ASMFC To Take Action to reduce Striped Bass mortality

[MAKAI]

Hey..... there's also some wicked pissa new health plans out there done by committees and boards that completely know what we need.
To put blind faith in any government " committee " is to have your head so far up your ass you could re-eat yesterday's lunch.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

[bart]

Originally Posted by MAKAI

Hey..... there's also some wicked pissa new health plans out there done by committees and boards that completely know what we need.
To put blind faith in any government " committee " is to have your head so far up your ass you could re-eat yesterday's lunch.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

[stripermaineiac]

So again what ARE WE GONNA DO TO FIX WHATS BROKEN.

[afterhours]

we need to organize...i for one can donate some of my time. we need an org. from the ground up.oh makai- thanks! i just spit up coffee everywhere

[stripermaineiac]

Very nice Makai. Love it.insurance anyone LOL

[stripermaineiac]

We need a computer guy that's under 50 LOL . Most of old farts just break the damn things or use them as a deck of cards.

[stripermaineiac]

can't stop laughin LOL

[MakoMike]

Originally Posted by stripermaineiac

The problem is Mike is that the numbers they keep using have shown to be flawed so often that all they've done so far is make things worse not improved things.we need to change the process. This isn't about what won't work we need to do something that will. ASMFC has shown it's self to be not just inefective but biased against the fish not just one user group or another.If we just sit on our hands and do nothing instead of working towards action that is posetive than we might just as well all give it up.I don't buy it.1 there are way too many of us to just say we don't count.2 all these appointees work for us it's time we show them that.I don't mind someone makeing a decision when voted or appointed to do so but time n time again they have shown that they're not up to doing the job. to continually ignore all of us time and again and for us to keep being proven right then it's time we changed this process or make them fix it.

To the contrary, the numbers they have been using have proven to be correct. None of us on here are "fishery Scientists" and that is what the managers are required to us, e.g. the "best available science." Like many here, you would like the fishery to be managed to maximize the population, but that is not the legally mandated requirement they have to work toward. As I have said before, if you want to change the system you have to use the legislative process, and with the Magnesson-Stevens act up for renewal now is you chance.

FWIW - based on the numbers that I have heard tossed about going to a one fish per day creel limit is a virtual certainty, but that alone won't be enough to do the job. They will also have to take other measures to reduce the harvest.

[MakoMike]

Originally Posted by Jackbass

The only thing that will have any legal teeth is a proposed amendment to the management plan. Which will be made available for public comment. We know how wildly popular going to the input hearings is. If someone were to present 100000 signatures or e signature to the board they would take notice
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Yes Comments on any proposed addendum or amendment would be noticed and be appropriate. But that would require people to actually read and understand the public information document that the board puts out. And that is an effort a lot of people refuse to make.

[MAKAI]

Double M.... being blinded by science often ends up as a fools errand. Silly stupid humans do it all the time.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

[MakoMike]

Originally Posted by MAKAI

Double M.... being blinded by science often ends up as a fools errand. Silly stupid humans do it all the time.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

But its the law as to how U.S. fisheries should be managed. Would you like to back to the days when the "science" didn't matter and the councils set harvest level waaaay above the scientific recommendations?

[MAKAI]

Depends whose sheets the scientists are in between. Unfortunately government agencies just don't fill me with confidence.
There's no way anyone knows the status of the fisheries. Way too many variables. ( ie cod . fair amount of science behind that one )
So excuse me if I prefer to err on the side of caution.
I did talk to a couple of fisheries ( at a meeting ) scientist regarding the Chesapeake watershed. They told me that it now takes 3 times the spawning biomass to produce the same YOY as it did 20 yrs ago. That's pretty telling science to me.
It's obvious science is important, but I don't find it the be all that ends all.

Just ask the rocket scientists at JPL after they crashed or lost contact with 3 out of 4 multi billion dollar probes to Mars. .... Oops
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

[stripermaineiac]

Mako , There are loads of laws out there that are tweeked and improved all the time. when one doesn't do as it's supposed to you fix it.you like many of us spends loads of time on the water. Sad part is we never see any of these so called science advisors or scientist out there. we know more than many of them ever could as we see whats there and not just from a computer screen.LOL we have fisheries law an a lisence yet I've seem 1 DEM 0fficial in 12 yrs.
As far as public information documents well -LOL- many are intentionally set up so that most couldn't understand them. Almost like lawyers have done to our legal system with legalise.The system needs to be fixed . IT IS NOT WORKING AS IT WAS SET UP TO DO.We need to fix it before someone in an office that has never walked a beach at night and seen the comercials pull up to draggers and off load striper during the com seasom to sell and split the money.Or been on the Canal and watch the xtra trips taken home with fish to keep multiple catches in the same day.The numbers are a sad guess at best. No where's close to being close to real.
Look at the Derby this year. Over 3000 entrants. 32 or more weigh in slots between shore,boat,fly rod and juniors and mini's a day for striped bass. 487 stripers weighed in for the whole 30 day plus Derby.Ms Tourney over 100 anglers and only 13 fish including blues over the weekend.These numbers are not listed as they weren't tabulated by scientist. They only use what numbers justify the political ajenda of the poletician in charge wants.I work for the state of Maine we see it all the time. Figures lie and liars figure.they read the fishing reports and use those numbers . LOL we all know how accurate those are.The system needs to be fixed. The fishing coastwide proves it not what a couple sharpies see hear n there.
Our fisheries laws have all but destroyed one fisherie after another. Time to fix it.

