virus would go pandemic, that Americans were likely to die in large numbers, the national lockdown would last well beyond Easter and even past summer. No miracle cure was on the horizon; the record for developing a vaccine was four years,” McNeil wrote. “Events have moved faster than I thought possible. I have become cautiously optimistic. Experts are saying, with genuine confidence, that the pandemic in the United States will be over far sooner than they expected, possibly by the middle of next year.”

Citing a March 16 White House press briefing on the virus, McNeil recalled President Trump and the White House Coronavirus Task Force presenting their “15 Days to Slow the Spread” recommendations. They showed a chart from London’s Imperial College, which used a “sinuous blue line” to demonstrate what Dr. Deborah Birx called a “the blue mountain of deaths.”

McNeil argued the coronavirus death toll in the U.S. did not reach the 2.2 million marker because Americans’ behavior and attitudes toward combatting the virus largely evolved over the past few months, as more people accept social distancing measures as the norm. More people also have accepted the practice of wearing masks, especially since President Trump contracted the virus.

“In the day-to-day fights over reopening schools or bars, it is easy to forget that there was a time when the idea of canceling large public gatherings — the St. Patrick’s Day Parade, the N.C.A.A.’s March Madness basketball tournament — did not seem remotely necessary,” McNeil wrote. “That there was a time when leading health officials said that only sick people and hospital workers needed to wear masks.”

TRUMP GETTING SUPPORT FROM THOSE MOST AFFECTED BY 'ASYMMETRICAL' COVID LOCKDOWNS: HANSON

Pharmaceutical treatments for the disease have expanded, as antiviral drug remdesivir and steroids such as dexamethasone have proven effective in treating the virus, and those hospitalized are less likely to die from the disease.

Still, McNeil pointed out that infection rates were spiking in some states, and experts have been racing to develop vaccines and monoclonal antibodies – dubbed the medical “cavalry” to defeat the virus once and for all. Recent projections by Dr. Anthony Fauci estimated some 400,000 Americans could die from the coronavirus before the pandemic is anticipated to end by mid-2021.

To avoid the pandemic from relapsing, he urged Americans to follow Fauci’s advice to “hunker down.”

He also wrote that vaccine skepticism must fade, and that Congress must act to make the vaccine available around the world, as well as helping Americans recover economically from the virus.

I'm not sure what more "hunkering down" we need to do. No doubt you want Trump to stop his rallies. As you like to say--we'll see.

detbuch

10-13-2020, 07:48 PM

From an NBC news article Oct. 8 2020 regarding masks at Trump's campaign rallies:

"'We take strong precautions for campaign events. Every attendee has their temperature checked, masks are provided and their use is encouraged, and there is plenty of hand sanitizer' said Courtney Parella, a spokesperson for the Trump campaign, when asked about what safety measures were being taken in light of the recent Covid-19 outbreak among White House and campaign aides."

I watched a bit of his rally in Pennsylvania today. Everyone in the grandstand behind him that fit into the camera frame had a mask on. Although masks are provided they are not required, and I didn't see any pictures of the huge crowd in front of and below his podium, so I don't know how many of them were wearing masks.

Pete F.

10-13-2020, 08:08 PM

There’s a billboard in Des Moines announcing Covita’s
COVID Superspreader Event
They’ll remember where they got it.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

detbuch

10-13-2020, 09:07 PM

There’s a billboard in Des Moines announcing Covita’s
COVID Superspreader Event
They’ll remember where they got it.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

They've probably never heard of Covita.

Pete F.

10-14-2020, 06:57 PM

Trump is about to hold a pandemic rally with no social distancing and very few masks in Des Moines, Iowa.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

The Dad Fisherman

10-14-2020, 08:53 PM

I think they are referring to it as a Protest, so corona virus has no power there.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Pete F.

10-15-2020, 05:46 AM

Trump’s strategy of ignoring the pandemic so that cases surge in battleground states in late October seems to be working out.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

detbuch

10-16-2020, 12:31 PM

Trump’s strategy of ignoring the pandemic so that cases surge in battleground states in late October seems to be working out.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

This is either a truly idiotic comment, or clever propagandistic mixture of words.

scottw

10-16-2020, 12:33 PM

there are apparently lot's of American republicans running around europe refusing to wear masks :huh::hihi:

Got Stripers

10-17-2020, 07:44 AM

I think they are referring to it as a Protest, so corona virus has no power there.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

That’s the fifth inalienable right Trumps Supreme Court pick couldn’t remember when asked to name all five.

Pete F.

10-19-2020, 12:26 PM

Trump: "Fauci is a disaster. If I listened to him, we’d have 500,000 deaths," before later saying it would be 700,000 or 800,000. "If there’s a reporter on, you can have it just the way I said it, I couldn’t care less." (CNN was given access to the call by a source.)

TRUMP vs DR FAUCI:
- politics vs science
- charlatan vs expert
- re-election vs public safety
- votes vs saving lives
- rhetoric vs empirical data
- spin narrative vs transparency
- manipulation vs proofing
- sole decision vs peer review
- reactive vs proactive
- hunch vs facts
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

detbuch

10-19-2020, 02:22 PM

Pete F.

10-19-2020, 02:53 PM

detbuch

10-19-2020, 03:34 PM

I’m old enough to remember Trump saying it would disappear like a miracle.

We’re making Trump disappear at the polls. Trump is a disaster and it’s time to stop the bleeding and the deaths.

Trump and Biden, as well as all the other biased pols have said a lot of lying BS. Your selective memory is meaningless other than some political talking point. And Trump losing won't "like a miracle" stop the bleeding and the deaths. It'll stop, as if by magic, the leftist media from making a bogus issue about it, and, as if by magic, their current complaints and accusations will turn to praise of what a wonderful job Biden is doing to defeat the virus. Even though all the ground work for defeating it has already been laid, and Biden won't be doing much different. It's like when Biden magically gave Obama credit for what looked like a successful democratic revolution in Iraq . . . after blaming Bush for actually making it possible.

In my opinion, what would be a disaster is if the Dems revert to bringing back their old taxes and regulations and creating another historically low recovery and a return of their beloved stagnant "new normal." Not to mention re-invigorating their Progressive incremental destruction of the Constitution.

But Trump will be gone. So all will be well. As well as the slow disintegration of the American Republic with its outdated reverence for quaint notions of liberty and individual rights will allow. An older generation of "liberals" warned us of this brave new world that is coming. The current Progressives want the opportunity to make their version of it happen.

Pete F.

10-19-2020, 04:05 PM

Good thing it’s just:
The Insane Pumpkin's Super Spreader Farewell Tour.

Starring Agolf Twitler!

Cause COVID is nothing, tough guys like Covita get through it like nothing, of course with treatments not available to others.

But the media, who the rightwing has claimed for years are all against them, except Fox and even they are suspect are making an epidemic out of something that’s no worse than the flu.....

220K dead
New cases up 30% in the last 14 days
Great job, Covita
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

detbuch

10-19-2020, 04:18 PM

Pete F.

10-19-2020, 05:47 PM

Most Americans think there should be a federally coordinated response, because just like interstate commerce the virus is not required to pay attention to state laws
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Got Stripers

10-19-2020, 06:13 PM

You do realize that covid is being handled by the states, as it has been for several months, and is the constitutional way. Trump is not in charge of it. Nor should he be.

Right he has put an MRI doctor in charge of the Covid team, which probably explains your herd immunity posts and now his tweet stating masks don’t work was thankfully taken down by Twitter. His statements on Dr. Fauci clearly tell you where his head is at, basically up his own arse.

detbuch

10-19-2020, 08:35 PM

Right he has put an MRI doctor in charge of the Covid team, which probably explains your herd immunity posts and now his tweet stating masks don’t work was thankfully taken down by Twitter. His statements on Dr. Fauci clearly tell you where his head is at, basically up his own arse.

I don't have a hard and sure opinion on any of the "science" behind covid. I have seen and heard conflicting evidence. Also, their is a lot more to consider in fighting the pandemic than just focusing on killing and containing the virus. There is the total effect not just of the virus itself but the consequence of things likes the lockdown. There is solid evidence that the lockdown also causes different kinds of death, physical and mental health breakdowns, economic disaster, and long time impact of all those things.

Atlas is an advisor among others who have their various expertise. Mr. Atlas is a data wonk. His input should be a balancing of our response to best mitigate all the negatives. You won't watch it, and you claim that you won't read any of this, but for those who might want a wider more objective view of Atlas and his input, this video should help to temper or reject the biased, frankly political smear of him:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=biC4nHPYtbA&feature=emb_logo

Pete F.

10-19-2020, 09:12 PM

And as a sure indicator of his expertise, he echoes Covita’s rhetoric
Gotta be good
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

detbuch

10-19-2020, 10:19 PM

And as a sure indicator of his expertise, he echoes Covita’s rhetoric
Gotta be good
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Either you didn't watch the video, or your a bit dense, or you will dismiss, mock, suppress and destroy anything that weakens your narrative rather than debating it or even discussing it.

Pete F.

10-20-2020, 06:54 AM

detbuch

10-20-2020, 10:27 AM

We live in a country where a 79-year-old scientist and doctor who has dedicated 36 years of his life to understanding and stopping infectious disease, now needs armed federal security because his life is threatened for telling the truth about a pandemic. Vote Tweety out!

There's a lot of folks on both "sides" that require armed security because of what they've said or what their position is. This is an idiotic reason to vote for Biden or Trump.

Pete F.

