Striped Bass, the condition of the fishery

[Sea Dangles]

Dave, the comm fleet is not killing tens of thousands daily,not even close. It may not even be weekly.There are a limited amount of guys supplying bait stores with fresh pogies, but the comm fishermen don't even come close to taking those kind of numbers.

[Canalman]

You don't think so? I could be wrong... but I know more than a few guys who won't head out until they have 300 to rig for yo-yoing, chumming and chunking. Maybe TENS of thousands was a bit of an exaggeration but I don't think thousands is.

[JohnR]

In a nut shell, everything should be cut way back - commercial & recreational take for bass, commercial & recreational take for forage, etc...

Now, as pointed out in other posts, if all we are doing is arguing here about it in a circular fashion, we're probably going to argue and argue while the problem gets worse. What Would it take to get people INVOLVED?

[Canalman]

Originally Posted by JohnR

What Would it take to get people INVOLVED?

This is where I'm trying to go.

The problem I keep seeing is that people almost seem afraid to fight for any version of this. Especially on here. Now I am not saying that I'm some hero, because I'm just as guilty as the next guy.

If not for people like BasicPatrick and the very-few others that are the one loud voice on the behalf of the millions of recreational fishermen we would be toally sunk. The way the panels that vote on these things are skewed right now, there's already a foot of water on the deck.

Doesn't anyone own a bus...? that would be awesome to show up in an S-B.com bus and storm these very important meetings.

[Crafty Angler]

Well, you're either on the bus or off the bus, like the Pranksters used to say -

I'm in - no, actually, I'm on -

This isn't state by state because it does little to mandate a change in just one portion of the striped bass range - but it could be the start of a groundswell of support for tighter regs on BOTH sides of the issues - and we - recs and comms - BOTH have to take a hit on limits to preserve a common resource.

You can sort out the rest of the crap later but that aspect will never be fully resolved anyway as to who was to blame - there's plenty of it to go around and no one is faultless. The pissing contest just gets in the way of the objective and we all have a stake in the effort one way or another.

This could be the start of a groundswell at a grassroots level - the time could very well be right. Just keep your ****ing finger in your pocket for now and stop wasting time and energy if you actually want to get something done about it.

Hmmmm....I don't suppose anyone on this board owns a bus, do they?

Funny, while editing it appears a couple of other posts popped up with the same question...

[Canalman]

Let's try and do this then.

If we're going to have a loud voice, we're going to have to make it easy for people to have their voices heard. A bus trip sounds easy enough and it would probably be a blast.

Patrick, if you're reading this thread. Have they set a date for this Menhaden Meeting?

[Canalman]

This has worked before. I was talking to a well-known writer yesterday who told me the story about when MA was trying to impose a saltwater license where the money was to be destined for the "general fund". They organized a bunch of anglers and protested. Governer Weld stopped by to ask what the commotion was about, the next week's cover of The Fisherman was governer Weld holding one of the protesters signs. The next week, this writer and his friend were witness to the tearing up of the bill.

So it can work.

[Crafty Angler]

Hey, baahhdy - godtham guy, this heah could be pretty good - everbody knows we got troublesh ova heah with the stroipesh...


All attempts at injecting a little levity into a serious situation aside, it could work well if the effort maintains a centrist position on behalf of the fishery.

[fishaholic18]

Originally Posted by Canalman

A bus trip sounds easy enough and it would probably be a blast.

But how r u gonna get them to the bus??? Door to door pick up?? Could be a long trip.... Better be a beer bus.. And throw in a few Hooters girls..That'll get Clammer on board..

[Canalman]

Originally Posted by Sea Dangles

but the comm fishermen don't even come close to taking those kind of numbers.

How do you know this though? Do you know every commercial fisherman? Just the ammount of guys on the pigs, around the islands and gay head would easily add to up to a few thousand pogies each day if they had 40 each. (I know they take many more than that). And we're no even counting the Cape guys, the guys around Nantucket and the rest of the Vineyard and the Boston Harbor heading north. The more I think about it, the more I think 10,000 might be a possible daily bunker kill, during the commercial season.

Maybe we should make livelining and chunking illegal?

[Sea Dangles]

Originally Posted by Canalman

How do you know this though? Do you know every commercial fisherman? Just the ammount of guys on the pigs, around the islands and gay head would easily add to up to a few thousand pogies each day if they had 40 each. (I know they take many more than that). And we're no even counting the Cape guys, the guys around Nantucket and the rest of the Vineyard and the Boston Harbor heading north. The more I think about it, the more I think 10,000 might be a possible daily bunker kill, during the commercial season.

Maybe we should make livelining and chunking illegal?

I don't fish there too often to be honest.I do not know many comm. guys in MA either. I just know they don't all use pogies and not many comm guys chum.30 or 40 baits is enough to get out there and be effective. It is usually not a fleet out there the way you might envision it.Combine this with the amount of days you can actually fish commercially......