[bobber]

Mako has the right idea..... the way to fix this is to work to change the system- and work to bring a change in language in Magnusen/Stevensen Act; to affect the mandate that the commisioners are required to work with- now its "maximim sustainable yield". Under those guidelines, they are required to keep catching (killing) levels at the highest possible without the stock collapsing. that is THE GOAL of MSA

the StripedBass Management Board can only work within that framework.... amendments to the Plan will only bring about changes to achieve the exact same goal.
IF YOU WANT THE GOAL TO CHANGE- then you need to change the basic rules they operate under

[stripermaineiac]

Ok . So what do we need to do to get the language changed? Then how do we do it ? Some of you out there know way more about this stuff that I could ever dream.I just know what I see. How do we fix it?

[MakoMike]

Originally Posted by stripermaineiac

Mako , There are loads of laws out there that are tweeked and improved all the time. when one doesn't do as it's supposed to you fix it.you like many of us spends loads of time on the water. Sad part is we never see any of these so called science advisors or scientist out there. we know more than many of them ever could as we see whats there and not just from a computer screen.LOL we have fisheries law an a lisence yet I've seem 1 DEM 0fficial in 12 yrs.
As far as public information documents well -LOL- many are intentionally set up so that most couldn't understand them. Almost like lawyers have done to our legal system with legalise.The system needs to be fixed . IT IS NOT WORKING AS IT WAS SET UP TO DO.We need to fix it before someone in an office that has never walked a beach at night and seen the comercials pull up to draggers and off load striper during the com seasom to sell and split the money.Or been on the Canal and watch the xtra trips taken home with fish to keep multiple catches in the same day.The numbers are a sad guess at best. No where's close to being close to real.
Look at the Derby this year. Over 3000 entrants. 32 or more weigh in slots between shore,boat,fly rod and juniors and mini's a day for striped bass. 487 stripers weighed in for the whole 30 day plus Derby.Ms Tourney over 100 anglers and only 13 fish including blues over the weekend.These numbers are not listed as they weren't tabulated by scientist. They only use what numbers justify the political ajenda of the poletician in charge wants.I work for the state of Maine we see it all the time. Figures lie and liars figure.they read the fishing reports and use those numbers . LOL we all know how accurate those are.The system needs to be fixed. The fishing coastwide proves it not what a couple sharpies see hear n there.
Our fisheries laws have all but destroyed one fisherie after another. Time to fix it.

Sorry, I just have to say it, you have no effin idea of what you are talking about. There, I feel better now.

[MakoMike]

Originally Posted by bobber

Mako has the right idea..... the way to fix this is to work to change the system- and work to bring a change in language in Magnusen/Stevensen Act; to affect the mandate that the commisioners are required to work with- now its "maximim sustainable yield". Under those guidelines, they are required to keep catching (killing) levels at the highest possible without the stock collapsing. that is THE GOAL of MSA

the StripedBass Management Board can only work within that framework.... amendments to the Plan will only bring about changes to achieve the exact same goal.
IF YOU WANT THE GOAL TO CHANGE- then you need to change the basic rules they operate under

Ding, Ding, Ding! Give that man a cigar, at least someone understand what I have been preaching here for at least the last six months!

[MakoMike]

Originally Posted by stripermaineiac

Ok . So what do we need to do to get the language changed? Then how do we do it ? Some of you out there know way more about this stuff that I could ever dream.I just know what I see. How do we fix it?

How many times to have to type "write to your congressman and senators"? Sitting on you ass and typing on internet forums isn't going to get anything done!

[stripermaineiac]

LOL Yup your right I don't have a clue LOL. Done the writing as many of us do. Phone calls never are returned and the 1-800 report numbers seem to be a waste. Funny being that i have a cell have most of the numbers in it . Call frequent. When the site ask us to contact poletician we do. Broke is still broke. You have an idea . Good. How do we do it. how do dummie like myself that have no idea an have no clue get it fixed. You seem to have an opinion and hate hearing what others see an deal with so why don't you Quote get off your butt and help do something rather than just keep putting others IDEAS DOWN AND SLAMMIN THEM.Every year we see the same with guys slammin every idea instead of helping get something done.
Our rep is a freind of mine. We talk a bit. his frustration is that we don't have the numbers showing at the meetings to make a difference. The few of us that are trying keep getting sucker shotted by guys that don't want change till it's too late.
As far as not havin a clue well what i wrote I saw ist hand.I reported it along with boat numbers. Nothing was done.I fished almost 4 weeks of the Derby and saw charter guys and hard core chasing Black fish and sea bass due to so few stripers. I saw one of the hardest core fisherman I know go 3 weeks with out a striper at one of the top spots on the coast.But your right guys like me that take the time to argue don't have all the answers and when we ask for help we take sucker shots from those that don't want things to chang. but that's ok.We'll fix it with out your help if you just want to be negative.
Oh by the way my rep said if we can get some stuff going to get it to him. LOL That was just from sittin on my butt an not havin a clue LOL. Sorry had to.