10-20-2020, 11:28 AM

detbuch

10-20-2020, 12:21 PM

The Stable Genius has chosen to go to war with the idea of testing, with Dr. Anthony Fauci and with “experts” in general at precisely the moment when the fall wave they’ve been warning about seems to be showing up — which is also the moment when the two-thirds of Americans who describe themselves as “very” or “somewhat” concerned about the virus will be going to the polls.
But you think everyone should ignore that and vote for him
Blah, blah, blah

If you're responding to me, which I might assume since this follows my post and ends sarcastically with my sort of signature blah, blah, blah, you've picked the wrong one to respond to. But I do understand that you don't really pay attention or give any credence to what I say. But I'll say it again. IT'S NOT ABOUT TRUMP FOR ME. I don't care about Trump or Biden except insofar as they will be the executive of the party I want to win and the one I want to lose. IT COULD BE ANY PAIR OF REPUB OR DEM CANDIDATES AND I WOULD STILL VOTE THE SAME WAY. IT IS ABOUT THE PARTY AGENDAS!!!!!!

The Progressive agenda is an absolute no no for me. If Jesus was running on the Progressive ticket vs any Republican, I would vote for the Republican.

I don't give a rat's azz about some disagreement Trump has with Fauci. Or any of the other chicken chit anti-Trump factoids you want to pile on to the forum.

And I already voted.

Pete F.

10-20-2020, 12:50 PM

So you’d vote for him if he shot someone in the middle of Fifth Avenue, if the death toll was a million or he was owned by our adversaries.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Got Stripers

10-20-2020, 12:51 PM

Either you didn't watch the video, or your a bit dense, or you will dismiss, mock, suppress and destroy anything that weakens your narrative rather than debating it or even discussing it.

What is to discuss, I wouldn’t watch it because he lacks the credentials or experience to suggest he knows how to handle this. Sorry I will go with the 70 old who has spent his entire life becoming an expert on this very pandemic. His thoughtful science based commentary and advise is exactly why Trump mocks and shames him, it’s really embarrassing to watch our president go after the one guy we should all be listening to.

detbuch

10-20-2020, 02:34 PM

What is to discuss, I wouldn’t watch it because he lacks the credentials or experience to suggest he knows how to handle this. Sorry I will go with the 70 old who has spent his entire life becoming an expert on this very pandemic. His thoughtful science based commentary and advise is exactly why Trump mocks and shames him, it’s really embarrassing to watch our president go after the one guy we should all be listening to.

He is one of the advisers. There is no point in having a group of advisers who all have the same credentials and say the same thing. He has credentials in other areas that need attention paid to. The effect of prolonged lockdowns also includes related deaths and long time health concerns as well as the destruction of the economy and the worse the destruction the longer the recovery so the greater stress and deaths and mental and physical health dangers and loss of livelihoods. Video discusses a lot of this stuff, most of which the media pays little attention to and some that only "experts" would even know about.

All factors considered there could actually be more related deaths and destruction from overdone lockdowns than the number of deaths supposedly lowered by focusing strictly on containing the virus as much as possible.

But why learn about necessary considerations when you have an old expert with credentials who has changed his position on things like masks and contagiousness, among others.

Pete F.

10-20-2020, 02:57 PM

Leaked reports show the White House has known for more than a month that COVID-19 is surging as Trump has downplayed the crisis.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

detbuch

10-20-2020, 02:57 PM

So you’d vote for him if he shot someone in the middle of Fifth Avenue, if the death toll was a million or he was owned by our adversaries.

Depends on why he shot someone. If it was a crime, he wouldn't be eligible. Unlike you, I don't think He is responsible for the coronavirus deaths. If he was convicted of being owned by our adversaries, he would not be the candidate.

Question for you since your interested in hypotheticals, if the emails are legit, would you vote for Biden?

Got Stripers

10-20-2020, 03:15 PM

He is one of the advisers. There is no point in having a group of advisers who all have the same credentials and say the same thing. He has credentials in other areas that need attention paid to. The effect of prolonged lockdowns also includes related deaths and long time health concerns as well as the destruction of the economy and the worse the destruction the longer the recovery so the greater stress and deaths and mental and physical health dangers and loss of livelihoods. Video discusses a lot of this stuff, most of which the media pays little attention to and some that only "experts" would even know about.

All factors considered there could actually be more related deaths and destruction from overdone lockdowns than the number of deaths supposedly lowered by focusing strictly on containing the virus as much as possible.

But why learn about necessary considerations when you have an old expert with credentials who has changed his position on things like masks and contagiousness, among others.

He always gets the best advisors like the my pillow guy.

detbuch

10-20-2020, 03:48 PM

He always gets the best advisors like the my pillow guy.

I wouldn't compare Scott Atlas to Mike Lindell. Wouldn't compare Lindell to Birx and Fauci.

scottw

10-20-2020, 04:18 PM

He always gets the best advisors like the my pillow guy.

I didn't know Lindell was advising trump...I know he shifted a huge part of his production to make masks during an national emergency which was pretty impressive..I think that was when you were complaining that you couldn't get on a golf course and how unfair that was:bl:

detbuch

10-20-2020, 08:06 PM

Most Americans think there should be a federally coordinated response, because just like interstate commerce the virus is not required to pay attention to state laws

I had passed over this because it seemed silly. Of course, there was and is a federal response. But it is not supposed to override the states' responsibilities. At this point, most of the responsibility for handling covid rests with the states. You keep wanting the federal government to usurp the states' authority. I doubt if you think states are even necessary. Like the Constitution, they just get in the way of the central government being in total "coordinated" control.

You even seem to apply that notion to the Interstate Commerce Clause. Progressives would agree with you. They're the ones who transformed that clause from the limited federal power that is specifically expressed in the constitutional text into one which gives the Federal government nearly unlimited power. The Progressive "interpretation" of that clause and the Welfare Clause basically makes the rest of the Constitution an unnecessary waste of words. The "loose" and "elastic" Progressive interpretation of those clauses Just about gives the federal government total control of the country.

Contrary to what you say, interstate commerce does have to pay attention to state laws. The only thing the Commerce Clause was supposed to do was create a regularity in commerce between the states. Under the Articles of Confederation, the states economically warred with each other--imposed tarifs and made it more difficult and cumbersome with regulations on commerce from other states that competed with that in their own state. The ICC clause was made simply to stop interstate commerce wars. Otherwise, interstate commerce still must obey the same state laws that apply to all commerce in the states they visit.

Pete F.

10-20-2020, 10:40 PM

Trump's prepared texts warn that Biden is a radical who will make various extreme and destructive changes to people's lives.

Ad-libbing Trump warns that Biden is so boring that if Biden wins, "nobody's gonna be interested in politics anymore."

Must be Biden will just put everyone to sleep and then become a midnight radical and you’ll wake up in.........
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

scottw

10-21-2020, 02:38 AM

Must be Biden will just put everyone to sleep and then become a midnight radical and you’ll wake up in.........
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

biden only works an hour or two a week

Pete F.

10-21-2020, 06:49 AM

scottw

10-21-2020, 06:57 AM

Biden has the support of more than 200 retired admirals and generals

Russian or Chinese?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

The Dad Fisherman

10-21-2020, 07:41 AM

Russian or Chinese?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

https://i0.wp.com/metro.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/20018.gif
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Pete F.

10-21-2020, 08:02 AM

Biden has the support of more than 200 retired admirals and generals, including at least 22 four-stars. The latest to support him is Adm. Bill McRaven, former SOCOM commander.

Trump does not have the endorsement of a single four-star flag officer.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Russian or Chinese?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

The person with ties to Russia and China is sitting in the White House

Nearly 300 more former national security officials have signed onto a letter endorsing Democratic candidate Joe Biden for president.

The 291 new signatures announced Tuesday join 489 national security leaders who previously endorsed former Vice President Biden as having “the character, principles, wisdom and leadership necessary to address a world on fire.”

The new signatories include some officials who served under President Trump, such as retired Army Maj. Gen. Craig Whelden, who served as executive director of Marine Corps Forces Pacific until 2019 after retiring from active duty in 2009, and Anita Friedt, a career State Department official who started during the Reagan administration, worked on arms control during the Obama administration and stayed under Trump until 2019.

Also new on the letter is retired Lt. Col. Alfred Rascon, who was awarded the Medal of Honor in 2000 for heroic actions during the Vietnam War.

“Our nation is in crisis and, in times of crisis, those who have served this nation feel duty-bound to serve it once again,” Rascon said in a statement. “In just 10 months of COVID-19, we have lost more than three times as many Americans as died in two decades of U.S. involvement in Vietnam, with numbers still rising and no plan in place to combat the spread.

“This comes against a backdrop of a president who blames Gold Star families for his contracting the virus and, in the words of his own former secretary of Defense, does not even pretend to try to unify us as a country,” Rascon added. “He sees service members as props, not people. Joe Biden has the wisdom and decency needed to heal a fractured nation, so we enthusiastically support him.”

Trump has suggested he may have caught the coronavirus from Gold Star families. He hosted the families at the White House the day after an event for which several of those who attended later tested positive for the virus. None of the Gold Star families are known to have tested positive.

Former Defense Secretary James Mattis, who has not endorsed a candidate, broke his silence about Trump over the summer to criticize him as “the first president in my lifetime who does not try to unite the American people—does not even pretend to try.”

The new signatures on the endorsement letter also include former Pennsylvania Gov. Tom Ridge (R), who served as the first Homeland Security secretary under George W. Bush and previously announced he was voting for Biden.

The new endorsements also add 81 retired general and flag officers, bringing the total number to 284 retired officers on the letter. The first batch of signatures on the letter made headlines for including former vice chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Gen. Paul Selva and former Coast Guard Commandant Adm. Paul Zukunft, both of whom served under Trump.

“The initial release of the letter was a clarion call to so many patriotic Americans who believed they must do their part to elect Joe Biden,” Michael Smith, executive director of National Security Leaders for Biden, the group that organized the letter, said in a statement. “It is no secret that our nation is in turmoil. We believe Joe Biden and Kamala Harris will help truly unite the United States and navigate this nation through this troubled time.”

https://www.nationalsecurityleaders4biden.com/

Jim in CT

10-21-2020, 08:26 AM

Scott spin me a positive view of how life in America is better due to this administrations handling of Covid and please don’t fall back to Jims lame partial travel ban saved so many lives, I’m pretty sure that ship has sailed.

