Only because we provide billions to them in funding do they not.

They're too busy minding their own business. You know, what we should have been doing all along...

The Vatican really doesn't care about other religions. They're only concerned with their own and their kiddie touchers.

I can agree with this....but on the flip side if some Muslim Whacko puts a bullet in his head after he does this...I'm really not going to shed any tears for this guy............and his family (well, maybe his kids).

I always tell my kids that they have choices...some good, some bad. With every choice you make comes an action, make good choices and the action usually is a good one. Make bad choices and its probably going to be a bad action....but its your choice.....make it and be willing to deal w/ what comes afterwards.

This guy is choosing to burn the Quran...have a ball. But if you get terrorized, beaten or Killed because of YOUR choice....don't come whining to me about it.

People get beaten and/or killed here in the USA every day for antagonizing the wrong person(s) for stupid reasons....

here's a match buddy......knock your self out.

[QUOTE=.

This guy is choosing to burn the Quran...have a ball. But if you get terrorized, beaten or Killed because of YOUR choice....don't come whining to me about it.

.[/QUOTE]

arent we sworn as a nation to protect him and uphold the constitution?
Some people choose to vote.
Some people choose to pray.
Some people choose to write inflamatory articles.
Some people choose to protest.
All protected.
this guy has a guaranteed right by the constiution and the president is sworn to uphold it.
this is tough stuff, but I think this is why he is doing it. Who do we as a country stand with, him for exercising his right or for foreign nations and/or extremists? I think the answer is a tough one, but I dont feel there is any room for debate.

Yep, we are......

Now if a guy waltz's into Harlem and starts screaming the "N" word.....and he gets his ass kicked. Does he have the same right to be protected under the constitution....sure he does.....did he get what he deserved for being a friggin moron.......sure he did.

When do we start screaming about all the tax dollars being spent on protecting people who are doing stupid things......ya know....all this protection does cost money.

I agree, in the koran case, Im looking at it in a different light since its international pressure and potential international threats. If american muslims beat the crap out of him, they'd be wrong but I would feel better about it.

read this -

Press review: Who will stop 'crazy' Quran-burning priest? - CNN.com

You have to laugh. Spence/Likwid and others here is the "problem" in black and white. Muslim press/nations equating the killings, suicide bombings, and other terrorist acts with a guy burning a book. There saying he is an extremist and just as bad as their extremists.

I would classify him more as a Reality TV Star than an Extremist......just looking for his 15 minutes.

I posted that quote last week and had just come into this thread to post it again.

His actions are protected by the Constitution, plain and simple.

If people want to start squashing people's protected rights because the actions are offensive, let's start with those di%&#eads from the Westboro Baptist Church.

Yes, gross generalizations.

You're talking about small groups of people, you're talking about signs in "English" intended for Western media consumption, and you're talking about an Iranian government employee who's going to stirr the pot as only Iranians can.

Certainly some will use the event for violence, but most likely this would be driven by those intending violence regardless...like the Taliban fighting US Troops.

We'd see demonstrations (hell, we already are) but again these are usually orchestrated and often contrived. Do the people feel passionate about it? Sure, but again, there's already resentment towards the West that this feeds into.

Think of them like a Glenn Beck rally.

-spence

Remember, they're also pandering to their audience just like our media does.

-spence

Hey Spence. Are you gonna fish at all this fall? You owe me a plug and I was hoping to get it from you in person. Put down the bottles and binky's and grab your gear. I'll get RIJimmy to come too. If the fishing is bad, you can at least try hitting on him again.:)

huh?...you know, if someone that opposed the GZ Mosque were to suggest that while wrong, someone "beating the crap out of" Rauf in retaliation after the completion of the thing would make them "feel better about it"...I'd find that pretty offensive....I guess it ok to beat the crap out of someone if it has international consequences or if they're "being a friggin moron"?...why not just lop off the koran burning guys head?....if beating the crap out of him, while wrong, would make you feel better...watching his head roll around on the ground might give you a little chubby...

Already plotting, I agree a joint trip should be in order...land or sea.

-spence

no, no, no, no, no - you're taking my reply out of context. See Dad F's reply to me on N word in Harlem
I take a stong stance on protecting this pastor as an american, against threats from outside the country. I dont care what other countries think about us and we should defend out rights, wacky or not. Its our constitutional obligation.
But as Dad F points out, I go to a Pats game and yell " Brady sucks a$$" and get my head beat in, thats different.

Breaking News.... Imam agrees to move mosque and Pastor calls off book burning.

Buck, not breaking news...multiple news sources already reporting the Iman says it's all BS.

My guess is the FL pastor is playing games to try and come out ahead. And to think all this grandstanding is just adding fuel to the fire...

Buck, your buddy sure is a real low life.

