What's your recommendation?

[Back Beach]

Originally Posted by MakoMike

What's to recommend? Until the stock assessment is done there is nothing to do?

MM,

You just questioned the question.......

Originally Posted by MakoMike

Once the stock assessment is complete and, assuming that no rebuilding is required, you just need to set coastwide bag limits at a level that will equal Fmax. If you want to insure continued viability you would set size limits that allow each fish to spawn at least once, but technically that is not a necessity. If rebuilding is necessary then you would have to set size limits that will allow fish to spawn before capture and set a F level somewhere below Fmax, how far below will depend on the FMP's rebuilding plan. No rocket science here.

......and then answered it.Some people think the fish are on the brink of extinction, and rarely do they cite any scientific data or facts to back up their views. SF comes to mind. If you can, explain what fmax is so people understand, meaning how does it convert to inches when you say they need to spawn at least once? How big would a fish need to be that spawns at least once? The reason I posed the question was to try to shed some light on how this stuff really works. A lot of people might respond "36 inches and one fish a day" because it sounds like a good conservation measure, but might not be able to back it up with good methodology or science. Lets hear some more of the why, if you will.

[riverrat2]

I would like to see one at 36". There really is no need to keep two fish for yourself everytime you go out. I am not saying I don't do this currently because I do. But it seems that everytime I do the meat sits in the freezer for longer than I would like. But regardless, every bit of it does get eaten or given to family. If it were 1 at 36" it would cancel the temptation to keep that extra fish just for show. And one fish at 36" is still plenty of meat for a family to eat for a couple of meals.

[Sweetwater]

As a recreational fisherman, I'd like to see a limit not just on small fish but large fish as well. Current regulations encourage the harvesting of the largest fish, thus over time threatening to make the stock genetically smaller (i.e., the fish is more likely to survive and reproduce if it is genetically smaller).

Just as in any population, if you continually remove larger fish from the spawning population, only the smaller fish will survive to spawn thus their fry will increasingly be genetically smaller as adults.

Further, studies show that 90%+ of striped bass over 32" are females. By targeting larger fish for harvest, we are focusing on females and (being large) the best, proven egg-bearers.

I think a slot limit is in order. For example, allow the harvest of fish only between 22" and 34" while limiting the number of fish to one per day or less. By balancing the take between both male and female fish, and avoiding the taking of the largest fish, this will produce both /more/ fish and /larger/ fish over time.

Two references:

http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/conten...7cd225d189e4d4

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...0119231221.htm

[MakoMike]

Originally Posted by Back Beach

Some people think the fish are on the brink of extinction, and rarely do they cite any scientific data or facts to back up their views. SF comes to mind. If you can, explain what fmax is so people understand, meaning how does it convert to inches when you say they need to spawn at least once? How big would a fish need to be that spawns at least once? The reason I posed the question was to try to shed some light on how this stuff really works. A lot of people might respond "36 inches and one fish a day" because it sounds like a good conservation measure, but might not be able to back it up with good methodology or science. Lets hear some more of the why, if you will.

Sorry I misunderstood what you were asking for. The stock assessment is the first block in most fishery management decisions. The second step is to decide where you want the stock to be vis-a-vis the current stock assessment. Most times fishery managers don't want the stock to be less that it currently is, so I'll discount that possibility. More usual is that the managers want the stock at about the level it currently is (which IMHO is where the striped bass stock assessment will come in) or they want the stock to increase. "F" stand for fishing mortality. When a fishery management plan is adopted (FMP) it usually calls for a target biomass in a given timeframe, if rebuilding is required, or it calls for holding the biomass steady, if no rebuilding is called for. Fmsy ifs the fishing mortality that the stock can stand and still maintain the Maximum sustainable yield (MSY) which is the way the U.S. has decided that all rebuilt fisheries should be managed. To convert Fmsy to coastwide bag limits, one has to estimate the number of fishermen and divide the msy by the numer of fishermen and fishing days to come up with the bag limit. Stripers generally spawn for the first time somewhere between 32 and 34 inches in size. There is an additon factor in the assessment which is called "spawning Stock biomass." That's the amount of spawning fish and the FMP will cintain targets for the level of SSB, that will generall translate into size limits. All of this is a gross oversimplification, but it should be enough to gett he conversation started.

[NIB]

Originally Posted by MakoMike

Sorry I misunderstood what you were asking for. The stock assessment is the first block in most fishery management decisions. The second step is to decide where you want the stock to be vis-a-vis the current stock assessment. Most times fishery managers don't want the stock to be less that it currently is, so I'll discount that possibility. More usual is that the managers want the stock at about the level it currently is (which IMHO is where the striped bass stock assessment will come in) or they want the stock to increase. "F" stand for fishing mortality. When a fishery management plan is adopted (FMP) it usually calls for a target biomass in a given timeframe, if rebuilding is required, or it calls for holding the biomass steady, if no rebuilding is called for. Fmsy ifs the fishing mortality that the stock can stand and still maintain the Maximum sustainable yield (MSY) which is the way the U.S. has decided that all rebuilt fisheries should be managed. To convert Fmsy to coastwide bag limits, one has to estimate the number of fishermen and divide the msy by the numer of fishermen and fishing days to come up with the bag limit. Stripers generally spawn for the first time somewhere between 32 and 34 inches in size. There is an additon factor in the assessment which is called "spawning Stock biomass." That's the amount of spawning fish and the FMP will cintain targets for the level of SSB, that will generall translate into size limits. All of this is a gross oversimplification, but it should be enough to gett he conversation started.

The whole system is flawed IMO..
"The stock assessment is the first block in most fishery management decisions."
The accuracy of the assessment of any fishery is a joke at best..
Then they work the numbers down to .001..
Then they set the fishery to MSY.
The problem is still driven by money..
U won't see a drastic increase in size limits or reduction in bag limits till it becomes drastic again.Coms an recs alike when it comes to S-B
drive the train here.If the recs go the cut back route, the comns would have to follow..or vise versa It ain't gonna happen.I could hear the cries of poverty from here..
I have no problem with one at 36"
I can't imagine the uproar from the party boat capts here in NJ on that one..
We had a 1 fish 24-28 an one fish 34 or over..
a few yrs ago
Man they cried when they lost there 24 " fish ..
we went to basically 2@28"like evryone else..
Money IS everything..

[piemma]

I have advocated 1 fish 36"+ for a few years. I saw guys last year MEASURING 28" fish to see if it were legal. This is a crime and ultimately kills the fish.
We had 36" 1 fish, 34" 1 fish and we caught a lot of fish way over that. I think it was 90 to 94. I never liked the 28" limit. I know that the guys I fish with would be embarrased to be seen with a fish under 34".
Let's get back to 36"+ 1 fish limit

[snake slinger]

man law-1 fish 36''

[riverrat2]

I agree with Piemma. If you need to measure a fish its not a "keeper".