"don’t fall back to Jims lame partial travel ban saved so many lives,"

If you can find a post where I said anything like that, I'll drive to any location you pick, and put $100 into your hand.

What I keep saying, is that about the only real policy he implemented, was travel restrictions. And that the entire left (elected officials, media, everyone) said that was an overreaction.

The feds got the hospital ship to NYC, they got respirators to hot spots, they converted the Javits center to a hospital (not necessary as it turned out).

I've asked the gang of liberals here, at least 5 times, what are you saying Trump should have done, based on what we knew then? Not one of you came up with a syllable. Zip. Zilch.

Sure, his language and style are atrocious, but that didn't get anyone sick. At one point, the governors of both NY and CA (neither one of which is a Republican) said Trump was doing a great job helping them.

One more time...please list some steps Trump should have taken back in December/January, based on what we knew then. And keep in mind, all the democrats were saying then, that the virus was so benign that even a partial travel ban was an overreaction.

In terms of policy, what more was he supposed to do?

Jim in CT

10-21-2020, 08:28 AM

Russian or Chinese?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

That was good.

Pete F.

10-21-2020, 08:30 AM

We know where your allegiance lies

Jim in CT

10-21-2020, 08:37 AM

We know where your allegiance lies

You've been humiliated in this thread pretty good, both by others and by yourself. Isn't it about time you call my mom a hooker?

Pete F.

10-21-2020, 09:05 AM

You've been humiliated in this thread pretty good, both by others and by yourself. Isn't it about time you call my mom a hooker?

Oh, I've been humiliated?

Everyone else is trying to guess as to whether you’re 1) a Russian bot, 2) a Russian troll, or just one of the morons swayed by Russian propaganda (either directly or via State TV - i.e. Fox News)

You better send your hero some money because one revealing fact of this moment with Trump's campaign cash is the fact that he still hasn't cut his campaign a check, as he's suggested he might do if he needed it. He clearly needs it, but no check.
I'm sure it will be as sound an investment as Trump University

Jim in CT

10-21-2020, 09:11 AM

Oh, I've been humiliated?

Everyone else is trying to guess as to whether you’re 1) a Russian bot, 2) a Russian troll, or just one of the morons swayed by Russian propaganda (either directly or via State TV - i.e. Fox News)

You better send your hero some money because one revealing fact of this moment with Trump's campaign cash is the fact that he still hasn't cut his campaign a check, as he's suggested he might do if he needed it. He clearly needs it, but no check.
I'm sure it will be as sound an investment as Trump University

"Oh, I've been humiliated?"

Yes, as well as humiliated yourself, don't leave that out.

"Everyone else is trying to guess as to whether you’re 1) a Russian bot, 2) a Russian troll, or just one of the morons swayed by Russian propaganda"

See above bout humiliating yourself.

Yes, because I can praise or criticize both sides, that's precisely what everyone is wondering.

"I'm sure it will be as sound an investment as Trump University"

Fair to criticize him for that scam.

Pete, what do you think as of now, about Hunter's emails and Joes dealings described therein? All a Russian hoax (ne evidence of that)? Or do you concede it probably happened (the Biden campaign isn't denying it) but you don't think it's a big deal?

Pete F.

10-21-2020, 09:42 AM

As a swamp supporter you need to pay attention to the things the projector in Chief is doing and has done.
Once again he’s accusing others of his crimes.
The leader of the Crybaby Conservatism Movement

President Trump’s tax records reveal that he spent years pursuing business projects in China and even has a Chinese bank account

Elliott Broidy, a longtime GOP and Trump fundraiser, yesterday pleaded guilty to recent criminal charges that accused him of violating foreign lobbying laws by illegally lobbying the Trump administration to drop its investigation into the Malaysian 1MDB corruption scandal.

The parents of 545 migrant children, who were separated under a 2017 Trump administration pilot program, cannot be found, with over two-thirds of the 1,000-plus parents being deported to Central America without their children before a federal judge had chance to order the parents be found

The White House, particularly Meadows, is pressuring the Pentagon to lease its “mid-band spectrum” to 5G company Rivada Networks, a move that if approved would be “the biggest handoff of economic power to a single entity in history,” senior officials from multiple departments and agencies have warned. The Trump administration is pressuring the Pentagon to fast track Rivada’s “Request for Proposal,” skipping a competitive bidding process; the pressure has been firmly applied since September, and Meadows has reportedly been assisted in his pressure campaign by an unnamed top financial management official in the U.S. Army.

300,000 dead
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Jim in CT

10-21-2020, 09:50 AM

wdmso

10-21-2020, 10:36 AM

"Once again he’s accusing others of his crimes."

Aren't you guys all guilty of the same exact hypocrisy? You're criticizing Trump for profiting from his influence, but you put your fingers in your ears at any mention that Biden did the same exact thing.

Here we go again with .lies and deflections. Truth facts and evidence, are not required .. for a Trump Loyalist like your self ... see the big picture picture has always been problematic for the Trump cult

scottw

10-21-2020, 10:59 AM

... see the big picture picture has always been problematic for the Trump cult

see jim....wayne is smarted than you because he sees "the big picture" :scream:

Jim in CT

10-21-2020, 11:14 AM

Here we go again with .lies and deflections. Truth facts and evidence, are not required .. for a Trump Loyalist like your self ... see the big picture picture has always been problematic for the Trump cult

Are you willing to consider the possibility that Joe used his influence to enrich his son?

Who is deflecting? I am the one whos asking that everyone be held to the same standard...

spence

10-21-2020, 12:03 PM

Are you willing to consider the possibility that Joe used his influence to enrich his son?
Based on what Rudy says????????

:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Jim in CT

10-21-2020, 12:08 PM

Based on what Rudy says????????

:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

based on the fact that the biden campaign has admitted that they aren’t denying it. i posted a video
.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Pete F.

10-21-2020, 12:41 PM

If Borat was able to compromise Rudy, imagine what a trained intelligence officer could do.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

wdmso

10-21-2020, 01:31 PM

based on the fact that the biden campaign has admitted that they aren’t denying it. i posted a video
.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

So .. not denying it... is now seen an admission of Guilt

Not sure were you got your understanding of the Law

PS Carter Paige was was under surveillance not charged with anything aka part of an investigation nor was he accused of a crime

Republican Sen. Marco Rubio said they showed the FBI had justified its reasons to surveil Page. "I don't think they did anything wrong," Rubio said, defending investigators. "There was a lot of reasons unrelated to the dossier why they wanted to look at Carter Page."

spence

10-21-2020, 01:37 PM

based on the fact that the biden campaign has admitted that they aren’t denying it. i posted a video
.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
If someone is running a smear campaign against you the last thing I'd do is take a hard position one way or the other.

Jim in CT

10-21-2020, 03:33 PM

If someone is running a smear campaign against you the last thing I'd do is take a hard position one way or the other.

Says who? You don't proclaim your innocence when someone is lying about you?

DO you keep a straight face when typing this crap?

spence

10-21-2020, 04:03 PM

Says who? You don't proclaim your innocence when someone is lying about you?
They already did proclaim innocence. But don't give specifics, that could be used against you if you're dealing with really depraved people, as they are.

Jim in CT

10-21-2020, 04:42 PM

They already did proclaim innocence. But don't give specifics, that could be used against you if you're dealing with really depraved people, as they are.

i posted a video of a campaign spokesman saying ‘no one is saying the emails are inauthentic.’
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

spence

10-21-2020, 04:46 PM

i posted a video of a campaign spokesman saying ‘no one is saying the emails are inauthentic.’
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
Again
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Got Stripers

10-21-2020, 05:53 PM

Is Hunter running for President what did I miss?

Pete F.

10-21-2020, 06:46 PM

If you’ve lost your job, what do you want to hear about more: Economic policy or Hunter Biden’s laptop?

If you’re worried about getting sick, what do you care about more: A COVID plan or Hunter's laptop?

Covita’s fate will be decided by what he focuses on in tomorrow’s debate.

But the Stable Genius is going with............
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

RIROCKHOUND

10-21-2020, 06:51 PM

Based on what Rudy says????????

:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Rudy knows stuff. Today I learned the proper way to tuck in your shirt....

Sad watching Rudy’s slide the last 5 years or so. Booze is a hell of a drug for some folks...
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

scottw

10-21-2020, 09:02 PM

the leftists are awfully cranky and defensive...you'd think biden was being accused of running rape trains or something :uhuh:

Jim in CT

10-22-2020, 08:07 AM

Is Hunter running for President what did I miss?

How many threads are you going to make this post in?

The anti Trump group here, has expressed a lot of concern the last 4 years, that the Trump family has profited from his position. Yet none of you care the Biden obviously did the same thing.

Either it's OK when they both did it, or it's wrong when they both did it, but it can't be OK for Biden and wrong for Trump. Is that going too fast for you?

Jim in CT

10-22-2020, 08:09 AM

If you’ve lost your job, what do you want to hear about more: Economic policy or Hunter Biden’s laptop?

.........
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

So you didn't make any personal anti-Trump attacks, when unemployment was really bad. Because to you, the real issue is getting people back to work, everything else is a distraction to be avoided,

That's what you're saying? Seriously?

Jim in CT

10-22-2020, 08:11 AM

Rudy knows stuff. Today I learned the proper way to tuck in your shirt....

Sad watching Rudy’s slide the last 5 years or so. Booze is a hell of a drug for some folks...
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

In all seriousness, it is sad watching his decline. But none of you can admit Biden's decline?

