I mentioned the white buckets, but did not mean it in a derogatory way. I used to carry my gear in a bucket when I started. My point was more to the fact that there were 12 guys shoulder to shoulder spread over 35 yards at a spot that there usually isn't that many. What I should have referred to was the unbeleivable number of head lamps and flashlights on a very moonlit night, especially the ones in the water constantly. There just seems to be more new faces that are in the beginning stage of surffishing. It would probably be great for someone to write an article about etiquette and ethics in surfishing. Maybe then the crowding and head lamps and inconsideration for others would start to wane. Nothing like standing on a rock and having two yahoos jump in front of you........
The idea of spot burning has always fired me up, but since the OTW article, I have been more and more conscious of it. I have lost patience with people who insist on blabbing, wether it be in print or on a website. I just read a thread on another site over in ct and the blabbing about soco was unbeleivable...... so do not be surprised when we all see lotsa new faces at the spots Mckenna omitted. And when we do, we have someone to thank.
I also fish in less than favorable conditions and am seeing more guys at these spots than I ever have. I cannot imagine what it'll be like when its nice.

mike, i do (get pissed off at tackle shops). i go into some of the shops i frequent and ask, beg, and at times almost demand that they dont put certain areas in their reports. mind you, these reports are a week old, but you will see an increase in the people fishing there after a report.

as far as the shops, i look at the reports they may give an angler coming in as their "reward" for shopping or buying some merchandise from them. maybe how much the person buys or if they think they will come back will dictate where they may send those anglers. but, not all owners think like that. they are making a living from their business. i do not see to many authors making a living from writing articles or posting reports on the internet.

turn that around now, what does the magazine that prints these detailed articles on spots really earn? well, more subscriptions and if they are lucky more magazines that month from the tackle shop they are in as the newstand price is more than the subscription. so, what about the author of the article, what are they gaining? money for an article? what, a couple hundred for an article, maybe? some may have a side business, which benefits from getting their name or business exposed. for others, it may be new friends to fish with? or teaching someone how to fish a spot they may have "graduated" from? or, just notoriety for saying they can say they wrote an article and learned that spot? it could be one, many, or none of the above.

like many things, you cannot group spots into one general "rule" for when to say it's ok and when it is not. some are very, very limited in parking or space to fish. others, there's private property to cross that many may not know about. others are well known and the public is welcomed. as an angler, it is your job to learn more about the spot you may be fishing.

if magazines are now asking for detailed spots articles, i think this is unfortunate turn for this media. as much as some may think it's ok, it may do more damage than good, as has been written hear and on the previous thread. to me, this also holds true the those websites that welcome this same information. my interpretation is that johnr is against that type of activity and i repsect him for it and putting up with those of those that may get hot when these issues arise. here on sb, i think the treand has been to TEACH you how to fish, not drive you there, put the lure on for you, and cast for you. thank you, johnr.

Slipknot- my friend didnt read it word for word to me, he simply said what spots were mentioned and that it gave away alot... I figured it wasnt a big deal..

anyway, i am done wasting my energy over this. I'm bummed that there will be more people in those spots, but hey, thats life :(

Spot X
 

This goes to everyone but with emphasis to Uffah and Eben.

NO POLITICAL CRAP ON THE MAIN BOARD!!!! Do it in Scuppers or Grumpy - NOT ON THE MAIN BOARD.


Thanks,

John

That was me
 

And I made it quite clear I was in that camp for awhile... Are we THAT politically correct that where bieng called a white bucket brigade members is offensive? Sad....

I was totally kidding about the bucket! Geeeez, everyone needs to lighten up!

Speaking of eel storage . . . one day this summer I was fishing Rhody's Western most spot and I came I came across a cool eel bucket with a half-dozen fresh snakes that someone must have dropped (I was the only one out there at the time so I took the liberty of grabbing it). It was a plastic Folgers coffee can with a screw on lid, and it had a belt woven into two slits in the side of the can - it must have been made to wear around the waste. A pretty slick and inexpensive set up. To make a long story short, I didn't catch any fish that night until I started using those eels I found. If the person who lost them reads this - Thanks! :kewl: I prefer a small soft-sided cooler myself. Wal-Fart sells a cheap one that has a Velcro trap door in the top that makes it easy to grab the slimy buggers without having to zip anything up after. A big blue ice pack keeps them well-behaved until I can get a hook in 'em.

