IL unions get offered 14.5% raise, go on strike

[Sea Dangles]

Yup
I am selling my suburban and looking for a yetta
the best car ever??? Hahahahaha

[likwid]

Originally Posted by Sea Dangles

Yup
I am selling my suburban and looking for a yetta
the best car ever??? Hahahahaha

Dig the sand out of your vag.

Originally Posted by My own post

Face it, American cars are garbage. The only thing we seem to get right are full sized trucks.

I would have taken you for a Ford man anyhow, you need as much bling as possible.

[TheSpecialist]

[QUOTE]

Here's how public unions work, and I am not wrong here. Unions give big money to politicians. Those same politicians then, once in office, get to decide what level of benefits to reward the unions (their benefactors) with. Politicians like to stay in office, so they give the unions whatever they ask for. Fast forward to today, when the demographic trsunami called "the Baby Boomers" causes the pyramid to collapse. Municipalties go bankrupt. Retirees get benefits slashed. Taxpayers see huge spikes in tax rates.
/QUOTE]

Ask the Boston Police, and Boston Fire Department how that works, Mayor Menino a Democrat backed by Unions gave them all the shaft , they are not allowed to strike , and have been working for years without raises or a contract. After they finally agreed to Arbitration, the City didn't like what the cops had won, and ware trying not to pay it.

Unions aren't the only ones to blame for the loss of manufacturing jobs in this country. Business owners, and Wall Street demand more money in their pockets, therefore they move things over seas where the Average call center worker in India makes about $2 per hour. Do you know of anyone in America who could live on that? There is plenty of blame to go around for everyone.

[Jim in CT]

[QUOTE=TheSpecialist;1023288]

Ask the Boston Police, and Boston Fire Department how that works, Mayor Menino a Democrat backed by Unions gave them all the shaft , they are not allowed to strike , and have been working for years without raises or a contract. After they finally agreed to Arbitration, the City didn't like what the cops had won, and ware trying not to pay it.

Unions aren't the only ones to blame for the loss of manufacturing jobs in this country. Business owners, and Wall Street demand more money in their pockets, therefore they move things over seas where the Average call center worker in India makes about $2 per hour. Do you know of anyone in America who could live on that? There is plenty of blame to go around for everyone.

"they (police and firemen) are not allowed to strike "

Good. There is no earthly reason why police or firemen should ever be allowed to strike. If they strike, that puts everyone at risk, and that's not acceptable, ever.

"There is plenty of blame to go around for everyone"

It's not all the unions fault, you are correct there. The globalization of the economy had a lot to do with it.

How is Boston's budget looking these days? Good or bad? Is there "plenty of blame to go around", or is it largely because the city has astronimical union obligations that can never, ever be paid for?

[TheSpecialist]

L
Here is what I mean by plenty of blame to go around. You had people, managers, Mayors, Selectmen giving everything under the sun to public employees for years. Times were prosperous, no one saw what the future held. Now thirty or more years later, these things like pensions, exorbitant medical costs, pension calculation formulas are catching up to them, it's understandable that things need to change. But it's not fair that someone that has 15 or 20 years of service, has his or her benefits ripped out from under them, or because the municipality was run poorly they shouldn't get raises.

If you worked for a company for 20 years, non union, and you came into work one day and the boss said, "Jim I am sorry your pension is being frozen, we are making you pay 10% more for your healthcare, cutting back holidays from 7 to 5, and by the way no raise this year" What would you do? I know I would quietly start looking for another job. I see this happening now a days. Many of my college educated friends, have about 5-9 year longevity at jobs before they change to a different company or job type.

In the private sector there are many big profitable companies that stick it to their employees, union, and non union. They started using the Bank collapse as an excuse, even though they were still profitable. Unions, still have a place in society, to make peoples live better. It's how municipalities deal with public sector unions that needs to change. Instead of taking from tenured employees, change all of the benefits that need changing for new hires, and scale back the benefits of tenured employees over time..