Anyway, we can forget bout Rudy's role. Just look at the reaction from Bidens team. Have they denied it's Hunters laptop? Have they denied the authenticity of the emails? I posted a video of a Biden campaign spokeswoman, explicitly saying that no one in the Biden camp is saying the emails are inauthentic.

scottw

10-22-2020, 08:24 AM

Is Hunter running for President what did I miss?

no but the crime boss that enabled and directed him is :)

Pete F.

10-22-2020, 09:26 AM

I'm not sure how Biden is going to recover from constantly being accused of being a good dad
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

wdmso

10-22-2020, 09:39 AM

In all seriousness, it is sad watching his decline. But none of you can admit Biden's decline?

Anyway, we can forget bout Rudy's role. Just look at the reaction from Bidens team. Have they denied it's Hunters laptop? Have they denied the authenticity of the emails? I posted a video of a Biden campaign spokeswoman, explicitly saying that no one in the Biden camp is saying the emails are inauthentic.

again with the deflections

The young actress then invites Mr Giuliani, 76, to join her for a drink. After his microphone is taken off, he lies down on the bed and appears to be putting his hands inside his trousers.

what man lays on someones Bed in a hotel room thats thats not theirs with his hands in his pants

"This is an effort to blunt my relentless exposure of the criminality and depravity of Joe Biden and his entire family."

no its clearly showing the depravity of Mr Giuliani whos standard of conduct seems not to apply to himself .. a true republican trait

Pete F.

10-22-2020, 10:00 AM

Yes, Hunter Biden tried to do business with Chinese investors. You know who also did?

Donald Trump and his family business
nytimes.com/2020/10/20/us/…

Jared Kushner and his family business
wsj.com/articles/kushn…

npr.org/sections/thetw…

Why do the Trumplicans and Fox only care about Hunter?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

scottw

10-22-2020, 10:22 AM

Yes, Hunter Biden tried to do business with Chinese investors.

Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

so you are admitting the revelations are legit?

spence

10-22-2020, 10:51 AM

so you are admitting the revelations are legit?
There are no revelations, it's been debunked a long time ago, Hunter got nothing from the Chinese.

The Dad Fisherman

10-22-2020, 10:53 AM

I'm not sure how Biden is going to recover from constantly being accused of being a good dad
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Yeah, he raised a regular Eagle Scout there :rolleyes:
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

RIROCKHOUND

10-22-2020, 10:53 AM

again with the deflections

The young actress then invites Mr Giuliani, 76, to join her for a drink. After his microphone is taken off, he lies down on the bed and appears to be putting his hands inside his trousers.

what man lays on someones Bed in a hotel room thats thats not theirs with his hands in his pants

"This is an effort to blunt my relentless exposure of the criminality and depravity of Joe Biden and his entire family."

no its clearly showing the depravity of Mr Giuliani whos standard of conduct seems not to apply to himself .. a true republican trait

That is not how you tuck your pants in?:faga:

scottw

10-22-2020, 11:05 AM

Yeah, he raised a regular Eagle Scout there :rolleyes:
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

and he only charges half of the take :jester:

Jim in CT

10-22-2020, 11:12 AM

I'm not sure how Biden is going to recover from constantly being accused of being a good dad
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

I'm sorry, who is making that accusation? Read Hunter's bio. That's a deeply broken person, and that usually (not always) means horrible parents.

scottw

10-22-2020, 11:16 AM

I hope trump refers to biden as "the big guy" repeatedly tonight :laugha:

Pete F.

10-22-2020, 12:48 PM

scottw

10-22-2020, 01:25 PM

There are no revelations, it's been debunked a long time ago, Hunter got nothing from the Chinese.

there's a lot of new stuff...every day

Got Stripers

10-22-2020, 01:36 PM

there's a lot of new stuff...every day

No sh*t the faux news generators are working very hard as they release they are running out of time to help Trump, especially when he has a critical if not fatal case of foot in mouth disease. Just wait for tonight, not that I plan on watching as I’ve cast my vote, I’m guessing Trump will no doubt implode if they kill his mic. He might actually turn from Halloween pumpkin orange to an early Valentine red.

spence

10-22-2020, 01:46 PM

I'm sorry, who is making that accusation? Read Hunter's bio. That's a deeply broken person, and that usually (not always) means horrible parents.
This is a profoundly ignorant thing to say.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Jim in CT

10-22-2020, 01:49 PM

Hard to believe none of you have an addict among your relatives, friends or their children.
Even among Eagle Scouts
https://apnews.com/article/ce51cf7c958643629bce76764f71058d
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

I bet none of us have a family member who had an affair with their dead brothers widow, and then fathered a child with a stripper and refused to pay child support despite being worth millions.

We are all SHOCKED Pete, that you acted as if addiction is Hunter's only challenge, and you left out all those other Norman Rockwell-esque behaviors.

What are you afraid would happen, if you were honest for once?

wdmso

10-22-2020, 03:17 PM

I bet none of us have a family member who had an affair with their dead brothers widow, and then fathered a child with a stripper and refused to pay child support despite being worth millions.

We are all SHOCKED Pete, that you acted as if addiction is Hunter's only challenge, and you left out all those other Norman Rockwell-esque behaviors.

What are you afraid would happen, if you were honest for once?

2 years after his brothers death. Or why is this is an issue

Seeing you voted for Trump A POTUS whos paid porn stars to keep quiet Trump has been married three times

Nineteen women have come forward to accuse Trump of sexual harassment.

Trump's first marriage imploded on the covers of all of New York's tabloids after he brazenly took his mistress, Marla Maples, on a family vacation in Aspen along with his wife, Ivana, and attempted to hide her away until she approached Ivana and said, "I'm Marla and I love your husband. Do you?"

BUT BUT hunter go get your moral compass checked. You lost it around 2016

Got Stripers

10-22-2020, 03:34 PM

Is Hunter running for President what did I miss?

wdmso

10-22-2020, 03:50 PM

Here ya go The man Republicans want Americans to believe his integrity and honesty is beyond reproach.. with regards to the Bidens is on a young women's bed in her room with his hands on his junk...

Spin that

detbuch

10-24-2020, 12:42 PM

wdmso

10-25-2020, 07:40 AM

Schoolchildren unlikely to fuel coronavirus surges scientists say:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/health-news/schoolchildren-seem-unlikely-to-fuel-coronavirus-surges-scientists-say/ar-BB1ajezE?ocid=msnews

From. Your link

The evidence is far from conclusive, and much of the research has been tarnished by flaws in data collection and analysis.

detbuch

10-25-2020, 08:34 AM

From. Your link

The evidence is far from conclusive, and much of the research has been tarnished by flaws in data collection and analysis.

Very little about this virus is conclusive. And data collection flaws exist in all studies and collection efforts. The point is, there is evidence for various conclusions. And an insistence that there is some universally accepted THE science is flawed.

wdmso

10-25-2020, 10:30 AM

Very little about this virus is conclusive. And data collection flaws exist in all studies and collection efforts. The point is, there is evidence for various conclusions. And an insistence that there is some universally accepted THE science is flawed.

Only conservatives think the science is flawed, time and time again you and other present outliers as proof,, case in point

The bogus Steve Bannon-backed study claiming China created the coronavirus,
The study and the Chinese virologist behind it are quite popular in conservative media.

I think we can agree it isn't just going to dissapear..

What I don't understand with conservatism is they would rather do nothing because they see anything done by government is overreach

Or seeing the majority of Americans support an action their against it .. just because and just because isn't science-based

wdmso

10-25-2020, 04:01 PM

Trump lying again. baselessly accused healthcare workers of inflating COVID-19 statistics for financial gain by over-classifying coronavirus deaths because “doctors get more money and hospitals get more money”—even though there is no evidence

I think this was same excuse last time numbers went up

detbuch

10-25-2020, 07:12 PM

Only conservatives think the science is flawed, time and time again you and other present outliers as proof

THE science? There is science that you believe is flawed. As you showed a couple of posts ago. What I have posted were not proofs. Nor meant to be. They were examples of differing opinions, by scientists, on various aspects of the whole coronavirus understanding and process.

From Wiki: "All models are wrong" is a common aphorism in statistics; it is often expanded as "All models are wrong, but some are useful". It is usually considered to be applicable to not only statistical models, but to scientific models generally. The aphorism recognizes that statistical/scientific models always fall short of the complexities of reality but can still be of use."

From https://scienceblogs.com/startswithabang/2013/05/31/most-scientific-theories-are-wrong: "the next time you hear about some theory, it's totally reasonable to ask, 'What overwhelming evidence do we have that this is correct?' "

Or: "scientific method the way of approaching a problem by drawing up a hypothesis based on a series of observations, and then testing the hypothesis by means of experiments designed in such a way as to support or invalidate the hypothesis. On the basis of the experimental evidence a theory is proposed to account for the initial observations. If subsequently the theory is found to be wanting in some respect, new hypotheses are sought and tested experimentally, so the process is a successive refinement which in science never leads to an absolute truth, but to a more reliable knowledge.

That there are disputes, among scientists, about aspects of the various theories regarding this virus and how to handle it and what harm may come from handling it in one way or another or about the transmissibility at different age levels, etc., shows that there is no THE science. There are different scientific opinions.

case in point The bogus Steve Bannon-backed study claiming China created the coronavirus,
The study and the Chinese virologist behind it are quite popular in conservative media.

I did see a presentation by her. Has it been proven to be wrong?

I think we can agree it isn't just going to dissapear..

Most things eventually disappear.

What I don't understand with conservatism is they would rather do nothing because they see anything done by government is overreach

This is a very extreme view of "conservatism.
I am not familiar with the notion that "conservatism," whatever you mean by that, prefers to do nothing. As for what "conservatives" prefer re this virus, as with most things, ultimately, is that the proper constitutional levels do the work, and that the federal government not be responsible for everything, and certainly the burden should not be shouldered by the President. That is not only unconstitutional, it is a recipe for disaster no matter who is President.