[MikeToole]

If you look at what is happening in Area 1A right now there will be no herring fishing from 1/1/09 through 5/30/09. Much of this is due to a write in campaign by sport fisherman. There are on going meetings to put in place further restrictions.

http://www.wildlife.state.nh.us/News...rg_010709.html

Many of the state fishing commissions have an automatic Email system to alert you of up coming meeting and when there looking for public input. If you can't make the meetings write a letter. The sport fishing community is huge and when you throw in the tackle companies and boat manufactures we could have a real say. Instead a much small commericial fishery group has to much say.

[Canalman]

I think you all are misunderstanding the intent of what I am saying.

If it took a bus, I might consider trying. But if you look at the fact that it takes 4000 crowbars and 10000000000 pounds of dynamite to get the average recreational angler off his ass to even show up at a meeting (and lately to even voice his or her opinion on a pressing issue online!), the bus and the "storm" are used more in the metaphorical sense. I am trying to encourage people to get involved in something. But all I hear is Clammer poo-pooing it "it's too hard, I'm too tired" and sadly, that is the voice of the New England recreational angler. Then you hear Sea Dangles, saying "Nope it ain't like that, they don't all use pogies." As if that somehow makes my point invalid and leaves the "X" number of pogies killed as OK. Then we hear the overwhelming voices that say that stopping the commercial season will have "no effect" we all know that is not true... but it's EASY. And that's what we all want easy. Easy so we can bitch later about it and type angrily at each other, easy so someone else can do it, easy because it's a lost cause. And it is a lost cause if you all stay home to watch rerruns of SVU or House on the nights of these meetings.

So by all means, sit at home and brood, but don't ever talk about saving the bait or the bass again if you're not willing to do something about it. Because that just makes you look like an idiot.

I'll see you at the Plymouth Meeting, because that's the one that is the easiest one for me to get to.

[fishaholic18]

Originally Posted by Canalman

I think you all are misunderstanding the intent of what I am saying.

If it took a bus, I might consider trying. But if you look at the fact that it takes 4000 crowbars and 10000000000 pounds of dynamite to get the average recreational angler off his ass to even show up at a meeting (and lately to even voice his or her opinion on a pressing issue online!), the bus and the "storm" are used more in the metaphorical sense. I am trying to encourage people to get involved in something. But all I hear is Clammer poo-pooing it "it's too hard, I'm too tired" and sadly, that is the voice of the New England recreational angler. Then you hear Sea Dangles, saying "Nope it ain't like that, they don't all use pogies." As if that somehow makes my point invalid and leaves the "X" number of pogies killed as OK. Then we hear the overwhelming voices that say that stopping the commercial season will have "no effect" we all know that is not true... but it's EASY. And that's what we all want easy. Easy so we can bitch later about it and type angrily at each other, easy so someone else can do it, easy because it's a lost cause. And it is a lost cause if you all stay home to watch rerruns of SVU or House on the nights of these meetings.

So by all means, sit at home and brood, but don't ever talk about saving the bait or the bass again if you're not willing to do something about it. Because that just makes you look like an idiot.

I'll see you at the Plymouth Meeting, because that's the one that is the easiest one for me to get to.

End It...No matter what u say...guys will be against it...weather they want to or not... Dave..so don't let it get to ya...Negativity by nature.....here....

[Crafty Angler]

I'm out...

For now, that is...

[inTHERAPY]

Canal, your ambition and fervor is commendable. As I started the thread asking " How does one go about making a difference?" I did not expect a bus to be picking people up! I am, however, on the other side of the commercial/recreational debate. Once again I repeat, that does not imply that I am not preservation minded. As I see it we are not "enemies". As a commercial bass fisherman, a MA resident paying my licensing fee, following the law, why should I not be allowed to fish as such? If the comm season is ended, as you seem to support, are you ready to also close the recreational fishery? I do not see one happening without the other.

[Clammer]

This is off the thread a little But [M] mentioned that the commercial Bluefish season in mass was actually closed last season because of too many being caught . while this year in RI >>. the bluefish chase fleet was SOL /because it didn,t happen in the bay .. 1st time I,ve seen this inmany years >> && IMO that was because there was not a steady supply of small bait . they were year . try snagging a pogie & get it in before it was chopped off .
there were some on the beaches this fall // but there couldn,t have been many being taken to market / because the market price in October was .60 P/P >>on the hoof .not gutted . where RI bloooofish price is usually much lower . a fall price is usually anywhere from .40 to .10 >> to we don,t want them ;;
Just a observation .. didn,t mean to jump thread ><><

[BasicPatrick]

[QUOTE=MikeToole;658818]If you look at what is happening in Area 1A right now there will be no herring fishing from 1/1/09 through 5/30/09. Much of this is due to a write in campaign by sport fisherman. There are on going meetings to put in place further restrictions.
QUOTE]

As one of the guys in that bar in Maine (founding members of CHOIR Coalition) I think it is only fair to say that Mike, you are correct it was a letter writing campaing that started the effort but also we can not forget that the effort was made up of responsible commerical fishers, moderate enviros and recretional leaders that joined to get that effort that continues today (see my action alert from today) off the ground.

I just wanted to say thanks Mike for telling peeps it was a grass roots effort and yes we can make changes when done right...by the way it is dozens of hearings and waiting all day for 15 minute sections of a meeting that get's it done. It is not an overwhelming show of force but a steady reliable ready to roll into action whenever called effort that succeeds in fisheries management.