[MakoMike]

Originally Posted by stripermaineiac

LOL Yup your right I don't have a clue LOL. Done the writing as many of us do. Phone calls never are returned and the 1-800 report numbers seem to be a waste. Funny being that i have a cell have most of the numbers in it . Call frequent. When the site ask us to contact poletician we do. Broke is still broke. You have an idea . Good. How do we do it. how do dummie like myself that have no idea an have no clue get it fixed. You seem to have an opinion and hate hearing what others see an deal with so why don't you Quote get off your butt and help do something rather than just keep putting others IDEAS DOWN AND SLAMMIN THEM.Every year we see the same with guys slammin every idea instead of helping get something done.
Our rep is a freind of mine. We talk a bit. his frustration is that we don't have the numbers showing at the meetings to make a difference. The few of us that are trying keep getting sucker shotted by guys that don't want change till it's too late.
As far as not havin a clue well what i wrote I saw ist hand.I reported it along with boat numbers. Nothing was done.I fished almost 4 weeks of the Derby and saw charter guys and hard core chasing Black fish and sea bass due to so few stripers. I saw one of the hardest core fisherman I know go 3 weeks with out a striper at one of the top spots on the coast.But your right guys like me that take the time to argue don't have all the answers and when we ask for help we take sucker shots from those that don't want things to chang. but that's ok.We'll fix it with out your help if you just want to be negative.
Oh by the way my rep said if we can get some stuff going to get it to him. LOL That was just from sittin on my butt an not havin a clue LOL. Sorry had to.

I'm just fine with the way the ASMFC board is handling it, and I see no reason to change. What I was trying to do was to point those, like you who don't like the way things are, as to how to change things. If you don't know how to write a letter to your congressman or Senator, that ain't my fault. If "your" ASMFC rep wants to take measures that restrict the harvest more than what is scientifically required, he's going to feel like he was hit by a freight train.

[stripermaineiac]

Actually what he wants to do is try to fix whats wrong with the process. He's a fisherman like us and a guide.He was a kid in the 80's and felt what was a mess back then and fished with one of the best striper fishermen on the coast.
As far as letter writing well the thousands that hace been sent through postal an email just haven't seemed to had an affect.Mores needed to make a change.
Like I said you don't have to help. Just remember this is about the fish.

[MakoMike]

Originally Posted by stripermaineiac

Actually what he wants to do is try to fix whats wrong with the process. He's a fisherman like us and a guide.He was a kid in the 80's and felt what was a mess back then and fished with one of the best striper fishermen on the coast.
As far as letter writing well the thousands that hace been sent through postal an email just haven't seemed to had an affect.Mores needed to make a change.
Like I said you don't have to help. Just remember this is about the fish.

No its not about the fish if it was you could just join PETA and stop all fishing. Its about the fishermen and how they will be regulated.

[Liv2Fish]

Originally Posted by MakoMike

Yes Comments on any proposed addendum or amendment would be noticed and be appropriate. But that would require people to actually read and understand the public information document that the board puts out. And that is an effort a lot of people refuse to make.

This is where all of the shop owners and anyone who makes a profit off of having the fish available to catch comes in. A flyer in every shop on the striper coast that reads"THE STRIPED BASS NEEDS YOUR HELP TO REMAIN IN EXISTENCE" If you care about the striped bass, please go to SaveTheBass.org and read. Please sign the petition and volunteer what you can.

I would volunteer to stand at the entrance to the big shows and hand out literature.

I get notes from the menhaden defenders once in a while and have signed their petition and have read all of their stuff.

[bobber]

theres information available about the the committee meetings regarding the re-authorization of Mag/Steve- google search it (I cna't cut n' paste links from work) the committees are calling for increased flexibility in using MSA for future management efforts and better consideration of the shifting economic impacts that recreational fisheries are having on fishing communities. also- there is a call for CONSERVATION to be an important consideration in the next re-authorization



now write to your congressmen and ask them to push for conservation and flexibility to be part of the next version of MSA

[stripermaineiac]

Hey Pat ,Do you still have that info as to who- poleticians-that have worked best with fisheries issues you mentioned a couple yrs ago.I thought I had a copy but can't find it. Was talking to one of our senators ystrdy and that info would be handy drummin up more support in the congressional halls.I sent all ours a bunch of site addresses so they can read some of the discussions goin on. Some of what he read was very eye opening as he mainly hear mostly about lobsters and offshore netting. Ron