Or seeing the majority of Americans support an action their against it .. just because and just because isn't science-based

Your last sentence is totally incomprehensible to me.

Pete F.

10-25-2020, 09:20 PM

Watching the 60 Minutes interview and struck by Trump's constant posturing how how UNFAIR everything--the media, the coronavirus--is to him.

How many people would agree with the statement, "Life has been very unfair to Donald Trump?"
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

detbuch

10-25-2020, 10:41 PM

Watching the 60 Minutes interview and struck by Trump's constant posturing how how UNFAIR everything--the media, the coronavirus--is to him.

The media and the coronavirus are not everything.
Although, the media probably thinks it is.

How many people would agree with the statement, "Life has been very unfair to Donald Trump?"

I would agree that this is a goofy post that, if it belongs at all, it would belong in some other thread. Of course, since you can't start threads, you turn any thread into an opportunity to inject any irrelevant anti-Trumpist remark that you're just itching to spit out.

PaulS

10-26-2020, 07:14 AM

I would agree that this is a goofy post that, if it belongs at all, it would belong in some other thread. Of course, since you can't start threads, you turn any thread into an opportunity to inject any irrelevant anti-Trumpist remark that you're just itching to spit out.

You ok? You seem angrier and angrier and now seem to feel the need to insult people constantly. Everything going ok in your life?

PaulS

10-26-2020, 07:37 AM

Jim in CT

10-26-2020, 08:02 AM

This is a profoundly ignorant thing to say.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Expected response from a thoughtless liberal.

Pete F.

10-26-2020, 10:01 AM

I’d just like to have a President who isn’t scared of Lesley Stahl.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

detbuch

10-26-2020, 10:20 AM

You ok? You seem angrier and angrier and now seem to feel the need to insult people constantly. Everything going ok in your life?

Thanks for your sincere and heartfelt concern. Everything is OK.

detbuch

10-26-2020, 10:21 AM

I’d just like to have a President who isn’t scared of Lesley Stahl.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Trump is not afraid of her.

Pete F.

10-26-2020, 10:52 AM

detbuch

10-26-2020, 11:02 AM

He’s afraid of a lot.
Reminder: we still have never seen Trump’s school records, medical records, tax returns, minutes from meetings with Putin or WH visitor logs. He won’t say who he owes 400m to and he won’t submit his DNA from a case that is just one of his decades of sex crimes.

Maybe there's a computer with memos about all that stuff.

Jim in CT

10-26-2020, 11:02 AM

He’s afraid of a lot.
Reminder: we still have never seen Trump’s school records, medical records, tax returns, minutes from meetings with Putin or WH visitor logs. He won’t say who he owes 400m to and he won’t submit his DNA from a case that is just one of his decades of sex crimes.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Is the school records a big deal? Because it sure didn't matter in 2008 and 2012 when we had a guy who refused to share his school records.

PaulS

10-26-2020, 11:43 AM

Thanks for your sincere and heartfelt concern. Everything is OK.

:btu:

PaulS

10-26-2020, 11:46 AM

Is the school records a big deal? Because it sure didn't matter in 2008 and 2012 when we had a guy who refused to share his school records.

But you always wanted to see Obama's even though Obama never bragged about them and claimed he was #1 in his class.

Pete F.

10-26-2020, 12:25 PM

Classic Whatabout.....
That’s what happens to cult members
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Jim in CT

10-26-2020, 12:29 PM

But you always wanted to see Obama's even though Obama never bragged about them and claimed he was #1 in his class.

I didn't want to see Obama's, I just liked poinitng out the hypocrisy of liberals who made fun of Bush's transcripts and McCain's transcripts, but have nothing to say about Obama. And you all told me that it was no big deal that Obama didn't release his.

Again, how about one set of rules/standards, and we apply them equally to all presidents, regardless of party. Crazy, I know.

Got Stripers

10-26-2020, 12:56 PM

I didn't want to see Obama's, I just liked poinitng out the hypocrisy of liberals who made fun of Bush's transcripts and McCain's transcripts, but have nothing to say about Obama. And you all told me that it was no big deal that Obama didn't release his.

Again, how about one set of rules/standards, and we apply them equally to all presidents, regardless of party. Crazy, I know.

You mean like the hypocrisy of the GOP stopping a Supreme Court appointment saying that close to the election it just shouldn’t be done but it’s ok for them now. Listen to the Republicans running in 2016, they knew who Trump was and all those same hypocrites now kiss his authoritarian arse. Just afraid of loosing the power, loosing your moral standard, the rule of law or plain common decency is ok. People in class houses shouldn’t be throwing stones.

Pete F.

10-26-2020, 01:11 PM

detbuch

10-26-2020, 01:12 PM

PaulS

10-26-2020, 01:21 PM

Jim in CT

10-26-2020, 02:40 PM

So you didn't want to see Obama's but constantly would ask to see it anyways

Ok, I get it.

I didn't want to see it. I wanted to know why liberal hypocrites who made fun of Bush and McCain for their transcripts, didn't care that Obama refused to share his.

Going too fast for you?

Jim in CT

10-26-2020, 02:44 PM

You mean like the hypocrisy of the GOP stopping a Supreme Court appointment saying that close to the election it just shouldn’t be done but it’s ok for them now. Listen to the Republicans running in 2016, they knew who Trump was and all those same hypocrites now kiss his authoritarian arse. Just afraid of loosing the power, loosing your moral standard, the rule of law or plain common decency is ok. People in class houses shouldn’t be throwing stones.

I said 100 times, that because of the wording the GOP used with Garland, that makes them hypoicrites.

Now, can you admit that Biden is also a hypocrite on the issue? Biden came up with the 'Biden rule' where he said that Supreme Court nominations should not be made in an election year, and if a president made a nomination, the senate should block that nomination. That's exactly, precisely what the Senate Republicans did with Garland, they abided by the Biden rule.

Then in 2016, Biden flip flopped, saying an election year nomination was OK. Now hes saying its not OK. So you please tell me GS, what is Bidens position on this issue?

Answer - his position is the same as the Republican position, they will say whatever helps them in that moment. No principles.

I admitted the Senate Republicans were hypocrites. Please explain to all of us, how Biden isn't just as big a hypocrite.

Jim in CT

10-26-2020, 02:54 PM

Listen to the Republicans running in 2016, they knew who Trump was and all those same hypocrites now kiss his authoritarian arse. .

Most people didn't want Trump to be the nominee, which is why he didn't get anywhere near 50% of the votes in the primaries. Problem is, there were 100 people running who weren't Trump.

Now? No one had any idea he'd be this effective. Heck he didn't even campaign on progress in the middle east, and he's done more in a term than Biden has done in 47 years.

Tax cuts, insanely low unemployment, brought ISIS to their knees, stock market records, no questionable wars, raises for vets and improvements to their benefits, school choice, criminal justice reform, lowest minority unemployment ever, improved funding for black colleges, economic opportunity zones, and we became energy independent. And agree with him or not, he's the most pro-life president by far, of my lifetime.

Yeah, why would any Republican get behind a guy who did that in one term? What a do-nothing slacker! You sure showed me with that post, GS.

PaulS

10-26-2020, 03:01 PM

I didn't want to see it. I wanted to know why liberal hypocrites who made fun of Bush and McCain for their transcripts, didn't care that Obama refused to share his.

Going too fast for you?

No I understand perfectly. You didn't want to see it but asked for anyways bc it showed the Dems were hypocrites for asking for Bush's.

scottw

10-26-2020, 03:02 PM

scottw

10-26-2020, 03:03 PM

asking for Bush's.

biden thinks he's running against bush :rotflmao:

scottw

10-26-2020, 03:05 PM

One standard, huh?

Reminder: we still have never seen Trump’s medical records, tax returns, minutes from meetings with Putin or WH visitor logs. He won’t say who he owes 400m to and he won’t submit his DNA from a case that is just one of his decades of sex crimes.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

I'm sure you have all of the relevant articles and information taped to the walls of your bunker...you should send pics to adam shiff :cool:

Jim in CT

10-26-2020, 03:07 PM

No I understand perfectly. You didn't want to see it but asked for anyways bc it showed the Dems were hypocrites for asking for Bush's.

Asking for it, and asking why you didn't want to see it, aren't the same thing.

Again, sorry if that's going too fast for you.

PaulS

10-26-2020, 04:03 PM

Asking for it, and asking why you didn't want to see it, aren't the same thing.

Again, sorry if that's going too fast for you.

yes, I guess you are going to fast for me when I question why you constantly would ask why Obama didn't produce his transcripts but did it to show the Dems. are hypocrites for asking for McCain's transcripts. The Dems where hypocrites but somehow you are not.

What does Trump have to hide? He said he was #1 in his class at Wharton.

Got Stripers

10-26-2020, 05:33 PM

Most people didn't want Trump to be the nominee, which is why he didn't get anywhere near 50% of the votes in the primaries. Problem is, there were 100 people running who weren't Trump.

Now? No one had any idea he'd be this effective. Heck he didn't even campaign on progress in the middle east, and he's done more in a term than Biden has done in 47 years.

Tax cuts, insanely low unemployment, brought ISIS to their knees, stock market records, no questionable wars, raises for vets and improvements to their benefits, school choice, criminal justice reform, lowest minority unemployment ever, improved funding for black colleges, economic opportunity zones, and we became energy independent. And agree with him or not, he's the most pro-life president by far, of my lifetime.

Yeah, why would any Republican get behind a guy who did that in one term? What a do-nothing slacker! You sure showed me with that post, GS.

