No Guns in San Fran

[spence]

Originally Posted by basswipe

Also for every crime comitted with a firearm there are tenfold as many crimes prevented with one.Its peculiar how "the people" are never given those tidbits of information.

Probably because it isn't true. Care to cite the source?

I'm not a person who thinks guns a bad by the way...just that you don't have any god given right to own one.

-spence

[MakoMike]

Originally Posted by spence

Probably because it isn't true. Care to cite the source?

I'm not a person who thinks guns a bad by the way...just that you don't have any god given right to own one.

-spence

Spence a Study my a Dr. Lott, forget what university he's from. Google his name and you should find it.

[spence]

Dr. John Lott of the uber right wing American Enterprise Institute?

I agree there are plenty of gun myths...but I don't believe there's a 10:1 ratio of gun crimes to crimes stopped.

-spence

[spence]

Reverse that ratio in my last post...Damn edit...

-spence

[piemma]

Originally Posted by spence

Probably because it isn't true. Care to cite the source?

I'm not a person who thinks guns a bad by the way...just that you don't have any god given right to own one.

-spence

Hey, did you realize there was a gun in the truck last weekend.....

[spence]

Originally Posted by piemma

Hey, did you realize there was a gun in the truck last weekend.....

My pinky finger was stuck in the damn barrel for nearly an hour! It was like a freaking Chinese torture puzzle

You should really lock those things up

-spence

[toddonbi]

I saw this on the news last night. Am i correct that they said it applies to business owners also? If that's the case that's nuts.

[spence]

I think it covers just about everyone besides the police and military folks...people who need guns to do their jobs.

-spence

[toddonbi]

might as well make change out of a bucket on the sidewalk i guess...kind of like the penny tray beside the register.

[Skip N]

Originally Posted by toddonbi

I saw this on the news last night. Am i correct that they said it applies to business owners also? If that's the case that's nuts.

Of course its nuts its San FranFreako. Those people are just so outta wack its disturbing. They seriosly need mental help. The criminals must be loving this law. They can rob buisnesses and homes knowing the folks are unarmed. Man those people are retarded out there.

[toddonbi]

It just boggles my mind, although you are right it is SanFanny. I still like the Pa. law about breaking and entering...if they flop out of the door after you shoot them for breaking in grab 'em by the boot heels and drag 'em in.

[crash]

The truely pathetic part is that criminals will always have access to guns, and now the residents of San Fran. will not. In Boston where I went to school, I could buy a stolen gun for $20-$100, I would never do it, but I could have. When I turned 21 I jumped thru all of the hoops to get a permit so that I could buy a gun at $300. Does this make any sense?

[basswipe]

Originally Posted by spence

Probably because it isn't true. Care to cite the source?

I'm not a person who thinks guns a bad by the way...just that you don't have any god given right to own one.

-spence

You're right its not true it's actually a larger ratio.I used "tenfold" as a matter of keeping it simple.

The source I use for debunking the myths the antigun crowd likes to use is the Kleck Report.Google the name Gary Kleck.Its some of the only truly scientific research ever done on the gun control issue.

As an atheist I never considered my right to own a gun "god given" but I do
consider it a constitutional one.

[spence]

Originally Posted by basswipe

You're right its not true it's actually a larger ratio.I used "tenfold" as a matter of keeping it simple.

The source I use for debunking the myths the antigun crowd likes to use is the Kleck Report.Google the name Gary Kleck.Its some of the only truly scientific research ever done on the gun control issue.

Well, according to my Google research the Kleck survey done in 1993 reported about 2 million defensive gun uses per year by law abiding citizens.

According to the Department of Justice in 1994 estimated this to be closer to 1.5 million defensive gun uses. They also concluded...

"Evidence suggests that this survey and others like it overestimate the frequency with which firearms were used by private citizens to defend against criminal attack."

According to the Department of Justice during the same time there were about 1.3 million nonfatal firearm related violent crime victims, this obviously doesn't include the 15,000 or so that were killed.

So at best it's more like a 1:1 ratio.

This also doesn't include such alarming statistics as the increased probability a gun kept in the home is to kill another family member (43x in 1986) or the increased suicide rate in homes with guns.

But I'm not here to write a book, just that I don't believe the ratio is 10:1 or even 5:1. Given the millions of other things a person can do to keep them self safe, it doesn't seem like all that compelling of an argument.

I'd also note that since those studies, the number of gun crimes has gone waaayyyy down for reasons other than people packing heat.

And more importantly, if giving PIEMMA my money is the best way to save my life, I'll do it every time and not feel my courage is diminished in any way

If you have nothing to prove, you take the smart way out...so what do you have to prove?

-spence