I still haven't been able to find a place in town that sells OTW magazine. I was curious to know if any spots in Westerly were mentioned - not that I need another spot to fish, I was just wanted to see if there was any increase in traffic due to the article. I was surprised at the number of people at one spot last Saturday at dusk. It could have been a coincidence, but . . .

Ummm, it's spelled IDOL...

Don't feel bad, I'm sure your buddy Bush would have made the same mistake :jester:

-spence

[QUOTE=SeaWolf]mike, i do (get pissed off at tackle shops). i go into some of the shops i frequent and ask, beg, and at times almost demand that they dont put certain areas in their reports. mind you, these reports are a week old, but you will see an increase in the people fishing there after a report.

as far as the shops, i look at the reports they may give an angler coming in as their "reward" for shopping or buying some merchandise from them. maybe how much the person buys or if they think they will come back will dictate where they may send those anglers. but, not all owners think like that. they are making a living from their business. i do not see to many authors making a living from writing articles or posting reports on the internet.

turn that around now, what does the magazine that prints these detailed articles on spots really earn? well, more subscriptions and if they are lucky more magazines that month from the tackle shop they are in as the newstand price is more than the subscription. so, what about the author of the article, what are they gaining? money for an article? what, a couple hundred for an article, maybe? some may have a side business, which benefits from getting their name or business exposed. for others, it may be new friends to fish with? or teaching someone how to fish a spot they may have "graduated" from? or, just notoriety for saying they can say they wrote an article and learned that spot? it could be one, many, or none of the above.
[QUOTE]

My experience is that tackle shops have as many reasons for what they do as there are tackle shops. I do both the RI and offshore reports for Nor'east, so I talk to dozens of tackle shops every weekend. It's remarkable that very few of them single out individuals in their reports. There are only three in RI that regularly name people. But the one thing they all value is the publicity it gets them. By handing out specific reports they hope to increase their business.
As far as what does the writer get? Again there are probably as many reasons as there are writers. I do it for several reasons, money being at the top of the list, but I'm sure not making a living at it. Lots of charter guys do it for the publicity. When I do feature articles, as opposed to the weekly reports, I do name areas, but I don't give anyone the exact locations to fish. One reason is that fish have fins and tails and they swim. One day they may be at one set of numbers and the next at another. If I write about a specific set of numbers, and someone goees there and doesn't find fish, it hurts my credibility. So I avoid specfics. OTOH, when I'm doing the reports and a shop tells me that the fishing is hot a Quonny, that's what I'll write, and I don't feel guilty about it.

after viewing such hatred for white buckets im officially painting mine black. i need to call my therapist now!

Keep it white SCL....who cares what people think! :rotf3:

not an idol, simply an alternative. :smokin:

If/when I get to go fish Lil Rhody, I would be PMing guys I know from here and elsewhere for specific gameplan. Same would go for any other roadtrips. (Got guidance from Capesams for my Memorial Day Cape trip.) That article isn't gonna get me in my car to get my 40 in Rhody, but it will affect the occassional (yuppy) angler who lives nearby. Hell, they gotta get the mag to read it.

I will email OTW as a subscriber, and ask that they state their intent and policy with regards to such articles, and to present an angler ettiquette piece in the future. But that article is done. Let's move on to fishing the fall to the fullest each of us can.

OTW, are you lurking by any chance? Care to comment? (Only time I've seen that was the guy from Penn when they shut down their US production, remember?)

And yes, if members are heading up this neck of the woods, I will show you where you're most likely to hook up. I am gonna share some with a serious striper fisherman. Just ask TDF, Clogston, Luds48, Scottie, to name a few.