Your Trump successes are from a certain point of view, If he is so good, so successful at positive changes (I’m not in agreement on much), your guy should be winning this election by huge margins. Oh wait he was such a failure at handling this pandemic and continues the irresponsible messaging responsible for putting more Americans at risk, I guess it would seem the American voting public might not see this administration as a success. The irony is that if he wasn’t so fu*cking stupid at handling this pandemic he might have actually easily won a second term. Please don’t fall back on your staple travel ban argument, it just makes you look stupid and desperate.

Jim in CT

10-26-2020, 05:47 PM

Your Trump successes are from a certain point of view, If he is so good, so successful at positive changes (I’m not in agreement on much), your guy should be winning this election by huge margins. Oh wait he was such a failure at handling this pandemic and continues the irresponsible messaging responsible for putting more Americans at risk, I guess it would seem the American voting public might not see this administration as a success. The irony is that if he wasn’t so fu*cking stupid at handling this pandemic he might have actually easily won a second term. Please don’t fall back on your staple travel ban argument, it just makes you look stupid and desperate.

"Your Trump successes are from a certain point of view"

That's how it usually works, yes. But since a record 56% of pople say they are better off now than 4 years ago (that's a record who said yes to that), it seems that I'm not exactly the only one who feels that way. We can evaluate him as we see fit and vote accordingly, as it should be. I was responding to your inane comment that Republicans shouldn't be supporting him because of his manners. If you agree with the republican platform, you have to give the guy at least a B+. Adding to the debt is a big, big negative.

Is it only a certain point of view that would say he routed ISIS?

"your guy should be winning this election by huge margins. "

If the election was a year ago, he probably would have.

"he was such a failure at handling this pandemic"

That's the non-stop spin. I don't happen to buy into it being all his fault, but I'm guessing a lot of people believe it is his fault, and he gets creamed as a result. That's my guess.

"The irony is that if he wasn’t so fu*cking stupid at handling this pandemic he might have actually easily won a second term. Please don’t fall back on your staple travel ban argument, it just makes you look stupid and desperate"

I'm not stupid or desperate. I'm smart and more than prepared for him to lose big. You guys are the ones that can't concede ANYTHING that goes against your agenda, which obviously makes you the desperate ones.

What should he have done, back in December, based on what we knew then. What were the democrats calling for?

You're misrepresenting my stance on the travel ban. I'm not saying it helped or it didn't. WHat I'm saying, because its tue, is that when he implemented the ban, prominent democrats said it was an overreaction. Biden called it "hysterical" and "xenophobic". This means that Biden would have done LESS, not more.

Since that's obviously true (Biden would have done less), how would anyone conclude the death toll would be lower if Biden was POTUS? I'm asking a sincere question. Will you answer it as I asked it?

Also, if he could tone down the tweets and baby rhetoric, he'd also be looking at a likely second term. But he can't, he just can't refrain from being such a jerk.

But his results, from a republican view, were really good.

Got Stripers

10-26-2020, 05:54 PM

"Your Trump successes are from a certain point of view"

That's how it usually works, yes. But since a record 56% of pople say they are better off now than 4 years ago (that's a record who said yes to that), it seems that I'm not exactly the only one who feels that way. We can evaluate him as we see fit and vote accordingly, as it should be. I was responding to your inane comment that Republicans shouldn't be supporting him because of his manners. If you agree with the republican platform, you have to give the guy at least a B+. Adding to the debt is a big, big negative.

Is it only a certain point of view that would say he routed ISIS?

"your guy should be winning this election by huge margins. "

If the election was a year ago, he probably would have.

"he was such a failure at handling this pandemic"

That's the non-stop spin. I don't happen to buy into it being all his fault, but I'm guessing a lot of people believe it is his fault, and he gets creamed as a result. That's my guess.

"The irony is that if he wasn’t so fu*cking stupid at handling this pandemic he might have actually easily won a second term. Please don’t fall back on your staple travel ban argument, it just makes you look stupid and desperate"

I'm not stupid or desperate. I'm smart and more than prepared for him to lose big. You guys are the ones that can't concede ANYTHING that goes against your agenda, which obviously makes you the desperate ones.

What should he have done, back in December, based on what we knew then. What were the democrats calling for?

You're misrepresenting my stance on the travel ban. I'm not saying it helped or it didn't. WHat I'm saying, because its tue, is that when he implemented the ban, prominent democrats said it was an overreaction. Biden called it "hysterical" and "xenophobic". This means that Biden would have done LESS, not more.

Since that's obviously true (Biden would have done less), how would anyone conclude the death toll would be lower if Biden was POTUS? I'm asking a sincere question. Will you answer it as I asked it?

Also, if he could tone down the tweets and baby rhetoric, he'd also be looking at a likely second term. But he can't, he just can't refrain from being such a jerk.

But his results, from a republican view, were really good.

I knew you couldn’t resist going back to the travel ban, so predictable it’s just to fun to wind you up. Hey go poll those same people today and all the small business owners who have closed their doors, I know they won’t feel they are now better off.

Pete F.

10-26-2020, 07:18 PM

Jim in CT

10-26-2020, 07:40 PM

I knew you couldn’t resist going back to the travel ban, so predictable it’s just to fun to wind you up. Hey go poll those same people today and all the small business owners who have closed their doors, I know they won’t feel they are now better off.

i’m going back to democrats insisting that the feds didn’t need to do anything. i’m going back to biden saying it was a hysterical overreaction.

that happened. i’m sorry if you have no response whatsoever to that fact. but that’s the fact, the democrats said it was no big deal in january february.

GS: trump blew it with the virus.

Jim: what should he have done differently?

GS: you’re a jerk!

that’s all you got. how can you say he blew it, when you can’t tell
me what he should have done differently? this is like a sitcom.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Jim in CT

10-26-2020, 07:41 PM

They did poll them and they aren’t better off but that poll doesn’t fit the Fox narrative so he’ll never see it
Meanwhile many of the folks that helped Trump ‘win’ the last election can no longer vote for him in this election because they are now convicted felons.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
sorry, hey said they are better off. again, we’re all very sorry that this fact gives you menstrual cramps.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Got Stripers

10-26-2020, 07:50 PM

i’m going back to democrats insisting that the feds didn’t need to do anything. i’m going back to biden saying it was a hysterical overreaction.

that happened. i’m sorry if you have no response whatsoever to that fact. but that’s the fact, the democrats said it was no big deal in january february.

GS: trump blew it with the virus.

Jim: what should he have done differently?

GS: you’re a jerk!

that’s all you got. how can you say he blew it, when you can’t tell
me what he should have done differently? this is like a sitcom.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Trump continues to do exactly what the medical experts say you shouldn’t, he can’t even keep the White House safe, Moscow Mitch being the old fart that he is has avoided it like the plague. The messaging from the top from the beginning has been irresponsible Jim, but you are beyond drunk on the cool aid you are blind to the damage they continue to do. Asking him tough questions in the 60 minute interview shows how thin his skin is, he took his ball and went home. He is a miserable excuse for a leader, hoping it’s no longer our issue in a few weeks.

Jim in CT

10-26-2020, 08:06 PM

Trump continues to do exactly what the medical experts say you shouldn’t, he can’t even keep the White House safe, Moscow Mitch being the old fart that he is has avoided it like the plague. The messaging from the top from the beginning has been irresponsible Jim, but you are beyond drunk on the cool aid you are blind to the damage they continue to do. Asking him tough questions in the 60 minute interview shows how thin his skin is, he took his ball and went home. He is a miserable excuse for a leader, hoping it’s no longer our issue in a few weeks.

also, trump refused to
condemn white supremacists at charlottesville, right?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Jim in CT

10-26-2020, 08:07 PM

Trump continues to do exactly what the medical experts say you shouldn’t, he can’t even keep the White House safe, Moscow Mitch being the old fart that he is has avoided it like the plague. The messaging from the top from the beginning has been irresponsible Jim, but you are beyond drunk on the cool aid you are blind to the damage they continue to do. Asking him tough questions in the 60 minute interview shows how thin his skin is, he took his ball and went home. He is a miserable excuse for a leader, hoping it’s no longer our issue in a few weeks.

GS: he blew handling the virus.

Jim: what should he have done different?

GS: beats me! but cnn and msnbc said he blew it.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Got Stripers

10-26-2020, 08:22 PM

GS: he blew handling the virus.

Jim: what should he have done different?

GS: beats me! but cnn and msnbc said he blew it.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

GS: watch me make Jim spin like a top, pull the travel ban string and he goes and goes

Jim: what did Trump do wrong

GS: plenty of days left I will need time like trying to remember the 20,000 plus lies

Pete F.

10-26-2020, 09:25 PM

BREAKING NEWS: Trump White House Declares COVID-19 Uncontrollable and Says It Will Not Be Controlled, Conceding Defeat in the Midst of the Worst U.S. Public Health Crisis in a Century; Announcement Comes Even As Many Foreign Leaders With Fewer Resources Have Controlled the Virus
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

detbuch

10-26-2020, 11:55 PM

BREAKING NEWS: Pete F has gone bananas!

scottw

10-27-2020, 03:24 AM

You mean like the hypocrisy of the GOP stopping a Supreme Court appointment saying that close to the election it just shouldn’t be done but it’s ok for them now. People in class houses shouldn’t be throwing stones.

I'm sure Schumer and the democrats would have done it differently :rotflmao::rotflmao::rotflmao::rotflmao:

she will be a fabulous Supreme Court Justice

spence

10-27-2020, 05:41 AM

biden thinks he's running against bush :rotflmao:
:huh:
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

scottw

10-27-2020, 06:39 AM

:huh:
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gj0DRjlfvhw

Got Stripers

10-27-2020, 06:40 AM

Most people didn't want Trump to be the nominee, which is why he didn't get anywhere near 50% of the votes in the primaries. Problem is, there were 100 people running who weren't Trump.

