Disaster

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by wdmso

Jim neither Hamas nor Israel would exist with out the fear of destruction

Both use fear of the other to justify their methods. From building settlements to firing rockets

I look at like positional asphyxia

Israel has it knee on the Palestinians cutting of their air and in response they increase their struggles trying to breath , then Israel apply s more force to gain compliance and all they get it. More struggling

And round and round it Goes


As for you question are you serious? Israel is shooosed to respond exactly proportionately when attacked? Quick response is yes In most incidents you use enough force to stop the threat. Not to punish.. but Israel has a history of collective punishment.. which always comes into question when there so much infrastructure destroyed.. cell phone and civilian warnings look good for public relations not sure how effective it is at keeping non combatants safe
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Man.

Which side has a history of unprovoked violent attack a against the other, and which one uses violence after being attacked?

if someone punches you in the face, and you punch them back, those two things are not morally equivalent. not even close.

hamas doesn’t deny their goal is to wipe israel out of existnce. Israel wants to be left alone. not that israel is perfect, but theres no comparison. it’s like comparing the Nazis to the Poles in the 1930s.

forget about what each party’s line is, and just think. for two seconds, take off the blinders .
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[wdmso]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

Man.

Which side has a history of unprovoked violent attack a against the other, and which one uses violence after being attacked?

if someone punches you in the face, and you punch them back, those two things are not morally equivalent. not even close.

hamas doesn’t deny their goal is to wipe israel out of existnce. Israel wants to be left alone. not that israel is perfect, but theres no comparison. it’s like comparing the Nazis to the Poles in the 1930s.

forget about what each party’s line is, and just think. for two seconds, take off the blinders .
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What blinders my view is based on historical actions from both sides

Neither has the high ground but neither is willing to provide concessions .. the West Bank and Gaza are not much different from Indian reservations . With The illusion of autonomy . until the one with the power Israel decides otherwise
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[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by wdmso

What blinders my view is based on historical actions from both sides

Neither has the high ground but neither is willing to provide concessions .. the West Bank and Gaza are not much different from Indian reservations . With The illusion of autonomy . until the one with the power Israel decides otherwise
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ok, if you rely on historical facts. please point to all
the historical occasions when israel killed palestinian terrorists without provocation.

one side absolutely has the moral ground. israel would stop fighting if hamas would. israel isn’t explicitly saying they want palestinians to cease to exist. what about that don’t you get?

once again, towing the party line, never any exceptions.
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[wdmso]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

ok, if you rely on historical facts. please point to all
the historical occasions when israel killed palestinian terrorists without provocation.

one side absolutely has the moral ground. israel would stop fighting if hamas would. israel isn’t explicitly saying they want palestinians to cease to exist. what about that don’t you get?

once again, towing the party line, never any exceptions.
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Jim the world took their land may 1948 in and created the state of Israel. Out of thin air. 1967 they annexed East Jerusalem because the had the power to do so..

If these are not provocations I am not sure what fits your definition of a provocation..

I just find it odd with the History of persecution the Jews have and what happened in WW2 I understand they won’t let it happen again .. and I hope it never does .. But when you become what you opposed .. in the name of past transgressions, it’s very hypocritical to me ..
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[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by wdmso

But when you become what you opposed .. in the name of past transgressions, it’s very hypocritical to me ..
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ok. so you’re comparing Israel to nazi germany. you stink at this.

and MANY historians say jews were there first, a LONG time ago.
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[wdmso]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

ok. so you’re comparing Israel to nazi germany. you stink at this. No jim I am suggesting the Jew were oppressed but oppression has many forms .. you don't need gas chambers of slave labor.... to be The oppressor

and MANY historians say jews were there first, a LONG time ago. And indians were here before americans So they should get it Back you are to simplistic in your world view it lacks Nuance
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https://fivethirtyeight.com/features...-israel-party/

How Republicans fell in love with Israel

1988, Democrats and Republicans had basically similar attitudes toward Israel two fundamental forces combined to transform the GOP into the hardcore pro-Israel party we know today. First, the rise of the religious right, which sees hard-line support for Israel as a religious obligation. Second, the neoconservative movement successfully convinced most Republican leaders that being pro-Israel should be a core conservative value.


Democrats are much more open to criticizing Israel on issues like West Bank settlements, whereas Republican support for Israel is more unconditional.

one directly linked to the rise of evangelical Protestants in the GOP, whose beliefs about biblically granted rights to the Holy Land make them inclined to take a strongly pro-Israel stance.

So its all about religion for the GOP and its love affair with Israel...
religion makes poor policy

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by wdmso

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features...-israel-party/

l...
religion makes poor policy

Religion is the reason behind the anti-slavery movement in the country (which democrats fought a war over to keep).

Religion is the reason behind the anti-segregation movement in the country (which democrats fought to sustain).

Religion is the reason why the pilgrims came here, and it's very very obviously at the root of all of our freedoms and founding philosophies.

Islam makes bad policy. Moderate judeo-Christian principles? Come on.

[scottw]

Originally Posted by wdmso

But when you become what you opposed .. in the name of past transgressions, it’s very hypocritical to me ..

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are you calling Paul S and Got Strippers hypocrits?

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by scottw

are you calling Paul S and Got Strippers hypocrits?

no, no, when liberals do a 180, they are “evolving.”.
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