:rotf3: :rotf2:

get a home dirtpile orange colored one . no racial undertones

:rotf3: :rotf3: :rotf3:

I KILL MYSELF SOMETIMES

Seawolf,

I am not sure if we have ever met, however I know some guys that know you. Hence, I am assuming that you have been around for a while. It it this knowledge that has me baffled at your statement.

Magazines have been publishing articles like this for years and years and years. Just for SH%TS & GIGGLES I went into my files. You see I disect magazines when they are read and file certain articles that appeal to me. I have four articles from OTW & The Fisherman that give between 75% and 100% of the information contained in Mckenna's article on the Narrow River. I am not saying that these type of articles are good at all. All I am saying is that there is nothing new about this one. I think what has people all up in arms is who wrote it and not what was written. If this was Flap or Frank D, or even Fisheye I think the responses would be quite different.

I wonder how Steve and #^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^& would feel if I listed some of their "private" spots.

The two of them have been talking about spots to people on the Cape for awhile now.

Basic Patrick just hit the nail on the head.

If you have to wonder more than a second, than I guess you are not that bright :rollem:

Hey, Good for you. At least you got a response.

I sent them the following email, and NO response:

Mr. Bourque,

I am sure you have a fairly good idea why I am sending this email.
Sometimes, too much info, can have adverse effects.
Mr. McKenna shared too much, and perhaps was not given good
advise from his editor, as to what to leave out.

Perhaps you disagree, if so, I am saddened by that. All locations
mentioned in the article have been mentioned before... yes.
However, there is a great deal of difference in saying that the fishing
is great at the West Wall, or Horseneck beach, without giving the
explicit instructions, complete with detailed maps, and where, and what,
and when to throw it!

My point isn't spots,exactly, it's undue pressure placed on them,
and the possible loss of access to all.

Especially if parking is an issue, and it is at some of these places.
Also, a small percentage of "spot chasers", are not true sportsmen,
they will leave trash, old bait, beer cans etc., and defecate, and urinate
on and around both public, and private property. This infuriates the
owners of the high priced shorefront real estate. They pay a premium
in RE tax, so, when they call to complain, and they will, the local board
of selectmen, the Chief of the local PD, will be all ears, and more than
happy to close access, or put strict and severe limits on access.

I've lived and fished on the Cape for over 35 years. I have seen way too much
access lost since the first time I tossed a rebel windcheater off the
jetty at Breakwater beach in Brewster, and reeled in my first striped bass.

I am aware that others long before this months issue of OTW, have torched
spots... the granddaddy of them all, was Daignault's Hot Spots, and even
though that book is 20 years old, it still stirs controversy.

I would appreciate it, if OTW set some kind of policy, limiting the detail
on locations. I think it would go a long way to limit pressure put on our
remaining favorite fishing spots.

I have always enjoyed OTW in the past, and I am sure I will in the future.
I will enjoy it even more, if I see no more detailed "spot" articles, as I did
this month.


Sincerely,
Karl Faivre

P.S.
If you have not read this yet, please do:
http://www.striped-bass.com/Stripert...ad.php?t=26111




It's not about Rhody "spots", or Cape "spots"... it's about Access...
torch them, explicitly, and they will go.. ROW issues, blocked paths, off the beach by 11, the noose will keep tightening, as more are led to each area.
OK, I agree, it will cool down after a while, people will go, and not catch right away, dismiss the article as BS and go away, some won't like a long hike, or slippery rocks, and not return,,, some... will catch, and maybe larger than they ever have, they will keep going back, and bring others, so, while the initial bump in traffic will have subsided, more will still go, increasing the pressure on that location.

I keep hearing, "well, I was told by others where to go when I started."
Yeah, I was too... I was told to go to hell, not in so many words, if you ever asked where did you catch, it was either an icy stare, or the pat answer... "In the water".... What happened to the hunt?, Or as some say, putting in your time... used to be if you went out, and looked, with just some plain old fashioned sense, you'd figure it out, and yes, sometimes, some kind old timer would point you,,, if he had seen you trying on your own...
It's all Instant Karma now, or the Mc'Fishermen, wants it spooned into him...