Now? No one had any idea he'd be this effective. Heck he didn't even campaign on progress in the middle east, and he's done more in a term than Biden has done in 47 years.

Tax cuts, insanely low unemployment, brought ISIS to their knees, stock market records, no questionable wars, raises for vets and improvements to their benefits, school choice, criminal justice reform, lowest minority unemployment ever, improved funding for black colleges, economic opportunity zones, and we became energy independent. And agree with him or not, he's the most pro-life president by far, of my lifetime.

Yeah, why would any Republican get behind a guy who did that in one term? What a do-nothing slacker! You sure showed me with that post, GS.

To follow up on this three year view you seem to have, you can’t judge an administration on one, two or three years; it’s a four year term remember. So tax cuts that may have helped some have been spent to survive. We now have the highest unemployment and worse economy since the Great Depression. Vets expressing their disgust of numerous comments by Trump not sure he is viewed as positively by veterans as you think. Schools for the most part are closed and many if opened are closing again due to covid outbreaks. Report cards are for the entire term Jim, so grades aren’t passing, in fact they are failing grades but keep waving your Trump 2020 flag.

Jim in CT

10-27-2020, 06:41 AM

GS: watch me make Jim spin like a top, pull the travel ban string and he goes and goes

Jim: what did Trump do wrong

GS: plenty of days left I will need time like trying to remember the 20,000 plus lies

i don’t give trump good grades on handling the virus, nor do i give him a bad grade, i feel very unknowledgeable. but if i was saying he blew it, i’d be able to articulate why. you couldn’t. so you’ll go to the places pete gets his news and steal a few arguments. but what matters, is that you claimed he blew it, but had zero idea why. and you refuse to criticize biden, who said trump did too much.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

scottw

10-27-2020, 06:41 AM

To follow up on this three year view you seem to have, you can’t judge an administration on one, two or three years; it’s a four year term remember.

which is why the ACB nomination and confirmation was completely appropriate:kewl:

Jim in CT

10-27-2020, 06:42 AM

To follow up on this three year view you seem to have, you can’t judge an administration on one, two or three years; it’s a four year term remember. So tax cuts that may have helped some have been spent to survive. We now have the highest unemployment and worse economy since the Great Depression. Vets expressing their disgust of numerous comments by Trump not sure he is viewed as positively by veterans as you think. Schools for the most part are closed and many if opened are closing again due to covid outbreaks. Report cards are for the entire term Jim, so grades aren’t passing, in fact they are failing grades but keep waving your Trump 2020 flag.

we “now” have the highest unemployment since the great depression? now? wtf are you talking about?

unemployment was in the mid teens when states chose to shut down. are you saying trump should have somehow forced all businesses to stay open?

you’re alllll over the place. but rest assured, that as of right now, unemployment is nowhere near what it was during the depression, and trending better for now.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Got Stripers

10-27-2020, 06:42 AM

i don’t give trump good grades on handling the virus, nor do i give him a bad grade, i feel very unknowledgeable. but if i was saying he blew it, i’d be able to articulate why. you couldn’t. so you’ll go to the places pete gets his news and steal a few arguments. but what matters, is that you claimed he blew it, but had zero idea why. and you refuse to criticize biden, who said trump did too much.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Jim so many have articulated why for months, are you living in a bubble?

scottw

10-27-2020, 06:44 AM

We now have the highest unemployment and worse economy since the Great Depression.

.

huh???

scottw

10-27-2020, 06:46 AM

unemployment was in the mid teens when states chose to shut down.

Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

and "experts" projected it would be in the twenties

scottw

10-27-2020, 06:49 AM

we “now” have the highest unemployment since the great depression? now? wtf are you talking about?

Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

I think he meant "since the dark ages" :laugha:

Jim in CT

10-27-2020, 07:14 AM

I think he meant "since the dark ages" :laugha:

Seriously, what's unemployment right now, about 7.5%? THAT'S the highest since the Great Depression?

Jim in CT

10-27-2020, 07:23 AM

Jim so many have articulated why for months, are you living in a bubble?

Not from what I see. People say "he should have done more", but back then, those same people were saying he did too much. It's irrefutable that Biden said he did too much. So whjy would you presume we'd be better if Biden was POTUS?

That's fairly simple, obviously pertinent question, and you cannot respond. You're clobbered by a question a 6 year-old would know to ask.

Back in December, Biden said it was hysterical and xenophobic to do what Trump did. But you are saying Biden would have handled it better. Why?

Cue the chirping crickets...

GS, we shut down the economy, stopped interacting with each other, we bent the curve, no hospitals came close to being overwhelmed. What more should we have done?

Hindsight being 20/20, it would have been nice if we had more safety equipment and tests ready to go. But no one was calling for that before this started.

In the early days, the governors of both CA and NY both said Trump was big help to their states. Do you know who those governors are? They aren't Trump fans.

It's a global pandemic, not an American problem. And for the democrats, it was a political gift from God, just like the 2008 recession.

Please, tell us more about how unemployment right now, is the highest since the Great Depression.

spence

10-27-2020, 07:24 AM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gj0DRjlfvhw
You do realize the person who asked the question was George Lopez right? :bshake:
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

scottw

10-27-2020, 07:34 AM

You do realize the person who asked the question was George Lopez right? :bshake:
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

right...so he meant 4 more years of George Lopez

he will be fun if he stumbles across the finish line

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ef1WbLvZmEE

wdmso

10-27-2020, 07:50 AM

spence

10-27-2020, 08:02 AM

right...so he meant 4 more years of George Lopez
You’re about as gullible as Jim.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Jim in CT

10-27-2020, 08:03 AM

Jim all trump had to do is make it look like he was doing something and Americans could have said and would have said that was enough for them ..

But thats not what happen Trump denied it was an issue Fought against Masks tooth and nail .. {like you he made a suggestion here or there as evidence of his objectivity AKA to cover a base } the whole white house had a super spreader event,, Then he doubled down after he got out of Walter reed .. the head of the pandemic response Pence refuses to follow his own protocols. and his own chief of staff waved the white flag

I am sorry cutting off travel from China doesn't carry water anymore , operations warp speed Americans have seen right thru it .. Because torpedoed his own plan by offering un realistic release exceptions .. and even now with the Dakotas Wisconsin and areas in Texas exploding in Covid cases
he says we are rounding the bend or the the numbers are up because nurses and doctors and hospitals are inflating Covid numbers to GET PAID and hurt him really. I guess he has no idea whats going on in Europe ..

And for all the anti maskers (not suggesting you are one ) in general next time they have a surgery. please tell your surgeon and his team that you feel masks dont work.. so dont wear any and see what they tell you>>>

"Jim all trump had to do is make it look like he was doing something and Americans could have said and would have said that was enough for them "

So you would have been happy if he just made it look like he did something.

So the way he helped NY and CA, getting hospital ships there, converting convention centers to hospitals, getting them more than enough respirators, that wasn't even the appearance of doing anything?

Working with public and private agencies to ramp up production of masks and testing capabilities, that wasn't even the phony appearance of doing anything?

Here is an article with videos, where Gov Cuomo of NY said Trump "has delivered for NY. He has."

https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/politics/he-has-delivered-for-new-york-cuomo-praises-trumps-coronavirus-response/2371465/

So Governor Cuomo of NY, who isn't a huge fan of Trump, said explicitly that Trump did a lot to help the state of NY.

So, maybe you want to reconsider your asinine statement.

Here is an article where Gov Newsom of CA, also praised Trump's coronavirus actions. A quote from Newsom...

"We have the USNS Mercy in California because of [Trump's] direct intervention and support, 2,000 of these federal medical stations because of his direct support," Newsom said on CNN. "So I can only speak for myself, but I have to be complementary. Otherwise, I would be simply lying to you, misleading you"

In other words, the CA governor says you are lying, when you say he didn't do anything constructive or helpful.

https://thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/492324-california-governor-praises-trumps-efforts-to-help-state-amid

As always, his tweets, comments, and style were often disgusting. His actions? Well, don't take my word for it Wayne, just read the comments from two of the most liberal governors in the country.

Trump helped them. Again, I can only imagine how much you hate that fact. But that's the thing about facts, they don't care whether you like them or not.

Put down the blind partisanship for 10 seconds, take off the tin foil hat, and think.

You have been pulverized.

Jim in CT

10-27-2020, 08:06 AM

You’re about as gullible as Jim.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Gullible. Which one of us can never, under any circumstances, say anything critical of their party? And which one of us goes wherever the truth takes them? Hmmm?

You could not point to a single, solitary meaningful issue, in which you disagree with democrats. Not one. What does that tell you about your ability to think critically, Spence?

scottw

10-27-2020, 08:09 AM

. and even now with the Dakotas Wisconsin and areas in Texas exploding in Covid cases

>>

Illinios, California, league leaders in new cases, Rhode Island spiking beyond spring levels and I don't know if you've checked the BBC lately but europe is similarly spiking = clearly trumps fault...damn those conservative states with republican governors and non-mask wearing trumplicans!!!! :shocked:

ps...I was out and about the other day made a couple of stops at a convenience store and a couple other places and I could be wrong but the people I saw NOT wearing masks in public places were probably not those you hear described as typical or likely trump voters(I was wearing mine:hee:)

scottw

10-27-2020, 08:10 AM

You’re about as gullible as Jim.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

biden probably just missed his nap that morning or something

Jim in CT

10-27-2020, 08:11 AM

And for all the anti maskers (not suggesting you are one ) in general next time they have a surgery. please tell your surgeon and his team that you feel masks dont work.. so dont wear any and see what they tell you>>>

It's funny, like everything else, I struggle to make up my mind definitively on masks. Because there are very smart people who say masks work (which is where I lean), and there are very smart people who say they don't work. I feel like I cannot know who is right, I'm not a virologist, or a health care researcher. It's amazing to me that even on something as simple as masks, there is zero consensus. There are peer reviewed studies showing masks do nothing. It's hard for me to believe that they don't help at least a little, and I wear one every time I go out. But there's no consensus...

