Planned Parenthood

[spence]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

Again, what you see, tends to depend upon the issue you are advocating.

Federal law requires that no alteration in the timing or method of abortion be done for the purposes of fetal tissue collection (42 U.S.C. 289g-1).

Tell me that the videos don't suggest that this federal law was broken.

The videos are heavily edited, they suggest what the editors want them to suggest.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by spence

The videos are heavily edited, they suggest what the editors want them to suggest.

Shocker.

Is it not enough for an investigation, Spence? The lady from Planned Parenthood, in the most recently released video, clearly says that abortion procedures are manipulated to maximize the harvestable tissue.

Spence, when a liberal group released the video of Romney's idiotic remark about 47% of Americans not wanting to work, were you equally concerned about how the footage was obtained? Or are you selective about when you apply this concern?

[PaulS]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

Shocker.

The lady from Planned Parenthood, in the most recently released video, clearly says that abortion procedures are manipulated to maximize the harvestable tissue.
so what exactly does that mean? It could mean they try to make sure there are organs to provide for research (of which she clearly stated that they don't make $ off of regardless of how the right is trying to spin the videos).

Spence, when a liberal group released the video of Romney's idiotic remark about 47% of Americans not wanting to work, were you equally concerned about how the footage was obtained? Or are you selective about when you apply this concern?

Totally different - Romney's comment was taped by someone working as a bartender at that event - Not by someone using the sleazy tactics of Breitbart who out and out lies about who he is and represents (of which I'm not so sure is bad).

It is funny watching you state that liberals hate how the video was obtained yet it is conserv. controlled state legisl. who have been passing laws prohibiting people from taking undercover video of farms and slaughter houses.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by PaulS

Totally different - Romney's comment was taped by someone working as a bartender at that event - Not by someone using the sleazy tactics of Breitbart who out and out lies about who he is and represents (of which I'm not so sure is bad).

It is funny watching you state that liberals hate how the video was obtained yet it is conserv. controlled state legisl. who have been passing laws prohibiting people from taking undercover video of farms and slaughter houses.

"so what exactly does that mean? It could mean they try to make sure there are organs to provide for research (of which she clearly stated that they don't make $ off of regardless of how the right is trying to spin the videos)."

The law says that it's a crime to alter an abortion procedure for th epurposes of maximizing harvestable tissue. The law doesn't care if the tissue is to be used for scientific reserach or for a sandwich. The $$ is another law, which says you can cover your expenses, but not make a profit.

"Romney's comment was taped by someone working as a bartender at that event - Not by someone using the sleazy tactics of Breitbart "

Splitting hairs. Undercover videos are used to get people to say things they wouldn't say if they knew they were being recorded. Common sense suggests that people will be more honest and sincere, if they don't know they are being recorded. Sometomes, that's the only way to get the truth.

Some liberal jerk called Governor Scott Walker a couple of years ago, claiming to be one of the Koch Brothers, and Walker said some things that he wouldn't have said if he knew it was a set-up, and I don't recall people on the left complaining about how the footage was obtained. Fabulously, Walker did mention it that conversation that he's not concerned about MSNBC because nobody watches it.

"funny watching you state that liberals hate how the video was obtained "

I'm not just stating it, it's true. You yourself decried how the video was obtained.

"t is conserv. controlled state legisl. who have been passing laws prohibiting people from taking undercover video of farms and slaughter houses"

I'm 100% in favor of such undercover videos. While i love a bloody steak, I also believe we have a responsibility to treat the animals as humanely and ethically as is reasonably feasible. Fair enough?

[PaulS]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

"so what exactly does that mean? It could mean they try to make sure there are organs to provide for research (of which she clearly stated that they don't make $ off of regardless of how the right is trying to spin the videos)."