-spence

I know it's BS Spence. CNN, my go to news network, had it as "Breaking News".
Besides....Never trust an Imam

Which buddy? I have so many low life friends your going to have to name names.:buds:

oh, right ....I see....

if you say the N word in Harlem and get beaten or yell "Brady sucks" at a Pats game and you get your head beat in or "a guy is choosing to burn the Quran...have a ball. But if you get terrorized, beaten or Killed because of YOUR choice....don't come whining to me about it."
because what ?...you probably deserved it ???

you guys were pretty clear....sounds like violence in the face of what?...the wrong words or non-violent action..is acceptable? expected? deserved?

wow?

seems to me this insignificant nut in Florida proved that he could ignite the religeon of peace... world wide... simply by stating that he'd burn something printed on paper in his little corner of nowhere....doesn't say much for the muslim world now does it?

Good point, one might question if a lot of this is really about religion after all.

-spence

if you want to read about stuff burning and have a little time on your hands....Google "muslim unrest" or "muslim riots" and then the country of your choice....France, England, China, Australia, Spain, Netherlands...any of the middle east or african countries...on and on....try the same with any other religeon...just for comparison
Sweden...Cambodia, Phillipines, Indonesia, Greece........Germany, Ireland...Russia, Uzbekistan, Kyrgyzstan

great piece today....
The Eternal Flame of Muslim Outrage - Article - National Review Online

I agree, this "stunt" once again showed the muslims true colors. Been saying that this whole thread. Barbaric religious uncivilized loons. But that will be lost to most as they focus on the crazy pastorn not the WORLDWIDE reaction. Our secretary of defense call him, the president pleads with him. The mightiest nation in the world bows to islamic fear. Osama, you've won.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

It's not about bowing in fear, it's about staying true to who we say we are.

This entire stunt with the pastor was such a big deal only because it came on the heels of the Islamic Cultural Center controversy in New York. That was only such a big deal because people are exploiting fear of Islam for political gain.

We can have free speech in the country and let the crazies be crazies without it being a problem. But when the Right Wing is acting like MSG, primarily to serve their own interests, then they infringe on all our rights.

Sure, we have the right to ask for responsibility from Muslims abroad, but who are we to ask if we can't even practice what we preach?

Pretty soon you're going to see the fringe Right blaming Islam for all our ills. I can see it forming as we speak.

-spence

This is not about the "fringe Right". You really are clueless.

And you don't read. Remember what happened last time when you didn't read?

The scary part is you have fringes on both sides influencing a good part of the middle. They're going to lead everyone to war before you know it.

-spence

spence, you've lost it.
They can burn the bible, torah, koran, whatever - separation of church and state......right?
Practice what we preach? we preach individual FREEDOM!!!!!!!!!!
responsibility from muslims abroad???? for stoning people, for suicide bombers? for all kinds of inhumane tasks. THIS GUY WAS BURNING A F"IN BOOK!!!
He wasnt doin one damn thing to ANYONES freedom to practive their religion.

welcome to america, dont like it? hurt your feelings? spend a month in Saudi Arabia and try to get a beer and pick up a girl. You'll be thrown in jail or beheaded.

you obviously can't hold all muslims as violent but a quick look around the globe show far more than a just tiny minority of radicals causing the trouble, just as Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton have claimed to speak for the black community, Rauf claims to speak for the muslim community and he nothing but a two faced weasel who works shady deals and uses fear, racism and demands for tolerance to further his agenda...hope he continues to do interviews...IT'S GREAT WHEN "MODERATE MUSLIMS" SUGGEST THAT VIOLENCE WILL OCCUR FROM "RADICAL MUSLIMS" IF THE "MODERATE MUSLIMS" DON'T GET WHAT THEY WANT

Nope, still in control.

From an outside perspective many think we preach individual freedom when we choose, and that our beliefs don't apply to them. Why else would we let Israel punish Palestinians, ship off children and old men to GITMO and inflict tens or hundreds of thousands of civilian casualties all in the name of Freedom?

Is anyone more free as a result?

Agree or disagree this is a very real and very common viewpoint outside of the US, and not just by Muslims. Hell, just go north a few hours to CANADA, 'ey.

You're generalizing again.

As I said above, the real issue here isn't about the pastor. The white elephant in the room is how American's fear and mistrust of Islam is being exploited.

Ahh, the old "we must be right because we're better than them" defense.

I think I'd rather lead by example.

-spence

[QUOTE=spence;793807]Nope, still in control.



that was awesome :uhuh:

In control like Chris Mattews on a "the right sucks and is ruining the world" rant

the fear and mistrust of islam is not being exploited - its rationale is being highlighted. did anyone in their right mind thing the reaction would be different? DEATH TO AMERICA!!!!
and for the record, our beliefs do not apply to them. thats why we have different laws. dont turn this into some broad reaching discussion, this is a guy in Florida wanting to do something that insults muslims and they turn it into a worldwide incident because. NONE OF THE WORLDS FREAKIN BUSINESS.

Quote:
responsibility from muslims abroad???? for stoning people, for suicide bombers? for all kinds of inhumane tasks.