Rant off...
I'm done.

4 of the 5 spots McKenna describes are in Daignaults Striper Hot Spots Book, with MORE detail.
I brough this up when the posts first started.
For the Narrow, Daignault actually mentions a "better" place to park than McKenna. One that is more sensitive IMHO. Black and white for millions to read.
As others have said, I think folks are mad because Steve violated some secret Narr. surfcaster pact.
Newbies will go to the spots, get skunked and never return, no spots are guaranteed. I fished those spots, sometimes I caught, other times I didnt.

Hey, for a moderator to be flaming is not a good example. You still owe me a plug.Also; it is then not than if you are speaking English. Please forward my plug.

come get it :D
I am not an english major, I am a fisherman :uhoh:
I didn't quote you as a moderator, just pointing out the obvious.
nebe says it's poor form to point out my poor form :jester:

..

I fart in your general direction.You now smell of eldeberry.I now take offense to all that is offensive. Your fancy shmansy needle will be mine!

Watch for the editorial in November. I have a feeling this will all be addressed in that format, where each and every subscriber, consumer and casual reader at the dentist's office can evalute the magazines response. Then again, it goes back to the authors responsibility, IMHO,to think of circumstances that my likely develop if he does submit the piece for publication. The guys at the mag are all great guys and my friends. Are they die hard surfcasters, offshore fishermen or rabid, tongue dragging red-eyed Striper men. No. They love to fish, and they had an opportunity to open up a venue so that nutz like myself and others could share with the other nutz what when and how. Where exactly is verboten. Of course there has always been and there will always be the unwriiten code among the Striper Brethren against revealing the most secret details. Myself I have been threatened with bodily harm, threatening notes,damage to my vehicle and slander and lost friendships. I don't believe that I give away the farm as the article in question did. I have people comment on giving too much info in how and why even when I intentionally leave out the where. Like the late great Al Rienfelder once said when asked, after telling in detail the how and why, the where question, "even the CIA doesn't have that kind of information". I live that way and write that way. I might mention Truro or Wellfleet or be a little more specific by stating Balston or some such beach but if you are a really educated surfcaster you know Balston is one., a big place and two., bass usually crowd into the smallest holes at only certain points in the tide. I fished last night from 9 to midnight, I caaght quite a few fish on Needles, where? Don't ask I won't tell you.

I don't post on S-S.COM anymore because Frank disses the magazine because thery would not entertain anymore of his oft time re-hashed adventures and laurel sitting. He of all people is throwing jibes in threads like "Googan Writers" and NEBE's thread on the aforementioned article. He's retired, he can make money off of it and he does. Well that's okay but don't throw stones. Does anyone here remember when "Striper Hotspots" first printing came out that some spots were named incorrectly? Also a lot of these spots were never even fished by Daignault. Of all the people to comment he has a lot of nerve. Read twenty years on the Cape and you will be told everything you need to know about when, where and how to fish the backbeach. All while he bemoans the fact you cannot trust people to keep thier mouths shut. But it was over for him so why not tell all and make a little cake on the side from it. Trouble is it wasn't and still isn't over for a lot of guys. The New Yorkers he fished with still come to P-Town for the most part, at least those who are still alive. He actively bashes people who fish from boats yet his mentor and one of the most prolific writers in the Striper game, Frank Woolner, knew and told anyone that would listen that even though he thought surfcasting was the most enjoyable and rewarding way to catch stripers a really good bassman had to be proficient in all of the arts. Trolling, jigging, live bait, fly fishing in order to be considered really good in the Striper world. He told me that to my face when I was a teenager and it is the way I live my striper life. Too many double standards these days. Dammed if you do damned if you don't. Now, enough of this crap and let's get on with the important stuff. What was done is done and I am sure a lesson was learned. End of story. Next!

bp, i hear you. yes, i've been around. yes, we probably know many of the same people. i'd love to sit down and talk with you, or anyone for that matter, about these types of issues. shoot me a pm or email.