What works in surgery isn't the same as what works with this virus. It's possible the droplets are too small to be captured with a cloth mask. Again, I'm not taking that position, but there are smart people who do.

I pretty much gave up trying to figure this out, how can you when there is zero consensus among the experts? I don't know enough to feel comfortable saying one side is wrong. SO I go with my gut and wear a mask.

scottw

10-27-2020, 08:12 AM

[QUOTE=Jim in CT;1203822]

Put down the blind partisanship for 10 seconds, take off the tin foil hat, and think.

You have been pulverized.

/QUOTE]

he thinks you are a lying dog faced pony soldier or something:rotflmao:

Pete F.

10-27-2020, 08:50 AM

Covita's Great achievements

Candidate Trump decried the national debt in 2016 and promised to eliminate it. It's only gotten bigger.

The National debt, which doesn't matter to Trumplicans has increased 36% and was up significantly prior to the Trump plague.

Today, ISIS is anything but destroyed, and is again beginning to pose a threat. It has a significant presence in Afghanistan and Covita is ready to pull out.

The peace agreements Israel signed with Bahrain and the United Arab Emirates are a clear success—although the fact that previously hostile Arab states joined Israel due to their fear of Iran’s growing strength is a reminder that Covita's increasing sanctions against Iran had not produced the regime change the administration obviously hoped for.

When people talk about Covita's great foreign policy there is never any mention of Venezuela or North Korea. Nicolás Maduro is still head of Venezuela, increasing repression of its citizens, many of whom have fled or are attempting to do so, and opposition leader Juan Guaidó has failed in his bid to replace the regime and begin a policy of democratization.

Meanwhile, Covita's love affair with Kim Jong-un has not led to denuclearization—in fact, Kim’s regime just flaunted a giant new ICBM. The personal diplomacy Covita bragged about turned out to be the careful playing of the president by Kim. North Korea’s nuclear arsenal is now obviously larger than when Covita took office, and the danger of war still exists.

Start off with the claim that Covita exemplifies the doctrine of “hard work, faith, family and autonomy”—the very middle-class values that provide the framework for American society. It is hard not to chuckle at these words. We all know that Covita began with the proverbial silver spoon in his mouth, going into business with a few million dollars given to him by his father. Rather than engaging in actual hard work, Covita was the tabloids’ favorite New York playboy, making money by ripping off contractors, not paying workers for their labors, and setting up phony business schemes like the fabled Trump University, whose suing clients were paid off with undisclosed sums of money and prohibited from talking about it with nondisclosure agreements. His business acumen is questionable, as he has declared bankruptcy for his businesses six times.

The claim that Covita is “in favor of manufacturing jobs.” But many of the plants that Covita claimed to have saved have closed. And the coal mines he said would reopen have not—and coal mines in general have continued to disappear, leaving more miners jobless. And don't forget Foxconn, operative part is Con, talk about socialism and central planning............

As for Covita's faith, he has provided many examples of his actual unfamiliarity with the Bible, and his lifestyle shows, shall we say, an inclination to not follow middle-class family values. Someone who respects family does not sleep with a porn star while married or brag about grabbing women by their genitals.

Then look at Covita's mode of campaigning, in which he holds potential superspreader events one, two or three times a day, where his crowds wear no masks and do not practice social distancing?

How about the appointment of Dr. Scott Atlas—a neuroradiologist lacking significant expertise in infectious diseases—to the White House’s coronavirus task force, from which platform he has said that people shouldn’t wear masks (“Masks work? NO”) and that the United States should adopt a herd immunity approach to fighting the disease—a strategy that would cause hundreds of thousands of new American deaths?

Then to top it off you have Covita playing to his base and waging a campaign against the infectious-disease specialist trusted by the American people, Dr. Anthony Fauci, calling him a “disaster” and an “idiot”?

But you're all set because policies don’t matter; “owning the libs” does.

Jim in CT

10-27-2020, 08:58 AM

Start off with the claim that Covita exemplifies the doctrine of “hard work, faith, family and autonomy. .

Pete, please point to any meaningful number or Republicans anywhere, ever, who EVER said that Trump exemplifies faith and family? That's just made up gibberish. No one thinks he is a good family man.

wdmso

10-27-2020, 09:10 AM

"Jim all trump had to do is make it look like he was doing something and Americans could have said and would have said that was enough for them "

So you would have been happy if he just made it look like he did something.

So the way he helped NY and CA, getting hospital ships there, converting convention centers to hospitals, getting them more than enough respirators, that wasn't even the appearance of doing anything?

Working with public and private agencies to ramp up production of masks and testing capabilities, that wasn't even the phony appearance of doing anything?

Here is an article with videos, where Gov Cuomo of NY said Trump "has delivered for NY. He has."

https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/politics/he-has-delivered-for-new-york-cuomo-praises-trumps-coronavirus-response/2371465/

So Governor Cuomo of NY, who isn't a huge fan of Trump, said explicitly that Trump did a lot to help the state of NY.

So, maybe you want to reconsider your asinine statement.

Here is an article where Gov Newsom of CA, also praised Trump's coronavirus actions. A quote from Newsom...

"We have the USNS Mercy in California because of [Trump's] direct intervention and support, 2,000 of these federal medical stations because of his direct support," Newsom said on CNN. "So I can only speak for myself, but I have to be complementary. Otherwise, I would be simply lying to you, misleading you"

In other words, the CA governor says you are lying, when you say he didn't do anything constructive or helpful.

https://thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/492324-california-governor-praises-trumps-efforts-to-help-state-amid

As always, his tweets, comments, and style were often disgusting. His actions? Well, don't take my word for it Wayne, just read the comments from two of the most liberal governors in the country.

Trump helped them. Again, I can only imagine how much you hate that fact. But that's the thing about facts, they don't care whether you like them or not.

Put down the blind partisanship for 10 seconds, take off the tin foil hat, and think.

You have been pulverized.

Jim moving ship is not doing something trumps lovers love praising Trump for doing what he is supposed to do. Thats the real TDS

Prasing Trump is how you deal with this Transactional POTUs if you thought they were sincere your smoking crack.

TRUMP couldnt even try faking it. He couldn’t be bothered

The only thing you pulverized was the trump pill you snorted before writing this
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wdmso

10-27-2020, 09:13 AM

Illinios, California, league leaders in new cases, Rhode Island spiking beyond spring levels and I don't know if you've checked the BBC lately but europe is similarly spiking = clearly trumps fault...damn those conservative states with republican governors and non-mask wearing trumplicans!!!! :shocked:

ps...I was out and about the other day made a couple of stops at a convenience store and a couple other places and I could be wrong but the people I saw NOT wearing masks in public places were probably not those you hear described as typical or likely trump voters(I was wearing mine:hee:)

Scott maybe you should tell your Potus covid is running out of control or even better his faithful.. your post whould be blasphemy ..on any conservative web site
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wdmso

10-27-2020, 09:20 AM

It's funny, like everything else, I struggle to make up my mind definitively on masks. Because there are very smart people who say masks work (which is where I lean), and there are very smart people who say they don't work. I feel like I cannot know who is right, I'm not a virologist, or a health care researcher. It's amazing to me that even on something as simple as masks, there is zero consensus. There are peer reviewed studies showing masks do nothing. It's hard for me to believe that they don't help at least a little, and I wear one every time I go out. But there's no consensus...

What works in surgery isn't the same as what works with this virus. It's possible the droplets are too small to be captured with a cloth mask. Again, I'm not taking that position, but there are smart people who do.

I pretty much gave up trying to figure this out, how can you when there is zero consensus among the experts? I don't know enough to feel comfortable saying one side is wrong. SO I go with my gut and wear a mask.

What works in surgery isn't the same as what works with this viru

there is zero consensus among the experts?

OMG. I bet you think we moved out of the Stone age because we ran out of Rocks.

Unbelievable response to telling a surgeon not wear masks
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Pete F.

10-27-2020, 09:38 AM

Obviously the earth could be flat, how would you know, some people think it is.
Why would you think otherwise since there is not a consensus.

Try it at a really basic level, masks are cheap and by far the simplest part of the solution. All countries with low levels of Covid have high levels of mask wearing.

That's not absolute proof, but it's about 99.9% sure that it does something.
There are countries that are doing a better job controlling the virus than the US and there are no countries that had better options going in.
That's why the rest of the world feels sorry for us.
It's the leader that didn't want to panic people, thought it would go away like a miracle, you'll have a vaccine tomorrow.....................

The Dad Fisherman

10-27-2020, 09:38 AM

Vets expressing their disgust of numerous comments by Trump not sure he is viewed as positively by veterans as you think.

Well, I work on a Navy base and I work with a bunch of veterans, as well as keep in touch with a bunch of my old shipmates.

From what I’m seeing, he isn’t as despised as much by veterans as you think.
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Jim in CT

10-27-2020, 09:39 AM

What works in surgery isn't the same as what works with this viru

there is zero consensus among the experts?

OMG. I bet you think we moved out of the Stone age because we ran out of Rocks.

Unbelievable response to telling a surgeon not wear masks
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I'm not telling surgeons not to wear masks.

What I meant was, regarding covid, there is no consensus in the medical community as to whether or not masks work. I have to believe they help. But for every study you'd like to post suggesting masks help with covid, I can post a study showing they don't work.

That's the reality - no consensus on masks. I'm not making that up to prove a political point, as I wear a mask in public 100% of the time. I'm just stating the truth - within the medical and scientific community, there is zero consensus on whether or not masks work.

Again, I wear a mask, so I tend to err on the side of caution and choose to wear one. But there are scientists who say they are useless in the fight against covid.