You're generalizing again.

really? Are their LAWS in Iran that permit stoning? Are there state sponsored (Libya, Iran, Previously Iraq) agencies that support suicide bombers? See, you have the "vicitm" mentality hat on, you are wrong. Do women have rights in musliom countries? Its not generalizing its FACTS. I dont write their laws, maybe you do? tell me spence, if I go to Saudi Arabia and yell Allah sucks ******, how long will I live? thats not a generalization, its a fact.

just a few crazy radical......

A crowd, which a government official estimated at 10,000, poured out of mosques into the streets of Faizabad, the capital of Badakhshan in Afghanistan's northeast, after special prayers for Eid al-Fitr, the end of the Muslim fasting month of Ramadan.

One protester was shot dead when a smaller group attacked a German-run NATO base in Faizabad, hurling stones at the outpost, a spokesman for the provincial government said.

Afghan security forces rushed to the scene to restore order, and three police were hurt when stones the crowd was hurling hit them, the spokesman said.

A spokesman for the NATO-led International Security Assistance Force in Kabul the force is aware of the Faizabad protests and were checking the incident.

Eight Christian aid workers were killed by unidentified gunmen in remote and rugged Badakhshan last month. wow - where was the muslim uproar, aid workers????Several hundred gathered in a northern district of Kabul, while about 2,000 marched on a government building in western Farah, officials and witnesses said. There were also protests in nearby Badghis in the northwest and Ghor and Herat in the west.

Similar protests over perceived desecration of Muslim symbols have led to dozens of deaths in Afghanistan in recent years, including after a Danish newspaper published a cartoon depicting the Prophet Muhammad in 2005.
'We Will Attack U.S. Bases,' Muslim Cleric Warns

In eastern Nangahar, tribal chiefs threatened to attack NATO bases near the Pakistan border if Jones went ahead with the plan. "If they do this, we will attack American bases and close the highway used by convoys supplying American troops," a cleric named Zahidullah told Reuters.
At mosques in the capital, clerics also labeled the plan dangerous. "Muslims are ready to sacrifice their sons, fathers and mothers for Islam and the Koran," one preacher said at one Kabul mosque to cries of "Allahu Akbar" (God is Greatest). silly, dont they know its only the radical fringe, just ask spence!

The polls are seen as a key test of stability in Afghanistan before Obama conducts a war strategy review in December. Obama has said the plan, dismissed by conservatives and liberals alike as an attention-seeking stunt, would be a "recruitment bonanza" for al Qaeda.

WHEN THEY CUT YOU HEAD OFF...DON'T GO CRYING TO THE DAD FISHERMAN....

Dad F has been pretty sane on this issue. Suprisingly its spence who is way out there.

Actually, if you go to Faizabad and get in the middle of this and yell Allah Sucks.........and they cut your head off, don't come crying to me.

The biggest issue with the people arguing in this thread is that you're trying to rationalize the motivations of people who base their actions on an irrational topic - religion.

The Crusades, Jihad, the Taiping Rebellion the longest and deadliest of wars in human history, all motivated by one premise - you don't believe in the same religious figure as I do or you call him by a different name, therefore you should die.

EXACTLY !! and ALL of these cultures have moved on except one! Just one......and the only religion in the world that we have a modern day potential for war and violence is ________________

Freikin Lutherans....those bastards

This is what I dont get. This is from the imam who was negotiating with the wacky pastor.

The imam said he feels Jones is a "good person at heart" who simply got himself into a difficult position and could not back down despite calls from Christian and world leaders.

"He could not back down, and I felt that it's my responsibility, as the Muslim leader in central Florida, to go up to him and speak one-on-one with him and explain that he's putting American lives in danger and he should reconsider."

So, why is the imam saying American lives are in danger and asking the pastor to stop instead of saying to the muslims worldwide that this act does not impact our religion and is the work of a small group of people. Then say that we are a peaceful religion and should not harm anyone.
The Imam agrees that PEOPLE OF HIS RELIGION will kill people. And it appears its ok???? Whats the real "wrong" here, buring the Korans or killing people as a result????? For me, this is the core of the problem with the Muslim "voice". They do not speak up about the atrocities that are commited in their religions name. Here is a perfect example. The message - dont do it because mulsims in the world will kill americans. Huh????

RIJ, you're posting nonsense too quickly. I can't keep up...at least ScottW is pacing himself. Scott, thank you...

My favorite was your evidence that all Muslims are crazy, by citing a presently inflamed, already extreme part of a war torn country that's seen little but death and destruction for the past 30 years.

Why can't these people just pull themselves up by their bootstraps?

And from another perspective American and Russian bombs caused far more death and destruction than any actions taken in the name of Islam the last 30 years.

Instead of focusing on the religion, you should try taking a look at the history and present geopolitical environment that has shaped the modern world.

Most of the Islamic countries we see as higher risk didn't even exist or pretend to self govern until the 1940's. The influence of crumbling Colonization (followed immediately by the Cold War) combined with the abundance of fossil fuels (not to mention strategic geographic locations) on regional policies can't be ignored when trying to understand the situation or possible outcomes.

But you Jimmy just want them to let bygones be bygones and move along already.

Who's going to cut my head off again?

-spence