i am confused about what you mean about being baffled.

i finally received my otw magazine yesterday, but i actually was at a shop and read it late last week. now, i may fish some of those spots, i may not. that was never my issue of contention. my issue, and what i thought the theme of the otw thread, was about the idea or ethics about doing just that, putting spots (maybe detailed, and maybe lesser known) in magazines, on-line reports, on-line msgs boards and is it right and what good or bad is that now doing? are you really helping an angler out or not? are these articles taking the "hunt" out or surffishing?

as far as steve writing that particular article in otw this month, it appears he was asked for those types of articles (spots) previously by otw. i also know these are the same spots he talks about in his seminars, so it may not be anything new for those that have been to them. i have a problem with otw asking for those types of articles. i also have a problem w/ steve agreeing to do that. i may be in the majority or i may be in the minority on the sides of this issue. steve had the option of not accepting otw's position on these "how to/detailed article" and not giving his article. he chose to accept their concept. now, he is on the hook for it. my position may not be the right one, it may not be the wrong one, but it is mine and i put in my .02 and the subject from my experiences. i was trying not to b!---h about it, but put out ideas to think about.

yes frank, flap, others on this site or other sites, other authors, etc., have done similar articles recently and thru the years. i dont agree that the feedback may have not been the same if it was another author. it may have been worse, it may have been lighter. who knows. i remember frank taking a lot of heat when he wrote the striper spots book. some people and places declined to be mentioned just for some of these very reasons. maybe in years past the only way of venting on these issues was going right to the author (if you knew them), mailing the magazine, or going to a tackle shop. now, the internet has opened up all this. more and more forums open up each year. these issues will only continue in the future.

i amalso aware that there are people that may not post at all on these threads due to their business, relationship w/ that magazine, etc. i can respect that. maybe what they have read here may change their opinion. maybe it will not.

there is one thing that i have seen over the years about these types of threads, there are many opinions on it. some are 100% against, some are 100% for, some are middle of the road. where do you draw that line? will that line ever be drawn?

could you please elaborate on what #^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^& has to do with the article??? why should he be chastized for anothers actions??? What is your fasination with #^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&??? is it pennis envy? jealousy? or is it simply plain ignorant hatred?
and furthermore, what has #^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^& done to you?

I know one thing! We need more Cowbell!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :rotf3:

flap u spot burner

Call me you toothless bastage. I know where they are and you know the places. Easy fishing no crowds. You know the number. Can you say needlefish? Just like the ol'days when you lived down this away. :bshake:

I'm just the same as you guys, I put my pants on one leg at a time, but then I go make hit records...

This thread took on a major life of it's own..... as usual w/ this crowd :D

My final thought since I started this thread:
- I wasnt pissed people were there
- The people there didnt crowd those of us already there
- MORE people were there, probably because of the article, than would be there normally
- I dont hate steve, I dont respect this type of article, but who am I to judge
- I agree this wasnt the only spot burn out there; people brought up a bunch more, but this was VERY detailed, and yeah those of us that fish gansett regularly have a 'veil' of secrecy I suppose that is part of it...
that is all, carry on....

Agreed!!! 10-4 :hidin:

For more information, please see:

http:\\where-rirockhound-and-piemma-fish.com

:alien:

-spence

too funny spence.

the best part is the link works

well played!

Oh great Spence! Why dont you just draw little X's and say "cast here".
There goes another spot!

Where Spence fishes:
http://www.wherever-he-is-lucky-enou...oesnt-fish.com

will call dont care bout fish i find my own but if i get to buts your nuts then i phish with u.

Don't get mad, get even. Give him a taste of his own teachings. Burn a couple of his private honey holes. It can be done, it is not as hard as it sounds. Write your own article...something like...Striper hotspots SM actually fishes, by Suds Anguilla" And demand OTW publish it in fairness and blast it on the web as well.


Or

complain to OTW about printing that kind of low blow article and how it impacts serious anglers.