Why is The Striped Bass Conservation Bill so hush hush?

[The Dad Fisherman]

That being said there may be 600,000 fishing trips a year....but 600,000 different anglers...thats where I kind of find the number being hard to swallow.

and are they lumping in Sweetwater anglers and ice-fisherman into that total to justify the number.....in that case plenty of rec anglers that never had salt touch their line.

[DZ]

As often happens in threads like these there is often mis-information. Because of this I decided to contact SF to get some clarification. Info included below in brackets.

[The daily bag limit would be one fish, period. The bill does not say what size of fish CAN be harvested, but rather what size of fish CANNOT be harvested.

The slot would be determined by the department, but no fish could be smaller than 20 inches and no fish could be harvested between 26 and 40 inches. The department could have a tighter regulation than 20 through 26, for example 22 through 25, but it could not be more lenient than 20 through 26. Also, the department could make a larger minimum 42 or 44 or whatever, but it could not allow 38. If the fishery required it there could be only a fish of over 40 inches - or greater. The state might also decide instead to allow only a slot fish and complete hands off the larger ones.]


I suggest those that may want to see how the numbers are arrived at contact SF.

DZ

[leptar]

Ok just so we are on the same page...
We know that "scientific data" is based upon the input that "volunteers" and "paid" staff collect when they are armed with that pen and pad with a pocket lined with 1/2 melted candy..

We all know fishermen tell tales...

So even if 5% of the information collect is bullchit.. that in itself would be enough to over exaggerate any "published scientific data".

That is why i base my opinion on what i see and not what is read to me.

I got a reply from the ASFMC

Originally Posted by My Email response from ASFMC

"My understanding is that the bill (HD 245) indicates that the Massachusetts commercial striped bass quota would be set aside for conservation, rather than being given to MA recreational fishermen (such as through a mechanism similar to the recreational "bonus fish program" in NJ) or to fishermen (commercial or recreational) in other states. Also, there is currently no language in the Striped Bass Fishery Management Plan related to state transfer of commercial quota, nor do any states transfer any coastal commercial quota at this point. IF HD 245 were passed as law, and IF Massachusetts wanted to transfer its commercial quota to other states' commercial fishermen to catch (which seems contrary to the intent of the bill as I understand it), an addendum to the striped bass plan would be required to permit it. Should anything of this sort happen, there would be public hearings and a comment period, at which time I would suggest you and all concerned constituents provide comment.

Best regards,

Xxxxxxx Xxxxxxx
Atlantic States Marine Fisheries Commission"

[BassDawg]

AYYYYYY MEN!!

i agree with MOST of what Sandman is putting down,,,,,,,,,,,,,

especially 1 @36"+.

much easier to do and to enforce, unless
fishery mngmt requires the killing of the 20"-26" to augment
their fecundity ratios and better preserve the species, then so be it!
i DO KNOW that slots worked for the redfish in SW FL. cheaters and poachers included. no tolereance is key as well, poachers arew less likely to poach if they know they can lose their WHOLE kit and kiboodle; plus fines, and jailtime if needs be.

and as i and others have stated, ad nauseum, ALL of this IS MOOT

if we don't FIX THE FORAGE!!!! the two measures must go
hand in hand and must be supported by the science; yet, how can it
not be,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,seems like a no brainer from where i'm typing??

[DZ]

Originally Posted by BassDawg

ALL of this IS MOOT

if we don't FIX THE FORAGE!!!!

Just for info - not saying the striper stock is crashing but... during the last crash in the 1980s forage had nothing to do with it.

DZ

[Crafty Angler]

Dennis, as you know I'm researching the crash of the bass stocks in the late 1800's that finally caused the demise of the great striped bass clubs of the time -

In fact, I've been lucky enough to enlist the help of Dr. O'Nitis - the famous Irish marine biologist now that he's retired - figured it would be a good way to keep him out of mischief, too......but it also gives me someone with a science background to bounce things off of to keep any conjecture plausible...geez, talk about researching cold cases...

I've got some theories about that one - but from what I've unearthed so far, it seems like it was too much of everything going south over a 30 or so year period to maintain a robust stock - overfishing, forage depletion and the degradation of habitat - I keep thinking it's as much a cautionary tale as a piece of surfcasting history - I've found a few nuggets lately, too -

BTW, thanks for the call, I was at work - I'll try to give you a ring later today - and yup, I'm real interested...

[zimmy]

Another thing about the slot... I love the way it works in NC for drum. It is great to see tons of big fish caught and all released. I can't think of a time I've heard any complaim about not being able to keep bigger fish. The drum slot is 1 fish 18-27". The data indicate that stocks have gone up since instituting the slot. If I had a vote it would be the small slot and nothing over 27" for bass coastwide. The problem I have with 1 @ 36" is that, while it reduces the overall take as there aren't as many fish that size caught, it targets the breeders.

[Mr. Sandman]

IMO that "problem" is a misconception. 1@ 36 allows EVERY FISH to breed something like 4 or 5 times ( I don't have the numbers but is is something on that order). We are talking massive amounts of fish allowed to breed EVERY YEAR. The older so called "breeder" fish you site do have more eggs per fish however I am not convinced that they are as ripe or as healthy as a sub 36"er. If you ever have cut open a big female and looked at her eggs they are a different (much darker) color and I would bet most will not most of the eggs will not hatch even though there are more of them.

The problem I have with taking tiny fish is that you don't even give the fish a chance to reach maturity and spawn more than once. Give every fish a chance to spawn more than once.

1@ 36 has also worked, it was used during the rebound years and numbers increased dramatically. It allows ALL fish (not just a selected group) to spawn multiple times before being taken. Further, you spread the (rate of failure) risk among a larger number of females.

The slot is a theory and has never been technically proven. I would like to see some real evidence (not antidotes) that a few big females would be better then then bulk of the spawning biomass. I don't believe anyone has every really proved this. Saying it "worked" for one species is not the same. There are a lot of other variables that contributed to the rebound of those fish.


Lastly it is simple and straightforward.

I don't know about you but I just don't want to take a small fish...ever. It just feels naturally wrong to do so. I don't get any feeling of pride in even catching a small bass. I will stop fishing for them if that is all there is.