The law says that it's a crime to alter an abortion procedure for th epurposes of maximizing harvestable tissue. The law doesn't care if the tissue is to be used for scientific reserach or for a sandwich. The $$ is another law, which says you can cover your expenses, but not make a profit.
I'm not saying the procedure was altered I'm saying that maybe instead of just ripping the fetus apart, they are more carefull - disgusting, I know and meant it that way.
"Romney's comment was taped by someone working as a bartender at that event - Not by someone using the sleazy tactics of Breitbart "

Splitting hairs. Undercover videos are used to get people to say things they wouldn't say if they knew they were being recorded. Common sense suggests that people will be more honest and sincere, if they don't know they are being recorded. Sometomes, that's the only way to get the truth. i'm gonna disagree that it is splitting hairs. and I did say that I'm not sure I disagree with the tactic.

Some liberal jerk called Governor Scott Walker a couple of years ago, claiming to be one of the Koch Brothers, and Walker said some things that he wouldn't have said if he knew it was a set-up, and I don't recall people on the left complaining about how the footage was obtained. Fabulously, Walker did mention it that conversation that he's not concerned about MSNBC because nobody watches it.I'd consider that the almost the same as the PP video but the same as working at a farm and pulling a camera out and filing the mistreatment of an animal.

"funny watching you state that liberals hate how the video was obtained "

I'm not just stating it, it's true. You yourself decried how the video was obtained. I don't think I stated it the way you just implied I did."t is conserv. controlled state legisl. who have been passing laws prohibiting people from taking undercover video of farms and slaughter houses"

I'm 100% in favor of such undercover videos. While i love a bloody steak, I also believe we have a responsibility to treat the animals as humanely and ethically as is reasonably feasible. Fair enough?

nm

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by PaulS

nm

"I'm not saying the procedure was altered I'm saying that maybe instead of just ripping the fetus apart, they are more carefull - disgusting, I know and meant it that way. "

But in the videos the PP folks are explicitly saying that the procedures were altered, and they said it was done to influence the useful tissue for later use. That's what was said, and it's a blatant violation of federal law, and whie that alone isn't enough to convict anyone (maybe) sure as hell it should launch an investigation. And at a bare minumum, I should not be required to fund this place. I don't want my $$ going to these heartless ghouls. .

[spence]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

But in the videos the PP folks are explicitly saying that the procedures were altered, and they said it was done to influence the useful tissue for later use. That's what was said, and it's a blatant violation of federal law, and whie that alone isn't enough to convict anyone (maybe) sure as hell it should launch an investigation. And at a bare minumum, I should not be required to fund this place. I don't want my $$ going to these heartless ghouls. .

The laws intent is that you wouldn't say choose one form of abortion over another, or suggest an abortion with the intent of collecting tissue. But once that's said and done it's going to be more expensive to preserve tissue than just dispose of it...it's a different procedure.

As for heartless ghouls, I can guarantee you that many people who work for non-profits do so precisely because they want to help others...

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by PaulS

you state that liberals hate how the video was obtained yet it is conserv. controlled state legisl. who have been passing laws prohibiting people from taking undercover video of farms and slaughter houses.

You are correct on this by the way, and it's disgraceful. I went to high school with, and played tennis with, Wayne Pacelle, who is President of the Humane Society of the United States, and a great guy. I love animals Paul, love them, and you bring up a good point here, and one of the rare issues on which I side with the liberals (death penalty, gay marriage being the others).

[PaulS]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

You are correct on this by the way, and it's disgraceful. I went to high school with, and played tennis with, Wayne Pacelle, who is President of the Humane Society of the United States, and a great guy. I love animals Paul, love them, and you bring up a good point here, and one of the rare issues on which I side with the liberals (death penalty, gay marriage being the others).

I know Wayne from a past life (although not good) also. prior to the Humane Society.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by PaulS

I know Wayne from a past life (although not good) also. prior to the Humane Society.

Small world, sorry your experience wasn't positive. Was he a lawyer before joining HSUS? I think he went to Yale Law School, could be wrong.

[PaulS]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

Small world, sorry your experience wasn't positive. Was he a lawyer before joining HSUS? I think he went to Yale Law School, could be wrong.

I should have said that I didn't know him well. I knew the family more than Wayne. Nice folks. Yes, Yale law school.