[scottw]

Originally Posted by TheSpecialist

L
Here is what I mean by plenty of blame to go around. You had people, managers, Mayors, Selectmen giving everything under the sun to public employees for years. Times were prosperous, no one saw what the future held. Now thirty or more years later, these things like pensions, exorbitant medical costs, pension calculation formulas are catching up to them, it's understandable that things need to change. But it's not fair that someone that has 15 or 20 years of service, has his or her benefits ripped out from under them, or because the municipality was run poorly they shouldn't get raises.

it's not fair??...is it fair that taxpayers should continue to pay pensions, benefits and raises to people who, through their unions worked to elect "people, managers, Mayors, Selectmen giving everything under the sun to public employees for years"....sounds like they made their own bed, they should do what many Americans are doing...get a part time job....the poorly run municipality is broke many times over....the "someone with 15-20 years of service" has "benefitted" during that entire time thanks to the "people, managers, Mayors, Selectmen giving everything under the sun to public employees for years" was that "fair"?

It's how municipalities deal with public sector unions that needs to change. Instead of taking from tenured employees, change all of the benefits that need changing for new hires, and scale back the benefits of tenured employees over time..

it's not the new hires benefits that are grossly unfunded(yet)...it's the tenured employees....have ya noticed/observed what happens when you try to "scale back" benefits?....did ya miss the whole Wisconsin thing??.....it can be done...but please go back and understand how difficult it is and how uncooperative the benefiters can be...great isn't it?...you get to participate in the pillaging for years and then cry that it's "unfair" when the tipping point is finally reached....benefits(entitlements) without responsibility(except to the sugar daddy at voting time).....pretty much where we're at....

If you worked for a company for 20 years, non union, and you came into work one day and the boss said, "Jim I am sorry your pension is being frozen, we are making you pay 10% more for your healthcare, cutting back holidays from 7 to 5, and by the way no raise this year" What would you do? I know I would quietly start looking for another job. I see this happening now a days. ..

yes...it's called reality

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by TheSpecialist

L
Here is what I mean by plenty of blame to go around. You had people, managers, Mayors, Selectmen giving everything under the sun to public employees for years. Times were prosperous, no one saw what the future held. Now thirty or more years later, these things like pensions, exorbitant medical costs, pension calculation formulas are catching up to them, it's understandable that things need to change. But it's not fair that someone that has 15 or 20 years of service, has his or her benefits ripped out from under them, or because the municipality was run poorly they shouldn't get raises.

If you worked for a company for 20 years, non union, and you came into work one day and the boss said, "Jim I am sorry your pension is being frozen, we are making you pay 10% more for your healthcare, cutting back holidays from 7 to 5, and by the way no raise this year" What would you do? I know I would quietly start looking for another job. I see this happening now a days. Many of my college educated friends, have about 5-9 year longevity at jobs before they change to a different company or job type.

In the private sector there are many big profitable companies that stick it to their employees, union, and non union. They started using the Bank collapse as an excuse, even though they were still profitable. Unions, still have a place in society, to make peoples live better. It's how municipalities deal with public sector unions that needs to change. Instead of taking from tenured employees, change all of the benefits that need changing for new hires, and scale back the benefits of tenured employees over time..

You make many, MANY good points. Here is one i disagree with...

" Times were prosperous, no one saw what the future held"

Actuaries have been saying, for 50 years, that the entitlement programs cannot survive the Baby Boomer generation. They have been saying that for 50 years. Union officials ignore that because they want to get rich off union dues. Politicians ignore that because they like to get re-elected, and need union campaign donations.

Just last year, Paul Ryan had a proposal to modify Medicare. How did the liberals respond? By making comercials that showed Ryan pushing a wheelchair-bound old lady off a cliff.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by TheSpecialist

L
.

If you worked for a company for 20 years, non union, and you came into work one day and the boss said, "Jim I am sorry your pension is being frozen, we are making you pay 10% more for your healthcare, cutting back holidays from 7 to 5, and by the way no raise this year" What would you do? .

That's EXACTLY, and I mean EXACTLY, what happened to the private sector in the 1990's. And what did they do? They acdepted it for what it was. They didn't like it, but they accepted it. They didn't bitch, didn't go on strike, we didn't occupy wall street. We lived with it. Those in public sector unions need to do the same thing, and be grateful that they held onto their luxuries for 20 years longer than everyone else.

That sucks, but it's better than the alternative, which ius slashing pension payments for current retitees. If you think that can't happen, look up Central Falls Rhode Island. And they will soon be doing that in Detroit. In 15 years, it will be more common. Why? Because you can't have more than there is. It's that simple.